Georgia at War: What I Saw

The first thing that strikes me as soon as we are out of Tbilisi is the strange absence of military force. I had read that the Georgian army, defeated in Ossetia, then routed in Gori, had withdrawn to the capital to defend it. I reach the outskirts of the city, moving forty kilometers on the highway that slices through the country from east to west. But I see almost no trace of the army which has supposedly regrouped in order to fiercely resist the Russian invasion. Here we see a police station. A little farther on, a handful of soldiers, their uniforms still too new. But no combat units. No anti-aircraft weaponry. Not even the trenches and zigzagging fortifications which, in all the besieged cities of the world, are set up to at least slightly impede the enemy's advance. A dispatch received while we are driving announces that Russian tanks are now approaching the capital. The information is relayed by various radio stations and then finally denied, creating unspeakable chaos and making the few cars which had ventured outside the city turn back immediately. But the authorities, the powers that be, seem strangely to have given up.

Is the Georgian army there, but hiding? Ready to intervene but also invisible? Are we perhaps in the middle of one of those wars in which the supreme ruse is to let yourself be seen as little as possible, the way they did in the forgotten wars of Africa? Or has President Saakashvili deliberately chosen non-combat as a way to force us, the Europeans and Americans, to accept our responsibilities ("You claim to be our friends? You have said a hundred times that with our democratic institutions, our wish to become part of Europe, our government composed of -- unique in the annals of history -- an Anglo-Georgian Prime Minister, American-Georgian cabinet ministers, an Israelo-Georgian Minister of Defense - is the first in its Western class? Well, now is the time to step up and prove it."). I don't know. The fact is that the first significant military presence we run into is a long Russian convoy, at least one hundred vehicles long, headed in the direction of Tbilisi, casually waiting to get gas. Then, forty kilometers outside the city, around Okami, we see a battalion, as usual Russian, attached to a unit of armored vehicles whose role is to stop journalists from going one direction and refugees from going the other.

One of them, a peasant, wounded in the forehead, still dazed and terrified, tells me the story of fleeing his village in Ossetia on foot, three days ago. The Russians arrived, and in their wake, Cossack and Ossetian gangs pillaged, raped and murdered. As they did in Chechnya, they rounded up the young men and drove them away in trucks, to unknown destinations. Fathers were killed in front of their sons. Sons were killed in front of their fathers. In the basement of a house which they blew up with propane cylinders they had collected, they came upon a family and stripped them of everything they had tried to hide and then forced the adults to kneel down and executed them with a single shot to the head. The Russian officer in charge at the check point listens to the story.

But he doesn't care. In any case he looks like he has been drinking too much and he just doesn't care. For him, the war is over. No scrap of paper, a ceasefire, a five or six-point agreement- will change his victory. And this pathetic refugee can say whatever he wants.

II

As we approach Gori, the situation is different, the tension is suddenly palpable. Georgian jeeps are sprawled in the ditches on the sides of the road. Farther along is a burnt-out tank. Even farther along is a more important check point which completely blocks the group of journalists we have joined. And it is here that we are clearly told that we are no longer welcome, "You are in Russian territory now," barks an officer puffed up with importance. "Only those with Russian accreditation may go farther." Fortunately a car with diplomatic flags comes up. It belongs to the Estonian Ambassador, and is carrying the Ambassador and Alexander Lomaia, the Secretary of Georgia's National Security Council, who is authorized to go behind the Russian lines to look for the wounded. He agrees to take me with him, as well as the European deputy Marie-Anne Isler-Béguin and Tara Bahrampour from the Washington Post. "I cannot guarantee anyone's safety, is that clear?" Lomaia asks. Yes. It is clear. And we all pile into the Audi and head toward Gori.

