Christian Martyr Movement Leader Blesses Gingrich & Huckabee
On Friday, June 5, 2009, at an event featuring aspiring politicians Mike Huckabee and Newt Gingrich that was broadcast over the global media networks of GodTV, a rising leader in the rapidly reconfiguring Christian right who has publicly called for acts of Christian martyrdom prayed over and blessed Huckabee and Gingrich: TheCall founder Lou Engle.
The June 5, 2009, Rock Church event has received some media notice but coverage -which has noted Newt Gingrich declared Americans are "surrounded by paganism", and that he and Mike Huckabee made stump speeches calling for Christian conservatives to become more involved in electoral politics- has almost wholly missed the significance.
Leaders on the Christian right have been giving such speeches for decades, but the two-day Rock Church conference was not business as usual. Rather, it showcased the rapid reconfiguration of the Christian right around the rising, highly militant but poorly understood charismatic wing of the new Christian right, a movement which includes both Ted Haggard and Sarah Palin.)
One point of the spear for the new Christian right is an intense, raspy-voiced man who presided over the June 5, 2009 Rock Church event, layed hands on Mike Huckabee, and pledged the commitment of his prayer warriors to Huckabee and Gingrich was Lou Engle, founder of TheCall - which played a significant role in the push to pass the anti-gay marriage Proposition Eight in the lead up to the November 4, 2008 presidential election.
Only days before Huckabee and Gingrich received Lou Engle's endorsement at Rock Church, on Sunday May 31, 2009, late-term abortion doctor George Tiller was gunned down in the lobby of his Wichita, Kansas church. The next morning CBS's Jeff Glor reported, "We did speak with the accused shooters' ex-wife yesterday. She said she was not surprised this happened and that she believed Roeder wanted to be a martyr for the cause."
The November 1, 2008 TheCall San Diego event was the capstone event for the pro-Proposition Eight, anti-gay marriage push in California prior to the November 4, 2008 presidential election. Towards the end of the event, which attracted an estimated 30,000 attendees to San Diego's Qualcomm Stadium despite sweltering heat, TheCall founder Lou Engle, and his disciple Eddie Brown, as captured in footage taken at TheCall San Diego by documentary film-maker Michael W. Wilson made calls, from onstage before thousands of impassioned followers, for acts of Christian martyrdom. Engle has in the recent past declared that decades of legalized abortion since Roe v. Wade have incurred a blood debt which demands to be paid in blood.
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The service was concluded by Engle putting his thumbs in his ears and chanting 'booga booga booga'
The only rational religion, free of fanatics, and outmoded dogma is pantheism or the belief that the universe as whole is sacred. It is based on the spirituality of nature and its core beliefs can be summed up best by this quote by the late Carl Sagan:
"A religion old or new, that stressed the magnificence of the universe as revealed by modern science, might be able to draw forth reserves of reverence and awe hardly tapped by the conventional faiths.
Sooner or later, such a religion will emerge."
Pale Blue Dot
Oh god, save us from this ignorant pestilence! Wait... I don't believe in god!
Gives me an idea for Scary Movie 11.. or whatever we're up to..
It kind of makes the fiery Rev. Wright's sermons seem a boring Papal liturgy.
Insanity, pure and simple. The leaders of these movements convince their followers that anyone who says anything contrary to what they themselves are saying are "of the devil". They've created such a wall of fear and suspicion and worry for their own physical and spiritual safety that it is practically impossible to break away from. Isolationism and censorship and propoganda are their tools. I once believed it, now I'm a "heathen seduced away by the devil", or a "rebel against God" or a variety of other terms that serve to render me devoid of human qualities. Like all others outside the fray, "enemies of God', I am now (to them) some soul-less, slithering, persecuter of the brethren with an agenda. Interestingly, they are right about one thing. It was when I decided to step away from their voices and use my own rational brain, that I was able to think with a clear mind and see the error. It is the same thing that is happening within Islam, an otherwise peaceful religion being hijaked by hateful power-hungry kooks. The people swept up into it are convinced that they are fighting for more than just their own right to worship, they are convinced this is somehow an attack on their eternal lives and on God. Fear is powerful propoganda. But I'm proof that it is possible to break free.
Welcome back. People like you give me hope.
What you've described is the textbook definition of a *cult.*
Welcome back from the Dark Side.
Leland R. Erickson
Citizen
PROTESTant
Cult is exactly what it is. Funny thing is that they point out these cultish symptoms in other religions (their criticism of Jehovah Witness, Mormons, Moonies, Scientology to name a few comes to mind) but can not see them in their own.
Wiley Drake, a Southern Baptist Minister, admits that makes imprecatory prayers to God that President Obama will die. I am a Liberal Catholic Christian (pro-choice,etc) and I cannot fathom the depth of religious fanaticism that would lead one to pray for the death of another human being.
How does the fanatical religious right differ from religious fanaticism practiced anywhere else in the world?
Religion should make one a better, more loving person not self-righteous and hateful.
Acts or calls to such acts make them no better or worse than the terrorist that caused 9/11 - all in the call of religious fanaticism. I'm actually more concerned about these folks than I am any foreign terrorists. They're terrorists one in the same.
