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My Conversation With the Dalai Lama: The Convergence of Science and Spirituality, Part 2 (VIDEO)

Posted: 05/15/2012 8:36 pm

London -- At a lunch in the crypt at St. Paul's Cathedral before the Dalai Lama received the Templeton Prize on Monday, I was seated next to Canon Mark Oakley. "We need to move beyond relevance to resonance," he said.

It was a call to move beyond the shallows to the depths, beyond the passing novelties of the moment to the echoes of the soul. The Canon summed up the vicious circle we too often find ourselves caught in: "We are," he said, "spending money we don't have on things we don't want in order to impress people we don't like."

To find the peace of mind that alone can replace this aimless search which has led to an epidemic of stress, anxiety, and drugs -- legal and illegal -- the Dalai Lama is looking to science (specifically neuroscience) to convince a skeptical, increasingly secular society of the power of contemplation and compassion to change our lives and our world.

As he wrote in his 2005 book, The Universe in a Single Atom: The Convergence of Science and Spirituality:

The great benefit of science is that it can contribute tremendously to the alleviation of suffering at the physical level, but it is only through the cultivation of the qualities of the human heart and the transformation of our attitudes that we can begin to address and overcome our mental suffering... We need both, since the alleviation of suffering must take place at both the physical and the psychological levels.

It is for this decades-long passion to bring together science and spirituality that he was awarded the Templeton Prize, a $1.7-million honor given to "entrepreneurs of the spirit" who make "an exceptional contribution to affirming life's spiritual dimension, whether through insight, discovery, or practical works." The prize, the motto of which is "how little we know, how eager to learn," has been given annually since being established in 1972.

In awarding the Templeton Prize to the Dalai Lama, the organizers cited his "engagement with science and with people far beyond his own religious traditions," and the fact that "for the past 25 years, he has focused on the connections between the investigative traditions of science and Buddhism and encouraged serious scientific investigative reviews of, for instance, the power of compassion and kindness and its broad potential to address the world's fundamental problems."

Contained within that citation are three themes I focused on in my interview with him: his work combining scientific investigation with religious exploration; his thoughts on compassion; and his techniques for increasing our capacity for it, including, of course, sleep!

Of course, these three themes are all inextricably bound together. According to the Dalai Lama, science and Buddhist thought share many things:

On the philosophical level, both Buddhism and modern science share a deep suspicion of any notion of absolutes. ... Both Buddhism and science prefer to account for the evolution and emergence of the cosmos and life in terms of the complex interrelations of the natural laws of cause and effect. From the methodological perspective, both traditions emphasize the role of empiricism.

While the Dalai Lama contends that religious claims must give way to the empirical findings of science, he also believes we must "ensure that science never becomes divorced from the basic human feeling of empathy with our fellow beings."

Or, as he put in his 2004 book, The Wisdom of Forgiveness, co-authored with Victor Chan, "To utilize technology more constructively, inner peace is the most important factor. That's the main reason to have closer relations between modern science and ancient human thought."

When the two come together, the result is the cultivation of connection -- of empathy and compassion. What's extraordinary about the Dalai Lama is his capacity for empathy in the face of all that he's endured -- sustained onslaughts not just against his people but against him, as well. China, of course, has been brutally occupying his homeland since 1951, and he has been in exile since 1959. The list of human rights abuses against the people of Tibet is appallingly long, and those abuses continue to this day. According to the Human Rights Watch, China responded to a 2008 uprising in Tibet by "brutalizing detainees and torturing suspects in custody." In the past year alone, some 30 Tibetan monks have self-immolated in protest.

And though the Dalai Lama has been in exile for over 50 years and strictly advocates non-violence, such is the power of his teachings that the Chinese government treats him as an enormous threat. Among the attacks it has made on him are claims:

Despite this relentless demonization, he's remained among the world's foremost practitioners of the cultivation of compassion.

"We have to make every effort to promote human affection," he says. "While we oppose violence or war, we must show there is another way -- a nonviolent way. Now look at humanity as a whole. Today's reality: whole world almost like one body. ... Our future depends on global well-being."

At the heart of this approach is the Buddhist belief in the mutability of consciousness -- the idea that we can, through certain practices, change our inner being. "It means that the cultivation of loving-kindness can over a period diminish the force of hate in the mind," he explains. Unlike our physical qualities, "the qualities of the mind have the potential for limitless development," which means that "it is possible for a mental quality like compassion to be developed to a limitless degree."

