Republican Presidential Candidates Announce a Bold New Plan for American Women: Do-it-Yourself Abortion

Any casual watcher of last night's Republican debate may have come away thinking that women don't have much at stake in this election. After all, of the questions CNN chose, less than a third were even from women. (Sadly even in cutting edge political forums, like The Daily Show, that's typical. In the last year, of the 140 guests of the Jon Stewart Show 13 have been women of which only 4 were not actresses.) The Democrats have Hillary as a candidate this year, which puts women front and center. For the Republicans, though, it's pretty much a choice between graying, gray or bald white men, all of whom seemed to nod in agreement on one breathtaking policy initiative for women that surfaced in last night's debate: the DIY abortion.

The question from the "young lady" was: If abortion is outlawed then who is the criminal, woman, doctor, or both? This has always been the sticky question for the anti-abortion side. Do they intend to start locking up women for murder? Fascinatingly, Fred Thompson, National Right to Life's endorsed candidate, said no. He suggested that some people will be able to perform abortions at any stage of pregnancy with no fear of prosecution: women on themselves. Thompson explained his (and one would figure, National Right to Life's,) bold new plan that would kick in once Roe is overturned: "The question is who get penalized and what should be the penalty. I think it should be fashioned along the same lines it is now. Most states have abortion laws that outlaw abortion after viability and it [the criminal penalty] goes to the doctor performing the abortion not the girl, the young girl, her parents, or whoever it might be. I think that same pattern needs to be followed." So, under this plan, a woman is free to perform abortions on herself, possibly with the help of her parents or "whoever it might be" as long as a physician or healthcare provider who is actually skilled to provide safe abortion care isn't involved. The last time the United States banned abortion -- pre-Roe -- doctors faced only minimal penalties for providing safe care. Apparently Thompson, and every GOP candidate except Giuliani appeared to agree, that was a mistake. The crime of abortion, if (and apparently only if) performed by a doctor, will be murder and extreme penalties will apply. Of course, the details will have to be worked out. Electric chair or lethal injection, that's still up for grabs. But it seems clear that the environment post-Roe will be harsher than pre-Roe. The clandestine network of safe abortion services that sprung up last time might not emerge this time. The risk for physicians would be too great. And so women who can't reach safe care will be much more likely than women before Roe to take matters into their own hands, which apparently the Republicans don't mind.

During last night's debate, there were some anti-abortion ideas dismissed as too preposterous. Will there be a "federal abortion police" force? Candidate Ron Paul seemed to think that would be too difficult. But it's not been too difficult for other "pro-life" wonderlands and so it's probably not exactly off the table as a possibility. In El Salvador, for example, they do use police. Actually they're called "Forensic Gynecologists," and they investigate possible crime scenes (aka: women's bodies) after a miscarriage because, of course, once abortion is illegal every miscarriage is suspect. The immediate past AG of Kansas, Phil Kline, attempted some version of this; seizing abortion patients records in an attempt to find misdeeds on the part of the physician. Given the pro-life movement's attempts to conflate abortion and contraception, with the cooperation of "pro-life" politicians, it's any wonder the scope the GOP has in mind. While Governor of Massachusetts, a bill that would have made emergency contraception (EC) more widely available came to Romney's desk. He vetoed it because, he believes, EC is an "abortive" drug. So, would Romney propose that doctors who dispense EC face the same criminal penalties as those providing what is traditionally known as abortion?

In 2005, Geraldo Flores was a boyfriend of a desperate pregnant teen. Flores' girlfriend, believing she was unable to get a legal abortion in her state of Texas, asked him to strike her in the belly and cause a miscarriage. He did, and succeeded. He's now serving life in prison for doing it. Under the GOP plan, he would have to be a doctor to do that kind of time.

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Comments

[Qbear]

Forget being polite on this issue.

Say in NO uncertain terms

KEEP YOUR FILTHY LAWS OFF MY BODY!

[laocoon]

Truly amazing!!! This confirms something I have said about the "pro-life" movement. I preface this by saying I know it does not apply to many who are prolife. But>>> If the life of the child fetus were really the issue would he have said that. "We will look the other way while you kill the fetus at any stage so long as we may officially condemn it." They are more concerned about being on the "right" side of the issue than they are about the life of the fetus. Most pro choice people I know are more sincerely concerned about the life of the fetus than that. They simply want to score points for judgment day. They clothe themselves in the ultimately filthy rags of self righteousness. A supremely selfish position.

