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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
mountainweb
Conservative Commonsense
09:40 PM on 08/12/2011
"Both unions accuse the other of not having their members' best interests at heart" bottom line that has become true in this country, The union management puts THEIR interests, read MONEY, ahead of the workers. Sadly, many have developed an anti employer attitude that works against everyone but union management. No one, can allow unions to take over companies or governments but in may cases, it sounds like what the union management is shooting for...
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Abraham1771
Polymath Rationalist
02:20 AM on 08/13/2011
"No one, can allow unions to take over companies or government­s"

Look at our close ally and close competitor:
In Germany half of the Directors of all companies with more than 1000 employees are elected by the employees, say Unions.
This law was passed by the arch anti-communist, arch conservative Chancellor Konrad Adenauer in 1950.
Have they taken over the companies? No.
Do they participate in making their work place a better place. Yes.
Responsibility through participation.

Just look at the German Current Account balance (+200$Billion, vs US -600$Billion) and you see how well this has worked for a country of 85 Million, with no natural resources to speak of, which just has spent 1.3 $trillion to upgrade the infrastructure of the former East Germany
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09:39 PM on 08/12/2011
Dues, baby.

All we want is your dues.
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suds mcduff
we're not perfect, but they're nuts!
09:36 AM on 08/13/2011
Dues for paying lawyers to review crooked contracts provided by management and pensions absconded on by corporations to fatten dividends for shareholders.....baby....
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10:13 AM on 08/13/2011
Nah--mostly for those purple t-shirts and lavish luxury boxes at the Convention. Mostly.
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becky bradshaw
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth
09:27 PM on 08/12/2011
Union power oscillates in response to employer abuse. The employers have escalated the battle by:
1. moving jobs to slave labor locales like China and India, and
2. importing slave labor into the U.S. from, for example, Mexico.
10:28 PM on 08/12/2011
Blame the corporations as usual. What losers you libs are!
11:04 PM on 08/12/2011
A union job is always better than right to work. I saw first hand how southern workers are treated.
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becky bradshaw
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth
11:14 PM on 08/12/2011
Globalism's future can be found in the slums of Asia (http://www.walkthroughindia.com/lifestyle/major-slum-areas-in-top-indian-cities/).

Defenders of corporate America are either not paying attention (see idiot), are paid posters (see Karl Rove), or are profiting from the pain (see Goldman-Sachs).
10:46 PM on 08/12/2011
I worked for a great union company for 20 years. I was an officer in the union for 10 of those years. Yet even though they were paying us over $20 an hour, we went out on strike for 2 weeks over 35 cents. We cost the company millions in those 2 weeks. Now, the company is going out of business. And you want to blame companies for not wanting to go union, And you wonder why?
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becky bradshaw
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth
11:10 PM on 08/12/2011
Something smells.
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Lotus19
Power Concedes Nothing Without a Demand..FD
10:37 AM on 08/13/2011
Well then, I just couldn't imagine anyone being so petty as to vote for a strike that last 2 weeks over 35 cents. So I guess as an officer in the union you voted for that strike?

No one blames the companies for not wanting to go union. They certainly have their reasons why. The question is why wouldn't the workers want to go union (unless of course it's a union that votes for a strike over 35 cents).
09:22 PM on 08/12/2011
I think many of you, including the historians who commented in the article are missing the point. This isn't about a turf war between 2 rival unions. This is a battle between the members, who were left with a shell of a union, and the union who only cares about lining their pockets instead of servicing the members. Gone was the member participation in every major decision. Gone was the trust we had in our leadership. In its place was mistrust of the replacement leadership, utter chaos on our worksites, leadership that not only cuts back door deals with kaiser, but acts punitively towards their own members. We, the members CREATED a union of our own making, where we can once again be in charge of our own destiny. You talk like NUHW is some sneaky organization, trying to come in and steal workers! In my opinion, its just the opposite. We were the fastest growing, most member driven union within SEIU because of our members, and the relationship we had fostered with our union officials. Once SEIU stole us, by way of trusteeship, we lost what we once had. I agree this battle takes time and energy away from organizing the unorganized, but SEIU brought this battle to us. We just didn't roll over and accept our fate. If anybody should be blamed for the state of organized labor, it shouldn't be NUHW. We just want to regain what we once had. And I will continue to fight!
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09:56 PM on 08/12/2011
Are you related to Friedrich Engels?
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harveyr2
Be skeptical of politicians or be their pawn
09:15 PM on 08/12/2011
Separate the union leadership from union members.

The ONLY issue that union leadership cares about is increasing union dues and increasing political power.

The leaders don't care about their members. They are the CEOs of their business.
10:15 PM on 08/12/2011
It's really sad that you obviously don't know our leadership. I've sat side by side with them during bargaining, as well as at weddings and even funerals. They care deeply about their members. They are of course the CEOs of the organization, but any smart CEO knows you get better results when you work with your employees, than when you work against them. And when the product of the organization directly relates to the working conditions of the members themselves, it makes sense to work towards a common goal. SEIU doesn't believe that. They have sold workers rights away in many cases, in exchange for the right to organize more workers. In this way they line their own pockets while the workers suffer.
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JakeMontero
Independent thinking
09:13 PM on 08/12/2011
SEIU represents reality. NUHW represents the past
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Dameocrat
http://twitter.com/#!dameocrat
09:04 PM on 08/12/2011
not all unions are equal in their ability to push workers interests, and this is most certainly the case here. in the case of the seiu, they often make so many concessions that the benefits are hardly better than having no union at all. on top of which the enforce the bad deals they make and act as a strong arm of management.
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harveyr2
Be skeptical of politicians or be their pawn
09:15 PM on 08/12/2011
Yes, but the leaders of SEIU are extremely well paid and that's all they care about.
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suds mcduff
we're not perfect, but they're nuts!
08:56 AM on 08/13/2011
Do they make as much as the corporate executives at comparable levels?
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medicontheedge
big loud broad
08:54 PM on 08/12/2011
Is there a direct correlation between the erosion od workers rights, benefits, safety, etc, and the systematic eroding of labor unions by the right wing and their corporate tools?

