Indiana Middle School Girls Expelled Over Facebook Jokes 'To Kill' Peers Seek Repeal

INDIANAPOLIS -- Three eighth-graders from northwest Indiana who say they were expelled after joking on Facebook about which of their classmates they would like to kill asked a federal judge Wednesday to order the district to allow them to return to school.

The American Civil Liberties Union of Indiana filed a lawsuit on behalf of the three 14-year-old girls in federal court in Hammond, claiming that Griffith Public Schools violated the students' free-speech rights.

The girls were suspended and later expelled in January for the remainder of the school year after a classmate's mother alerted officials at Griffith Middle School to the girls' Facebook posts, the lawsuit says. The suit says school officials told the girls they had violated school policy against bullying, harassment and intimidation.

School officials didn't immediately return a phone call seeking comment Wednesday.

ACLU attorney Gavin Rose said it was clear the girls were joking because their remarks were accompanied by smiley faces and other emoticons, along with Internet abbreviations for laughter, such as LOL.

"The fact of the matter is that no reasonable person looking at this conversation would think that these girls were going to go out and inflict harm on anyone," Rose told The Associated Press. "If you make a legitimate threat against someone ... you don't follow it up with an emoticon."

The posts were made after school on the girls' personal electronic devices, not on school computers, the lawsuit says, and were visible only to the girls' online friends who were allowed access.

"Schools do not possess infinite reach into the private lives of their students," Rose said in a separate statement.

Since 1969, the U.S. Supreme Court has generally ruled that students have free-speech rights, and schools can prohibit their speech only if it is vulgar or disruptive to schoolwork or other people. The lawsuit claims the posts did not cause any disruption at school, and no one at school mentioned the posts the following day.

The district told the girls they would be permitted to proceed to ninth grade at Griffith High School this fall, the lawsuit says, but only one of the girls intends to attend that school.

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Comments

[Chipper1]

07:06 PM on 04/29/2012

See, this is why I don't join ACLU. For every case of theirs that I support, there's one like this where I think they are very wrong. These girls got what they deserved. We can't say awful things and then get away with the "just kidding" defense. Free speech does not mean totally unrestricted speech. Putting threats on a social media like Facebook is "publishing" and publishing threats can get you in trouble.

[aralpharetta]

05:21 AM on 04/29/2012

CLEARly Should Have Been EXPELLED.

[snowdreamer]

04:56 PM on 04/28/2012

Good for the school for actually doing something about bullies. Mr. Rose needs to brush up on his laws. In today's post-9/11 world, death threats are NOT protected speech. I hope a smart judge throws this out of court and that the parents of the victims sue the a** off the bully parents in return.

[Disgusted Parent]

12:57 PM on 04/28/2012

The girls comments on Facebook may actually be criminal. Depending on the laws of the state, their comments may even be a felony. You see folks, people can't just say they're going to kill someone - even if they're joking. To the woman who compared this situation to posting a comment about her husband driving her crazy and "jokingly" implying she would kill him could someday find herself in trouble posting such a comment should her husband ever find himself in "fear" of her. If your threats are documented, witnessed, cause fear, etc., you could be charged with criminal or terrorist threats. The ACLU should be careful what they draw attention to on this one. Their young, dim-witted clients may have more to contend with than just being expelled from middle school. IMO, these girls are getting off pretty easy. The parents should suck up a year of homeschooling or private school. They could use this time to look into how to raise productive members of society who offer the world more than their hateful, self-centered nonsense. The girls aren't even expelled forever - just this year. They will be allowed to return to public high school.

[Gonzo36]

02:23 PM on 04/28/2012

Nope. Just because YOU think they are criminal comments doesn't actually make them criminal. No charges have been filed against the girls. You know why? Its called our first amendment. These girls did not threaten anyone, nor did they say they were going to kill anyone. They only said who they would want to kill and it was obviously a joke. If I was their parents I would give them severe consequences such as taking away their computer for a year, but this is not up to the school. This is a parental issue and it is up to the girl's parents to handle this.

[Disgusted Parent]

03:02 PM on 04/28/2012

Gonzo - What you are doing on this site by commenting and opposing my point of view is exercising freedom of speech. Freedom of speech does not protect hate speech or threats to cause bodily harm - which is what these young girls did. Dig into the facts and the law before you hide behind the any ammendment that is intended to protect my friend. The school is well within their right to discipline a student who violates their standards of conduct. If a parent doesn't like the schools policy, they have every right to find a different school for their student to attend. In this case, the school has helped such parent make that very decision. These parents are now free to choose a school that is tolerant of such ignorant behavior. Hopefully this will serve as a wake up call to the girls and their parents. It's okay for people to not to like eachother - It's not okay to threaten to harm the people they don't like. It's a simple concept I learned from my good, if not a little imperfect parents.