How can this be done? One way is through the practice of mindfulness, focusing one's mind by focusing on a single process, most commonly breathing. Another technique is one he calls "giving and taking." This is how he describes it: "I make visualization: send my positive emotions like happiness, affection to others. Then another visualization. I visualize receiving their sufferings, their negative emotions. I do this every day. I pay special attention to the Chinese -- especially those doing terrible things to the Tibetans."

One of his goals in bringing science and Buddhism together is to study and enhance the transformative effects of these practices. Since 1987, he's been organizing dialogues between scientists and Buddhist thinkers and practitioners on a range of subjects, from physics and astronomy to empathy and compassion.

"These are times," he says:

...when destructive emotions like anger, fear and hatred are giving rise to devastating problems throughout the world. But I believe we have a valuable opportunity to make progress in dealing with them, through a collaboration between religion and science...


Experiments have already been carried out that show some practitioners can achieve a state of inner peace, even when facing disturbing circumstances. The results show such people to be happier, less susceptible to destructive emotions, and more attuned to the feelings of others. These methods are not just useful, but cheap: you don't need to buy anything or make anything in a factory. You don't need a drug or an injection.

So how can we spread these ideas? How can we scale them to meet the huge challenges we're facing all over the world? A good way to start is by trying to emulate this remarkable man's approach to living: "The important thing is that my daily life should be something useful to others," he said last year. "As soon as I wake up in the morning, I shape my mind. The rest of the day, my body, speech, mind are dedicated to others."

Call it step one on our journey from "relevance to resonance."

Watch my conversation with the Dalai Lama here (with a video slideshow here).


Add your voice to the conversation on Twitter: twitter.com/ariannahuff

 
 
 
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London -- At a lunch in the crypt at St. Paul's Cathedral before the Dalai Lama received the Templeton Prize on Monday, I was seated next to Canon Mark Oakley. "We need to move beyond relevance to res...
London -- At a lunch in the crypt at St. Paul's Cathedral before the Dalai Lama received the Templeton Prize on Monday, I was seated next to Canon Mark Oakley. "We need to move beyond relevance to res...
 
 
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Nadine B. Hack
CEO beCause Global Consulting
11:10 AM on 05/30/2012
Indeed, the alleviation of suffering worldwide must take place on the physical and psychological levels for all human beings. And, while most of us are not as focused on the more noble goals in life as the Dalai Lama is minute by minute every single day, we certainly have an obligation to devote significant energy to the goal of alleviating the suffering of all.
02:54 PM on 05/20/2012
Economic not spiritual leadership is needed in the real world, spirituality is a personal affair, con men as the Dalai Lama should be ignored. Dalai was booted out of China and he will also be booted out of the homes of enlightened people. He has no shame.
02:48 PM on 05/20/2012
Arianna wrote: “To find the peace of mind that alone can replace this aimless search which has led to an epidemic of stress, anxiety, and drugs -- legal and illegal -- the Dalai Lama is looking to science (specifically neuroscience) to convince a skeptical, increasingly secular society of the power of contemplation and compassion to change our lives and our world.”

I’m an atheist and believe that government should not favor religion over non-religion (what some people mean by secularist). And I believe that “contemplation and compassion” can help make the world better. They are not sufficient. But they are helpful. So, one can be an atheist secularist and also believe that “contemplation and compassion” can help make the world better.

As for the issue of drugs, it is important to note that drugs can sometimes be good for some people to take. For instance, some people in chemotherapy benefit significantly from occasionally smoking marijuana. And antidepressant medication has helped a lot of people cope with depression. Psychotherapy and contemplation are also very important. But sometimes it is also good for people to be on antidepressants.
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kooldalai
There is no spoon
05:59 PM on 05/20/2012
The Dalai Lama knows that drugs save lives and are used for health reasons....he takes medications for a medical issue he has...he was talking about using drugs as an escape from reality which only serves to make matters worse not better.
06:34 PM on 05/18/2012
This is a very insightful article and we need more like this to inspire and empower others to make a shift and create positivity in our world understanding that we are all interconnected and by helping other people excel we also excel. www.the-spiritualawakening.com
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ftkl1234
05:53 PM on 05/17/2012
It's like humanizing all our celebrities that make them less glamorourous, mysterious and inaccessible on pedestals. But though teh Dalai Lama is humanized rather than being so Holy, humanity is fortunate to have such a wise and profound being who can be relied upon for his opinions and wisdom. This should not detract from his being respected for that.
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bnbmarble
04:32 PM on 05/17/2012
JESUS is my SAVIOR....not my religion - I follow Jesus...not man made rules, Amen
Jesus never taught that we should have "religion" he wanted a relationship with us. We were made for follow ship with him
Revelation 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
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wutrup
We are here to Evolve
11:02 AM on 05/18/2012
Jesus had no religion, like Buddha was a master, and incarnated to show us unlimitation. Liimitation blocks the mine from what is, and the true messages.
01:38 PM on 05/18/2012
Jesus thought he was a good Jew and wanted to update the teachings away from the vengeful, violent (now the Old Testament) god towards a more compassionate, kind, forgiving, generous and thoughtful one. You may notice many promoters of hate always quote the Old Testament and not Jesus.
10:32 AM on 05/17/2012
In the beginning teachings of Buddhism, emphasis is placed on relative truth and ultimate truth. Relative truth is the relative existence that we as humans and other beings perceive. Ultimate truth is what it says, the absolute and ultimate truth. I won't go on trying to go any further as I'm not a Buddhist scholar in possession of the knowledge of countless Buddhist texts. Yet even an ignorant practitioner of Buddhism, like myself, knows that there is an absolute and ultimate truth that is acknowledged truth arrived at from a philosophical and methodological perspective.

