Barack Obama Courts Pro-Gun Vote

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Politico   |  Carrie Brown   |   April 5, 2008 06:22 PM


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Barack Obama did not hunt or fish as a child. He lives in a big city. And as an Illinois state legislator and a U.S. senator, he consistently backed gun control legislation.

But he is nevertheless making a play for pro-gun voters in rural Pennsylvania.

Read the whole story here.

 
 

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I think Obama's position is clear yet Robert Novack's column from today explains otherwise. I don't agree with it, the url is www.creators.com/opinion/robert-novak.html

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:00 PM on 04/07/2008

The Constitution remains in effect as last I noticed. The 2nd Amendment stands. Don't opt for a solution which is worse than the problem. Fix the real problem and you won't have to worry about gun ownership.

The problem is not guns. The problem is the Scot-Irish dueling culture which remains embedded in our society at all levels which dictates if someone offends you or your honor you have the right to inflict violence upon them. Think about it.

Look at the circumstances which preceded the school shootings. Someone was bullied or ostracized and felt it was legitimate to strike back.

Look at what is spewed forth by Hollywood that the righteous who are wronged should vindicate themselves by going after their offenders rather than let the law take its course.

Look at the criminals who are made heros by the movie, TV and music industry.

If you get rid of guns only the government and violent criminals will be armed. This situation may appeal to you if you worship authority or don't value your family's safety. However I'll stand with the Founding Fathers on this issue.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:25 AM on 04/06/2008

It's very smart of Obama to open the minds of people that otherwise wouldn't bother to listen to a word he says.
Anyone that takes the time to learn about him can only come to the same conclusion that many of us already have; That Obama is without question, the best possible option running for office today.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:49 AM on 04/06/2008

On this page alone, Obama has pissed off Gays and Gun owners this week. Last week he pissed off WW II veterans by saying the campaign was like the Bataan Death March. He better let Michelle make his speeches, she only pissed off Patriots who love America.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:39 AM on 04/06/2008

Gay gun owners?

Pink Pistols - Yuk. Sorry I forgot about this organization while taunting Helmke about colorizing guns..

http://www.gurapossessky.com/news/parker/documents/07-290bsacPinkPistols.pdf

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:46 AM on 04/06/2008

Because you say it, it MUST be true, huh?

Isn't it odd then, that his numbers either stay stable, or improve, daily.

Could it be because people like you just don't get the fact that Americans are much more capable of discerning lies and innuendo from truth, and see the stuff you and your candidate Hillary put out as the trash it actually is?

Why do Hillary and her supporters think that the voters are stupid?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:43 AM on 04/06/2008

Boy, he must be desperate! Outspending Clinton 5-1 in Pennsylvania and he seems to be so afraid of losing that he promises anything. Well, it won Idaho for him.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:09 AM on 04/06/2008

another flip flopping anything to win moment for Obama. Promise them anything, just get the vote.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:13 AM on 04/06/2008

As far as I'm concerned, gun nuts shouldn't be allowed to vote. Their guns should be removed from their possession and they should be put on drugs until someone can figure out what's wrong with them.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:42 AM on 04/06/2008

Are you saying gun owners are all "Nuts?" Maybe you should get back on your medication and resume therapy. I'm a gun owner. And I'm NOT nut? Troll!!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:06 PM on 04/06/2008

What a cooincidence. Charlton Heston just died. I guess we can go pry his gun loose "from" his "cold dead hands."

http://youtube.com/watch?v=O0B_UZNtEk4&feature=related

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:06 AM on 04/06/2008

All gun violence involves at leat one person with a gun. If either is absent, there cannot be gun violence. It shouldn't take a genius to figure out that making it difficult for a person to have a gun is going to reduce gun violence.

The question of gun control comes after we, as a society, decide that we are indeed against gun violence. If we are, we should have strict gun control. If we are not, we must learn to accept the massacres in our schools and shopping malls.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:33 AM on 04/06/2008

Here's a very recent school massacre you won't hear about in the American Media. A licensed, civilian shot the murderer and they were finished off by a military person at the scene. The police were outside hiding.

http://web.israelinsider.com/Articles/Security/12702.htm

There is no reason why we should 'accept' massacres at our schools or malls, or in our homes either.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:12 AM on 04/06/2008

I love Obama, but he is pandering on this issue. He isn't pro gun, he's anti gun, however I live in one state that has the most liberal gun laws, so I'm not worried, plust there are much bigger fish to fry like the economy.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:55 AM on 04/06/2008

