Read more reactions from Huffington Post bloggers to ABC's Pennsylvania Democratic debate
During Wednesday night's Pennsylvania debate, George Stephanopoulos didn't flinch from trying to smear Barack Obama by association with former 60's radical Bill Ayers. Too bad George didn't ask Hillary about her own summer spent working for a law firm run by Communists.
The facts: Obama met with former Weather Underground radical Ayers and his wife, former 60's SDS leader Bernardine Dohrn, at a 1995 Chicago meeting. From 1999-2002, Obama served on the board of a charity organization with Ayers that gave out a couple of grants. Now, I knew these Weathermen folks back in the 60's, and they were quite unsavory then. There were plenty of us who were in SDS at that time who thought the Weathermen were despicable. And, frankly, I have no particular affection for them now. I found Ayers' memoir, published in 2001, to be execrable.
But by the time Obama met them in the 90's, they had cleared their violent past with the criminal justice system, they had served their punishment, gone back to school and by then become legitimate and even respected educators, and players in Chicago liberal politics.
When Ayers and Dohrn were running amuck advocating violent revolution, Obama was literally eight years old.
Compare and contrast those facts with Hillary's own association with 60's radicals. In the summer of 1969, when Hillary was just entering Yale Law School, she went to work for the foremost radical law firm in, yes, Berkeley. Carl Bernstein recounts the episode in his Hillary biography of last year titled "A Woman in Charge."
This is what Bernstein told interviewer Jon Wiener last summer:
"That summer she went to work at the most important radical law firm in America at that point: Treuhaft, Walker and Bernstein in Oakland. They defended the Panthers. Two of their partners were members of the Communist Party--including Bob Treuhaft, who was married to Jessica Mitford. I talked to Bob Treuhaft not long before he died, and he said he was certain that Hillary came there because she subscribed to some of the kind of law they practiced and the kind of clients they defended. In her so-called autobiography, "Living History," she put in a couple of sentences about living in Berkeley with Bill that summer and working at that law firm, but she makes it sound like their work focused on postal rate increases. There's not a word about radicals."
I have no desire to flesh out any of this information as my position is simple. Every one deserves the best legal defense possible, and I have no problem with Hillary having worked for a law firm run by Communists and engaged in defending Huey Newton and other radicals accused of killing cops and other violent acts.
But the hypocrisy by Clinton on this matter and the acrobatic cherry-picking by Stephanopoulos are simply staggering.
Read more reactions from Huffington Post bloggers to ABC's Pennsylvania Democratic debate
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I always enjoyed Marc Cooper. I wsh her were back on the air.
America is on guard of the terrorists and those that will undermine America from within. We have suspicions about Bush and Cheney and Rove and Gonzales and Halliburton and Blackwater and now we should add Marc Cooper. And we shouid check out the writers that pen for the military but do not do it openly.And how about he media that airs the news scripted by the administration without citing the source. Talk about a free press. Better yet, don't talk. Yell like hell and keep yelling.
Cool. .... maybe the flames/heat from the jets has cooked some brains. When they cool think.
Early in the campaign, I was in favor of Clinton, but as we've seen, she will do anything and everything like the R's to win an election. She lies, deceives, tells half truths and is sneaky. Who would want someone like her as president.? We've already had 7 very long years with another jerk. Come on, we can do better with Obama--also, she is much like her unloving partner, who also lies.
The post by Vajara is politics? I see no criticism of programs, advocacy or even talk of it. All that I see is simply repeating GOP lies. There is no elucidation of how Obama is to the left or is even progressive. Obama has told plenty of lies as well. So I fail to see how mistatements, lies, exagerations mean a whole lot since I have yet to find a candidate that does NOT do that. I have a LOT more problems with Clinton than most, but she is the one who has the most coherent, practical programs of any candidate.
I can see that Mr. Cooper was not around at the time of the Panthers since he would know that Charles Garry and HIS firm were the lawyers for the Panthers. As a participant in going to that trial in New Haven, I am outraged that he accepts such LIES as are perpetrated by the GOP and the right wing. It simply shows that he is a GOP dupe and willing to use their lies in furtherance of his candidate.