So much for religion - and chrisitianity. If this is the new brand, they can have it.
Right on the mark! Someone should ask these religious leaders and politicians who prostrate themselves before them to tell us the difference between Wahabism that spurned the Taliban and Al'Qaida and Christian fundamentalsim. Why is Christian martyrdom preferable to Islamic martyrdom of suicide bombers? I know the great majority of Christians and muslims do not subscribe to this dangerous idiocy, but they do not speak out forcefully against them. Why doesn't the political establishment and the media demand that politicians like Huckabee and Gingrich denounce these extremist hate mongers; the same way they demanded Obama to denounce Rev. Wright? I remember Black politician being urged to denounce Farrakhan every time he spoke.The United States Senate took an unprecedented decision when it passed a unanimous resolution (all 100 of them) in 1984 denouncing Minister Farrakhan ( private citizen) for his alleged comment that judaism was a gutter religion? But white right wing Christian pastors routinely call Islam an evil religion and not a peep is heard from Congress or the MSM. Some people are now praying for the death of the President and I have yet to see a politician introduce a resolution to denounce these agents of hate.
This is why they're "surrounded by paganism".
Paganism starts sounding awfully nice after listening to these morons for a few minutes...
Paganism IS nice. If you actually go and read about it, ask an actual Pagan believer about it. Of course anything sounds horrible from a prejudiced perspective.
Yes, I'm well aware... I don't self-identify as "pagan" exactly, but many of my friends do... and we're all quite happy to be part of Newt's paranoia..
Personally, I believe a few simple statements:
"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law"
and
"Love is the law, love under will."
I have yet to hear any pagan call for the killing of people in the name of paganism, or ask pagans to become martyrs by killing those they consider evil, or try to impose their pagan beliefs on nonbelievers.
Don't worry, we've got them surrounded! Which is news to me, but OK. :)
*pulling out handy bullhorn.*
'Throw down your weapons, (We know this might take a few minutes) And come out with your hands up... If you'd like! OK? Fine either way!
But we've got you surrounded, ...I guess... If you want to look at it that way... Actually, we're really just kind of... Around.... If you know what I mean. We'll just be.. Around.... Really doesn't have much to do with you, actually. OK?! '
:)
Very nice people, us, actually.
Still, this kind of talk does make us a little nervous about these people's intentions.
With this kind of endorsement from Lou Engle, Gingrich and Hackabee have entered a realm of extremist Christianity not very different from that of Islamist movement. I think they will definitely run in 2012.
Yet another group for the Homeland Security watch list, they're openly praising a terrorist as a martyr.
They are called "fundamentalist " because they think with their fundament.
One man's martry is another's jihadist. Religion hijacked is a dangerous thing.
I agree. But it is very easy for "our jihadist" to be viewed with respect while the jihadist of the Islamic fundamentalist are evil. This is not knew. The KKK, which at one time enlisted many political leaders in the South, always viewed itself as Christian and it had no qualms burning the Cross to terrorize blacks, jews and others who are viewed as aliens.
I am much more afraid of extreme fundamentalist Chistianity than of militant Islam, for the simple reason that the Christians are already here, all around us. It's a kind of mass insanity. These people used to be a more or less silent minority, until the Republican party invited them into the mainstream and provided a national forum for their frighteningly irrational views.
I guess we are forgetting that this fellow who killed Dr. Tiller was, like so many who have killed religious people in recent years, mentally disturbed. He acted out of hatred, has been condemned by even the most right leaning pro-life organizations, and has generally been found to be no more sane than the fellow who gunned down members of a conservative church a year or so ago. Beyond that, has there been any beheadings lately at the hands of conservative Christians? Suicide bombings? Spouse slayings? Mass terrorist attacks? Any Christian fatwas issued? As deplorable as the likes of Fred Phelps is, has he advocated violence or his church members lashed out to physically harm anyone? I'm a little confused at the comparison. I have long said that the modern Western Left sees only conservative Christianity as a threat, and everything else as negotiable. For me, it's one of the more vacant beliefs held by the modern Left. And one, IMHO, that will cause us to pay a horrible price down the road (like how in Europe in the early 20th century, people were so worried about Communism that they failed to care about the rise of Fascism).
Responsible people on both sides of the political spectrum are concerned about the religious extremism which breeds violent acts of terrorism. Terrorism is more about changing political realities by the perceived THREAT of violence than by the methodology used in their actual acts of lawlessness.
You underestimate the political and social damage. Do you really want creationism taught in schools in place of science? Do you want your books and movies censored because of "immoral" content? Do you want all social safety nets dismantled so that the elderly and poor will be thrown on the mercy of the churches? (A couple of years ago, a woman who was recuperating from and paying for surgery was informed by her church she was no longer a member because she hadn't been paying her tithe.)
Please also read up on the crusades. Especially the fourth and the Albigensian crusades. Money, power and religion are a volatile mix. Add a lot of hate ....
I don't know about RECENT beheadings, but there has been PLENTY of wretched torture visited upon innocent people in the name of God or Jesus etc.
