Let The Chips Fall -- Beyond Predictable Left/Right Ideology

Before you get your panties all bunched up and send me "how-can-you-say-that?" emails please note: the lists below are not lists of statements I necessarily believe to be true, but rather a (very partial) list of what you never, or almost never, hear from the right or left. And I hope you'll use your comments to add to these lists.

Why? Because the left and right talk to themselves/ourselves. We live in hermetically sealed echo chambers. If we wanted authentic debate we'd bring up things that make us uncomfortable, not just indulge in predictable "correct" stroking.

Left or right, we're experts at pulling our punches. And when paper tigers, and/or the "establishment," or the "other side" is attacked it's almost always in a way that will please one's readers.

Is always being stroked a bad thing? It's debilitating! It is also one more reason that the failure of the major newspapers is a tragedy, since most web sites are too predictably of the left or right. We all need to be challenged!

So... here are two (very partial) lists of things you won't read on right or left wing sites.

Some Things You Won't Read On Left Wing Web Sites:

That, Zimbabwe was better off under white racist rule than it is now under Mugabe, and it would be a huge favor for the British to re-colonize it.

That, as long as the progressive movement (through the Democratic Party) is in hoc to the teacher's union, we'll have second rate declining educational system that new buildings, higher pay and a computer-on-every-desk will never fix.

That, as long as the progressive movement (through the Democratic Party) is in hoc to the trial lawyers, we'll remain a litigious country unable to ever curb health care costs, let alone raise fearless children, given that even swing sets can't be built in a country populated by whiners abetted by lawyers ready to sue.

That, the sexual revolution was actually a bad idea, and that its leaders turned out to be not much more than a bunch of dirty old (and/or dirty young) masturbators whose personal (often misogynistic) lives gave the lie to any notion of actual liberation.

That, the post-Vietnam generation used that war and the all-volunteer system of military recruitment which followed it, to duck service to our country in a way that is both elitist and profoundly dishonorable, and hypocritically excused themselves by always finding fault in this or that war, or president, while the real issue always was: let the working class do the heavy lifting!

Things You Won't Read On Right Wing Sites:

That, for all the talk of honoring military service the conservative deciders' and influencers' own children almost never volunteer.

That, for all the talk of morality, right wing evangelicals get divorced, commit adultery, and have abortions like everyone else and would privately be horrified if the right to do those things was actually taken away, for all their Church Lady noisy sanctimonious public posturing.

That religious arguments against gay people are really just an excuse for a gut reaction against the "other," and no more logical than it would be to literally follow the biblical command to stone children to death who are disrespectful of their parents, proof again that even fundamentalists like to pick and choose what parts of the Bible they apply.

That, our support for Israel is really all about evangelical apocalyptic "End Time" eschatology, not what is good for America.

That your average upscale educated and creative gay couple make better parents than your average dimwitted working class born-again slobs who's idea of "child care" is using the TV as a baby sitter.

That if your daughter was raped and made pregnant, you'd be off to the abortion clinic so fast it would make your head spin...

Want to add to the lists? Please do! What don't you ever want to read on "your" site?

Make yourself uncomfortable. Let's start the New Year by putting everything on the table and explore all options to our history, prejudices, beliefs and superstitions, not just stick with what our ideological peer group finds acceptable.

Frank Schaeffer is the author of CRAZY FOR GOD-How I Grew Up As One Of The Elect, Helped Found The Religious Right, And Lived To Take All (Or Almost All) Of It Back. Now in paperback.

Comments

[mattymoo]

left: anti-abortion

right: anti-death penalty

[mivogo]

The birth control pill is why George Bush has been President for the past eight years. Before the advent of the pill, it was very common to see families of three, four, five or more. Now only the relgious and the dumb have large families, with the more thoughtful having two, one or zero children (if you doubt this, check your own families). A generation later, the religious and the dumb are who put George Bush over the top in two close elections, and we have all suffered for it. Talk about the law of unintended consequenc­es...