[PC]

Yes sex is inevitable but pregnancy can be avoided without abortion. If that fetus is left to its own devices it will become a child. Why cannot women kill their young if they choose to post birth? Listen I have seen both sides of the coin, I don't call it murder because, due to societal norms, there is no malice in the mother's intentions and it is a very tough situation to start with. It usually has to do with being irresponsible, most people in poor areas can look around them and see if you have a child you cannot afford you are going to be screwed. What is so hard about comprehending that? I don't think that the feds should subsidize bad choices or waste money trying to make people make good choices, that is what communities are for. If people put as much effort into helping their communities as they do trying to changing laws and whining about the other side we wouldn't even be having this discussion. Go to a public housing complex and buy birth control for a couple people if you feel so strongly, buy them condoms, that is what you want someone else to do anyway. Teach people about consequences, hold group meetings with young women. All the resources are out there especially with the internet, stop talking and start doing. Why do you think paying for terabytes of useless powerpoint presentations to overpaid federal workers on with political agendas is going to fix this on either side?

Personally I think abortion should be left to the states, but I would prefer a woman only referendum in whatever state I would reside to decide the matter.

[talkstocoyotes]

You know, considering the number of young women who consider feminism outdated and the number of female bubbleheads who vote for Repug candidates, a post-Roe world might have some unintended consequences. The ducking and weaving over the "what penalty?" question isn't surprising; I've asked that question several times and the most common answer is that the "girl" (also often referred to as "the womb") would be treated with 'compassion' because she is a 'victim.' In other words pregnant women, and possibly women in general, are not to be treated as adults.

There was actually a book published in the late 1970s called "When Birth Control Fails" with info about do-it-yourself abortions. It's out of print but currently available. If you're a female of childbearing age, you might want to start planting that pennyroyal, tansy and cohosh this spring....

[shep65]

What planet are these morons from? If the conservative nut bags were really pro life then the death penalty would be banned, the SChip funding would have passed in congress with enough votes to be veto proof, illegal wars(Iraq) would not happen, water boarding, and rendition would be outlawed.
This country is one terrorist attack away from becoming another two bit military dictatorship.
The Republic is taking its dying breaths and its citizens, by and large, dont seem to give shit.

[Tannim]

And frankly, if you're so worried about abortion vs. the much bigger issues in the world today, expescially the out-of-control cost of living, economic collapse and recession/­depression­, and the war, then your priorities are mixed up. Besides, with a Democratic Congress a Republican President sending Roe v. Wade back to the states is not going to happen anyway.

[Tannim]

Panama is a far size smaller than the US, both in geogrpahy and population.

Also, if a woman needs and abortion and can't see a doctor, then there are natural means to do it (mistletoe tea comes to mind). But since America and the abortion argument is stuck in the allopathic quackery world of medicine, nobody mentions the natural ways.

[duggie]

This is a question of Quantity vs. Quality. In quantity-oriented societies, the individual has no rights: the individual is owned by the state. Think Old testament, communism, tribalistic groups.

The individual, is in fact, an invention of the Ancient Greeks; an invention that has been opposed by all but a handful of groups since. Women have barely made it into the waiting line for individual rights. Every time you see that row of old fathead male politicians pontificating about women being possessions of the state, throw a fit and fight harder.

[Silknspark]

NWGuy,
Thank you for your kind words.
Herein though, exists a woman who's been treated as an equal since scrubbing out the barn 55 years back, and no one has controlled since. I keep a pretty good check on myself - - out of plain and simple cognizance of not wanting my aura of influence to bring harm to others...a­nd me.

[NWGuy]

Throughout history, especially "Western", people have tried to control other people and one of the common ways is to control their sexuality. Look at the church for an excellent example. Ever since the Goddess was ditched for the God, men have had a love-hate relationship with women's procreative abilities. Until just recently, only the woman knew who the father of a child was, obviously terrifying to insecure men. So, they have worked to control women's sexuality every way they possibly could. It is also no surprise that the fundamentalists are a driving force is this.

What is sad/offensive is that in today's world where women have repeatedly shown their ability to compete successfully, sometime surpass, with males at every level, that there are still people who want to keep women controlled and as second class citizens. They continue to define women just in their reproductive role. Regardless of the "life is sacred" BS used as the facade, this is about control and keeping women subservient. These "men" (I use the term loosely here) need to back into the caves they usually live in. The rest of us will continue to move forward.

[LunaNik]

The abortion controversy is not about the sanctity of life, but about control of women. If the right wing sanctified life, as they claim they do:

They would be at fertility clinics, having unused embryos implanted in their wombs, with the intent of carrying to term, giving birth, and raising the potential child.

They would be adopting children from around the world who otherwise would languish and die.

They would be hosting the scores of foster children awaiting homes.

They would not support the death penalty.

They would support social programs intended for the benefit of children, like SCHIP and fuel assistance.

They would support stem cell research, which would improve the lives and health of millions.

