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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
10:11 AM on 06/03/2013
2Peter2:12
01:42 PM on 06/03/2013
Which means nothing
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Ian Wagner
09:47 PM on 06/03/2013
1 Timothy 2:12
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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
06:30 AM on 06/04/2013
Don 't get jealous, read Roman Chapter 16 and tell that to Paul!
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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
10:10 AM on 06/03/2013
Maintain Your conduct fine among the nations , that, in the thing in which thy are speaking against you as evildoers, they may Asa result of Your fine works of which they are eyewitness glorying God in the day of his inspection. Amen
10:05 AM on 06/03/2013
Very well said. What are your suggestions for moving this fdiscussion forward into the Roman Catholic Church where allw omen, even today, are isolated and marginalized? It is the religion most powerfully perpetuating thre evrer virgin perspective on Mary throughout the world.
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James D. Tabor
09:28 AM on 06/03/2013
Several readers have made the point that Protestants have not insisted on the "perpetual" virginity of Mary, the mother of Jesus. This is not wholly the case. The doctrine of Mary Mary was "ever-virgin" (Ancient Greek: ἀειπαρθένος aeiparthenos) was in fact supported by the early Protestant Reformers such as Martin Luther and Huldrych Zwingli. Calvin was more open to the idea of Mary having sexual relations. Even John Wesley, founder of Methodism, supported the notion of her "perpetual virginity." Today many Protestant churches that teach the "virgin birth" do not insist on the perpetual virginity but many Christians of whatever persuasion have a difficult time with imagining a "sexual" Mary, mother of Jesus, as my post points out, since "holiness" in our Western culture has been traditionally associated with asceticism and thus celibacy.
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lynus55
I'm cute and powerless to stop it!
12:10 PM on 06/03/2013
I prefer the other 200-300 legends (religions) that have virgins giving birth. Makes the superstitions more "real". (?)
02:43 PM on 06/03/2013
Like Madonna the singer?
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Krzysztof Ciuba
01:35 PM on 06/03/2013
The problem is like with natural science discoveries; we can laugh at many strange traditionalist views in the history until we, humans learn the ones in textbooks now. In this case of "ever-virgin" thes old diputes were base on the lack of today's knowledge of Scripture.That's all. They treated usually Scripture literally, therefore this 'strange" anti-biological idea. Marian's titles and feasts are just interpretations to show the importance also of Jesus' mother though NT mentions her only few times. Psychologically it is quite obvious to understand it wen we imagine the soul of Mary like any mother at the cross. Do not mix seeing a lightning bulb (a physcial fact, data with the "seeing" the light as photons or elctrical currrent as moivng electrons -they are just an interpretation (presented in a math model) of the physical data.The same applies to theology.
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Mason J Stewart
Retired, Military, Theology
09:05 AM on 06/03/2013
Jesus is a creator in the flesh and bones. A 5,500 year old prophetic message filled starting with Adam and Eve. Until the birth of Jesus all Jewish prophets were not born with supernatural powers. Men and women shared the use of supernatural powers within the Jewish community. Jesus powers and authority given by permission matched that of a GOD! Just like the rest of the females married to a prophet Mary did not deal with being barren during marriage. Compare and relate incidents amongst Bible characters differences would become clear. Enoch, Moses, Elijah and Jesus are the most commendable Jewish prophets.
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lynus55
I'm cute and powerless to stop it!
12:11 PM on 06/03/2013
To bad, they're all mere legends.
01:12 PM on 06/03/2013
Until the birth of Jesus all Jewish prophets were not born with supernatural powers.

