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Christian Piatt

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Are Atheists Better People Than Christians?

Posted: 05/18/2012 1:03 pm

A friend of mine, Andrew, who considers himself marginally religious, if at all, is a regular follower of my stuff. He sent me an article recently that cites research finding that atheists are more compassionate and generous than highly religious folks.

Actually, this doesn't surprise me. Back when I waited tables, the Sunday after-church crowd was the absolute worst of the week to wait on. They took forever, were super picky, were terrible tippers and tended to be the most critical customers I had. It really killed me when, instead of leaving a tip, they'd leave a tract on the table. If you're not familiar with these, they're little booklets that some Christians pass out to try and save people. They justify substituting this for money because saving my soul is a far greater gift than a couple of dollars.

Well, I've got news for you. Last time I tried to pay rent with a tract, my landlord wasn't impressed. Second, that assumes an awful lot about me, my beliefs and my needs, doesn't it?

I'm digressing, but the point is, I identified with this article just by the title alone. It actually reminded me of this church sign that I've posted before, but which warrants a second look:

Another friend of mine, Paul, posted the following reflection about why this somewhat counter-intuitive phenomenon might be. He said:

When religious people do "good things" they are often doing so in conditioned response to an ethereal reward/punishment set of beliefs. When non-believers do "good things" its because they want to do them.

Tragic if true, but I think Paul might be onto something. I should note that Paul is involved in ministry like me, so he's not throwing stones from a distance.

I also wonder if it has something to do with the comfort that comes with being part o the cultural majority. Yes, there are Christians who will claim we're part of a persecuted minority, but that's simply ignorant. Christians have had the lion's share of power in this country for a long, long time, and it shows in our attitudes. We assume that what "we believe" is normal, and that anything else is an aberration. The result of this is that anyone who doesn't claim to be a Christian is made much more aware of it because of their difference.

It's like how I've written before about the inherent privilege of being straight. Generally, straight people don't think about being straight as much as gay people think about being gay, namely because the "default" sexual orientation -- aka, the majority identity -- is that of straight people.

Fact is, we don't think about who we are and how we act nearly as much when we're the ones in control.

Atheists, on the other hand, are fairly regularly persecuted (socially at least) for their lack of belief. They are made quite aware of their atheism, either because of how they're treated for it, or because they have to keep silent about it for fear of being ridiculed. So perhaps with this tendency to be more self-conscious comes an equally more self-aware set of behaviors and attitudes.

Put another way, if you're part of a group that is stereotyped in a negative way, you might go out of your way to act differently, even at an unconscious level, to try and defy that stereotype.

I could be reaching here, but I think there's something here that's basic to contemporary human nature. So although I don't think there's anything inherently better or worse about an atheist brain or heart than a Christian one, I do expect that atheists may work a little harder to convince the rest of the culture around them that they're decent, loving, caring people, regardless of whether they believe in God.

Is this a case for atheism? An indictment of Christianity. Not really either, I think. If I'm right, it tells us more about the power of cultural norms, the potential negative (but relatively invisible) effects of majority consciousness, and the responsibility of those with the privilege of being in the majority to go out of their way to act against the negative effects of such privilege.

All I know is that, when someone tells me I defy many of the common expectations they have of Christians, I take that as a compliment. I wish it wasn't the case, but it's clear from the empty seats in many of our churches that we have done an awful lot of this to ourselves.

 
 
 

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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
TheWM
aka The Wrong Monkey
01:38 PM on 06/26/2012
I see that you wrote a book called Banned Questions About Jesus. I get the impression that despite the book's title you didn't not closely examine the one question which seems to be most thoroughly banned among theologians: did Jesus exist? I know that Bart Ehrman's latest book, which I have read, purports to examine that question -- the question is the title of the book -- but many of us skeptics got the impression that Ehrman did not so much examine the question as unfairly denounce those who have seriously questioned whether there ever was an historical Jesus. Further, many of us are of the opinion that such unfair overly-hasty dismissal of the question have been standard operating procedure for as long as people have been able to ask the question without getting tortured and burned for it.