After crossing through six new check points, one of which consists of a tree trunk hoisted up and down by a winch commanded by a group of paramilitaries, we arrive in Gori. We are not in the center of the city. But from where Lomaia has dropped us, before taking off in the Audi to collect his wounded, from this intersection dominated by an enormous tank as big as a rolling bunker, we can see fires burning everywhere. Rockets lighting up the sky at regular intervals, followed by short detonations. The emptiness. The slight odor of putrefaction and death. Most of all, the incessant rumbling of armored vehicles. Almost every other car is an unmarked car jammed with militia, recognizable because of their white armbands and their headbands. Gori does not belong to the Ossetia which the Russians claim they have come to "liberate." It is a Georgian town. And they have burned it down, pillaged it, reduced it to a ghost town. Emptied.

"It's logical," explains General Vyachislav Borisov, as we stand in the stench and the night waiting for Lomaia to return. "We are here because the Georgians are incompetent, because their administration collapsed and the town was being looted. Look at this," showing me on his cell phone photographs of weapons of Israeli origin, which he emphasizes heavily, "Do you think we could leave all this lying around without supervision? And let me tell you," he struts around, striking a match to light a cigarette, startling the little blond tank gunner who had fallen asleep in his turret, "We summoned the Israeli Foreign Minister to Moscow. And he was told that if he continues to supply arms to the Georgians we would continue to supply Hezbollah and Hamas." We would continue? What an admission! Two hours go by. Two hours of bragging and threats. Sometimes a passing car would slow, but it would change its mind after noticing the tank and speed off. Finally Lomaia came back, bringing with him an old woman and the pregnant woman he had pulled from hell, and asked us to take them back to Tbilisi.

III

President Saakashvili, accompanied by his counselor Daniel Kunnin, listens to my story. We are in the Presidential residence of Avlabari. It is two AM but the noria of his counselors is working as it would during business hours. He is young. Very young. With a youthfulness which can be seen in the impatience of his movements, the intensity of his gaze, his abrupt laughter, even the way he guzzles cans of Red Bull as if it were Coca-Cola. All of these people in fact are very young. All these ministers and counselors were students sponsored by various Soros-type foundations, whose studies at Yale, Princeton and Chicago were interrupted by the Rose Revolution. He is a francophile and speaks French. Keen on philosophy. A democrat. A European. A liberal in both the American and European senses of the word. Of all the great resistance fighters I have met in my life, of all the Massouds and Izetbegovics I have had occasion to defend, he is the one who is the most unfamiliar with war, its rites, its emblems, its culture - but he is dealing with it.

"Let me make one thing clear," he interrupts me, with a sudden gravity. "We cannot let them say that we started this war ... It was early August. My ministers were on vacation, as I was too, in Italy, at a weight-loss spa, getting ready to go to Beijing. Then in the Italian press I read, "War preparations are under way in Georgia." You understand me. Here I was just hanging out in Italy and I read in the paper that my own country is preparing for a war! Realizing that something was wrong, I rushed back to Tbilisi. And what did my intelligence services tell me?" He makes the face of someone who has posed a difficult riddle and is waiting for you to find the answer, "That the Russians at the exact moment they are showering the press corps with this garbage are also emptying Shrinvali of its inhabitants, they're massing troops and troop transports, positioning fuel trucks on Georgian soil, and finally, sending columns of tanks through the Roky tunnel which separates the two Ossetias. Now, suppose you are the leader of the country and you hear this, what do you do?" He gets up to answer two cell phones which are ringing at the same time on his desk, comes back, stretching out his long legs ... "After the hundred and fiftieth tank lines itself up facing your cities, you are forced to admit that the war has begun, and despite the disproportion in the forces opposing us, you no longer have a choice."

"With the agreement of your allies?" I asked. "With the members of NATO who have more or less slammed the door in your face?" "The real problem," he says, sidestepping, "is the stakes involved in this war. Putin and Medvedev were looking for a pretext to invade. Why?" He begins counting on his fingers, "Number one, we are a democracy and incarnate an alternative to Putinism as an exit from communism. Two, the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan [oil] pipeline goes through our country, such that if we fall, if Moscow replaces me with an employee of Gazprom, you, the Europeans, would be 100% dependent on the Russians for your energy supply. "And number three," as he takes a peach from the fruit basket which is brought to him by his assistant--"She's Ossentian, mind you!"--and then resumes, "Number three, look at the map. Russia is an ally of Iran. Our Armenian neighbors are also not far from Iran. Now imagine a pro-Russian government installed in Tbilisi. You would have a geostrategic continuum stretching from Moscow to Tehran which I seriously doubt would be doing business with the free world. I hope NATO understands this."

