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01:45 AM on 06/09/2012
Science and Religion are compatible as long as you don't think about one or the other too much or either at all.
07:53 PM on 06/07/2012
Science is successful (mostly) due the the scientific method. Make sense?

Scientific method: 1) Ask your/a question.

2). Research! (open your mind).

3). Construct a Hypothesis.

4). TEST your hypothesis. (This in itself is a big step for you theist due to your belief that you must not test god, if this is the case then admit that religion and science don't coincide with each other here).

5). Analyze your data and draw your conclusion. (Even if the data shows other than what you thought would happen. Be ready to be wrong/proved right and/or corrected on this step).

6). Communicate your results.

Religion has repeatedly failed the criticism of Science with FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER COLORS!
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Jradxit
Faithless morality over baseless faith
11:11 AM on 06/05/2012
Millers argument appears to me to be that science is right and in the past was supported by religion so in that limited way was compatible. He then goes on to say the "concept of god" and science are incompatible, but this concept is so constrained as to be meaningless as Shermer pointed out - i.e. what's the difference between a universe whose starting conditions were defined by "God" and set into motion never to be tweaked again and one in which the starting conditions are defined by the nature of reality unconnected to a "God" agency? Furthermore "faith" is the antithesis of science. Faith could be defined as: Certainty of belief independent of evidence; and science as: Belief only to the degree of certainty warranted by evidence.
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Jradxit
Faithless morality over baseless faith
11:48 AM on 06/05/2012
Edit: Meant to say compatible rather than incompatible in the second sentence. Apologies.
09:52 PM on 05/28/2012
Why do Atheists claim to be great thinkers, but yet lose all ability to think when it comes to reading the Bible?

Why do Atheists think it is perfectly acceptable for them to use figure of speeches such as "I'm so hungry I could eat a horse!" but it isn't ok for the Bible? Why is it ok for them to not always be literal but the Bible must ALWAYS be literal? What's up with the double standards?

Atheists complain they are never given evidence or that there isn't any (which is a lie). Haven't any of you ever thought that maybe you could go look yourselves for it? Truth is that it isn't that there isn't any, but rather that you don't WANT it.

Just some things to think about.
05:53 AM on 05/29/2012
You claim there is evidence for God, yet you fail to provide it... could you perhaps give me one piece of evidence to examine- I really do WANT to see it.
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ivsciguy
Engineer
02:43 PM on 06/06/2012
I've read the bible. I also understand the the difference between literal and metaphorical interpretations. If god is so real and powerful he can come say hello and settle the debate.
06:39 PM on 06/12/2012
Y'know maybe he did... thousands of years ago... He came to provide humanity with a set of guiding principles that would help them lead better lives... but then humanity sparked a bunch of religions from his influence that took his guiding principles and turned them into divine mandates that lead to the religious using his name as an excuse for hate, discrimination and war; mankind bastardize his teachings. Since then, God has had second thoughts about interfering with humanity again in that he might spark ANOTHER wave of hate and violence... frankly the only way he's gonna be able to stop us from killing eachother is if he strips us of our free will.
09:52 PM on 05/28/2012
Also have Atheists ever thought about how irrational and illogical it is that they are so angry with a God whom they claim doesn't even exist? Just think about it.

Why do Atheists say there is no God, but yet accuse Him of being at fault for all the "atrocities" in the Bible? Um if there is no God, then all those events could not logically be His fault. How can He be the cause of something, if He doesn't exist?

Why do they say there is no God, but then turn around and blame Him for suffering in this world? Uhhh. I have yet to make sense of that one. There is no God, but yet it is all His fault we are suffering, but there is no God. Yet it is all His fault even though, according to Atheists, He isn't even real. Uhhh. Sorry, but I prefer to think.

Why do Atheists say we blindly believe whatever we are told, but then turn around and blindly believe whatever Dawkins and others say without question?

Why don't they question their beliefs? I have questioned mine. I don't even go to church. I prefer to let the Holy Spirit teach me.
06:12 AM on 05/29/2012
Atheism (specifically agnosticism) is the absence of a belief in God. Much like you might have absence of a belief in the Tooth-fairy.
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Jradxit
Faithless morality over baseless faith
11:43 AM on 06/05/2012
I am atheist and I cannot be angry at something which I don't believe is real. However, I am angry at PEOPLE who base their actions on irrational faith in a God of their personal choosing and even more angry at charlatans who use this faith for personal tax free gains. I am angry at those who try to teach creationism in schools, who neglect to provide safe child care in religiously exempt daycares, who refuse to treat treatable medical illnesses for themselves and their children in lieu of faith "healing," I am angry that people justify prejudices based on belief in god, I am angry that George Bush and Tony Blair discussed biblical apocalyptic nonsense to justify war, I am angry that because of religious belief contraceptives have been made less available to people in third world countries rife with AIDS and overpopulation, I am angry that you can believe you learn anything of value from the "holy spirit".
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godlessliberal0
blasphemy is a victimless crime...
01:59 PM on 06/19/2012
F&F
08:03 PM on 06/26/2012
Good points, at least some of them. I'm not angry at creationists who are simply offering an alternative to bad psuedo science evolution. It takes as much faith if not more to believe in evolution as creation. So we're all people of faith, just different beliefs.
09:42 PM on 05/28/2012
I know there are other "problems" people may have with the Bible. The choice is yours: Do the research and think or just be pissy and stop all thinking. Your choice.