In Buddhism, there is more than one accepted view on this subject, and there are different philosophical schools that differ from His Holines the Dalai Lama's Gelugpa school of Buddhism. Whether or not His Holiness believes as is written in your welcome article, this point is at variance with the Nyingmapa school of Buddhism.

I felt obliged to write an answer as this point of your article is highlighted.

As for the role of empiricism, I would agree but only when it is applied to "thought experiments" as are found in science and limited to spiritual and immaterial, and not material, phenomena. I see no possibility for Buddhism to "give way to the empirical findings of science" as Buddhism does not accept and in fact disproves the existence of physical matter, as does science as well. Doesn't the scientist Leonard Sussking describe the "world as a hologram?"
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ftkl1234
05:57 PM on 05/17/2012
I wonder if the Perennial Wisdom can be accepted as Absolute Truth (access online: Perennial Wisdom)?

It's a common denominator of all religions and spiritiual beliefs. Any not adhering to PW's tenets cannot be considered a true religion or spritiual belief.
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ftkl1234
06:00 PM on 05/17/2012
Is Perennial Wisdom absolute truth? (Access online: Perennial Wisdom)

Any religion or spiritual belief that doesn't adhere to PW's tenets cannot claim to be a true religion or belief.
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wutrup
We are here to Evolve
11:15 AM on 05/18/2012
Religion is not based on elements of truth, but faith, the hope for something to be true.
If religion was based on material fact, it would have such a narrow bandwith, it wouldn't be worth mentioning. I hope I never have to explain religion to a higher evolved interdimensional being.
09:48 AM on 05/17/2012
The Milky Way galaxy, of which our sun is one of 200 billion other suns with planets as well, is only 100,000 light years across. Until 1924, even Einstein believed it was the universe. But, thanks to Dr. Edwin Hubble, we know that our galaxy is one of HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS of galaxies in our universe, containing hundreds of billions of solar systems as well. And our universe may not even be the only one!

Can any truly thinking person look at numbers like these and believe in ANY religion? If so, HOW?
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QuietProfessional
Recovering Jedi
11:59 AM on 05/17/2012
--Can any truly thinking person look at numbers like these and believe in ANY religion?--

Yes, when one looks BEYOND those numbers and peers into the infinity that we call the "universe".
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wutrup
We are here to Evolve
11:10 AM on 05/18/2012
Is what is called the multiverse.
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wutrup
We are here to Evolve
11:09 AM on 05/18/2012
Of course religion offers a very limited view of reality. It always has and always will. Cosomology will replace religion in the short term. It is based on the understand that God is not a being but an all pervasive consciousness that inhabits all things, everything that exist and everything that does not exist. is the ever evolving consciousness of God. I you he she it we or they is all of the God consciousness, expressing itself throughtout all dimensions of time and space. At least that is what my et friends told me....
02:53 AM on 05/17/2012
I spent a great deal of time composing a response to the above article which was rejected. Oddly, the New York Times has not only accepted similar writings from me about the same subject, but corresponds with me. As an authentic Tibetan Buddhist, who was initiated more than 35 years ago as a Tibetan Buddhist, my community has been that of Tibetans, who escaped from Tibet.

The western public needs to understand who the Dalia Lama based on facts. He is not the pope nor holy. The concept of preciousness exists but not holiness. Tibetan Buddhists recognize him as enlightened. Tibet no longer exists.

It is personally offensive to me that the west characterizes that the Tibetan People suffer "human rights abuses" of the Communist Chinese, specifically, the HAN, when in reality they have suffered a genocide. The Tibetans state so.

