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Cliff Rothband
Never Assume Anything
09:33 AM on 09/30/2011
An old Jewish saying," the difference between a Jew and a Christian, Christians are born with Original Sin, Jewish People are born with Original Guilt". I agree with almost all the comments so far.
Except, in the Jewish Tradition we always leave an extra seat, You never know who might show up. I seriously doubt any Temple, Shul or Synagogue would ever turn a non ticket holder away, or anyone for that matter.
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flippy1409
John Galt was right !!
04:13 PM on 09/30/2011
It was attempted on me in Albuequeque NM in 1969 as a returning vet from Viet Nam. Only after I guaranteed a publicity nightmare, were apologies offerred and I was allowed to enter and pray on Yom Kippur.

Your belief that this is not being done is as absolutely and categorically wrong as the practice itself ! It IS shameful...AND embarrassing. Jewish folk who abide this crap have no more clue about how this practice feeds anti semetism, than they have of the dangers of Liberalism gone amok and yet still support it to the 93 percentile
03:05 AM on 10/02/2011
I am sorry this was done to you. They did wrong, and they violated basic Jewish norms in doing so.

On the other hand, sometimes angry people get angry responses from others. There's an axiom in the Torah: "Do not put stumbling blocks before the blind". Their behavior sounds extreme. But so does yours.
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gposner29
08:46 AM on 09/30/2011
Simple solution...Eliminate the intermediary....Pray wherever and whenever you choose....It's what's in your heart not what's in your wallet. Human beings can communicate with God without being forced to contribute money to a "house of worship" at the same time.
03:02 PM on 09/30/2011
True, but it's also about fellowship. God said that where ever 2 or more gather in his name, he will be there too.
Rubberfish
Who needs a stinkin' micro-bio
07:07 PM on 09/30/2011
People can have fellowship right in their own homes, regardless if they're Jewish or Christian, and it won't cost a thing except what people already are paying to maintain their home. (Ok, and maybe some refreshments)
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Daveh88
SLTFATF
09:59 PM on 10/02/2011
no one forces you to pay, its your choice. And don't condemn people for their religious views. You come across pretty arrogant
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gposner29
10:18 AM on 10/05/2011
No one is condeming anyone for "religious views." It's the "behavior" that's troubling when money is involved. Money changes things. It's not about the money...it's about having God in your heart and obeying his laws everyday...not just on Sunday when you pay a "cover charge." Arrogant? Hardly. Practical? Definately. Your witness.
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ebuist1825
08:32 AM on 09/30/2011
Organized religeon is a very lucrative business, it's all about the money. At the same time, however, if people want a central indoor location to worship, that location needs to be maintained, and that costs money. Everything from HVAC to electric, plumbing, landscaping, pest control, etc. Then there are advertising costs trying to expand the congregation, salaries for staff & clergy, and in house programs for the congregation. While no one should ever have to pay to pray, if they can't afford to support their religeous facility with money, there should be volunteer programs in place for less fortunate members that would save the organization money and still remain solvent.
08:11 AM on 09/30/2011
High Holy days???? Damn, and I'm out of Pot.............
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gmabobbie
gma is for Grandma, bobbie is a girl's name.
07:51 AM on 09/30/2011
I don't belong to any religion...every night I get on my knees and pray and it costs me nothing. In an effort to give my 10% to show honor to God, I will give to the homeless on the streets, or others in need...when I can make sure the money is going to them and not some religious organization. For me, and keep in mind this is just my view, I'm not trying to change yours, all churches are nothing more than 'God stores', they all offer salvation, but you have to pay for it. I've read the bible more than once, and not once in there does it tell me that I can 'buy my way into heaven'. Call me a heathen if you must, but at least I let my actions speak louder than my money.
03:10 PM on 09/30/2011
I've read the Bible more than once, too. You are missing the point of tithes. We give tithes freely because that is what God asked us to do, it's an act of faith in God. If the Pastor, Priest, Rabbi.etc. uses it for hookers and booze, that's between him and God. I know that I have done my part.
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gmabobbie
gma is for Grandma, bobbie is a girl's name.
07:10 PM on 09/30/2011
And I know I have done my part. What part of I give my 10% to the homeless is not a 'christian' thing to do. Am I not doing the very thing Christ did?
Matthew 25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
07:01 AM on 09/30/2011
These comments about carrying money to shul, reducing dues, etc. does not apply to every synagogue. When I got divorced, I lost my house, my car, I had no job, and I had two children to feed and clothe. My synagogue put the bite on me for $1000 for yealy dues. They said they had already reduced them as low as they "could" go. I met with the dues committee and was strong-armed by the shul president that "if I didn't pay the dues, they would not bar and bat mitzvah my children." I gave "junk" right back to them and told all present that if they didn't work with me on this, I would blab to everyone I knew, including the Detroit Jewish Newspaper about their intentions. They finally backed down and let me pay what I could. I later found out that the clergy lived in 3000 sq. ft. homes, and the endowment they were using to pay expenses with was invested and lost on the stock market. Point: not all synagogues are trustworthy, and don't believe them when they tell you large, absorbanant dues are necessary.
06:26 AM on 09/30/2011
Religions are nothing more than businesses, and they will do anything to keep customers, just like Walmart....the realm of the spirit is not found in bibles, or churches, or temples or whatever....it is found in nature, in yourself.....cancel my subscription to the resurrection......as the lyric goes....
01:04 AM on 09/30/2011
The comment about the Lubavitcher Hasidic community may be misunderstood. The organization is better known as Chabad, has thousands of synagogues world-wide, and also runs non-sectarian education, social service, drug rehab, new immigrant, and senior services. It is the oldest Jewish-run social service organization (1774) in the world. There is a Chabad House on most college campuses. Although the Rabbis are Chasidic, most who pray are ordinary Jews from all walks of life. The Rebbe, the spiritual leader, received the Presidential Medal of Freedom/Congressional Gold Medal, and each year on his birthday, Presidents of both parties declare "Education Day" in his honor. At Chabad you don't have to pay to pray.
02:43 AM on 09/30/2011
While Chabad may not charge, if you pray regularly at a Lubavitch center, remember, _someone_ needs to pay to keep the lights on. I know my local Chabad rabbi well, and it's a tough life. Their house was recently foreclosed on, and there's no longer a local center. A few people in the community are keeping Chabad in our area afloat, really.