Pandering, does that mean lying? Anything to win, right?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:52 PM on 04/06/2008

does pandering bother you, it does me. Gun control is important to me, and I thought it was to Obama, I guess it depends on where he is speaking, and what vote he is trying to get,that's disgusting! Does he have a different position for each state! Very nice!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:15 AM on 04/06/2008

Don't forget Obama's a Constitutional scholar. The Second Amendment is something he is very very familiar with, can talk at length about, and honestly cares very much about. I don't see this as pandering because Obama is not adopting a position he did not hold previously, just to gain support.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:04 AM on 04/06/2008

Bovine manure from an Obamabot. What else would you expect. The "messiah " can do no wrong.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:10 PM on 04/06/2008

I wish BOTH Hillary and Obama would come out saying that guns have no place whatsoever in our streets, especially those easily modified to become fully automatic. Our cities and our police are overwhelmed with the fear of armed drug users and criminals who have an easier time obtaining guns than they do obtaining a drivers license. Gun ownership may be protected, and should be, but out cities have a hard time combatting organized crime and homicide when gun laws are different in every state, and slack in more rural areas. I grew up in a very pro-gun family and was taught to shoot a 12 gauge at age 10, it is so disturbing that this is okay! Democrats know this, but pander to middle-america, perhaps this is our way of showing our hair on our chests?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:38 AM on 04/06/2008

Racism and Gun Control

14th Amendment Application of second amendment to freedmen.

http://www.gurapossessky.com/news/parker/documents/07-290bsacij.pdf

Georgia Carry - Racist roots of Gun Regulations

http://www.gurapossessky.com/news/parker/documents/07-290bsacGeorgiaCarry.pdf

Congress of Racial Equality - Racist Roots of Gun Control

http://www.gurapossessky.com/news/parker/documents/07290bsacCongressofRacialEquality.pdf

American Civil Rights Union

http://www.gurapossessky.com/news/parker/documents/07-290bsacAmerCvlRight.pdf

Sen Obama - for a constitutional scholar, seems unconcerned that his gun policy is not just irrelevant to firearms crime but racist as well. No matter what comes out of the Supreme Court - it will be either bad or very bad for the Senator.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:20 AM on 04/06/2008

You give a lot of links. It's unlikely that I can find time to look those up. However, on the surface, your final sentences seem ludicrous., almost laughable.

Look, there are a lot of pro-gun web sites, I know, and there is the NRA. Just giving a bunch of links means nothing because, if I take the time, I can post twice as many from the anti-gun groups.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:39 AM on 04/06/2008

Sorry, I'll try this again

These 'lotsa links' are carefully reasoned, heavily referenced serious minded briefs submitted to SCOTUS this year in relation to the so-called DC gun ban.

I stand behind my statement that Sens Clinton and Obama are going to suffer damage no matter what SCOTUS decides. The reluctance to take a side in the briefs submitted and avoidance of the issue so far in the campaign supports.

Here is one side by members of congress

http://www.gurapossessky.com/news/parker/documents/07-290bsacMembersUSSenate.pdf

Here is the other side by members of congress

http://www.gurapossessky.com/news/parker/documents/07-0290acMembersofCongress.pdf

Sen McCain took a side, neither Sens Clinton nor Obama did.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:41 AM on 04/06/2008

Pro gun???... There is no such thing in the US. To this date there are restrictions on the guns you can possess.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:07 PM on 04/05/2008
Moderator's Pick

HuffPost's Pick

We must pass laws against guns. Laws against drugs worked so well.
Criminals will always have guns and if guns are illegal there will be a new way for evil ppeople to make money.
The current laws are fine. Owning a gun doesn't make a person shoot people.
Why do people hurt other people? That is the problem that needs to be solved. American culture pays lip service to respecting people but the actions of so many institutions in the USA are disrespectful towards individual Freedom. Shooting someone is the ultimate rejection of individual freedom. ( except in defense of ones life of course)
Drugs , guns and reproductive and sexual freedom are non-issues that both the right and left indulge in. These issues are either non of anyones business or they involve inanimate objects.
It is not only against the spirit of Freedom in America and the constitution but it is a waste of time trying to regulate personal behavior and inanimate objects.
We have a violence problem in the USA, banning guns will not solve it just as banning drugs doesn't solve addiction and banning abortion doesn't stop it or prevent unwanted pregnancies.
I hope Americans will start to address the nuances and complexities of the world instead of letting media sound bites and the uninformed and emotional dictate the debate.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:24 PM on 04/05/2008

yeah those gun laws don't work in other countries either, look at England, Australia, France, German, Canada. Oh wait never mind, their laws seem to work, they have barely any gun deaths. what was it you were saying!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:18 AM on 04/06/2008

