Pa. Voters Divided Over Obama Remarks

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MARK SCOLFORO | April 14, 2008 11:08 PM EST | AP

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Democratic president hopeful Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., center, is seen with Rep. Chaka Fattah, D-Pa., left, and Rep. Bob Brady, D-Pa., at the Sheet Metal Workers' Hall in Philadelphia, Monday, April 14, 2008. (AP Photo/Matt Rourke)

SHENANDOAH, Pa. — Yes, some Democrats in Pennsylvania's Rust Belt communities were upset by Barack Obama's suggestion that voters there "cling to guns or religion" because of bitterness about their economic lot. But many more seem to think it was no big deal _ and if there's a problem it's with the political slapfest that has followed.

Obama's comment, which the Illinois senator made during a San Francisco fundraiser last week, set off an exchange of insults between the final contenders for the Democratic presidential nomination as they vie for blue-collar support in the state's April 22 primary. Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton has criticized the comment as "elitist," while Obama has mocked the New York senator's own recent emphasis on support for gun owners' rights.

In interviews Monday in Pennsylvania communities like the ones to which Obama referred, Democrats on both sides of the race were divided over the controversy.

"It's so difficult to watch every word," said Mary Ellen Matunis, a Clinton backer from Shenandoah.

"I was not offended," she said. "Poor choice of words, but I think it was just misspoken."

Matunis, 56, is a retired teacher in this central Pennsylvania borough of barely 5,000 residents that was once a boom town of the anthracite coal industry. But that industry has been on the decline for longer than most residents have been alive, and the textile factories that followed are gone too.

Dennis Yezulinas, another Clinton supporter in Shenandoah, said he is more offended by the rhetorical fight that followed Obama's comment than by the remark itself.

"Not just for the good of the Democratic Party, but for the good of the country, they need to make it less contentious," said Yezulinas, a former state prison guard who has been laid off from a plant that manufactures doors in a neighboring town.

In the southeastern Pennsylvania community of Coatesville _ a once booming steel city outside of Philadelphia that now has empty storefronts downtown _ two Clinton supporters sharing a meal at a Coatesville restaurant said they felt Obama was wrong to stereotype small-town voters.

"It's like we're not smart enough to understand what the politicians are saying. It's an insult to our intelligence," said Susan Kamerdze, 50.

Mike Zemacke, 57, said that, while Coatesville has seen better days, he's not bitter. He said he used to work as a press operator before a disability led him to retirement.

"I'm just frustrated," he said. "I used to live a lot better than this."

At another Coatesville eatery, lifelong resident Armon Richardson said he remains firmly committed to Obama.

"We're getting in the silly season," said Richardson, 33, a computer analyst. "It's being overanalyzed."

In Pottsville, a city south of Shenandoah that also thrived during the coal boom and is now known as the home of Yuengling beer, coffeehouse owner Mary Ann Price, 56, said she is undecided about which candidate will get her vote in the primary, but that Obama's remarks won't affect her decision. She said she is more concerned about U.S. standing in the international community.

"The whole world hates us, and with good reason," she said.

Mike McGeever, 47, a Clinton backer who works for a neighborhood revitalization agency in Pottsville, called Obama's comment "uninformed, rather than elitist."

"To throw a blanket indictment out there against the people in this area, it is definitely patronizing," he said.

Truck salesman Bob Bildheiser, 49, said he is tentatively supporting Obama and that he agreed with the point that Obama was trying to make about the nation's economic problems.

"The people are bitter about the economy, about jobs, about the gas prices. It's terrible," he said.

At the California event, Obama said some small-town voters bitter about their economic circumstances "cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."

Clinton, who polls show still leading in the Pennsylvania primary, criticized the comment as "elitist and divisive," and suggested that it could cost Democrats the presidency if Obama were the nominee. Obama said he was disappointed by Clinton's criticism and questioned her opposition to the NAFTA free-trade agreement that some voters believe eliminated thousands of U.S. jobs.