Sadly the above comment is not true.
This person appears to read the bible with blinkers on.
Even to raising people from the dead, this has happened as written in the Old Testament.
Study again my friend.
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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
01:30 PM on 06/03/2013
Not. Really...lfe
01:48 PM on 06/03/2013
How can she. She has never read the OT. Most Christians have not read it or they would not be Christians.
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08:59 AM on 06/03/2013
wow. this article sure is bringing out the crazies.
09:14 AM on 06/03/2013
No foolin; can you believe how many people actually believe this virgin birth idiocy?
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10:17 AM on 06/03/2013
yeah. I don't mind what people believe - their beliefs don't harm me, just like a gay marriage doesn't harm my own marriage - unless, of course, they try to preside over my life & choices by citing their own beliefs.. Anywhom, I find biblical history quite interesting. seeing how Christianity has changed from its inception to its current form is facinating. lots of politics.
same with most religions.
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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
09:54 AM on 06/03/2013
Lol..
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gutenmorgen
a.k.a. crowsnest
08:47 AM on 06/03/2013
I think that the author misses the main point of the Maria/Miriam cult. Like all man-made products a religion must remain attractive to stay on the market. Since 50% of mankind is female a religion like Judaism or Islam which does not specifically cater to woman can be at a disadvantage. Although Mary/Miriam has not been elevated to the status of a head honcho she is a very powerful woman at least in the RCC. What a magnet! Brilliant concept! It worked great in Mexico.
01:15 PM on 06/03/2013
I think my friend you have hit the nail on the head.

The same as for introducing Christmas instead of a pagan celebration, complete with tree etc.
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ruthsdaughter
Each of us is willed; each of us is necessary
06:09 PM on 06/03/2013
if you think he has hit the "nail on it's head" look into what he is referring.
How did the images appear in the eyes of Our Lady of Guadalupe?

Google it.
02:49 PM on 06/03/2013
The catholic church is not a corporation we do not have a marketing department. All Christ said was; my sheep will hear my voice.
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gutenmorgen
a.k.a. crowsnest
10:06 PM on 06/03/2013
Wrong. Your marketing department is named Vatican.
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07:40 AM on 06/03/2013
What I find strange is that Christians attribute Jesus as the messia, who is to come from the house of David. And he does by way of Joseph, on the first page of the NT
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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
08:21 AM on 06/03/2013
Nice .. Acts 7: 7-9..amen
01:50 PM on 06/03/2013
WRONG... That is completely false. The Messiah's seed (from the father) must come from a person of the Davidic line. That did not happen in Yeshua's case. He is not the messiah.
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kodimirpal
teacher
09:08 AM on 06/03/2013
The only name common to lists between David and Jesus is Joseph and that, too, a “supposed” father according to Luke 3:23

This one name is glaring. You need no fine-tooth comb to catch him. It is Joseph the carpenter. You will also easily observe that the lists are grossly contradictory.

Could both the lists have emanated from the same source, i.e. God? .

Matthew and Luke are over-zealous in making David the King, the prime ancestor of Jesus, because of that false notion that Jesus was to sit on the “throne of his father David” (Acts 2:30).

But with their extravagant enthusiasm to trace the ancestry of Jesus physically to David, (for this is actually what the Bible says - that of the fruit of his (David’s) Loins, according to the flesh” (literally, not metaphorically Acts 2:30), both the “inspired” authors trip and fall on the very first step.

Matthew 1:6 says that Jesus was the son of David through Solomon, but Luke 3:31 says that he (Jesus) was the son of David through Nathan.

One need not be a gynecologist to tell that by no stretch of the imagination could the seed of David reach the mother of Jesus both through Solomon and Nathan at the same time!

We know that both the authors are confounded , because Jesus was conceived miraculously, without any male intervention. Even if we concede a physical ancestry through David, both authors would still be proved wrong for the obvious reason.
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sjaent2001
Change is Challenged, chngr changes/CROSSED
07:12 AM on 06/03/2013
Incidently, 2.5 billions Christians and 1.5 billions Muslims looking for Jesus second coming and the tribulations. With so much outsourcing from US to China and India, even the 1.75 billions non believers now drenched with so much economic surpluses, are wondering after centuries the turn of economic tides --- those who were the poorest by the help of greedy rich of the West, have changed the shift to about 7 billions of the mix of believers or non believers ----- God knows best how to correlate the -----------"""There she reigns next to her Son Jesus Christ at the right hand of God as co-intercessor with him on behalf of humankind, and for some, even "co-Redemtrix."------
08:39 PM on 06/04/2013
What is the EVIDENCE from the Bible to support your claim that -----------"""There she reigns next to her Son Jesus Christ at the right hand of God as co-intercessor with him on behalf of humankind, and for some, even "co-Redemtrix."

