Hillary's Popular Vote Notion only 'Popular' with the Punditocracy
It is incomprehensible to me that Mrs. Clinton can seriously be touting the notion, with the support of the punditocracy of CNN and Fox, that she is leading in the popular vote and should therefore be seriously considered as the most electable candidate in the November election. She's including those who voted for her in Florida and Michigan's name recognition ballot saying that to exclude them would be to disenfranchise them. What about the Democrats in Alaska, American Samoa, Colorado, Idaho, Kansas, Minnesota, New Mexico, North Dakota, Nebraska, Washington, Hawaii and Wyoming who did not cast ballots because they were playing by the pledged delegates playbook and voted by caucus. What about them? Certainly if the rules are going to be changed and judgment is based on the 'popular' vote those voters in the eleven caucus states and Samoa will be disenfranchised. What about them?
And what about us? What about the American people? Haven't we had enough of Mrs. Clinton's mad antics in her pursuit of the realization of venal personal ambition; her 'say anything, do anything, no matter what' effort to manipulate our all too willing media to gull this country's populace into believing that her wretched illegitimacy is indeed legitimate. How much mendacity do we have to suffer, how much brazenness do we have to swallow before someone, anyone, has the decency, the common sense, to relieve us of this terrible trifle, this pathetic madness?
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I, for one, am so tired of the Clintons perpetual, incessant 'we are victims here' campaign. You ran, you lost, now go away.
Mr. Sutherland, would you consider running for elected office? Probably not as you don't mince words. Our loss.
ps... Please, blog often!
Isn't Donald Sutherland a Canadian, living in Montreal?
While I agree with your assessment, how, if you are Canadian, are you part of "we" as in "We the People of the United States"?
I don't know his current citizenship to be honest. I assumed he's an American citizen since he wrote, "And what about us? What about the American people? Haven't we had enough..."
Dual Citizenship.
It's Senator Clinton, Donald.
It's Mrs if he wants it to be!!! It's his post!!!
So - Hillary is no longer married?
I don't she is going to be Senator for very long. The people of New York are getting more and more fed up with her.
"Mrs. Clinton" is a perfectly acceptable title. Unless she dumped Bill, while I was sleeping.
NO elected official in the United States should properly use her or his office as a title; the correct address (unless you are speaking directly to the person) is "Mrs. (or Ms.) Clinton" or "Mr. Obama".
See Federalist Papers regarding this issue; it was set up by Gen. Washington, who escewed honorifics.
I wish some Obama supporters would realize that they are the ones helping to divide this party. You support a candidate who claims to be above the same old nasty politics, yet read the majority of your posts. They are childish and nasty.
This is not a candidate that only has a few votes, this is a woman who has received over 17 million votes. That is 17 million voters Obama needs to win the election, maybe it is not in his or his supporters best interest to alienate them with the vitriole I have seen on this site and others.
We believe in Hillary, the same as you believe in Obama, realize that. OUr support for her is just as real and needs to be respected as yours for Obama.
Hillary is out there at this moment dividing the Democratic party. Go listen to her me me me rhetoric. She continues to incite division.
Read the pro-Hillary comments her and at her website and other Hillary fan sites. Then come back and tell us how childish and nasty you think we're being.
This is not an election. This is a party's nominating process. Delegates will be the ones casting selecting our nominee at the Denver convention. Hillary has told me and voters in 11 states that we don't count, our votes don't count because we voted in caucuses.
Either you'll support the democratic nominee or you won't. After Hillary/Bi
Who hasn't respected you? I never have suggested that Hllary supporters are also not childish, I was making a point about Obama supporters. Saying, well you are too, does not negate the fact.
I have never suggested that there will not be a loser in this primary, I am suggesting that for supporters of a candidate that preaches change and a new way of politics, his supporters are the exact opposite. You might want to realize that Obama will need my vote, and the votes of the millions of other Clinton supporters to win. Belittling us is not the way to get it.