IV

Friday morning. I, along with Raphaël Gluksmann, Gilles Hertzog and Marie-Anne Isler-Béguin, the European deputy, decided to return to Gori which, according to the ceasefire agreement written by French President Nicolas Sarkozy and Russian President Dmitry Medvedev, the Russians would have begun evacuating, and where we are supposed to meet with the Orthodox Patriarch of Tbilisi who is himself on his way to an Ossetian village where hundreds of Georgian corpses have reportedly been left for the dogs and pigs. But the Patriarch is nowhere to be found. And the Russians have not evacuated Gori. And this time we are blocked twenty kilometers short of Gori when a car is held up in front of us by a squadron of irregulars, who, under the placid gaze of a Russian officer, haul the journalists out of the car and take their cameras, money, personal objects, and finally even their car. So it was a false report, part of that habitual ballet of false reports at which the artisans of Russian propaganda seem to be past masters. So off we go toward Kaspi, halfway between Gori and Tbilisi, where the interpreter for the deputy has family, and where the situation is in theory calmer - but two other surprises await us there.

First, there is the destruction. Here too. But this time it is destruction which has apparently targeted neither houses nor people. What have they destroyed instead? The bridge. The train station. The train tracks, which are already being repaired by a team of logisticians who are being supervised by the head mechanic from his room because of a severe hip wound. And the electronic command system of the Heidelberg cement factory, built with German capital, which was hit by a laser-guided missile. "There were 650 workers here," the factory director, Levan Baramatze, tells me. "Only 120 were able to come in today. Our production machine is broken." In Poti, the Russians sank the Georgian war ships. They even hit the BTC pipeline at three different points. Here in Kaspi, they deliberately took out the vital centers upon which the region and the country both depend. In other words, targeted terrorism. The will to bring this country to its knees.

Then there is the second surprise, the tanks. I repeat, we are standing at the outskirts of the capital. Condoleezza Rice is at this exact moment giving her press conference. Yet out of the blue comes one of those combat helicopters whose appearance always signals the worst, flying at low altitude just above the treetops. And suddenly the few people still in Kaspi find themselves in the street, first in their own doorways, then jammed ten at a time into old Lada cars, screaming at everyone and especially at our drivers that the Russians are coming and we must get out. At first we don't believe it. We figure it's like the false rumor we heard the day before yesterday. But no, the tanks are there. Five of them. And a field engineering unit digging trenches. The message is clear. With or without Condoleezza Rice, the Russians have moved in. They move around Georgian lands as if it were conquered terrain. This isn't exactly like Prague in 1968, it's the 21st century version of the coup, slow, bit by bit, with blows of humiliation, intimidation, panic.

V

This time the meeting is at four AM. Saakashvili has spent the end of the day with Rice, the day before with Sarkozy. He is grateful to both for their efforts, for the trouble they took and the friendship they demonstrated, which no one can doubt - didn't he call "Nicolas" "tu"? And the Republican Presidential Candidate John McCain, "close to Ms. Rice," - hasn't he been calling three times a day since the beginning of this crisis? But this time, I find he has a melancholy air unlike that first night. Maybe it's fatigue, so many sleepless nights, the continuing setbacks, the grumbling which he can feel rising in the country and which we, alas, must to confirm: "What if Misha is incapable of protecting us? And if our ebullient young President only attracts more of the same? What if in order to survive we will have to accept the wishes of Putin and his puppet?" All of that must figure in the melancholy of the President. Plus something else on top of it, something cloudier and that applies to, how to say, his friends' strange attitude.