www.rationalchristianity.net
www.carm.org
www.answersingenesis.org
www.godandscience.org
http://www.reasonablefaith.org/
http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/menus/debates.html
http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/menus/articles.html
www.christiananswers.net
www.tektonics.org
www.atheismfallacies.org
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ivsciguy
Engineer
02:49 PM on 06/06/2012
I have read many books on both sides, and I have not found any reason to think that any religion is any more real than any of the others. When you realize why you reject all religions that are not Christianity, you will see why I reject even that.
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gdog62
Facts are kryptonite to stupid people.
12:56 PM on 07/10/2012
"Problems"?

How about this: Please explain the 9 mentions of unicorns in the Bible, and why I shouldn't take them as evidence that your book is nothing but Bronze Age mythology.

9.Isaiah 34:7 – And the unicorns shall come down with them, and the bullocks with the bulls; and their land shall be soaked with blood, and their dust made fat with fatness.
09:37 PM on 05/28/2012
That is how it is...with this and all the others..God is warning people and telling them that if they keep doing what they are doing...they will suffer consequences. He is doing it out of love. Which is more loving? To warn them in hopes they will repent and be spared or to not warn them at all and have them suffer?

If you have a friend who drinks, which is more loving?

To warn the friend that if he drives, he could die and kill others? Or Not say a thing and have your friend die and others as well?

Think about this: Imagine if God never warned the people in the Bible of their sins or of the consequences. Imagine He never warned the Egyptians and Ethiopians they would one day be led away naked. Wouldn't Atheists and other critics then say, "What a loving God! He knows the future, but yet He didn't have the heart to warn those poor people!" Yet God does loving warn and people have hissy fits! God warns them of their sins specifically and tells them the punishment(s). It isn't His fault if they are too stubborn and too prideful to repent.
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ivsciguy
Engineer
02:51 PM on 06/06/2012
Taking these arguments to their logical conclusion wouldn't got be much better if made us born with innate knowledge of god and what sins to avoid. Think of all those people that have never even heard of the bible, god is being quite evil towards them.
09:32 PM on 05/28/2012
5. There are times in the Bible that God gives some warnings to nations that may be troubling.
Here is an example of one that used to trouble me.

Isaiah 20:3 And the Lord said, Like as my servant Isaiah hath walked naked and barefoot three years for a sign and wonder upon Egypt and upon Ethiopia;

4 So shall the king of Assyria lead away the Egyptians prisoners, and the Ethiopians captives, young and old, naked and barefoot, even with their buttocks uncovered, to the shame of Egypt.

Ok so Isaiah is commanded to walk totally naked for 3 years. He is a sign that some day the Egyptians and Ethiopians would one they be led away captives totally naked to their shame.

Now at first glance I thought that God Himself was going to strip them all naked! I thought how cruel and mean for God to publically humiliate them! However, I considered. I thought. Then I realized that God wasn't the one who did it to them. He was warning them. Warning them that if they keep on the path they are now, some day they will be led away naked and shamed. If they had listened to God's warning through Isaiah and repented, then they would have been spared.
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Brooke123456
God is ....(fill in the blank how you like)
01:50 PM on 06/19/2012
Your "thought" is in fantasyland.
1. Why presume gawd even exists?
2. How do you know this supposed "lord" said what was written in Isaiah 20:3, 4 etc.?
3. How do you know that this even happened in the detail that is written?
Now..."think" on those questions, the first one especially, and then come back with answers.
The questions you ask are more important than the answers you give.
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gdog62
Facts are kryptonite to stupid people.
12:58 PM on 07/10/2012
Exactly. You can't look through Bible verses for evidence of god's existence. The veracity of the book is what's at question! *facepalm*
09:25 PM on 05/28/2012
3. If God is so vicious and cruel, why did He warn people of their sins and tell them specifically what they were doing was wrong and what would happen to them if they refused to repent? If He was so cruel, He would have said NOTHING to them. There would have been no warning, nothing. He warned them in hopes they would repent and not be punished. If He was so heartless, He wouldn't have said a thing.

4. If God is so unmerciful and unloving and hateful and mean, explain Jonah. God sent Jonah, who disobeyed, but ultimately got back on task to go to Ninevah to warn the people. The people repented and God forgave them and spared their city. Now if God is such a cruel monster, why did He warn them in the first place? Why didn't He just wipe them out without any warning? Instead He shown them mercy and compassion.
09:25 PM on 05/28/2012
Some Questions to Ask Oneself.

