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04:43 AM on 08/29/2011
Ever notice that these pro-Israel propaganda pieces always omit the following words:

"occupation", "illegal settlements", "collective punishment", "land theft", etc

Maybe when David Harris starts introducing these words into his articles I might take them seriously.
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10:04 AM on 08/29/2011
"occupatio­n", "illegal settlement­s", "collectiv­e punishment­", "land theft"

All of the above terms are used by anti-Israel propagandaists, so yes, they will be omitted by people favoring the Jewish state.
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SamSeven
You're either with Humanity or you're not.
11:46 AM on 08/29/2011
"occupatio­­n" since 1967


"illegal settlement­­s" since 1948

"collectiv­­e punishment­­" ie Gaza.

"land theft' since 1948
10:53 AM on 08/29/2011
"We plan to eliminate the state of Israel and establish a purely Palestinian state. We will make life unbearable for Jews by psychological warfare and population explosion. . . . We Palestinians will take over everything, including all of Jerusalem.”--Yasser Arafat
02:57 AM on 08/29/2011
This is never going to stop, is it?
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01:55 AM on 08/29/2011
Mr Harris, Me Thinks Thou Doth Protest Too Much
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charlietuna11
12:01 AM on 08/29/2011
the nerve of those palastinians not wanting to wait another forty plus years. they should return to the table and allow even handed america to hold and play all the cards. america at one time was the defender of the mistreated and abused. america is not called the united states of Israel without reason. at no time in the past 40 years has any resolution criticle of Israels treatment of the palastinian ever escaped americas veto. are you now suggesting mr. Harris that america is going to be a fair and balanced player? i think not...
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anton123
12:31 AM on 08/29/2011
These are emotions and we need pragmatism in this conflict.
There were way too many emotions and drama and misery in this piece of land.
We need courage of BOTH sides to come to negotiate and compromise.
And we need both sides to stop blaming the other for torpedoing the negotiations.
03:54 AM on 08/29/2011
The Palestinians have been offered deals several times over the years, and have rejected each and every one. As the president of Iran has said several times, getting rid of Israel is their main and final goal. They will not make a deal unless it means they get all of israel, and that is just not realistic.

And please don't say that Ahmadinejad never said this, because he has said it on more than one occasion (do the research). And,since Iran pulls Hamas' strings, they follow his lead.
Thelonius
Lived in Middle East for
11:46 PM on 08/28/2011
Some of the peace initiatives that Israel has rebuffed include: U.S. Secretary of State William Rogers’ The Rogers Plan (1969); The Scranton Mission on behalf of President Nixon (1970); Egyptian President Sadat’s land for peace and mutual recognition proposal (1971); U.S. President Jimmy Carter’s call for a Geneva international conference (1977); Saudi Arabian King Fahd’s peace offer (1981); U.S. President Ronald Reagan’s Reagan Plan (1982); U.S. Secretary of State George Shultz’s Schultz Plan (1988); U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s Baker Plan (1989); the much heralded 1993 Oslo accords signed by Yasser Arafat and Israeli Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin that unravelled following the latter’s assassination and subsequent return to power of the Likud party from 1996-1999 under Benjamin Netanyahu; continuation of the Taba II negotiations (2001); the 2002 Arab League’s Beirut Summit Peace Initiative (which offers Israel recognition as a sovereign state, exchange of ambassadors, trade, tourism, etc., if Israel complies with international law and its previous commitments) and the unofficial Geneva Peace Initiative of November/December 2003.
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anton123
12:23 AM on 08/29/2011
Are you sure that Israel was the only side the "rebuffed" these?
Why didn't you list initiatives that were rejected by Palestinians? For example 2000 when Ehud Barak offered Arafat "97.5" what Arafat wanted - including parts of Jerusalem. But Arafat refused and ignited another wave of violence.
Or simply why didn't you just list ALL peace initiatives since 1967?
You list of very one sided and this is very subjective and biased way to present things.
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Richard Pearce banned
Never let them tell you it can't be done.
04:49 AM on 08/29/2011
Oh, I see someone is still convinced Obama is foreign born (after all, it is the same sort of willing disconnect with reality as the '97.5%' offer, which starts off with the premise that what Israel decides belongs to them, even in the face of international law that says it doesn't, belongs to them without question and must not be considered when calculating how much is on the table)
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02:19 AM on 08/29/2011
You forgot the White Paper of 1939 and the Wannsee Conference.
Thelonius
Lived in Middle East for
11:43 PM on 08/28/2011
Reality:
Nahum Goldman, president of the World Jewish Congress: “Israel has never presented the Arabs with a single peace plan. She has rejected every settlement plan devised by her friends and by her enemies. She has seemingly no other object than to preserve the status quo while adding territory piece by piece.”

Professor Avi Shlaim, Israeli historian, as summarized by Ha’aretz (11 August 2005) in its review of his book The Iron Wall: “...[B]ased on facts, he surveys the history of Israel’s contacts with the Arab world from 1948 and states decisively (‘The job of the historian is to judge,’ he says) that the Israeli story that Israel has always stretched out its hand to peace, but there was nobody to talk to - is groundless. The Arabs have repeatedly outstretched a hand to peace - says Shlaim – and Israel has always rejected it.”

Mr. Harris also misrepresents UNSC Resolution 242 by ignoring the preamble which governs all that follows: "Emphasizing the inadmissibility of the acquisition of territory by war...."

Furthermore, Resolution 242 explicitly states what lands Israel must withdraw from:, i.e."Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories OCCUPIED IN THE RECENT CONFLICT [my emphasis]."
Indeed, both Aba Eban and Moshe Dayan advised the Eshkol cabinet that this clause calls for Israel's return to its boundaries as of 4 June 1967.
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anton123
12:26 AM on 08/29/2011
You pooling things out of context or presenting citations from very marginal sources (and people) - so they will serve your purpose and propaganda.
Very biased and not to say falsified way to present things.
05:39 AM on 08/29/2011
Yes, the UN and international Law are "marginal sources." Of course they are. And a professor of History at Oxford is now apparently a "marginal" figure?
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10:59 AM on 08/29/2011
Shlaim is an anti-Israel "New Historian," who approved the doctoral work of Ilan Pappe, a widely discredited Israeli writer and educator. Shlaim's own work has been criticized as well for his ridiculous notion that Israel rejects every peace offer. The Goldman quote is uncited, as another poster mentioned.
10:05 PM on 08/28/2011
"Fourth, to be a state entails certain criteria, including control of defined borders. "
Interesting Mr. Harris, what are Israel's "defined" borders?
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Vlady
Better Late
10:57 PM on 08/28/2011
>>what are Israel's "defined" borders?

Stay the same as they are now, but seriously fortified
Thelonius
Lived in Middle East for
11:18 PM on 08/28/2011
Evasive response.
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02:05 AM on 08/29/2011
Maybe you could help the rest of us in where those borders actually are
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anton123
11:22 PM on 08/28/2011
The author immediately explained what he mean - Gaza together with WE or not.
It's not about specific border line, but rather if Abbas really represent Gaza as well.
The very unstable agreement between PA and Hamas can break at any moment and there is no clear definitions how they plan to work together.
In reality - there are two separate territories with 2 separate governments