___

Associated Press writers Kathy Matheson in Coatesville and Peter Jackson in Harrisburg also contributed to this report.

 
 

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- JohnTalbutt See Profile I'm a Fan of JohnTalbutt

There was a very telling vote on 2nd Amendment rights in 2006. The bill prohibited the Federal government from declaring an emergency and confiscating guns that were legal under state and federal law. Obama vote against confiscation. Hillary voted for. See link below.

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=2&vote=00202

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:25 PM on 04/17/2008
- TN See Profile I'm a Fan of TN

Obama has not made himself clear. Lou Dobbs and his guests are still saying he insulted gun owners and religion. They know better, but the average american does not. Please, Barack, when people feel they have no power over their govt. to protect the avg. joe's economic standard of living, many people will get fooled by republicans that will tell you, the dems will take your guns. Or they tell you, the dems want to make gay marriage legal, and some vote republican based on those lies. Say it over and over until it sinks into the fattest head. Dems won't take your guns, so don't vote republican based on that lie, don't cling to that lie. Dems don't have an agenda to see to it that gay marriage becomes legal, don't vote republican based on that lie, don't cling to that lie.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:53 PM on 04/16/2008
- butchie65 See Profile I'm a Fan of butchie65

The guy is from New Jersey, just read it on another blog. She tries everything she can to win. Doesn't this woman think these lies will catch up with her ?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:47 PM on 04/16/2008
- bittertypicalwhiteperson See Profile I'm a Fan of bittertypicalwhiteperson

Well he can register to vote ..... But at least Hillary does not have fake endorsements !

Today you show an endorsement for Obama from a gun group..what a farce !

The AAHSA is actually the latest in a long line of anti-gun groups camouflaging themselves as pro-hunting and pro-conservation in order to split our community. Before you give AHSA any creed " beware the wolf in sheep"s clothing, and see for yourself:

http://nssf.com/share/pdf/AHSA_Fact_Sheet.pdf

Obamas real stand in his own words is to disarm America

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dl32Y7wDVDs

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:30 PM on 04/16/2008
- TN See Profile I'm a Fan of TN

No sane american wants an arms race. Only idiots think they can arm themselves, but tell every other country you cant. Sorry after Bush, no country will ever trust america again. Those days are gone, thanks to the GOP and the idiots that voted for them.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:59 PM on 04/16/2008
- kenjisan See Profile I'm a Fan of kenjisan

her own words have been used to prove what a liar she is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exsmFDYyK4U

it's kind of hard to deny this - when it comes out of your own mouth.

oh what tangled webs we weave when we venture to deceive

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:26 PM on 04/16/2008
- RoseFromPhila See Profile I'm a Fan of RoseFromPhila

Yes, I am bitter because 'HE IS AN ELITIEST" and it is sad many do not see it..... He loves lobbyists and their Money, Money, Money.... Okay, we hear how Michelle was middle class and Barack wa raised by a white mother on foodstamps and his father had left when he was two and blah, blah, blah, we get the past but now look at then both >>>>"THEY ARE ELITIEST" and love the lobbyist how about the back door remarks with the SanFran group (elitiest) and the dinner party he says he and Michelle never attended but did for a close friend of Rezko (elitist) and he did as it came out last week at the Rezko hearings..... he is so pulling the wool of the eyes of many......

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:58 PM on 04/16/2008
- kenjisan See Profile I'm a Fan of kenjisan

helloooo... knock, knock... check out the video above your comment.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:27 PM on 04/16/2008
- jedd See Profile I'm a Fan of jedd

This might be news to you, but everyone who has occupied the Whitehouse has been an elite part of American society. Would you rather the cashier at the local WalMart run for president? They're elite because they know more than the avergae American about economics and foreign policy. All the people running for president are millionaires. Obama is the poorest of the candidates. No one is running to be Best Friend in Chief. I want someone to know a lot more than I do to be in the Whitehouse. If that makes the person an elitist, so be it.