If your claim can not be proven from the Bible - it must be REJECTED.
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sjaent2001
Change is Challenged, chngr changes/CROSSED
02:38 AM on 06/05/2013
The quote that you also pointed above is not mine but the author of the article narrated that so I have nothing to prove.  The author should have the burden of prove that you are requesting.  Rejection and Acceptance --- is all due the act of free human will. We reject often that should be accepted and we often accept that should be rejected often. It is all about acceptance and rejections so will the end of the day of justice when there will be great reckoning and there would be acceptance and rejection on the scale that humans have never seen before in this world ---- God knows best and it is all in what one believes in or not -- So God help us to know more about Your Will and how to submit to your will for the glory of humanity and the heavenly GRACE. AMEN.
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sjaent2001
Change is Challenged, chngr changes/CROSSED
07:10 AM on 06/03/2013
""""From a historical point of view, Christian dogma and devotion, as sincere as it might be, rob both Jesus and his brothers and sisters, not to mention the mother that bore them, of their humanity. The very concept of an asexual "mother of God" is alien and foreign to Jewish culture and to the Hebrew Bible"""-----

------"""What our various sources tell us is that Mariam was the mother of seven children: Jesus, his four brothers -- James, Yose, Simon and Judah """"""""---------

-----------------Dr. Tabor I am impressed with your extensive work on Jesus --early Christianity, and Judaism, from the above quotes one thing is self evident ---- there were other siblings blood related to Jesus through mother and other father. They were HUMANS and got birthed, lived infancy, childhood, adolescence, adulthood and old age and DEATH ultimately was tasted.

Somewhere I read that Adam was created without a mother and Jesus was created without a father. Two examples for the entire Humanity or entire Universe that when God say Kun, so be it.
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frjohnmorris
09:31 PM on 06/03/2013
If you knew anything about Middle Eastern culture you would know that close relatives are frequently referred to as brothers and sisters. Mary's womb carried God in the flesh. It would be desecration for it to carry a mere human. It is not only Roman Catholics who honor Mary. Orthodox Christians also venerate the Blessed Virgin Mary. Instead of lowering it, the status of Mary elevates all womanhood because the greatest human who ever lived, was Mary, a woman. It is through Mary's obedience to God that humanity was saved from the curse that came into the world through the sin of Adam and Eve.
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sjaent2001
Change is Challenged, chngr changes/CROSSED
02:43 AM on 06/04/2013
According to the story and the article the author has stated that there were atleast six other siblings for Jesus Christ through Mary. The Example of Mary is complete submission to the WILL OF GOD to carry out HIS WORD, and give birth to a unique person only second to Adam who did not have a mother, and Jesus did not have a father, afther fullfilling this supreme will of GOD, as God always does it KUN, so be it and it is done, there were six other humans who got birth and died natural deaths. What is so unique about Jesus is that he was lifted and that he shall return to tell the rest of the story and then establish the Kingdom of God. The tribulations are here and it seems the more liberals and athiests we become there is more awareness worldwide as the West is looking for the LOST WEALTH and CREDIT WORTHINESS and OUTSOURCEDNESS and the EAST is abudantly enriched out of the blue with so much surpluses that they can buy out the WESTERN DEFICITS.