Perhaps you'd answer, as Ehrman did, that many people who deny that Jesus existed are unscholarly, and often even kinda kooky. And that's true. But when almost all of the people best qualified to examined the question of Jesus' existence, the people who've spent their entire careers learning the relevant ancient languages and studying the evidence and writing about it in peer-reviewed journals -- when nearly all of these professionals avoid the question or dismiss it out of hand, and ridicule the few of their scholarly, non-kooky peers who are looking into it, is it any wonder if the level of public discussion of the question suffers as a result?
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c-tom
Badges we don't need no stinking badges
02:27 PM on 06/26/2012
I found Ehrman's latest book to be rather difficult to get through. He circles and instead of A to B to C it's more A to C to A to A to B to A to A and then rinse and repeat.

He did however manage to satisfactorily destroy that annoying Mithra was born on the 25th, and his mom was a virgin story.
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sweetlilthing
hurt no one but tell the truth
01:07 PM on 06/26/2012
" I do expect that atheists may work a little harder to convince the rest of the culture around them that they're decent, loving, caring people, regardless of whether they believe in God"

We ARE decent, loving, caring people who aren't afraid to speak up and say we don't believe there's a God. In a few decades the religious won't have the inherent privilege of being the majority as we are seeing by the empty seats in many of their churches.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
TheWM
aka The Wrong Monkey
12:48 PM on 06/26/2012
"Are Atheists Better People Than Christians?"

One difficulty for me in answering that question is that I am not only an atheist but also -- duh-duh-DUHHHH!!!! -- a moral relativist, which many people, and not just religious people, seem to equate with being a horrible person.

So let me break it down a little: by and large I like and admire atheists more than Christians. By and large i find atheists to be more intelligent. But there are some Christians I love and admire very much. Some of the most brilliant people I know, both irl and from reading many centuries' worth of writing, are Christians, and some of the most infuriatingly stupid people I've ever had the misfortune to encounter, both living and authors centuries dead -- *cough* Tom Paine *cough* -- are atheists.

In short, a person's views on religion are just one small part of them. An important part, but very far from defining the whole person.
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traditionalliberalsrock
The heart of the wise inclines to the right...
12:07 PM on 06/04/2012
Saying Christians are motivated to do "good things" by an "ethereal reward/punishment set of beliefs” displays utter ignorance of fundamental Christian confession. We are saved by God’s grace and mercy through faith; NOT – in any way - because of “good things” we've done.

As for the “tip” (vs. “tract”) comment - we also believe that a “faith without works is dead.” The key is where you place “works.” Works do not result in or lead one to salvation; they reflect one’s salvation. They are not some “get out jail free card” but a reflection of Love and a Christ filled heart. Personal generosity and charity should be a hallmark characteristic of any Christian. But remember the old woman in scripture who gave “out of her need” (vs. her “abundance”). I would also recommend you read Liberal author Art Brooks on “Who Really Cares?”

I agree with Pastor Tate’s sign. No “Christian” should ever suggest they are “better” than anyone else. God is no respecter of persons and everyone is a sinner in need of the Savior. However, we must be careful of the placing humanistic values, virtues and ideals above those of God. Many “Christians” today have detached themselves from scripture and have replaced God’s Truth with that of their own individual consciences. Churches are dying and empty because they have strayed from God’s truth. People are (and have always been) desperately searching for Truth. Sadly, there is less and less to be found in today’s Churches.
09:03 PM on 06/19/2012
How can there be "sin" with no god, no supernatural? What's my "sin", not conforming to your belief in how everything should be? What about hers?....or his?.....or the Dali Lama's?