For example, the ceasefire agreement which his friend Sarkozy brought and which had been written by four hands in Moscow with Medvedev. He recalls the French President, here in this same office, impatient for him to sign it, raising his voice, almost yelling, "You have no other choice, Misha. Be realistic, you don't have a choice. When the Russians come to overthrow you, not one of your friends will lift a finger to save you." And finally what a strange reaction when he, Misha Saakashvili, got them to call Medvedev but Medvedev sent word that he was asleep - it was only nine o'clock, but apparently he was already asleep, and would be unreachable until the following morning at 9 AM - here the French President got antsy again; his French friend yet again didn't want to wait--in a rush to go home? too sure that signing was what mattered, regardless of what was being signed? This is not how you negotiate, thinks Misha. This is also not how you act with your friends.

I have seen the document. I have seen the written annotations by the two Presidents, the Georgian and the French. I saw the second document, again signed by Sarkozy and given to Condoleeza Rice in Brégançon, for her to give to Saakashvili. And finally I saw the memorandum of remarks, written during the evening by the Georgians, a vital piece in their eyes. They managed to cross out - and this is by no means negligible - all allusions to the future "status" of Ossetia. They also got to be specified - again, not a small detail - that the "reasonable perimeter" in which the Russian troops would be authorized to patrol to protect the security of the Russian-speaking population of Georgia be a perimeter of a "few kilometers." The territorial integrity of Georgia, however, is mentioned nowhere in either document. As for the argument of legitimate aid for the Russian-speaking people - we tremble to think what could happen if we consider the Russian-speakers in the Ukraine, the Baltic countries or in Poland, who may one day decide that they too have been threatened by a "genocidal" will.

The last word will belong to the American Richard Holbrooke, a ranking diplomat close to Barack Obama whom I meet in the bar of our hotel at the tail end of the night: "There is floating in this affair a bad smell of appeasement." He is right. Either we are capable of raising our voice and saying STOP to Putin in Georgia. Or the man who went, in his own words, "down into the toilets" to kill the civilians in Chechnya will feel he has the right to do the same thing to any one of his neighbors.

Is this how we will build Europe, peace and the world of tomorrow?

Translated from the French by Sara Sugihara

(Photos courtesy of Régis Fourrer)

Comments

[Brokenduck]

Frankly, Russia has every right to protect it's foreign interests, which amount to countering American encroachment upon it's borders. From absorbing former Warsaw Pact nations into NATO to setting up military bases and STAR WARS sites in the former republics of Europe and Central Asia.....how is Russia supposed to act? Remember folks, this has all been taking place within the context of America attempting to dominate the world as a so-called "sole Superpower". Don't think for a minute that Afghanistan-Iraq-Colombia-Venezuala-Haiti-Taiwan-Balkans....and all the other places we have meddled...have been overlooked by those in the Kremlin who were products of the Cold War. This is not to excuse Russian military brutality, which we've seen in Chechnya, Georgia, and domestically.

And it should be interesting to see what kind of mess is left for Obama to deal with and what he does to clean it up....if anything.

[tony2008]

President Reagan must be spinning in his grave. Something he has worked so hard to bring to an end is being re erected by reckless neocons.

[ImpalaSuperSport]

So this whole Georgian thing is the fault of the neocons. You've got to be f*cking kidding me.

[carlgt1]

it's a big coincidence that US troops were having "exercises" in Georgia 3 weeks before and right up to the day the Georgia invasion/killing in South Ossetia started

[who38]

No, this is real.

[research]

Yes, it's "wag the Dog" time. the USA and Israel armed and trained the Georgians, then McCain and his adviser convinced Georgia to attack Ossitia. The Russian response scared Poland into accepting US snake oil missiles that don't work, but are likely to shoot down a Russian Airliner.

The Dems must be in on it, to get it so wrong as well.

[Jason357]

Reagan??He set up this whole thing, either on purpose or via incompetence!! Just say no to drugs, militarization of local police, tax cuts for the wealthy, granting government money to private (for profit) corporations, empowering the maniacal religious right, on and on. He's the genius who said if we could just make the rich much richer, then the poorer of us would be so much better off. Yeah, that works really well. Go praise Reagan to someone who doesn't know better.