This is similar to the lie about Bill Clinton pardoning the two women of the Weathermen. He did NOT pardon them. Their sentences were commuted, there is a big difference if you can understand it. They had served over 15 years of a 40 and 58 years sentence which was FAR more than the average time for their crime of transporting explosives. I suppose you are in favor of increasing prison time for political offenses too. Go back to the GOP or stop buying into their lies.
I am a long time radical and now liberal supporter of Clinton because Obama is to the right of Clinton on most of his positions. You sound more like McCain and the GOP. The fact is that comparing even the CP with the Weathermen is absurd. It is even worse when you slander the lawyers who were defending Panthers who were the VICTIMS of ILLEGAL police actions as being the equivalent of the Weathermen. Clinton should be proud of the fact that she worked to defend her clients which is what good lawyers do. The problem with Ayers is NOT what he did back then, but the FACT that he thinks he did GOOD and did not do enough BOMBINGS today!
If McCain sat on a board with a Nazi, it would be a real scandal and it would be wrong. The same standard applies to our candidates as well Ayers is an unrepentent terrorist, Stalinist, elitist, and totalitarian today. THAT is the problem. I remember when it was a big scandal if a candidate belonged to an all white country club which was not illegal or even necessarily racist. Sitting on a board and accepting support from such people as Ayers is today is a bad act and is a legitimate indicator of Obama's lack of sense.
Obama's "connection" to Ayers is another "swiftboat" pack of lies and distortions shouted by the right, to be repeated by the media sheep to influence those too stupid to think on their own.
Obama was 6 - 8 years old when Ayers was protesting the war. When McCain was 6 - 8 years old some of his future partners in the US Senate were in the KKK. And he later served on boards and in commitees with these admitted former racists.
Would a thinking person not hold McCain "just as responciple" for the long past crimes of his "future" associates as the right wants to hold Obama for his "sins" as a child?
Think people!
Now if either one of their pizza boys, pool boys, maids, or accountants of these fine Americans is found to have committed a crime in he past ... or in the near future, I am sure that will tip the scales of "justice" and the results of this election .
You have to be old enough to remember some things. Wasn't that the "Tommie the Commie" firm?
Was that the firm that defended the murder suspects in the Black Panther Shackley (I am not sure of the spelling) torture and murder? Yes, it was said that Hillary did work there.
All of that was a long time ago. But, they shouldn't try and use things against Obama unless they want things to come back at them.
I'm curious as to what a "communist" law firm would be like.
Do they not own their law books? Do they have to apply to the Ministry of Reproduction to get a copy made? Does Writing Implement Factory #3 supply their pencils?
The mere fact that they were attorneys acting as an adversary against the government belies they're being Communists. By leftists work for the state.
The press has given them a pass on so many things. No wonder she went into this thinking she would have it all sewn up by the first of January!
Some posters on here are blaming conservative news meda outlets for not reporting this. If they had would any of us have listened???
Why didn't the so-called liberal news media outlets not report it? Wheter we agree with the choiced she has made or not, at least the truth would be out there.
This is what I cannot stand about the Clintons. When they were young they embraced the far left. Once they went on to run for public office they hid their past alliances and the press (liberal and conservative) helped them to do it.
But, I doubt that Hillary and Bill would have been elected dog catcher with the stances they took in their Yale years.
Its all shocking to some people but the norm to others.
What's soooo telling is that the republicans and the media are not bringing these things up. It's not that they don't know about them, it's that they desperately want her to be the nominee, so they are waiting. They don't want to bring them up now and spoil her chances of getting the nomination. They want to wait until she is the nominee and then they will destroy her. They know she is the weaker candidate. If they thought otherwise, they would want Obama to be the nominee, and they would be attacking her not him. McCain aides have even admitted that he would much prefer to run against her. Why else does he have NOTHING critical to say about her and only criticizes Obama. God, democrats are so foolish if they don't see what's going on here...