Without a religion/preacher telling me what he likes or not and what he expects me to do/not do, how do we define it? What about those Pacific islanders who never heard of your god? They can't "sin" your religion, either.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
detroitblkmale30
Wise Men Still Seek Him
09:17 AM on 06/04/2012
The fact of the matter is that anytime a group of people christian or atheists think of themselves or their beliefs more highly than they should, they are going to treat people with disdain. The issue is not the faith or lack of it, it always, is the individual. This is Dr. Seuss' Sneetches thinking they are better than others because they have "it" a star on their belly in the book. Unfortunately some Christians use their faith as a badge of honor to belittle others, and some atheists do the same by belittling Christians with reason and logic.

The honest among us know that there are good compassionate Christians and good compassionate atheists. You don't have to be a Christian to be compassionate or moral.You don't have to be an atheist to be rational and logical. The us vs. them war of words is tiresome and inaccurate.
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traditionalliberalsrock
The heart of the wise inclines to the right...
12:16 PM on 06/04/2012
I do not disagree. From my perspective - for me personally and in viewing other's comments - Christians can be challenged to share the Truth in Love.

The reality is tha the Truth may "heap hot coals" on one's head; we don't like it; sin is convicting and painful when we come to the realization of who we really are. We must stand on God's Truths and values. For example, It is not "loving" to affirm and tolerate lifestyles that violate scriptural sexual ethics. The challenge is to communicate that Truth with the message of God's love, forgiveness and salvation. Too often we, myself big time, simply sound like a "noisy gong."
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
detroitblkmale30
Wise Men Still Seek Him
02:15 PM on 06/04/2012
well said, it is a balancing act, having convictions and still being compassionate with how you express them.
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DianaLynn1967
It's a great life if you don't weaken!
03:07 AM on 06/09/2012
I'm not sure that it's the Christian's job to point out the sins in other people. On the contrary, it is the continual need of both Christians and nonchristians to point out how other people are flawed that leads to rebellion and hate. Instead, we as Christians might deal with our own sins--the ways in which we ourselves fall short of the glory of God and work to become more Christlike in our day to day lives. This way, the light of God will shine from within us providing light to all.
04:31 PM on 06/01/2012
I've seen this before, and I must resectfuly disagree. As an atheist, mind you. Go into an atheist chat room, and you'll see the same hate and holier-than-thou present in every group of people.

Perhaps it's not as noticeable because there are fewer atheists, and keeping it behind closed doors, so to speak, seriously limits hw much you hear about it? Or it's possible that whether or not one agrees wth an athestic position, it's clear that statstially speaking, there's a clear underdog here, and it's not the Christians- and somehow, people never will understand that te people who are buillied can BE bulles, too.

I think a lot of problems could be solved by giving up these group identifications. There's no typical atheist, there's no typical Christian, and statistical likelihood means squat when you're dealing with a new person. How compassionate that individual is you'll have to learn in time.
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DianaLynn1967
It's a great life if you don't weaken!
03:08 AM on 06/09/2012
What you've written is very much the truth. Fanned and faved.
09:17 PM on 06/19/2012
I've belonged to several atheist chatrooms and newsgroups. Every one is under constant siege by hateful christers, 24/7, as if their very lives depended on making sure we never had a civil atheist chat in public. Are they that afraid of logic and reason? Who feeds them so much hate, the business? We don't "threaten" anyone. We're not the ones on the street corner forcing atheist pamphlets into unwanting hands. Atheists don't stuff books into every hotel room drawer. Until provoked, have some anti-atheist laws shoved down our throats or stuffed in our face, we don't think about atheism at all! Christers are taught to think we "hate" them. Nothing could be further from the truth! I'll help anyone escape their delusional enslavement, IF THEY ASK FOR IT. What could we "sell" them? We simply don't believe in superstition and supernatural. There's nothing there to sell! I don't ask anyone to "believe" in anything I cannot put their hand against it...or many show them a photograph of something real but too dangerous or far off to touch. Fossils, yes....Ghost, no....picture of Jupiter, yes...Flying Spaghetti Monster, no.
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05:08 PM on 05/30/2012
Both are bad. When we realize that, then there is hope. All have fallen short of the glory of God. Read Romans.
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Meerrinhuff
12:55 AM on 05/25/2012
If this were true, then why would a number of scholarly studies show that, Conservatives, who are more likely to be believers than Liberals, give a much greater share of their income to charity. Before you try one response, this is true whether the Conservatives and Liberals are Rich, Middle Class, or Poor. Check out any study you want on this. Done by Liberal or Conservative, polling organizations. The result is always the same. TJC
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dschiff
Always learning
10:03 PM on 05/29/2012
Source?
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Meerrinhuff
12:48 AM on 05/30/2012
For one, I would suggest a book called "Who Really Cares?" by Arthur C. Brooks. He is a social scientist. If you take 2 people of the same income brackett, and study their charitable giving, about 75% of the time, the conservative will give a much greater % of their income to charity. It does not matter whether you are talking about lower middle class, or the fabled 1%. This is often an interesting comparison of presidential candidates, McCain vs. Obama, Bush vs. Gore, Bush vs. Kerry. Remember, we are talking about a % of income, not a raw number. The conservative tends to be more generous with their own money, and more thrifty with other people's. TJC
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08:18 PM on 05/23/2012
Are Atheists Better People Than Christians?
Simply answer... no.