Anyone who was able to flee Tibet during the Communist take over did. The Dalia Lama was not the only person in Tibet to flee to any country which would have him.

There is a constant effort to dummy down the fact that the Communist Chinese have murdered not only the Tibetans but their own, because we, the United States, do business with the Chinese.

Any Tibetan Buddhist knows that the Dalia Lama is not the supreme Lama, he is not a king, and many other people, men and woman, are lamas. We Tibetan Buddhists don't have a god or savior but we do know of China's capabilities.
02:24 AM on 05/17/2012
If we regard Buddhism as a combination of philosophy, psychology and religion, it's surprising how much mileage we can get from the first two aspects before we need to start invoking 'faith'... http://rational-buddhism.blogspot.com/2011/05/rational-buddhism.html
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Zia
01:15 AM on 05/17/2012
Did Dalai take credit formBin Laden death and lambasted him?
01:05 AM on 05/17/2012
In defense of polemics

Or

The use of polemics as a defensive weapon in argument
Or
The necessity of polemics in certain

Categories of argumentation

You have made the remark that Prof, Filliozat characterized my text as polemical, there are several points to be made on this remark. i feel i should elaborate on the nature of this remark especially since my dear friend NS Rajaram (whom i consider to be more of a mentor ,made the oblique remark to me that i should not encourage polemical essays [n
treatments of a topic in the new journal on the history of mathematics that i plan to publish starting in 1Q2013 ).

If the only adverse remark that Prof PFilliozat made was that my book (The origins of astronomy ,the calendar and time is polemical in nature I am somewhat perplexed as to his motivation for making such an obvious statement. Calling my book a polemical book is equivalent to calling the bible a theological work
08:22 PM on 05/16/2012
I like the Dalai Lama and had in the past, practiced this form of buddhism for a couple of years, mainly out of curiosity. The Lamas like to align themselves on the side of science and it's a rather loose association inasmuch as they also are deeply steeped in superstition, shamanism (nothing wrong with that I guess) and magic. The science connection is with cause and effect and the interconnectedness of all things. That's where it leaves off on goes on some rather weird tangents; We often heard about 'flying lamas', 'rain making lamas' and all manner of unscientific phenomena whose basis rested in keeping the flock in line. It wasn't for me and frankly I found it all rather like the catholic church must have been in the middle ages.
Ana4
neutrino alert, just passing through
02:22 PM on 05/20/2012
The teachers (in this case Lama's or Rimpoche's) start at the very simplest level and slowly bring the student to greater awareness, over years, while giving practices for the student to evolve through, as I'm sure you know. The ancient mind did indeed believe in superstitious phenomena, many still do. The teachers start with that.
07:31 PM on 05/16/2012
Science and religion are incompatible. The former relies on fact and reason, while the latter relies on nonsense. Furthermore, it is the height of arrogance to state that science (and scientists by extension) lack or easily lose a sense of compassion or understanding of the human condition. Let's all remember the tyranny and horrors Buddhist monks committed in Tibet during their reign of terror. The Dalai Lama is the last person to talk about compassion.
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kooldalai
There is no spoon
06:14 PM on 05/20/2012
No, you are the ;last person to talk about compassion.
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
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10:50 PM on 05/20/2012
Tyranny and horrors? I'm sorry, I must have been out that day. So tell me about the tyranny and horrors.
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agrue6
Minneapolis Socialist
07:24 PM on 05/16/2012
One more thing to support my belief that Buddhism tends to be the most accepting and thoughtful major religion.
10:18 PM on 05/16/2012
Please do a little deeper research.
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kooldalai
There is no spoon
06:16 PM on 05/20/2012
I am a Buddhist and have done a tremendous amount of research and agrue6 is correct.
02:56 AM on 05/17/2012
One - it is not a religion until you practice it.

Two - it is non sectarian in principle and practice. You can be a Jew, Catholic or Muslim, and practice
mediation; it is irrelevant where you came from or the views or other beliefs you might maintain.

Buddhism is about ending the cycle of rebirth, not going to heaven.
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agrue6
Minneapolis Socialist
03:46 PM on 05/17/2012
Buddhism is most definitely a religion, and it is not the only one to include meditation. Going by your logic, there is no religion, as I practice none.
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kooldalai
There is no spoon
06:20 PM on 05/20/2012
No Buddhist would ever argue whether it is a religion or not....that is not the point,. To some it's a faith, others it is a religion and still to others, it's a philosophy. It really does not matter.