Basically, the folks in Brooklyn send young couples out to the middle of nowhere (and if you're extremely orthodox, "nowhere" is just about anywhere in the US or elsewhere), and leave the job of raising money to support Chabad's programs to the young rabbi and his equally young wife. It works more often than you'd think, but I have a lot of respect for someone that young taking on that kind of project.

Judaism in the US is like PBS -- it's brought to you by donations by "people like you". I'm aware of a lot of congregations of all kinds that don't know how they'll pay for a place to meet, much less how to pay a rabbi enough to live on. If you can help out the congregation you pray at, you really should.
12:51 PM on 09/30/2011
The Rebbe also said to give what you can. Some of the other institutions even ask for your income tax return to figure out how much to give.
I beleive in giving what I can give and hold the Rebbe in high regard for this. For one never knows how much a mitvah may cost, it may go over the proscribed amount.
I am all for helping the Shul but my fellow man comes first. There are homeless to house and to feed, I feel my funds are best used for this first and will always practice this way.
But I do love my Chabad and the fact that I feel they practice active Judaism.
L'Shana Tova chaverim. May you and yours be inscribed ito the Book of Life.
06:08 PM on 09/30/2011
Some Chabad services such as day schools, oriented to those of all incomes and having high costs, charge a fee and offer scholarships based on ability to pay. To make this process even-handed, scholarship decisions and means testing is performed, for example in Los Angeles Chabad schools, by a division of the Educational Testing Service set up for that purpose. Its decisions are based on need, not student testing.