Discuss.
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JakeMontero
Independent thinking
09:11 PM on 08/12/2011
nope. next point?
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Major Nikon
Slow thinkers keep right
10:28 PM on 08/12/2011
Why then do states with the highest union membership typically have the highest household income? Unions raise the bar for employers such that even non-union employers have to offer higher wages to compete for employees. 18 of the 22 states that have right to work laws have below average median household incomes. GOP union busting policies have a direct and negative effect on wages. It's that simple.

Cheers!
10:47 PM on 08/12/2011
Labor unions did themselves in. Read my other post regarding the time i was a union officer.
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thekid360
Black, Union and Proud, Booyah
02:53 AM on 08/13/2011
I read your post and how you became an officer for 10 years is mind blowing. No one who believes in union's could never say the union ran a company out of business with the example you gave. If the workers went out for only 2 weeks and cost the company millions for only 35 cents, says to me the company made a bad business decision.

And for you to be an officer at the time, what was your part in the decision to go on strike, if you were against it, then you obliviously were not a leader who could influence others, which begs the question again how did you get elected. And the above post also does not lead me to believe union was in your heart. When it served your purpose and provided benefits and pension, it was good. But once the company continued to make bad business decisions you blamed the union for their incompetence, hypocrite you are or worse an undercover scab. Shame on you.
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ghostrider57
Unable to find reality.sys Universe halted
08:46 PM on 08/12/2011
Well the SEIU sounds a lot like Walker in this instance. Here is what I am running on.

Now that you have voted for me, here is what I am going to do.

I would vote for NUHW.
Genders
Love, Tolerance, Enlightenment
08:31 PM on 08/12/2011
Meanwhile, Sweden with some 90% union, has a higher standard of living, higher happiness, longer life... and longer vacations.. Do the math.
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09:41 PM on 08/12/2011
They are really, really white.
Genders
Love, Tolerance, Enlightenment
09:57 PM on 08/12/2011
No, they are not.

Sweden has more non-white immigrants percentage wise, than the USA.
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Abraham1771
Polymath Rationalist
02:28 AM on 08/13/2011
They have, for example, taken in more Iraqi refugees tahn the US.
In absolute numbers.
This is something to be really ashamed of, that we did not take in Iraqi people who as translators and in other functions resked their lives for the US.
08:25 PM on 08/12/2011
this is a fight about members rights to have a Union that fairly represent them, the danger to the labor movement is the SEIU's lack of representations of thier members , so please dont blame the victim for the crime.
07:39 PM on 08/12/2011
Unions are great at one thing, and one thing only. They are great at costing people their jobs. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but find me one union in this country (that isn't taxpayer funded) that has increased the number of employees in the field.

Let's see....

Steel, nope.
Auto, nope.
Airlines, nope.
Shipworks, nope.
Railroads, nope.
Mining, nope.

On and on.
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Littlewords
Micro font for main bio not available
08:23 PM on 08/12/2011
M0ron, unions are not in play to create jobs, they are there to represent the interests of those with jobs and to establish standards for those jobs.

Thus in this case, what did we find, Kaiser illegally withheld both pay and benefits. But for this case, that would not have been resolved and thus the employees would not have been paid what they were due.

So is the fight odd, yes, and potentially unnecessary maybe but maybe not, were harmed employees remedied for illegal and unethical actions by their employer, yes in deed.
11:00 AM on 08/13/2011
You're right, they are not there to create jobs, but they sure to destroy them... please see above examples. What is that right there, about 4 million jobs?
08:10 AM on 08/14/2011
Wouldn't creating jobs be in the best interest of the labor unions' constituencies? Isn't there immeasurable irony in your opening sentence?
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BadHaBritt
Always looking for the broader perspective
07:22 PM on 08/12/2011
This is very sad. It's like the NUHW & NLRB are actually acting like greedy, power hungry corporations. Both sides heed to regain focus and join forces.
07:16 PM on 08/12/2011
The reason there was an electoin in the first place was because SEIU came in and took over the local UHW for insubordination. SEIU wanted 65,000 of the 150,000 workers UHW had grown. they planned to put these workers in a other failing local. The workers objected with the locals help and so Seiu put us in trusteeship. We are the real organized workers now called NUHW. We want our union back. Seiu spent $50 million in dues to fight the members and put out a campagned full of lies to scare workers into staying with SEIU. We have a new election and it is a new day and people realize they were hood winked.
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Simple Living
Stand for something
07:12 PM on 08/12/2011
Having belonged to a sell-out union, this fight is justified. Why does Kaiser want to keep the SEIU ? The members deserve better.