McCain and Clinton get PAC money from lobbyist but Obama does not. He gets money from everyday people and will not have to be beholden to special interest groups like his opponents. Stop bringing up Rezko. There was no wrongdoing found on Obama's part. It's smoke and mirrors with no substance.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:48 PM on 04/16/2008
- RoseFromPhila See Profile I'm a Fan of RoseFromPhila

Okay how about his banker contributors, lawyers groups, who know and have an expertise in gathering front groups and as someone else said use "astroturf tactics" ...... yes, they know how to exploit the masses, they diversify and funnel this money He is not for the american people he is for corporations He is someone the ole croonies in DC can groom and be told what to do as he constantly screws up when his speech writers are not around...... Oh yes, these oldsters will groom him and only him because they know they cannot make Hillary do what they want. She has a mind of her own and he is a sheep in wolf's clothing for sure, who has not been vetted as yet and it is coming out in drips and drabs.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:33 PM on 04/16/2008
- lm945 See Profile I'm a Fan of lm945

Whatever you may think of how Obama phrased it (personally, I had no problem with it), the thought and reasoning behind it was dead on.

How can you be offended by the truth?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:16 PM on 04/16/2008
- SEQUOIABISON See Profile I'm a Fan of SEQUOIABISON

That still leaves a lot of brain dead voters who are offended by his remarks, but they probably would never have voted for Obama anyway, this incident just gives them a legitimate excuse to align themselves with their innate bigotry and call it something else.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:18 PM on 04/16/2008
- ARealist See Profile I'm a Fan of ARealist

I don't know what to think about Obama. Negative things just keep coming out about him. Now CBS is reporting more bad associates and it makes me wonder if he is going to be crushed in the general election. Here is the article by a CBS reporter.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/04/11/opinion/main4009369.shtml#ccmm

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:57 AM on 04/16/2008
- CindyM2008 See Profile I'm a Fan of CindyM2008

It's not CBS reporting it. This is an National Review opinion piece. The author is conservative (opinion) columnist Andrew C. McCarthy.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:53 PM on 04/16/2008
- IRIE See Profile I'm a Fan of IRIE

If you don'd know what to think about Obama then why did you post the following? Your mind seemed pretty made up.

"Daniel, He is unelectable as he is an apologists for the black people again, only in a different package. Before everyone but blacks knew about the Rev. Wright situation, they were willing to vote for him. Now they find out that he is just like Al and Jesse only he is much more attractive in many ways. But they just don't want a Black apologist and enabler as their President. posted 03/26/2008 at 14:10:53 "

Are you a paid staffer for HRC?

YOU ARE AS BAD AN ACTRESS AS CLINTON.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:08 PM on 04/16/2008
- me2you See Profile I'm a Fan of me2you

Next time, why don't you directly link to Rush-fat-face article. The national review article is the same old school of old repubs.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:11 AM on 04/16/2008
- rollingdivision See Profile I'm a Fan of rollingdivision

Special notices!!! Though your candidate must first win your party's nomination, the goal of the presidential election campaign is to elect your candidate to the presidency. The general election will be decided by independent and moderate voters, not Republican or Democratic partisans. If your candidate makes your partisans happy, but not independents and moderates happy, you lose. So it doesn't matter if Democrats are fine with Obama's remarks, it's all about the swing voters.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:17 AM on 04/16/2008
- Brooklynindy See Profile I'm a Fan of Brooklynindy

Rolling, Ditto for Clinton. And Clinton has not shown the ability to attract independents and moderates. Quite the contrary. And Obama even now has more of their support than she does.

For the record, I'm an Obama supporter but I know we have two outstanding candidates here. For my own well-researched and carefully considered reasons I believe Obama to be the best of two greats, but I'll vote for whomever is the Dem nominee in November.

However, though I would vote for her, I have never at any moment thought that she was electable. My roots are in Texas and Indiana, and I can tell you that the observation that Hillary Clinton will galvanize Repub (& independent) voters like nothing else can is spot on. She has no chance.