...And yes, there has and is PLENTY of spousal abuse justified under the whole "the man is head of the family and is second only to God" belief system, with I'm sure, slaying of said spouse as an end result in some cases.
I could go on and on but the point is that Christian extremists are the same as any other extremist from Islam or Judism.
Just because the crazies from Islam use the word "fatwas", doesn't make the outcome of Scott Roeder's "martydom" any less deadly, it's just a different word. Good and reasonable Christians need to take responsibility for extremism in their ranks and stop making excuses.
And they become more radicalized with downturns in the economy, real or perceived threats and an administration that is not to their liking.
If you think about it though, this is great--this dude makes Rev. Wright look mild. When Huck and Newt trot themselves into the next race, this'll be very "helpful" to non-crazy voters.
American Talliban.
Proof required for that accusation.
Good grief, where to start?
If they talk like theocrats and act like theocrats they are theocrats.
Proof will be supplied once the existence of God is proved! Whatever you do, don't hold your breath!
You can continue to attack, slam, and compare the Christian faith to Jihad all you want but it does not matter. In the Bible Jesus told us that the world would HATE US as His followers. All you have to do is take a few moments and read these comments after this blog. Hatred, clear and present. There are bad apples in every group. Try to not be so narrow minded. I know many good Christians who are Democrats, who support Pro-Life, and its legal since Roe vs. Wade. 4,000 lifes are loss every day in the name of CHOICE, and its not going to be over turn in my lifetime. California rejected Prop. 8 twice in elections, and the court upheld it. This issue is truly in the hands of the people of California. The murderer of Dr. Tiller is someone who has mental illness, much like a Chapman, or Hinckley. So why do we have articles here that are clearly agenda motivated to do what? Promote FEAR?? HATE?? I thought you were against this.
You are kind of confused. Prop 8 was PASSED, not rejected, by the voters of California in '08, and then upheld by the state Supreme Court. Supporters of gay marriage wanted to have Prop 8 overturned.
I think you are missing the point about why it concerns people that some in our country want their personal (Christian) beliefs codified into law. That is against the constitution. Celebrate the fact that you may enjoy the right to exercise your religion as you choose in our great country.
But don't try to force those views on others by restricting their civil rights.
Don't like abortion? Don't have one, and protect every woman with whom you have contact against unwanted pregnancy.
Thanks Mamabird62 for correcting my error about clearly Prop 8 passed, and withheld by the state Supreme Court. I made a mistake in my typing. As far as my my thoughts on abortion is its legal and happens every day. Nothing I can do about it, but vote for leaders who share my views that the life of the unborn matter. Every life matters in my eyes, including the life of our men and women who die in war in which they volunteer to serve. The life of the unborn does not have a choice. Its just viewed unwanted. We have to come together as a country and strive to lessen the need for this procedure. All three of my children were born C-section, and my wife would have died on the table trying to give them life. That was her choice. Thats the love we have as parents. They never were some cells in her body. How can anyone not respect someone for having such precious view of life and call them radicals?
Jesus also said "Many will call me Lord, Lord," but their hearts are far from me. He said his response would be, "Depart from me, ye workers of iniquity."
C'mon, lighten up dude. We're just having a little opinionated fun. However, the only lives being taken every day in the name of CHOICE are, for instance, the men and women fighting the US war of choice in Iraq. As far as I am concerned, you and your opinion are wrong. I know you will take the time to show me/us where the Holy Bible states that abortion is the cessation of life. I know what I have read and it's not likely you will make me think differently but this is your opportunity. Short of that I would assume your feelings are personal and secular and that CHOICE is yours and I would respect it. But to think you know more than I do, that your opinions are more righteous than mine, that you are holier than me and The Lord thy God only speaks the truth to you is, well......
I don't hate you dude but I'm not terribly fond of the way you think or what you represent. That is my CHOICE.
Now, be a good boy and blog on your etch-a-sketch.
Because there are ministers like Wiley Drake who pray for the death of President Obama.
People who pray for his failure, etc. That is not the way loving Christianity should be practiced.
PS I am a Christian; guess I've read a different Bible, mine was full of love, acceptance, forgiveness and lack of judgment.
Kudos to you, peacegurl.
peacegurl if you tell me that you prayed for President Bush to have success, and that you supported all his decisions, and did not judge him for the mistakes he made then I will truly believe you are sincere in your faith. I really like President Obama. He has so many wonderful gifts to share, and give to this country. I pray for him every day. I just do not agree with everything he is doing, or trying to accomplish. That does not make me a bad Christian. God bless him always and keep him safe, and may the words of men like Wiley Drake be ignored.
All religions say that their followers will be persecuted.
You claim 4,000 lives lost everyday, yet you know women spontaneoulsy abort all the time. Must be God's will, but you won't say that. Pro-lifers are hollering about your quoted lost 4,000 and could care less about the millions of parentless children here now! When are your ilk going to go to some 3rd world country in masse, and adapt their kids? Or ones in the US? 12th of never?
I can go to any damn xian website and view the filth that you call Christianity promoting hatred, ostracizing gays and minorities! GGRRRR! Take off the Joo-Janta sunglasses and see the disaster around you!
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