And people are actually voting for this woman to be our next president. Now that's staggering.
WHY was Hillary's LACK of a flag pin not an item of intense Stephanopoulosian interest? And where were the clips of Perfectly Patriotic Pennsylvanians showing concern about her jewely selections?
Hillary said her grandfather worked in a lace factory in Scranton until he retired. Was he "working the line" all that time, as she implied? Does anyone have the skinny on Mr. Rodham's work history?
The American Political system.
Death by innuendo and association.
And if that doesn't kill them - then dig into their PARENTS PAST.
Yeah, that's it - - - - the SINS of the fathers WILL visit the children, and THEY will be made to PAY
This article underscores in bold "red" the falsity of Hillary's claim of being fully vetted. That's why the right wing has been so eager to have HRC as their opponent.
I agree. She knows what has not been released yet and would like everyone to stop looking for more stuff. Fact is, the Republicans have a very well thought out list of things Hillary - a flow chart, if you will. They will simply go down that chart as needed to stop Hillary with yet unreleased stuff. Barack poses a new problem for them. They now have to compile a list on him, just in case. The major problem for the Republicans is that they have invested so much time, money and energy on the presumptive Democratic candidate, Hillary, that they may be caught with little on Barack. Furthermore, since they would rather run against Hillary, they are actually using some of their valuable smear on Barack now to help Hillary win the primary. So if she loses, their "shit closet" will contain even less shit to use against Barack. In short, for the traditionalists the world is spinning the wrong way. This will be fun!
As I have said before regarding Clinton, "people who live in glass houses should not throw stones".
Another good one is, "Whenever you point the finger of blame at another, there are always three fingers pointing back at you".
Ofcourse, what is true is that neither Clinton or Obama have given us any evidence that their politics are reflective of those contacts they've had in their younger years.
Let's remember folks, that no matter what, we cannot have another Republican as president. Especially not one as conservative as McCain.
PumaJ, you said it well. You're absolutely right. We absolutely cannot, as you said, have another Republican president as conservative as McCain, not after eight disastrous years of Bushy Boy.
Neither Hillary nor Barack is any kind of saint. They ARE human, after all. But, come on, people, there should be a time limit -- for both politicians and the media -- as to how far back into a candidate's past one should be allowed to go to try and smear someone who's running for elective office. Come on! The '60s?!? For Pete's sake! Geez! While they're at it, how about going back to their childhoods for some "dirt.." Did Barack cheat at marbles on the school playground? If Hillary ran for student body president in high school and won, did she rig the election? SHEESH!! Give me a break!
Of course, we have to look at the candidates in the near past, present and future, unless it's their own family who do the bad deed!
This blog is infuriating. It follows the same pattern that I have witnessed in the HuffPo. Whenever Obama has to answer an uncomfortable question one of you radical Obama supporters has to hunt down something to say about Clinton that is as bad or worse. Don't you realize that you are the ones who are driving the wedge between the democrats. Obama answered the question. He said he was only 8 years old when the Weathermen existed as a terrorist group. By bringing up anything you consider equally culpable about Hillary, you keep this story alive and you alienate half of the democrats, voters you will sorely miss in the Fall.
You're right, Suprshrink -- by demonizing our fellow Democrats and Progressives, we run the very real risk of handing the election to the GOP by default.
There's nothing wrong with America that we can't be solve by becoming better Americans. Democrats can only benefit by abandoning the GOP-flavored politics of personal destruction and adopting a higher, more positive standard of behavior.
Talk about calling the kettle black! Hillary Clinton needs to keep her trap shut -- period. She's her own worst enemy and the ironic thing is, she doesn't realize it.