The lesson here is that submission to the will of God and carryon HIS WORD has supreme glory and grace. The salvation of Humanity is in the submission to the Will of God if you do not believe me than who else could be the best example for such submission than Mary -- the mother of Jesus Christ, for all the females of the world.
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sjaent2001
Change is Challenged, chngr changes/CROSSED
02:47 AM on 06/04/2013
left out portion of reply to your comment:
God has chosen women for a supreme duty to raise good children so there is Glory to God and not the problems we face nowadays because dogmatically we mix and match oranges with apples figuratively. God Knows best and let us pray GOD HELP ALL OF US. PEACE AND AMEN.
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06:20 AM on 06/03/2013
The concept of Mary as the 'queen of heaven' is only Rome Catholic doctrine. The Bible doesn't explicitly or implicitly say that. Should the ancient popes and their high rank aides had read the Bible completely, they'd have known that there is a passage in JEREMIAH 7:16-20 “So do not pray for this people nor offer any plea or petition for them; do not plead with me, for I will not listen to you. Do you not see what they are doing in the towns of Judah and in the streets of Jerusalem? The children gather wood, the fathers light the fire, and the women knead the dough and make cakes to offer to the QUEEN OF HEAVEN. They pour out drink offerings to other gods to arouse my anger. But am I the one they are provoking? declares the Lord. Are they not rather harming themselves, to their own shame? “‘Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord says: My anger and my wrath will be poured out on this place—on man and beast, on the trees of the field and on the crops of your land—and it will burn and not be quenched." The popes in RCC and their high rank aides have been leading mankind off the righteousness of God's Words by asking its followers to cling to its canon law n doctrines.
01:23 PM on 06/03/2013
Good quote

Good comment
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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
06:17 AM on 06/03/2013
People need to start being responsible in knowing God Word and stop listening to false teaching and believes,,, life
08:40 AM on 06/03/2013
i agree totally and ,after reading some of these posts here, i am astonished about how so many so called "responsible people" in our society believe in total nonsense.
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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
10:12 AM on 06/03/2013
Smile...life
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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
05:26 AM on 06/03/2013
She was a Jewish mother of seven!
08:38 AM on 06/03/2013
yes if she is effectively a real historical person, of course for she would be a Jewish mother of seven par excellence.
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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
08:43 AM on 06/03/2013
Well that is a question well all need to be wondering, would you think?life
05:18 AM on 06/03/2013
James D. Tabor,

What you're really doing is covertly giving Jesus his "human place". Or, as I should state it with more clarity. When you give Mary her human place you are denying Jesus as the Christ.

I know of no Christians, who are Protestants, that consider Mary to be "Queen of Heaven". For those same Christians, Mary is given her honor due to the "virgin birth" of Jesus. However, after that event Mary had children, (i.e., the half brothers and sisters of Jesus), by Joseph.

The reason very little is known about what happened, (i.e., the events which subsequently took place), to Mary after the crucifixion of Jesus is that those were of little importance to the writers of the New Testament.

Your article is what could best be described as "sheep's clothing".
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Debra Martinez
Who is your God...
05:32 AM on 06/03/2013
That is so true ! Not even a Christian would've believed that. Lol, Jesus , in fact told his mother in John 2:4 but Jesus said to her : What have I to do with you, woman? My hour has not yet come. And we know that Jesus hour of death to save all haven't came yet, even to save her from her sins.
And if you read Luke 8:21 in reply he said to them :My mother and my brothers are these who hear the word of God and do it. Here he is talking about preaching and teaching the Kingdom of God!life
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07:42 AM on 06/03/2013
"And if you read Luke 8:21 in reply he said to them: My mother and my brothers are these who hear the word of God and do it. Here he is talking about preaching and teaching the Kingdom of God!life" I don't think yr interpretation is correct. More logic is t't Luke 8:21 shows Jesus indicates t't God has accept no COLLUSION on requests, meaning mankind has to come to God DIRECTLY, not through any mediator, as recorded by Matthew in Mat 11:28 “Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.” He didn't explicitly nor implicitly teach His disciples to come to other than God for help, none of His disciples recorded Him saying to come to His physical mother, so is in the OT: there's no concept of asking for help other than to YHWH.
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07:42 AM on 06/03/2013
Jesus is indeed the intermediary between mankind and God the Father (read: the Messiah), but He is actually God the Father who transformed to a man, that's why He said, recorded by John in John 10:30, "I n the Father are ONE". John 19:26-27 indicates that at the time Jesus' soul left His physical body, He CEASED being Mary's PHYSICAL son, because God doesn't need a physical mother. Mary is one of God's important n extraordinary means in His salvation plan, still she was a human being.