Nevertheless, Chabad seeks support for students where available. For example Chabad participates in the non-sectarian Los Angeles Universal Pre-School Program which provides free pre-school in Chabad's "inclusive" classrooms which require at least 10 percent of the children to be Special Needs, fully integrated into the classroom and playground equipment.
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BahtHarim
Rabid Partisan Democrat
12:36 PM on 09/29/2011
Let's clear one thing up. Anyone can go into synagogue any time of the year a pray. No cost. Charging for tickets during the High Holy Days is the Jewish equivalent of passing the collection plate in church every Sunday. Many Jews don't go to temple at any time during the year except during these holidays, they don't belong to the temple and are therefore not members, who pay membership to pay the Rabbi (do you think they do it for free??), upkeep for the building, etc, etc. During the year, anyone can come in and pray, member or not. This time of year is a way of helping maintain the congregation. And another thing--not all congregations charge for attending High Holy Day services. A shining example is the Lubavitcher Hassidic community. Anyone, anytime, even this time of year, can come to services, member or not, paying or not. They, of course, request donations, but if you can't do, it's still ok. I'm sure some jerks are going to make hay about Jews and money, and we need to nip that in the bud right now.
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pfz
My micro bio is empty but not without feelings.
12:50 PM on 09/29/2011
thank you for clearing that up, the article has a definite slant it.
12:35 PM on 09/29/2011
Because one cannot carry money or do anything involving money on Shabbat or holidays, a plate cannot be passed at services. Thus, synagogues charge dues for membership. In some cases High Holy Day tickets are included in the dues structure. In others, the tickets are extra. In all cases, tickets are available to those who cannot pay. Churches ask their members to tithe, synagogues request dues...in both cases, those who cannot pay are still welcome.
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BahtHarim
Rabid Partisan Democrat
12:42 PM on 09/29/2011
Thanks for pointing out that no one is turned away for inability to pay.
12:51 PM on 09/29/2011
Actually, I liked your response better...much more direct.
12:32 PM on 09/29/2011
Is this not how Cristianity began with Jesus getting upset the the Synagogues leaders getting wealthy by charging for thier services?

Wow, thousands of years later, still the same...
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BahtHarim
Rabid Partisan Democrat
12:39 PM on 09/29/2011
Not at all, not at all. You are entirely misinformed about both Jewish and Christian history. Go read both bibles.
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chedet
Le Panda
12:57 PM on 09/29/2011
The same reason why the Protestant movement started. Pattern repeated by the Catholics. You point is?
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BahtHarim
Rabid Partisan Democrat
01:43 PM on 09/29/2011
His/her point is that Jews are all about money and nothing else. It's clear that poster has an agenda.
12:26 PM on 09/29/2011
You have to pay to pray in a Synagoue?
You can't just walk in?
Am I understanding this correctly?
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BahtHarim
Rabid Partisan Democrat
12:40 PM on 09/29/2011
No, you are not understanding this correctly. See comments above.
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gposner29
08:55 AM on 09/30/2011
Just for the high holidays...unlike the daily dish passing in churches.
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Joshua Grisenthwaite
Your friendly neighborhood Communist
12:02 PM on 09/29/2011
Tickets? Those better be REALLY nice temples if you have to pay to sit in them for a couple of hours a week.
02:16 PM on 09/29/2011
Really? Because most churches not only pass the plate every single Sunday and holiday, expecting a weekly donation in the middle of a religious service (crass to me) but also send out mailings with envelopes you are supposed to mail back.
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gposner29
08:56 AM on 09/30/2011
Check them out.
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Steamboater
Forget hope. Agitate.
11:52 AM on 09/29/2011
As far as I can remember it's always been like this with having to buy a ticket for the high holidays at a synagogue and yes, the synagogue does use the money for upkeep of the temple.
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YakittyGirl
Pro deo et patria
11:52 AM on 09/29/2011
""Synagogues are not like the churches," Van Raalte said. "We don't have a central organization where we can get funding."

It appears that Ms. Van Raalte doesn't realize that most churches that have central organizations get their funds FROM local churches.
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westpascolooking
01:57 PM on 09/30/2011
what "central organization" are you talking about...I've read that a number of times but have no idea what you are talking about. Do you assume that because a church is catholic it can rely on the Vatican? Because it is Lutheran it can depend on the Synod? If so I really think you need to find out how things really are. I can show you 6 Lutheran Churches that closed down because they couldn't afford to stay open any longer and NO central organization came to the rescue.