[Disgusted Parent]

03:17 PM on 04/28/2012

Sorry - One more thought...IC 35-45-2-1 details what constitutes misdemeanor and felony threats or intimidation in the State of Indiana - None of what the Indiana statute covers provides relief under the First Amendment. A threat, is a threat, is a threat. Pretty sad that we'll let the emoticons decide guilt or innocence here. May set a precedent for the Smiley Faced killer. Maybe he/she can use it too - "I killed all my victims with a smile on my face, so therefore it was not a crime". The girls parents who went to the school to address the threats directed towards their daughter should have taken it to the police too.

[aralpharetta]

05:22 AM on 04/29/2012

Hateful, Self Centered, Nonsense???

[Caryn Banker]

08:09 PM on 04/27/2012

The schools are between a rock and a hard place on this issue. Apparently, they will be sued by someone, no matter which way they turn.

[Griffith Parent]

05:46 PM on 04/27/2012

As a (step) parent to one of the girls that was targeted, this is no joke! These girls are backpedaling as fast as they can because they were CAUGHT! Cyberbullying is a major epidemic in this country, and somehow the actual victims become the villians for standing up for themselves. The parents and student sign for handbooks that points out cyberbullying will not be tolerated and can lead to being expelled. If the President was "joked" about being killed by these girls, I promise you that the FBI would of beat down their doors and would of arrested them. Threats are threats and need to be taken seriously. What if they would of carried out what they said they intended to do? this would of been a whole difference news story about "Where were the parents, the teachers? Who did not see the signs of their behavior!

[Gonzo36]

07:22 PM on 04/27/2012

I am a Jew. There are hundreds, maybe thousands of websites calling for my death. But as despicable as those websites are, I believe they are legal and are protected under the constitution. Should those girls have said such mean things? No. But they are KIDS. They were not cyber bullying. Did they send the conversation to your step daughter? Not according to the article. Did they threaten her at school? Not according to the article. They were having a conversation amongst each other. It was mean, and nasty but that is the nature of growing up.

[Griffith Parent]

08:31 AM on 04/28/2012

Good for you that you are a Jew. That is not the story here. The story here is that some girls posted that they are going to kill students and teachers on facebook. A threat is a threat. There was a girl that was similarly targeted on facebook at Griffith middle school two years ago. She ended up moving to Minnesota to get away from it. She ended up committing suicide over it. These kids know right from wrong. It is school policy and was stated in a signed for handbook (both parents and students). The federal government also gave a cyberbullying/threat class at the beginning of the school year to the students. I bet you do not have any children of your own and I bet if it happened to your kids (if you had any) you would think differently. And do not believe everything you read in the "article." These girls are not so innocent as they would like you to believe. One use to be friends with my step-daughter (the one who was directly pointed out in the comments.) Kids are kids, yes, however, too many incidents around the country start like this and kids commit suicide or take guns to school to shoot the people who are making fun of them! I bet you see that in the paper and news channels quite frequently.

[snowdreamer]

04:47 PM on 04/28/2012

Do these racist sites list you by name? Bet they don't. Therein lies the difference.

[blahahah]

09:36 PM on 04/27/2012

These are kids that were joking around. The school had no right to check their conversation in the first place; it digs deep into the privacy of the children. Sure, they talked about killing somebody, but they didn't actually direct the conversation to the girls. Children nowadays joke around about everything. I'm sure as a child YOU JOKED AROUND as well, or else where did your fun come from at your childhood. I doubt that the girls who were talking about "killing" some people meant it; they just dislike certain people. It's normal for wishing a person to be dead, but people deal with it, but not by killing somebody, because people would get caught. CHILDREN AREN'T STUPID ANYMORE!!!!!!

[Griffith Parent]

08:33 AM on 04/28/2012

The school did not check into the conversation. We printed it off facebook and took it to the school since there was a threat against a teacher and other students. Any you are right, children aren't stupid, just people who think they are not capable of pulling of shooting at school or stabbing them out on the streets. And yes, they did directly target my step daughter. She was the only on they named.