Just an opposing view for your consideration...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:03 AM on 04/16/2008
- tedbear See Profile I'm a Fan of tedbear

There just cannot be that many stupid people in this country, and I am from Pennsylvania originally, and don't think the people there are any more stupid than anywhere else. Now I live in Ohio. Yesterday I was in a tire store waiting for my car, and another patron and I started talking about the campaign. We were both women about 60 yrs. old. She said to me, "I don't really want to vote for Hillary, as a Democrat I shouldn't vote for McCain, but Obama is a Muslim.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This was a woman who appears to know what time it is, and yet SHE THINKS HE IS A MUSLIM. OUTRAGEOUSLY UNINFORMED.

This kind of thinking scares me. Then, I will think that if people weren't majorly stupid, they would not be voting for Hillary Clinton. Anyone with eyes can see she is acting as if she is ,whatever she needs to be, to get your vote, and she is a BAD actress. WAKE UP PENNSYLVANIA!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:35 AM on 04/16/2008
- Brooklynindy See Profile I'm a Fan of Brooklynindy

So Tedbear, how did you respond to her? What did you say? Though you were outraged I hope your response was diplomatic. We've got our work cut out for us from here to November. He's still largely unknown to many, and it's up to us to help establish a clear picture of who he is and what he represents. And that has to be done without any condescension whatsoever.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:07 AM on 04/16/2008
- givetruthachance See Profile I'm a Fan of givetruthachance

I can attest that what Barack said about people being bitter is absolutely true, at least for some folks. My father (from PA btw) died bitter, for the reasons Barack spoke of, feeling the "government didn't give a rat's ass" about people like him.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:08 AM on 04/16/2008
- realrick See Profile I'm a Fan of realrick

One thing I've found fascinating about this whole "bitter" nonsense: Just how dog-eared and thin-skinned a lot of people are about the imagery of small-town America.

Obama said that there might be some "bigoted people" in small town America. HORRORS!! How DARE he? And, he said it IN SAN FRANCISCO, which as, we all know, is not part of the real America. Well, he's just "out of touch". Which seems to be the CW of Obama's opponents to the "bitter" comment.

Well, reality check:

--Foreclosures and job losses are happening in rural areas as well as urban areas. Seems like both areas are suffering. But, no one's bitter or bigoted from the experience, right?

---Disgusting crime happens everywhere. A truck dragged James Byrd after he was dead because he was black in rural TX, not San Fran. Matthew Shepard was beaten and left for dead in WY, not San Francisco.

--How about serial killers? Whether you're talking Gacy, Ramirez, Gilmore or BTK, they've both got 'em.

--As weird as any gay pride parade may be, does it top that polygamy cult in TX for weird? And, to my knowledge, no kid was ever molested at a gay pride parade.

People need to realize that small-town America is not some Capra movie or Rockwell painting or Andy Griffith episode. It's just as real and flawed as anywhere else. Just like San Francisco, It can take, and could use, some constructive criticism.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:27 PM on 04/15/2008
- MadeinAmericaProud See Profile I'm a Fan of MadeinAmericaProud

Realrick,

Don't incest in small town and urban America.

Bottom line:

These articles are written in sound bites, like all the other sound bites. It's keeps us writing in to help the blog sites pay their bill and get paid.

The only article I read in Huffpost that told me a complete version of what really happen was Mr. Coleman.

Had I not read Obama was asked a question as well as the other detail so many of these poorly written articles, I feel I would have to step away from this outhouse blog site. It is starting to smell bad.

Only a few people on these sites keep saying the same crap over and over. some articles that Main street America should be up in arms about not one comment is made.

McCain stump speech on4/15/08 sounded more like Obama than Obama. McCain trash the word "HOPE" and Obama book The Audacity to Hope". McCain on the proposed bills to make so many changes, you think he was given his state of the union speech.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:32 AM on 04/16/2008
- Zeusthunderbolt See Profile I'm a Fan of Zeusthunderbolt

With inflation eating away our savings, declining buying power, fuel cost and food cost going thru the roof almost daily, I am amazed that a whole lot more people, are not bitter. This economic downturn will swallow the white collar republicans, who always felt beyong the reach of misfortune. Only if this downturn lasts a few years, that our countrymen will look beyond gays, guns, world domination and the political hatred spewed and swallowed.