Laws against Drugs? They have not worked well. Instead it has created a very lucrative black market industry with a high turnover of dealers and therefore a constant demand for new labor. We release our orphans who are wards of some state on the streets at age 18 with $1200 to start their life with, we release criminals and mental patients with enough to make a phone call and nothing more, and we expect them to magically become productive law abiding citizens? No, drug dealing and doing drugs is sadly the most likely outcome, and the recycling within the criminal (nonjustice) sytem continues, and with the privatization of this system, a few very rich people benefit. They send lobbyists to Washington to strengthen and expand laws like 3 strikes and yer out, and to continue the process of criminalizing poverty itself. College students are selling guns and drugs to pay for school and ultimately get swallowed up by the very lifestyle that come with it, drop out or get kicked out, or arrested, addicted, etc.

Drug use, Drug dealing, mental illness, and poverty are all linked and a sytematic approach is desperately needed, and frankly a strong Democratic Congress and House with a Democratic President are desperately needed. We need to focus not only on our race for the President, but our state Senate races and local races for state Representatives. We need to regain a SUPER MAJORITY!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:49 AM on 04/06/2008

1. Guns are not drugs. Drugs cannot be used, for example, if drive by shootings and nassacres in shopping centers.

2. "Criminals will always have guns and if guns .." - that's just an opinion of an anonymous poster, nothing more.

3."The current laws are fine. "- They are not. They are inadequate and excessive gun violence is the result of that inadequacy. Countries with stric gun laws have less gun violence.

4. "Why do people hurt other people? That is the problem that needs to be solved. "- That's true, but it is not an argument for not having strict gun control.

5. "Drugs , guns and reproductive and sexual freedom are non-issues" - out of the three, only guns are used to kill others. Therefore, the three don't belong together. One cannot use drugs or sexula freedom to commit mass murder in schools, for example.

6."We have a violence problem in the USA," - that is more of an argument for gun control. Were we a peaceful society, we wouldn't need gun control.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:45 AM on 04/06/2008

Reference item 2. "Criminals will always have guns and if guns .." - that's just an opinion of an anonymous poster, nothing more.
Before the "easy availability of guns", criminals used "zip guns". These were made from ordinary pipe with a shotgun shell inside. They were just a deadly as any assault weapon used today.

Reference item 3. ."The current laws are fine. "- They are not. They are inadequate and excessive gun violence is the result of that inadequacy. Countries with strict gun laws have less gun violence.
These same countries also have traffic laws that are obeyed by their citizens. The problem isn't guns, it's the attitude of the people who think laws are for the other guy. The nicest people I have ever met were at a gunshow. Even Americans say "excuse me" when they are surrounded by others holding guns. Can you imagine anyone saying the things posted on this site, face to face, to someone who might be armed with a concealed weapon? Statistics show that when States have passed must-issue concealed carry permit laws, crime rates go down. I'm not talking about the type of permits where only the rich, connected people, politicians, and OTHER criminals can get permits, I'm talking about average law-abiding citizens who pass background checks and receive training in firearm handling.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:25 AM on 04/06/2008

Zip gun or AK-47 makes no difference troll. Either one will kill you just as dead. I for one will defend my life and the lives of my loved ones by any means possible. Including the use of a gun.

And just for you information I have done just that

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:17 PM on 04/06/2008

Reference 2: Even if true, how can there be any doubt that reducing the ready availabilty of semi-automatic and automatic weapons would make it more difficult for criminals to have guns. I am sure that "zip guns" would not be as effective as the guns carried by our police, otherwise criminals would be using those now. Besides, how come countries with strict gun laws don't have a major "zip gun" problem?

Reference 3: What you said about traffic rules is just not true. Try driving in Italy, Spain or Greece, for example. In fact, many Europeans are surprised how well Americans follow traffic rules. That said, if your point is that we are a less law abiding people, that is more of a reason that we shouldn't be trusted with guns, is it not?