[Disgusted Parent]

03:32 PM on 04/28/2012

I'm sorry, but I don't think it's normal to have a desire to joke about killing anyone. There are lots of jokes I can see being "normal", but joking about killing someone and joking about how it would be nice if you could do it and not get caught (as these girls "joked" about - your words) seems really NOT normal in my opinion. As someone who was once a young girl who had friends, freinamies and my fair share of enemies, I often joked that I wished they'd fall off the face of the earth, move to another state, get struck by lightening (all of which aren't very nice thoughts), but I never joked about wanting to actually kill anyone. Killing someone and wishing them bad luck are on a completely different ends of the spectrum.

[worriedaboutall]

05:10 PM on 04/27/2012

Too many schools have lost the ability to protect the children that are in there care. This is a great step to assure they are doing there best not to lose control or lives. We all would rather be safe than sorry in the long run. A threat is a threat. Safety First and formost. They did the correct thing. If any student makes any type of threat to another it should be looked at as no joke. Children are dying everyday. I say thank you to the school for taking the necessary steps. Great job well done. If the girls wanted to talk about murder, maybe they should consider a play house in there back yard to hold there meetings there. They were stupid to bring it up on FB. I know they are aware of all the violence that does happen on school property. Again, thumbs up to the school system at its finest.

[wanda Jacobsen]

04:45 PM on 04/27/2012

When do we really determine joking vs non-joking? Understandably free speech is free speech, yet we must draw the line on free threats. If these so called jokingly funny girls had in fact acted out on these so called joking threats, it would be way different wouldn't it? And thank you for the laugh, Attorney Gavin Rose....."The fact of the matter is that no reasonable person looking at this conversation would think that these girls were going to go out and inflict harm on anyone," Rose told The Associated Press. "If you make a legitimate threat against someone ... you don't follow it up with an emoticon." Really? Come on now. What do you define as a reasonable person? You just don't get it do you. Many don't unless it affects their life personally. Any form of bullying from any source must some how some way stop. At times we need to use certain situations to begin setting examples. I guess Mr. Gavin you believe...."The tree of liberty must be refreshed from
time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
It is its natural manure.".... Thomas Jefferson. How many more people do we have to lose to this jokingly matter?

[snowdreamer]

07:47 PM on 04/28/2012

"If these so called jokingly funny girls had in fact acted out on these so called joking threats, it would be way different wouldn't it?"

nailed it in one, Wanda.

[ChemicalPulse]

04:39 PM on 04/27/2012

I think part of this problem is from the parents. They should grow up and stop using Facebook/Narcissismbook. If they are using it, chances are, their kids will use it. They let their kids go on this site, when they are under 18. People need to start boycotting Facebook and grow up!

[justanotherRN]

11:34 AM on 04/27/2012

This boils down to ineffective parenting. The parents of the 3 middle school girls should have been monitoring the use and comments each child made on FB. That is their responsibility. It is also the obligation of the parents to teach what is and is not appropriate in a home environment, school setting, in public, and on a public forum. There is a significant difference between a right and a priviledge. FB is NOT a right and should be monitored. If these children had yelled fire in a public place the consequences would have been much harsher than a school expulsion. I doubt the parents would have retained the services of an attorney or involved the ACLU in that scenario. How is this situation any different? It is NOT. A public venue + threats = decisive action which should include being expelled and not allowed to return to that school for 9th grade as well as legal consequences. So now in addition to having those 3 girls engage in their unacceptable behavior, we also have their parents engaged in "bullying" behavior by suing the school board. Parents wake up, your children were wrong, take the consequences, do not sue, do not let this turn into a freedom of speech issue (which it is NOT) by the ACLU and MOVE ON! As parents you need to set the example...oops you did...a perfect example of lack of accountability. Let these girls take the consequences of their actions.

[Gonzo36]

10:00 AM on 04/27/2012

So if I joking write on facebook: 'ugh. my husband makes me so mad sometimes i just want to kill him! LOL!' then I have the freedom of speech to do this and everyone knows I am just kidding. But if my teenager writes the exact same thing (but substitute a name) then it is grounds for expulsion? Here in America we have something called the first amendment and it extends to ALL citizens.

[Griffith Parent]

05:52 PM on 04/27/2012

If you even had a clue to what was said of facebook, I think you could tell the difference. I hope that you are smart enough to know the difference between what you say to your husband and detailed accounts of how they wanted to kill other kids and teachers. My step daughter was one of the intended targets and it scared the heck out of me that kids could think that deep about how to kill people. I guarantee you that if it was your kid on the receiving end of this, you would not stand by and say "Oh, it was just freedom of speech!"