Only if a vast majority feels their livelihoods threatend, will it understand the pain of a town lost tio lost jobs.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:13 PM on 04/15/2008
- Doofus See Profile I'm a Fan of Doofus

Heard a Repo congressman yesterday remark that gas prices have gone up
at least a buck since Demos won in '06, Nancy Pelosi has done NOTHING about it.

Given the limited short-term political memories of 'most of the people, some of
the time', this could be effective Strategery for November, $10T National Debt or not.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:48 PM on 04/16/2008
- riverhouse See Profile I'm a Fan of riverhouse

Oil was $25 a barrel when GWB came into office. The price hit $115 today.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:39 PM on 04/16/2008
- Arouet See Profile I'm a Fan of Arouet

Amazing how the media confuses wealth and elitism. You can be a billionaire Texan and still be a good ol' boy. And you can be an impoverished artist in Brooklyn and still be a coastal Metrosexual.

Barack's problem is that he has no natural ethnic tribe. That is why he makes dumb remarks about Arugula and bitterness and bowls when he shouldn't. Raised in Indonesia and Hawaii, he is tone deaf to the nuances of Americana in a way that say, Al Sharpton, would never be.

I especially love the "raised by a single mom" angle, as if he had been some poor waif in the ghetto. His father was one of the smartest people in Kenya. His mother was a Ph. D., someone avant garde enough in 1960's America to marry an African and an Asian ...and a non-religious freethinker to boot. His grandmother was a bank officer.

Look, a lot of us here on Huffpost are Opera lovin', Sushi slurpin', Scotch swillin' nattering nabobs of negativism, who have never fired a gun, and only visit temples of superstition for a friend's wedding.

But we are not running for office.

Barack is clearly not yet ready. Time to fold his tent for 2008. He is only 46, and will have many more chances in years to come. Settle for Veep. It's only the second highest office in the land.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:55 PM on 04/15/2008
- Rose52 See Profile I'm a Fan of Rose52

I hate opera and sushi, drink vodka not scotch, never fired a gun and go to church once in a while.
I'm probably more optimistic than not and yet I understand where Obama was coming from with his comments. You don't have to live someone's life to understand it . So he gave voice to what he thinks is going on in small towns. I respect him for that. HRC on the other hand used it shamelessly and I would like to think that small town America will see thru that. There's my optimism again.
Obama 08

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:41 PM on 04/15/2008
- realrick See Profile I'm a Fan of realrick

The guy lived and worked in Chicago for 20 years!

That's about as getting in touch with America as it gets.

btw, your stereotypes about the visitors to this site are both false and disgusting.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:33 PM on 04/15/2008
- mesuki See Profile I'm a Fan of mesuki

Who the hell do you think you are Arouet?............ Telling Obama you don't think he's ready to run for office.If your'e not a fan of his now you sure as hell won't be in 2012. I guess you think that hillary is more qualified with her make believe experience. People like you who constantly degrade Obama,wouldn't vote for him no matter what he does. So don't waste your time bashing him here,just vote for the person you were gonna vote for anyway!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:27 PM on 04/15/2008
- Arouet See Profile I'm a Fan of Arouet

Au contraire, hold your friendly fire....I would vote for Obama against The Mad Midget McNasty. The problem is not getting us limousine liberals to vote for Obama in November.

The problem is that the white booboise in the Rust and Corn Belts, both male and female, will go heavily for Patriot John and his Pretty Cindy against the Obamas.

Hillary though could take a chunk of that critical electorate, enough to win the electoral college.

The choice is now between Hillary and Pres. McCain.....after Rev. "Damn America", "Typical White Woman", and bitter armed men "clinging" to the opium of the masses, he is too burdened to win.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:46 PM on 04/16/2008