The rest of your post is, of course, neither here nor there. Also, you seem to be implying that we can have politeness only out of fear of being shot. That I mind amusing.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:53 AM on 04/06/2008

Has he put on the orange Elmer Fudd suit and gone out to shoot some fenced in animal for the NRA yet?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:09 PM on 04/05/2008

The Dems used to write-off Southern voters. I think it's way past time that we write-off gun nut voters. And then pass laws that further restrict their guns and especially their ammunition. And to all those who say that drug laws don't work - well how come our prisons are filled mostly with drug offenders?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:48 AM on 04/06/2008

Obama will have a very difficult time selling himself as pro-gun with his record. Why doesn't he just honestly present his views which match those of his supporters?

Obama and Gun Control:

From the Chicago Defender, Dec. 13, 1999:

Sweeping federal gun control legislation proposed by Sen. Barack Obama (D-13th).

Make it a felony for a gun owner whose firearm was stolen from his residence which causes harm to another person if that weapon was not securely stored in that home. [!!!]

Restricting gun purchases to one weapon a month and banning the sale of firearms at gun shows except for "antique" weapons.

Increasing the licensing fee to obtain a federal firearms license.

Ban on police agencies from reselling their used weapons even if those funds are used to buy more state-of-the-art weapons for their agencies.

Wants only those over 21 who've passed a basic course to be able to buy or own a firearm.

Gun dealers sell firearms in a storefront and not from their homes while banning their business from being within five miles of a school or a park.

Banning the sale of 'junk" handguns like the popular Saturday Night Specials.

Requiring that all people working at a gun dealer undergo a criminal background check.

Gun manufacturers be required to develop safety measures that permit only the original owner of the firearm to operate the weapon purchased.

Increase the federal taxes by 500 percent on the sale of firearms,ammunition

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:02 PM on 04/05/2008

Obama will not run on his record or beliefs on the gun issue since he knows it will cost him dearly in the general election. Right or wrong, Obama, like his supporters, are against individual gun rights and for many more regulations on the manufacture, sale, ownership and possession of guns. Obama is not being honest about his position.

[Eugene Volokh, May 9, 2007 at 8:15pm] Trackbacks
"Obama's Support for a Ban on Sales and Transfers of All Semi-Automatic Weapons: Just wanted to highlight a fact I discuss in more detail in the post below: Sen. Barack Obama's stand on guns is apparently to support a ban on sales and transfers of all semi-automatic weapons.

For those not up on the details, note that this is far broader than the existing bans on fully automatics, or the bans on so-called "assault weapons." Most modern handguns (such as my own Glock 17) are semi-automatic, as are many rifles (such as my Ruger 10/22) and quite a few shotguns. And while the ban would still allow sales of revolvers, bolt-action rifles, pump-action shotguns (such as my Mossberg), and similar guns, there's good reason to think that a broad ban on semi-automatics would lead to still broader bans."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:20 PM on 04/05/2008

Define for us, please, what you mean by "individual gun rights". Is it similar to our right to own property?

And please tell us what types of guns are covered by that "right", and which are excluded, and why, and who decided that?

Now, the example you sighted involves "Sales and Transfers of all Semi-Automatic Weapons". Does being opposed to "Sales and Transfers of all Semi-Automatic Weapons" mean that one is against "individual gun rights"? By what logic?

Also, it would be nice to have the actual text of the legislation, rather than Eugene Volokh's spin on it. That way, we wouldn't be wasting time arguing about things that might not exist.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:34 PM on 04/05/2008

Read the Second Amendment. If you have that ability. It will enlighten you.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:21 PM on 04/06/2008

This might help understand Sen Obama's extremism.

http://www.ontheissues.org/2008/Barack_Obama_Gun_Control.htm

I believe he is against s&t&p of all semi-automatics. Check the section with
Source: 1998 IL State Legislative National Political Awareness Test Jul 2, 1998

As for the link you question. The link is roughly, self defense is a right - self defense is an individual responsibility - ownership of tools for self defense is allowed - semi-automatic firearms are designed for self-defense - done deal. There has been a lot of quibbling over the years on these points and a big decision is coming up.

Several of your questions were developed in the briefs submitted in the case now before the Supreme Court. All sides worked very hard to construct quality briefs. Worthwhile reading.

http://www.gurapossessky.com/news/parker/pleadings.html

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:58 PM on 04/05/2008

Funny that you call that extremism. I wonder what you would call my position, which is "an outright, total and immediate ban og all gun ownership. Change the Constitution as needed."
I looked up the first link. If anything