[Gonzo36]

07:13 PM on 04/27/2012

It has been and I still believe in freedom of speech. When I was a teenager we used to have long discussion on if we would rather die by guns, lethal injection, beheading, etc. We would weigh the pros and cons of each one. Kids are just that- KIDS. They are not adults, and these girls were just venting. Unless they spread this FB to the class or said something directly to your step daughter, they did nothing criminal. Wanting to kill someone isn't a crime. Acting on it is.

[cmmprime]

12:07 PM on 04/29/2012

I've read all of your comments on here and i now have a few questions. If this conversation is so "graphic in nature" why did the Griffith Police and the Indiana States Attorney both say there was nothing illegal in said conversation? If the girls are so dangerous and such a threat to students, why were they invited back a few days later to take their ISTEP tests? Beyond that, why were they invited back to resume school next year among these same students that they allegedly threatened? You say your daughter was friends with one of the girls, so isn't it feasible that your daughter only turned these girls in as a revenge tactic for telling her boyfriend that she was cheating on him? Why is it that the other four students named as people they hate, not want to kill, but hate, didn't turn the girls in? Or any of the hundred or so other students who saw the post? Why didn't any of them give it a second thought? And finally, if your daughter is such a "victim" here then why are you trying so hard to justify your actions?

[frycat44]

12:27 AM on 04/27/2012

which student to kill,why not have a bet on the next suicide?

[Once in a Blue Moon]

12:26 AM on 04/27/2012

So, do I understand you, Mr. Gavin Rose, that emoticons are a guarantee for no harm done, no harm to come? And no consequences for the wrongful exercise of free speech?

Or is there no relevance for the concept of wrongful use of free speech; in which case there is no relevance for the concept of rightful free speech. Oh oh,, there go right and wrong. And then, where are we? Back in the stone age, where only bully-might is right.

I wonder if our cerebral cortex will shrink to what it was then?

Please. These are children. The schools have a right to set an expectation of how its students behave toward one another and not just on school grounds. Parents, families, neighbors, friends, communities, society each has a role to play in shaping the growth and development of its children. I'm not suggesting schools get involved in every little thing. But, potentially, this was not a little thing.

[Gonzo36]

09:48 AM on 04/27/2012

Except it WAS a little thing. And no, a school does not have a right to set an expectation of how students behave on their own time. Its called freedom of speech and it is our first amendment. You should look it up.

[MissMichelleP]

10:48 AM on 04/27/2012

Bethel v. Fraser (1986). Look it up.

[ChemicalPulse]

05:25 PM on 04/27/2012

I agree. People like the person above are the reason we're losing freedom of speech in this country.

[LolaM9259]

12:10 AM on 04/27/2012

Oh Facebook strike back again!

[aralpharetta]

05:28 AM on 04/29/2012

A MUST SEE REMINDER: BABY got BACK!

[mockingjay16]

12:07 AM on 04/27/2012

You do not JOKINGLY threaten to kill someone, these girls are complete airheads for doing something so stupid. The school I think is completely within their rights, and did the correct thing in expelling these girls. Bullying is a serious issue that my old high school never took seriously. Only once did they take an online threat seriously. My friend had gotten in an online fight with someone and that person then proceeded to post a status about how they couldn't wait for school the next day so that they could beat my friend up. We printed off the posts, and showed them to the principle, the person was arrested and expelled. but in most cases schools tend to not take any post seriously. Also what was that bullshit about emoticons means they weren't serious. Teen girls will put smileys at the end of a post sometimes just because it adds an extra sense of bitchy to it. These girls deserve to be expelled. This is just ridiculous.

[Gonzo36]

09:51 AM on 04/27/2012

Of course people joke about who they would like to 'kill'. I had a list when I was a teenager. I used to talk about it with my friends as well. The only difference these days is it is on a computer so there is a record. It sounds like there were no prior incidences of 'bullying' and these were just some girls 'talking' amongst themselves. In addition it was done on their own time on their own computers. Its called freedom of speech. Oh, and fyi- I am a female.

[mockingjay16]

12:58 PM on 04/28/2012

What does being a female have to do with anything? I said sometimes teen girls do the smiley thing to be bitchy I didn't say all, and i said sometimes. Also I get that teens do it, but when they post it publicly on facebook, that is not amoungst themselves, that is inviting other people to see their list and it is bullying. Ok so if the school doesn't or can't do anything, then i think the victims parents should sue the girls. What they did was wrong, I see nothing funny at all about posting on facebook who you would like to kill at your school. If you were on that list I highly doubt you would find it funny that those people want you dead. even if the list was just a joke.