But they don't do any of those things, do they? Actions speak louder than words, and I see no action from the allegedly life-loving group. Instead, I see a bunch of sexually-repressed, power-hungry, hypocristian idiots clamoring for power and mouthing pious platitudes.

And included in this self-proclaimed pious group are divorcees, adulterers, panderers, bribe-takers, war profiteers, and the like. "Sinners" are always the first to cast stones, lest the spotlight be turned on them. They disgust me.

[Silknspark]

Manners are fun.
Some words of cautioning to those quick to categorize then dismiss people, you may someday need their vote/support.
As an independent, I love working with Democrats and Republicans who have good(Yes, they are out there.), to bring equitable solutions to the table.
I refuse to believe Democrats are so stupid they've blindly succumbed to paralization they claim forced on them by Republicans.
I refuse to believe Republicans are so orbital they've left many floundering on the ground.
Come on folks, let's exercise thoughtful intelligence and manners, and get to work on civility and solutions.
Thank you.

[LorettaSingbiel]

Once Roe is overturned, "The question is who gets penalized and what should be the penalty". The crime of abortion, if performed by a doctor, will be murder and extreme penalties will apply. A woman is FREE to perform abortions on HERSELF, possibly with the help of her parents or "whoever it might be" as long as a physician or healthcare provider who is actually skilled to provide SAFE abortion care ISN’T involved.

The FEMALE American would be cheering "God, I love FREEDOM"?

Where is the "whoever it might be" MAN who knocked her up? Since our government agencies aren't exactly hell-bent on tracking down the sperm donors of pregnancies BROUGHT TO TERM, a woman is also FREE to raise these children by HERSELF?

How long must the "unmarketable" children, languishing in foster homes and orphanages, wait for a "RIGHT-TO-LIFE" advocate to adopt them?

How many "snowflake babies" have been adopted from the 400,000 frozen embryo pool? How many frozen embryos are tossed in fertility clinic dumpsters each day, because (according to BIBLE BUSH) they have MORE "inherent value" than Americans suffering & DYING from devastating diseases?

Instead of allocating funds for UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE (right-to-LIFE for every POST-born American), most REPUBLICANS believe monies would be better spent on hiring "Federal Abortion Police and Forensic Gynecologists to investigate possible crime scenes (women's bodies) after a miscarriage because, of course, once abortion is illegal every miscarriage is suspect"?

Well, with BIBLE BUSH in charge, "the childrens do learn" that AFTER they’re born, they are NO LONGER his PRIORITY!

And THAT’S NOT MY definition of "Right-To-LIFE"!!!

Stay safe, healthy and happy,
Love, Loretta

[Truthortradition]

After hearing their horrific answers about abortion, my question to the Republican sobs would have been the following.
Gentlemen, you seem so concerned about the life of a fetus. So seem so morally superior to the bad Democrats. However, I need to know a few more facts about you before I can make a decision on who I support in the next election.
What do you intend to do about the FACT that the number one cause of death to American pregnant mothers and their fetus is MuRDER at the hands of the Father of the baby?
Does that worry you?
Are you concerned that by outlawing abortion, even more women will die as a result of murder by the man who fathered the child?
Are you aware of the vast number of Deadbeat dads that abound in this great country? Do you care?
Do you know that every 90 seconds, a woman here is raped? Do you care that we have the highest incident of rape of any other country in the world?
Or are you all male chauvenist pigs who truly hate Hillary so much that you want to punish all women who dare think they are equal to a man?
Are you all still living in a cave? Is your ultimate dream to rule us the way the Middle Eastern dictators rule without a consitution, using a bible, a whip and tyranny? While reading this post, at least four women in America have had the shit beaten out of them by some heterosexual pig and at least one woman has been raped and the day is young. Does that keep you up at night and how do you plan to fix it? Oh I know, Pray. Yea, that works.

[stryker]

Chris Matthews had a "pro-life" suuporter on the other week (can't remember his name, sorry) and Matthews asked the question. "Why not hold the woman getting the abortion as liable as the doctor who performs it?" Of course the gentleman hemmed and hawwed his way around the answer, no matter how many times Matthews put it to him. He said on ly the doctor should be guilty, not the woman.
What he and all the other pro-lifers won't admit is that they believe women are not intelligent enough to make what will be one of the hardest decisions they would ever have to make. That is why you never see them pushing an anti-abortion law that punishes the woman. They know that if they did, they would be trashed unmercifully and the law would never even come to a vote. That's why I wish that a pro-choice congressman or senator would submit a bill like that, then see how fast the lifers would backtrack.
That is the real reason why the majority of pro-lifers are male. These neanderthals don't want their little women to be concerned over important things, like their bodies.