Obama has not exactly been a paragon of virtue in this primary, he has played dirty also and to suggest otherwise is naive and blind.l.
There's no doubt that there are people on both sides who have been childish and rude. But the candidates themselves talk speaks volumes. Clinton has publicly torn Obama down, implying that he's not qualified (which is IS) and is not electable (which he IS) - while Obama has been complimentary of Clinton, saying that she's run a good campaign (which she hasn't) and has suggested she stay in the race if that's what she wants to do. I respect that your support for Hillary is real. But doesn't there have to be a loser in the primary, and isn't that based on previously agreed to parameters?
I can only guess that you don't read at sites like OpenLeft, MyDD, Hillaryis44, etc....
And I can only guess that you don't listen to your candidate's surrogates, either. Just last night her campaign released a statement suggesting that delegates were "stolen" from Hillary - absolutely not true if one takes the time to examine the real facts - and that she reserves the right to appeal the delegates at the credentialling for the convention. THAT is divisive. It's dog whistle politics and it's the kind of trick Hillary has been pulling throughout this campaign.
The commentary of a peanut gallery like this one is hardly the place to make any kind of assessment of a candidacy.
I don't know who you are but your nagging and finger wagging have all the stinky earmarks of the Old Guard. That's the problem with Hillary!
This "we need to be respected" thing is so old, and misses the point. Obama supporters, and Democrats in general, are tired of this ugly spectacle where one candidate is dividing the party over an uncloseable gap in pledged delegates, the only measure of victory in the primaries.
She's fanning the flames of outrage, and attempting any argument to convince SDs, and her supporters, that the only official metric that ever counted, delegates, is now somehow a superfluous bit of information. She keeps running down Obama whenever she says she's the only one who can win.
She keeps running down Obama and the rest of us, by impugning the integrity of the process.
If you saw the protesters yesterday, who was childish and nasty? And for what genuine outrage?
Put yourself on the other side...If HRC was in Obama's position, would you not be outraged that he was making the claim that nothing counts but whatever metric Obama deems important, and that HRC can't win the general? Would you not be angered that fellow Democrats were threatening to stay home, or vote for the opposition, when HRC had run a campaign like Obama's? Would you not be outraged that he would be blaming racism, or reverse sexism to disenfranc
MR.SUTHERL
wolf blitzer to day even went so far as showing off His 3 SCENARIOS OF HILLARY WINNING THE POPULAR VOTE.
THE CLINTON MACHINE KNEW THAT THEY 'D BRING THIS LAST......
AND HE SHOULD HAVE GIVEN.....
I don't understand this party. They made a huge deal over Florida in the 2000. They are still making
movies about it. But it's okay not to count their vote now or only count half of it?The whole dimpled
chad thing was that" people's intentions should be counted". The people in Florida want Hilary.
In 2000 the people's vote in Alaska and all the sates you mentioned had been counted. But the
Democrats were insisting on recounting the vote in Florida. Becuase "people's intentions should
be counted". What happened to that theory now. MR.SUTHERL
In agreement with you, cualibre.
I think there are a lot of newbies here, that have not participated in the voting process until now, but hopped onto the new band wagon that BO built, because it was so shiny and new and full of HOPE. They have no idea how hard we'd fought for voters' rights.
BO marketed his campaign in a way that attracted people, because if you vote for BO, you are "educated" and "young". Who doesn't want to be a member of that group?
Too bad it was only a marketing strategy. Once again, we will see how well this brand pays off. This country was sold a bill of crap with Bush, who didn't know his rear end from a hole in the ground.
BO may be the dem version of Bush: a figurehead that's easy to manipulate by the ruling class.
Great.
I am realllly ready for a new party, run by the people for the people, NOT by the marketing class for the ruling class. This time, let's get someone who is serious about campaign reform, and someone who has had accountable experience, someone who has achieved a remarkable feat before running for office. Someone who not only speaks well, but works and accomplishes tangible honest goals for the good of the people. Not a handsome dude with a tiny resume and a kind demeanor.