[Swerinjer]

No, that was Charlie Wilson's war. Reagan just took the credit.

[Gronamox]

Great article because he captures the incompetence and the lies of everyone-the refugee with his atrocities, the Russians with their truce and the Georgians with their naive belief that the they have allies. This young Georgian President is vacationing in Italy and doesn't have a clue he is going to be invaded? He then demands intelligence to report? Who is he kidding? Nothing but a little poseur. Ossetia is vital to whom? Does anyone believe that Putin didn't want to kick Bush's teeth in after that smirking twerp said he knew Vlad's innermost heart. Bush and his dreary little wife acting like royalty. The Russian's despise this kind of fool. Ronald Reagan actually believed he destroyed the Evil Empire. That incompetent never heard of the sequel? The Empire Strikes Back. Bush has been told to keep his mouth shut until Obama is installed.

[MIKEinNYC]

What happened to the concept of "self-determination"?

South Ossetia is populated by ethnic South Ossetians. If the South Ossetians want out of Georgia why not let them go?

[FarOutFish]

The Slave States want to leave the United States of America so why not let them go? Six-hundred thousand Americans died answering that question.

[antirepublocrat]

The majority of the population of South Ossetia is Ossetian and recently voted in an internationally supervised election to continue their independence from Georgia, which they won in a war of independence at the time of the Soviet breakup. The majority of the population of the Slave States were black slaves and non-slaveholding whites, many of whom were loyal to the union. There was no democratic election in the southern states establishing their right to self-determination. In addition, the South fired the first shots, at Fort Sumter. In this case, Georgia began the hostilities by shelling (and leveling) Tskhinvali and then invading South Ossetia in force.

The recklessness of the Bush administration knows no bounds. What business do we have pouring money into Georgia to influence their elections, then arming the resulting client state in opposition to its neighbor, Russia?

[superlive]

By that logic West Virginia should be returned to Virgina. West Virgina became a state during the American Civil War and was made up of the western counties of Virginia that remained loyal to the Union.

[DannyRose]

Yes, Georgia should let South Ossetia go, because Russia under Boris Yeltsin let it and 14 other republics go WITHOUT A FIGHT. It's time that Georgia returned the favor!

[Guynemer]

Good point. General Robert E. Lee had the same argument.

[who38]

So did Crazy Horse.

[Praedor]

That self determination ONLY applies when the US wants it to, like with Croatia and the former Yugoslavia. There, separatists are GOOD and to be supported (ie, SCREW "territorial integrity") but in the Baltics or anywhere else where such self-determination/separatism would favor the Russians, why THEN self-determination and separatism is BAAAAD and to be fought tooth and nail.

[DelvinMcGee]

I guess you are not a hypocrite and think Lincoln was one of the worst presidents ever for forcing the southern states to remain in the US?

[DrWippit]

As I'm reading this article I'm beginning to have some serious WWIII concerns with an "Axis" of Russia, Iran, and any anti-West terrorist group they can get to sign on with them, and thanks to our invasion of Iraq, (not that any one would "invade a country" in the 21st Century, right McCain?), there are plenty who will. So the sad thing is history will look back on the Bush administration as the antagonists that started it all. I think the last chance to put the world on track with diplomacy will be this year's election, because some people think not only that WWIII is necessary (see evangelical's looking for Armegeddon), but that there's something to be won. As long as there's a need for war, nobody's won anything.

[whatsthatsound]

I think the key question is, "will it be good for business?" This country is not being run by evangelicals, or even neo-cons. It is being run by giant corporate interests who have a long term investment in selling products and energy (through the oil kingdoms they are in bed with) to a potentially one billion strong middle class in China and India over the next few decades. Some wars are great for them, if they help them secure the Middle East's oil, and sell lots of weaponry. But a big ass, nuclear, all out conflagration that puts bullseyes on American, Russian and European cities, is not.

Of course, in heated moments, disastrous decisions are possible, even to be expected. But I have to disagree with the implication that WWIII is the plan of the people in power.