Well if you hate her so much, then you should be happy that "she's her own worst enemy" and there should be no reason for all the horrible, insulting, vitriolic things Obama supporters repeatedly get away with posting about her on this site. You pour hateful insults on her, and then you get all bent out of shape if a reporter asks your candidate a perfectly reasonable but uncomfortable question. Yeah--so Hillary worked with Bob Treuhaft's law firm 35 years ago. Treuhaft, along with his wife Jessica, were very nice people incidentally, and the insinuation that just because they were socialists they were also "radicals" in the sense that the Weathermen were is libelous. They, unlike Obama's buddies, NEVER advocated blowing anything up, or killing police officers. And Hillary's associations of 35 years ago, when the vast majority of young American students were virulently against the Vietnam War, are a lot less "current" than Mr. Obama's associations with Bill Ayers that continue to this day.
Hillary Clinton is taking the Democratic Party down because she is angry and BITTER about the fact that she actually had to compete for the position. She is much like the movie queens of yester-year who saw it as the most deplorable of insults, if they were asked to do a screen test. If she thinks she is helping the party or anyone else by doing the GOP' work for them, then the question must seriously be raised as to what her real plan is.
Hillary is trying to save the party from putting McNasty in office. She sees Obama will get his butt kicked in the general. Last night was just another pointer that Obama is not yet ready for prime time. He will be, but he needs several years seasoning.
What is your objective? Win the White House or to run Obama?
I an independant voter and Obama supporter will vote for Senator Clinton if she is the nominee. I beleive she is no more experienced or ready to be president than Senator Obama but will suppport the Democratic nominee. I will reluctantly vote for her rather than threaten to vote for Senator McCain who most likely will continue to lead this country down a slippery slope.
I think Hillary would be a fine president, but spare me the ridiculous nobility bull****. She's not running to "save the party". She's not running because "Obama will get his butt kicked". She's running because she wants to be president. The End.
And why is Obama running? No candidate for president has a small ego, not Clinton and certainly not Obama. Both of them are running because they want to be president.
Both, and they intersect on election day.
She had much the same experience that all First Ladies have. As for baggage, She often brags about the fact that "SHE" has a lot of baggage and that people have rummaged around in it over and over again. I voted for her husband both times and remember well the dirty laundry that is in there, In particular, a blue dress belonging to Monica Lewinsky. Hillary knew all those years that he was a womanizer but she and he lied time and again about it. After all the lies they took turns blaming it on everybody but themselves. If she thinks that republicans won't use her baggage against her, then I say she is lacking in that all important leadership quality, Judgement and should not be President.
I agree. Hillary showed her real colors with her description of Tusla threat. What was she doing in Oklahoma anyway?
As much as it pains me to help the McCain effort, I feel obliged to support Barack Obama by heaping a little dirt on Hillary Clinton:
Obama has been attacked for some supposed 'link' to 60's African American radicals who blew up empty buildings (the only people who died were bombmakers). What about Hillary's links to Puerto Rican radicals who also blew up buildings but actually *tried* (and succeeded) to killed people? (Armed Forces for National Liberation - the FALN.) They were pardoned by Bill Clinton in 1999, after an approach had been made to Hillary's senate campaign office. It was felt the pardons would secure the Puerto Rican vote and help HRC's efforts to become Senator in NYC. So Clinton granted the pardons.
If you think I'm making this up then just google 'Bill Clinton Pardons Puerto Rican Bombers'
What an incredible range of beliefs- from red baiting to global warming warnings. The issue is that the media (owned by a handful of corporations) are virtually all that most people have to give them information, and the only sphere for political debates for president. All of us should be outraged, not just by the clusterfuck of last night's poorly done "debate"- but because our worlds are shaped by such forces. As some wise person said- if you REALLY wanted change you would have voted for Ralph, Dennis or Ron. Everyone else is owned by the same masters- spinning left and right.
Clinton will do anything to win. The critizism that she might make Obama unelectable sails right over her head because, of course, SHE, Hilary Clinton, WILL BE the nominee. Bigots are grateful to Clinton because after the "bitter" ado, they can not vote for Obama not because they do not want to, but because Obama is predudiced against "us". So twisted.
Hillary should be called on to denounce Bill for his war potesting and association with the communists at Oxford while he was dodging the draft.
Posted April 16, 2008 | 11:06 PM (EST)