This is Bible 101 stuff

Romans 3:23
...for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
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03:35 PM on 05/23/2012
These are tired old stories, Christian... or is it tired old Christian stories... ??? Still sounds right... :)
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SmileAndActNice
Utilitarianism, the -ism that works.
02:14 AM on 05/23/2012
Not all religions are as toxic as the monothestic ones ... it is possible for a religion to be good. You just have to design it properly.

1- Polytheistic.

Monotheistic religions are to divisive. the idea that you have a monopoly on Truth leads to disrespectful behavior towards others. It also tends to lead to groups claiming to be "more holy" than others because they "One True God" favors them.

2- Afterlife determined by weighing the good you have caused against the bad.

"Forgiveness" doctrine is societally toxic. It leads to people being cavalier about their actions because they can just "mean well" and get "forgiven". The entire system needs to be more oriented toward outcomes than intentions to encourage people to think more before acting.

3- Possibility of re-incarnation in afterlife.

You care more about the state of the world if there is a chance that you'll be back.

4- No centralized earthly authority.

Big pools of money are inherently corrupting and your holy people won't stay holy long if you allow them.
01:23 AM on 06/16/2012
I would like to say that monotheism can be positive.
1. Remove the word religion from the vernacular
Religion from the Latin meaning to 'bind' was used by the Roman Empire to refer to the Imperial religion which pretty much meant worship the emperor and any other conquered culture's religion that would enforce the emperor's control. Religion is normally tied in with the state or power.
2. There is only one spirituality that does not seem to have a place where those who are bad get tormented or hell and that is the Native American Indian spirituality. Historically judgement has been used to coerce adherents to act in ways that were more in line with the wills of the religious leaders.
3. God is coming to make his home down here with us and heaven will encompass the entire cosmos.
4. I like this one. One of the many things that needs to go is the hierarchy because Christians are all clergy so there is no need for religious professionals in the church.
5. The institution of Church needs to die. Organised religion is evil. Jesus did not intend to start a religion but a community who would stand up for the oppressed, the poor, gender equality, the LGBTQ community, against violence and injustice.
6. Modernity is the problem as well with it wanting to increase efficiency, demonising nature, emphasising patriarchy, and a certainty that progress will cure all ills just to name a few.
08:30 PM on 05/22/2012
The person who identifies themself as an atheist is one whose own confusion is evident in that they make argument over that which they believe doesn't exist.

Within us all is the knowledge that Christ is both LORD and GOD. There is no getting around this truth. The rebel though is one who suppresses this truth in the attempt to not become convicted by their actions which their own conscience screams is wrong. This of its self will drive one to insanity!