[FarOutFish]

There always will be a need for war as long as thugs try to impose their will upon others. “The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.” Thomas Jefferson. Aggression allowed humans to climb to the top of the food chain. Despite our facade of civilization we are still the ‘thinking ape’ with a club.

[interventor]

The president of South Ossetia, Eduard Kokoity, is little more than a Russian puppet. He was a wrestler and head of the local Konsomol (communist youth group) before the breakup of the USSR. He lived in Moscow for a time, before returning to Georgia. However, at least, he is an inhabitant of Georgia.

Most of the South Ossetia government officials are silovicki (ex-KGB officers from Russia, proper). South Ossetia is a combination of a Potemkin village and a Sudetenland excuse for an invasion.

The Defense Minister, Vasily Lunev, used to be military commissar in Perm Oblast in Russia.
Interior Ministry, Mikhail Mindzayev, served in the Interior Ministry of Russia's North Ossetia. The Ministry of the Interior controls most non-military security and police forces. The head of the local KGB, Anatoly Baranov, used to head the Federal Security Service (FSB) in the Russian Republic of Mordovia. The FSB is the successor organization to the KGB. The secretary of South Ossetia's Security Council, Anatoly Barankevich, is a former deputy military commissar of Stavropol Krai, again in Russia proper.

Georgian military separatists (read Russian soldiers with different uniforms) for the last two years have shelled ethnic Georgian villages within South Ossetia. The Georgian government only sent in troops because in the two weeks before the invasion the shellings significantly intensified. Russian troops were marshalling tanks, troops and materiel across the border awaiting the provoked attack and a subsequent invasion.

[who38]

Jesse Ventura was a wrestler and a governor of Minnesota; it's about the same size as South Ossetia.

[DelvinMcGee]

The entire country of Georgia is the size of South Carolina, so it seems your geography skills are a bit weak.

[mexicanamerican1948]

Finally some sense, perhaps finally we see the truth that the Russians are not a group of pacifists, but want the Russian peace, that peace is the peace of the Russian boot, that Captive nations lived under from Central Asia to the Baltic Sea for decades. These countries do not want to return back to Putin's new novo-Soviet Russia. All Americans must realize this and not be afraid to but strong. The totalitarians have nothing to offer, we support individual liberty, what does Putin support? Case closed...

[idest]

"These countries do not want to return back to Putin's new novo-Soviet Russia."

Well, South Ossetia does.

[superlive]

That argument is utterly irrelevant because the Georgian government is dominated by Cosmopolitanists who haven't actually done much living in Georgia themselves. It can be argued that they are tools of Western business interests -- because THEY ARE!

That almost everybody in Ossetia (and Abkhazia) of personal importance were formerly part of the Russian security apparatus is both unsurprising and undismaying. The South Ossetians wish neither of Georgian sovereignty nor independence -- they want to be part of Russia, so it is a necessity that their leadership should have Moscow connections.

[research]

GEORGIA ATTACKED

[esquire07]

The funniest thing about the whole situation is that Bush - the lying war criminal - has sent Condi Rice to Georgia.

Condi Rice is part of the Bush cabal - can anyone honestly take anything that former Exxon Board memeber serously ? She should be in prison with her master.

Over One Million Iraqis are dead because of Bush/Cheny lies and war crimes. And Bush dares to call what Russia did Agression ?? Please.

153 days before Bush is scheduled to leave office - you better believe (if he leaves) he will leave a trail of destruction the like of which the world has never known.

Human suffering does not matter. All that matters is who controls the Oil and who profits from the Oil.

[cambridgedude]

Actually, it's former Chevron board member, but why quibble.

Together with all the hacks and cronies, our great administration has thrown away the nation's moral authority and hence the right to lecture other aggressors who invade and plunder at will.

Let Still-Presidant Bush stay in Texas for as long as he wants - maybe he will leave us all alone now, to get on with reapairing what can be saved of Americs'a tattered reputation.

[MIKEinNYC]

Let's be realistic.

This business about Russians patrolling Georgia's "perimeter" is, in fact, an occupation. A a low-level occupation but an occupation never-the-less.