Don't be so disingenuous.
HRC agreed with the DNC BEFOREHAND that the results from MI and FL would not count. And now, after voting where all potential participants knew BEFOREHAND that the results would not count, you want to act as though voting held under those conditions would produce the same results as a primary not declared null and void before it occurred.
This has nothing to do with "count every vote." The only time that argument made any rational sense was BEFORE the primaries took place.
The difference in 2000 was that FL was deemed a valid election BEFORE people went to vote, and so the status of the very election itself was never in doubt.
Libre, your state's democratic party got fleeced by the GOP. They fouled your primary by leading a vote to move the date in violation of Democratic Party rules. It is not the first time one political party got screwed by another. But if you want to blame Obama for it, you're not willing to face the ugly reality we've been shown since 2000: the GOP doesn't care much *how* they defeat their opponents, so long as they can make it look like the work of another opponent. Don't be fooled.
THE POPULAR vote is important if counted correctly.
if we elect by POPULAR VOTE , then it is also imperative we change the General Election and abolish the ELECTORAL COLLEGE.
Bye, Bye Hillary! Your egotistical trip has become most tedious, distructive and valueless. You are not
the automatic successor to the throne as you and Bill thought. Be a "good and gracious loser' and
return to the Senate/ where there's lot of opportunity to do good things!
Exactly.
What the hell, she may have another war to vote on!!!
AP title TOO ARROGANT ..........
many people think that the Clintons prefer McCain to win so that title fits in.
Don, please tell us how you really and truly feel. LOL! By the way, thanks for this. The Clinton's are slowly turning into damaged goods or at least becoming irrelevent. Obama will do for the Democratic party what Reagan did for the Republican party: Recreate and Reenergize!!!
Mr. Sutherland, I could not agree with you more. The time for this childish grandstanding to be put to a stop has long, long passed. If Hillary had continued to stay in the race, kept to the high road and campaigned on the issues, most Obama supporters would have given it a pass and let it play out. When her strategy seemed to become a deliberate effort to do as much damage as she could to the party's presumed choice, that's when people started to get mad. She has always had high negatives among committed Republicans, but she has now permanently earned the hostility of a large piece of her own party. If she manages to convince a sizable number of Democrats that she was "robbed" because she is a woman, as she seems bent on doing, then the party, the nation and the world will long rue the day. Shame.
First to Donald Sutherland:
Luvya Much!
Please post more
To Clinton supporters posting here:
Much is being made of Obama's ability to win over the Clinton voters. How does Clinton, should she get the nomination, win over black voters, college educated voters, young voters, white male voters, and the entire left of her own party?
I'm so sick of boxes!
Obama Loving Old White Woman (and all my friends)
Oh Donald, play nice. Obama still needs those 17 million hillary voters...;
He'll get them, at least the lion's share. But alas, the one's like that Harriet Christian are too far gone to turn them towards the light.
He will need then IF people are dumb enough to vote for John Bush McCain.
She has badly missjudged America's problems and thus has blown her campaign. America does not need her poor judgment as President. There has been enough of that provided by the present administration.
Please send your article to all the TV stations. I am sick of listening to their repeating mantra of the Clintons' spin that she had "the most popular votes any candidate got in the history". This a blatant lie on the part of the Clintons to brainwash their supporters into believing that she lost unfairly, but the media! don't they know what is included and what is excluded in "that number". To lie to snatch the nomination is shameful and the Clintons don't know shame anymore. They lie all the times and contradict themself: "every vote coutns" then disenfranchised the entire 11 states and ignored Obama's 0 votes in MI. Ickes, her surrogate even had the nerve to ask "fair reflection of voters' intent" where there was no legitimate primary to speak of. He should know that her "win" of 73% in a name recognition contest was not legitinate to count for delegates. He was the one who voted to punish MI&FL in the first place. she and her surrogates lot all the respect people have left for them , if not before, then right now.
From one Canadian to another- Thank you Mr. Sutherland.
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