1. How do you know the Canaanites and other peoples of the Bible were innocent and didn't deserve punishment? Have you bothered to look up and see what sort of practices those people did or do you just assume they were innocent?

2. Haven't you considered the fact that all of the 10 plagues were against specific gods of Egypt? Don't you realize that God was showing them through each one that He was stronger than all their gods? Don't you think that the Egyptians prayed and sacrificed to their gods only to find out it did no good? Don't you think that they would have realized that, "This God they worship has sent all these plagues to us, we have prayed to our gods, but they couldn't stop it. Moses prays to his God and it stops immediately!" They should have put two and two together and realized..."Their God is the one true God!" Far as the first born, that was the last plague. God shown them through the first 9 He was in charge not their gods. So they could have spared themselves the last plague if they had humbled themselves. Many assume first born means baby or child. What?! There are first born ADULTS out there. I know. I have one such sibling.
08:33 PM on 05/28/2012
That picture of "God" is how many see Him...with a huge scowl on His face. They think God is this vicious mean bully because others have told them He is. Some verses or a verse in the Bible offends them, but instead of researching it and thinking, they determine that God is a savage cruel heartless beast. Sadly they never give Him a chance.

I urge all who read the Bible and find verses that trouble you to look into them, to think, to do research. Ask yourselves questions.

For instance when you read about the genocide. Ask yourselves: Why did God command this? What sins or wrong did these people do? Don't just assume they were innocent. That is the assumption people make. Go see for yourselves the facts about the Canaanites (for example) and see how "innocent" they really were.

I used to think that God in the OT was vicious and cruel because that is what others said. First time I read the Bible, I could see why. I saw all the blood shed, death, suffering, etc. and concluded that they were right. God was a vicious angry monster.

However, I wasn't, like many, being fair. I reread the Bible again and this time looked into those verses that bothered me. Praise God, I have found out that God isn't vicious and heartless fiend after all. I have read the entire Bible more than once...every word, every number, every single bit.
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Jonathan Munoz
2 things you can't argue with: crazy and stupid
08:08 PM on 05/24/2012
Science tells us how the universe was made and how it works

Religion tells us why the universe was made and why it works the way it does.

I think that science and scientific explanation is just a complex way to explain what God does. God made the universe, ok if you were there what would you have seen, you would have seen the big bang, that is what Godused to create the universe. It's not magic. There's an explanation behind it.
06:01 AM on 05/29/2012
When you think about it: "How" and "why" are essentially the same thing.

With this in mind: religion doesn't really tell us anything that can elucidate the universe around us.
You seem to imply that God is a route to simplicity. Indeed, it is a route to a simple mind.
06:04 AM on 05/29/2012
Furthermore, invoking a God doesn't really explain anything- since you are left with the burden of explaining god.
12:48 PM on 05/24/2012
I grew up Catholic back during the tail end of the old Latin Mass, (which was a slow process). It was a time of ecumenism & we all got along, Protestants, Jews, & Catholics, in our small city. From both sides of my family were found members of both areas of Christianity, & we all had lots of Jewish friends. Really. And, there was no conflict whatsoever, that I was aware of.As an altar boy up through high school, I could read pages of Latin prayers & responses, & for the most part, hadn't a clue what I was saying. Yet nobody thought that was unusual...but it was....Perhaps I grew up very naive, but I always assumed that science told us what happened & when. Religion told us why. I have not been involved in religion in many years; nor has any of my family. For me, I was turned off by the apparent changes in the church that made it look like an attack dog. Our parish priest was a regular golf partner with the local rabbi, & that was seen as the way life ought to be. I only recall good priests who were widely respected, although some were the worst poker players in history. We all got along.
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bnbmarble
12:19 PM on 05/23/2012
The eternal power and deity of God are observed by all. "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened" (Romans 1:18-21).
Even those who do not know the Scriptures are without excuse because, all around them, they can see ample evidence of the eternal power and deity of God. This should cause them to seek God. Israel was told that even in captivity they could find God if they diligently sought Him: "But from there you will seek the Lord your God, and you will find Him if you seek Him with all your heart and with all your soul" (Deuteronomy 4:29). God has promised: "I love those who love me, and those who seek me diligently will find me" (Proverbs 8:17). "And you will seek Me and find Me.
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gdog62
Facts are kryptonite to stupid people.
01:00 PM on 07/10/2012
Ridiculous. I'm one of "all" and I don't see any divine power. I see a bunch of desperate people clinging to Bronze Age nonsense.
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James Clovispoint
08:53 AM on 05/22/2012
This subject is such a no-brainer it's pathetic.
Science deals with natural phenomena, Religion with supernatural phenomena.
Religion deals with the Irrational, Science deals with the Rational.
Religion proclaims to communicate directly (and indirectly) with a god(s), Science has not found evidence for such communication.
Science and Religion are as incompatible as water and oil.
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Jonathan Munoz
2 things you can't argue with: crazy and stupid
08:08 PM on 05/24/2012
i disagree
12:17 PM on 05/31/2012
Do you have a reason for disagreeing?