The Russians now control Georgia's border. A country that controls the border, especially from the other guy's side, in fact controls the country. The Russian occupiers at the perimeter can spring into action to clamp down on the country anytime the thugs in Moscow want them to.

The occupation of Georgia began when the Russians stationed so-called "peace-keepers" in South Ossetia. After all, who are these peace-keepers if not fully armed soldiers.

First, peace-keepers come in.

Then Russian soldiers are stationed at Georgia's border from the Georgian side.

With this move, in fact, Russians are deep inside Georgia because what has been construed as "the border" is, in fact, the border between Georgia and South Ossetia not the one between South Ossetia and Russia. We will recall that South Ossetia is part of Georgia. What we have here is a de facto annexation of South Ossetia by Russia.

These are classic "salami tactics". Taking a slice at a time.

Now, if ANYTHING happens in Georgia that the Russians disapprove up their soldiers are in place to easily step up the occupation.

Sarkozy!

Rice!

Is it Neville Chamberlain all over again?

And what are we supposed to do about it?

Blow up the world?

I think not.

[lisakaz2]

S. Ossetia has declared its independence but Georgia refuses to accept it. The Sudentenland never did that much and moreover no part of Czechoslovakia even attended Munich in 1938 so they had no control over what happened.

[research]

wag the dog

[Danny]

"Wag the Dog" the movie. Perfect. You gotta rent it, if it's at all available.

[Jayne Lyn Stahl - Huffpost Blogger]

It is wonderful to see your post here at HuffPost. Thank you.

[Danny]

Jayne -- I am a fan of yours. You, chained to the White House gates that summer, in protest. Someday that story will be told.

[Jared137]

The sabre rattling will begin with Russia as we move into the elections. People are notorious for voting Republican when they are scared. Great set up.

[nomobull]

russia will rattle back.then what

[who38]

Well, if we are going to rattle sabers and/or follow through on Bush's latest pronouncements, we will need to bring back the draft, raise taxes and ration oil. That should scare a lot of people.

[jbd]

If the US thinks it can attack Iran, the moment our forces start to occupy Iranian territory, the Russians and most likely the Chinese will not allow it (the takeover of another oil country) and things are going to get very hot around here. We'd better hope they stop at a limited exchange. McCain = World conflagation.

[hosshoss777]

I think when the USA is "forced" to invade Pakistan to "protect" the world from "terror" we might get a glimpse of the super power politics involved in our "letting" Russia have a free hand there in Georgia. Isn't it great that either president Obama or McCain will wish to expand war everywhere?
Meanwhile all the peoples of the world continue to live with the on going never ending beat of violence and oppression.

The whole notion that we couldn't respond is just ridiculous. Doesn't anybody remember that we have an Air Force? We didn't respond because we didn't want to, nuff said.

[who38]

Look at what a quick, neat job the Air Force did in Iraq. They work well in the beginning but we need foot solders to do the brunt of any war activity. If the USA invades Pakistan in order to protect the world from terror, there will be world wide chaos.

[amp27]

Russia has nuclear weapons, any escalation would be a real escalation. They are crazier than we are, and sometimes you just let the crazy guy win the fight. (Bosnia and Iraq did not have any WMD). We are actually trying to pressure them diplomatically, which may or may not work. But we can't go in with fists flying, we aren't really prepared, and obviously the Russians are.

[long333]

Being married to a Russian and being familiar with what is happening in Russian politics under Putin, it is frightening that the masses of posters here who can only see the US and Georgian conspiracies or failings. The admonishment of people "who don't know better in the US" and would have the gall to doubt the Russians capable of deceit is not laughable but dangerous. These postings would make a great republican campaign device. The sheer staggering anti-Bush sentiment that makes any story from the Russians believable and any conspiracy true makes me shudder to think what people who would write this would do if in charge. I can only hope there are clearer minds than this at the top of the democrat party. Blindfolds and Tin foil hats for everybody.

[getoffmedz]

long333 - How does specifically "anti-Bush sentiment" make "any story from the Russians believable."