But there is hope... Imagine waking up one day to know that Christ has forgiven you and that you have been declared righteous by the One who took upon Himself your sins on the cross of Calvary so that you could truly live...

When GOD looks at the cross He sees you, and when GOD looks at you He sees Christ. 2 Corinthians 5:21 is the greates passage in all of Scripture.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Scotland Dave
Stop lying to kids,break the cycle of religion.
11:19 PM on 05/22/2012
LOL; it's when I read posts like this I see why Mankind has been held back from discovering new things throughout our early history: no wonder we rarely progressed as a species during the Dark Ages and it's no coincidence that we have moved further in the last 150 years than in the previous 5,000 years because we don't have mindsets like this poster to hinder progress.
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08:20 PM on 05/23/2012
...so the Scottish lead in lack of religion and they are discovering what???
05:18 AM on 05/23/2012
I think that atheists have good reasoning for their beliefs. Personally I think that being an agnostic is a better position because to me it seems to be impossible to say whether there is or isn't a God. To believe in God takes a bit of faith, something that atheists and agnostics just don't have in them. If God showed up in person at their door saying he wanted to forgive them I'm sure they would listen. It's just that they don't believe or don't know what to believe about a spiritual world. For me personally I want real flesh and blood relationships that I know are real, not something that I'm not sure I believe in. I think everyone should read as much of the Bible as they can and contemplate its meaning. No one should reject the opportunity to gain knowledge. If it changes them to become a Christian then so be it. The important thing is that we respect one another and work to make the world a better place.
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Scotland Dave
Stop lying to kids,break the cycle of religion.
09:34 AM on 05/23/2012
Nathan, atheists are so not because they stridently don't believe in any god, my stand is that there is just no evidence to support the possibility of one and the logical step is that until there is tangible evidence we must accept that there is no god on that basis. If god showed up at my door then my atheism would be negated forthwith. :-)
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
dschiff
Always learning
10:27 AM on 05/23/2012
A nice sentiment.

It's worth noting that agnosticism and theism/atheism are not mutually exclusive positions.

That is, one is either: a gnostic theist, an agnostic theist, an agnostic atheist or a gnostic atheist.

Most self-defined atheists are agnostic atheists, like myself. They don't claim to know that no gods exist, but they don't have a positive belief that they do.
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ras121s
Bark less, wag more.
05:20 PM on 05/22/2012
An intelligent person does not need the promise of heaven to see the merit in good deeds.
02:59 AM on 05/23/2012
Not believing in Heaven doesn't make you intelligent, and doing good deeds doesn't necessarily make you good.
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dschiff
Always learning
10:28 AM on 05/23/2012
I don't understand your second claim.
Nightangle
NPA - no party affiliation
11:58 AM on 05/23/2012
"promise of heaven" - the most contradictory person to ever include that phrase, yet somehow in your subconscious that place called heaven does exist.

No logical progression of thought.
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ras121s
Bark less, wag more.
07:02 PM on 05/23/2012
Have you ever heard of irony? I don't believe in heaven. Or hell. It's an expression - that's all. You Christians need to loosen up.
Hidare
Let me help you out. Which way did you come in?
05:02 PM on 05/22/2012
Wow what about the people from India? They would never tip in their lifetime and do everything they could to pay 10% for the meal. What about these poor souls?
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monkeyshine89
God goggles, like beer goggles, but more deceptive
03:55 PM on 05/22/2012
I think atheism tends to attract intellectuals, who are often liberals, who are known for helping the poor.
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traditionalliberalsrock
The heart of the wise inclines to the right...
12:49 PM on 06/04/2012
Orwell said something along these lines:

"You must be an intellectual. No ordinary man could be so stupid."
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monkeyshine89
God goggles, like beer goggles, but more deceptive
01:41 AM on 06/05/2012
I'm sorry I didn't know helping the poor was stupid.