I fail to see ANY connection.

[Thomas2005]

geoffmedz, if you fail to see the connection the you did not read the bulk of the comments below. It is clear that most of the commenters blindly hate the Bush administration and are willing to give credit to any of its adversaries, Russians or otherwise, without any regard for facts. It looks like if the Russians have bloodied the Bushies then they have to be right. This is the most ridiculous reflex of the "enemy of my enemy is my friend, no matter what" syndrome. The Bush regime should be denounced for invading Iraq based on false pretenses, and Russia should be denounced with the same ferocity for invading Georgia under false pretenses.

[whatsthatsound]

Although philosophically positioned on the left, and having absolutely no affection for the current American administration, I have to say that I agree with you. A quick scan of the posts here and I see assertions that Bush is responsible for the mess, Russia is just protecting its interests, etc., and implications that the writer has no credibility.

It is as if some here are so enraged by the bullying of Bushamerica, that they find it refreshing to have another bully entering the sandbox, and kicking things up. In the sense that the warmongering, irresponsible behavior of the U.S. in the 21st century has set a poor example for China and Russia, I can understand and accept the anti-Bush criticisms as valid. But going beyond that to basically put all of this at America's feet, as if Russia under Putin isn't a dangerous and violent entity of its own will and accord, is a blinkered and inexcusably naive perspective.

[nomobull]

s if Russia under Putin isn't a dangerous and violent entity of its own will and accord, is a blinkered and inexcusably naive perspective.
helped by bush

[Danny]

So WW III or WorldWar IV OK with you, Whatsthatsound?

[etc]

So your Russian wife deceived you, what does it have to do with anti-B-sh sentiment??

[AlieNation]

People such as yourself always assume that being critical of one side means that you support the other side. That is Bush/Cheney thinking, as in “if you're not with me, you're against me”.

It is possible to dislike Bush and Putin at the same time. However, Bush and his ilk are the only ones Americans can vote out of office.

Being critical of the Bush and Cheney regime is for many Americans simply recognition of the lying, bullying, warmongering, torturing, criminal, and expansionist policies which have characterized this administration.

[BookDesigner]

Being married to a Russian will only provide you with his/her point of view, not necessarily reflecting the opinions of people in Russia. It will also not necessarily give you any real knowledge of "what is happening in Russian politics under Putin." What you get is one Russian's viewpoint.

I lived in Russia for five and a half years with my Russian wife before returning to the U.S. with her. I watched, on Russian TV, the transition from Yeltsin to Putin. Whatever western demagogues may say about Putin and Medvedev, they have done more good for Russia than harm. Keep in mind that they don't care whether they please America or Britain, they act out of purely Russian interests. Our next president would be wise to try to understand what those Russian interests are and figure out a way that their interests and ours could fit together for the benefit of the whole planet.

As I've said elsewhere, Peter the Great founded and built his capitol of St. Petersburg in 1703, while our capitol was little more than a village in the woods.

[Danny]

BookDesignerT -- that is the kind of insight I turn to the HuffPo for. One would never read what you wrote (thank you) on any MSM outlet.

[Tasies]

I'm reminiscing with melancholia and nostalgia wishing the Cold War days would return. We were much better off then.

I wonder what this will do to Reagan's legacy, when in fact we all realize that the socialist ideology is experiencing a revival, and the 80's where just respite years.

[LeftVetPatriot]

socialist ideology?

Explain, please.

[sissymonster]

Wasn't it just wonderful living in fear? Hiding under our school desks? Waiting for nuclear war? The FREEDOM of it all.

[Danny]

Tasies -- Listen to Thom Hartmann on Air America radio, on the web, or somehow. Everyday Mon-Fri, ET 12-3 p.m. An education, all by itself.

[JeanPaulSatire]

Russia to Georgia: All your base are belong to us.

Russia to Poland: Did you not see that all Georgia base are belong to us?

[nomobull]

too simple

[Danny]

"Wag the Dog" the movie. Sheesh.

[who38]

China to US: We own you.