[William999]

These are the kinds of political discussions I wish I could have with my family. Unfortunately, every time I discuss politics with my ultra right-wing family, its like they're spokesmen for a campaign and it is 3 days until the election. Only they're not bullshitting like a campaign spokesman, they actually believe it. I have to try very hard not to counter their bullshit with equal and opposite bullshit.

Something you'll never hear from the right:
"Do you thing Rush and Sean are a little over-the-top? I mean, I'm conservative, but these guys are a little nuts."

Something you'll never hear from the left:
"Do you think Keith Olbermann is a little over-the-top? I mean, I'm liberal, but this guy is a little nuts."

[JimReed]

William,
I think the way to prevent things from decaying into bullshit vs. bullshit is to stay focused on what is important. We started a war to steal oil. We built the green zone, a superfort, with the intention of controlling Iraq for decades, long enough to get that oil. Even if Iraq had WMD, that doesn't justify war. Many nations have them, and none more than us. Once you can force acknowlegment that this was a war for greed, other things can start to fall into place.

The bullshit vs bullshit thing is a strategy used by those who don't want to face the basic fact. If they can get things to decay into a shouting match, then everyone can go away feeling justified in what they believe. You can't win everything, so stay focused on what is most important and win there.

[DonCosenza]

So your tactic is to repeat statements until others, who hold diametrically opposing views, agree with them?

Sounds great... what about when they do the same?

[DonCosenza]

One thing you'll never read in either left or right sites: that sociobiology may not only offer correct diagnoses for many of our problems, but might also offer a perspective that can lead to alleviation of them better than dogma from either the left or right.

The [far-]left hates sociobiology because they believe in the post-modern dogma that everything is a social construction: nothing in human behavior is innate, and therefore individuals can be molded and shaped into utopian ideals by ubiquitous- some would say totalitarian*- social authority.

The [far-]right hates sociobiology because they (incorrectly) believe that belief in innate behaviors absolve individuals from responsibility; they (correctly) believe that it weakens the concept of a spiritual soul behind our actions; and because Darwinism is involved in the theory, and of course that's a big no-no.

* At the far extremes, both the far-left and the far-right resemble each other, in that both devolve into totalitarianism.

[mattymoo]

This subject sociobiology currently pops up from time as a discussion in the gay community. Some would love to see the discovery of a simple genetic cause for homosexuality because they feel it would help mute much of the most toxic anti-gay rhetoric, help bring about a more balanced re-evaluation of sexuality by many traditionally religious but not anti-science individuals and groups (think Galileo and Rome etc), and remove a lingering sense of guilt from countless mother's who still can't get the old psychologist's mantra that held sway from the 40's - 70's that held that it was the fault of overly close/lovi­ng/indulge­nt etc relationships between mothers and their son's that was the cause of homosexuality.

Others in the gay community see the identification of a gay gene (or something like it) leading to widespread pre-natal testing for this "disorder" and a possible "gay holocaust of unborn homosexuals" leading to an ironic future where the majority of gay children will be born by those who accept them into their family as the result of their anti-abortion stance. (Of course many will accept their unborn gay children for what they are and rejoice in them.)

Should such a sociobiological cause be identified conclusively you and I will hear a lot more on this subject from the gay community.

[JimReed]

This is a great topic.

How about is there actual reason such as aids prevention, to circumcise boys? Was it wrong to dogmatically state God never told anybody to do this and the Bible is misleading when it tries to connect circumcision to God?

I think your topic is almost impossible. At best it just becomes a new reverse psychology way for people to state what they already agree with. How about you? Are you going to also respond? Do you think attending even a less problematic church still might be damaging because it just helps keep the illusion alive?

[Chernynkaya]

How about: The USA is not the best country in the world- very good, not the best; that our military has not performed "brilliantly"; that our country does not have the greatest labor force in the world. In fact, there are several democracies with higher standards of living , our soldiers are sometimes barbarians, and our work force is often lazy. Oh, and our medical care is something like 32nd.

[bdaved]

Time is money!
Money talks!
and
Talk is cheap!
A clock that keeps perfect time, if it's set wrong, will never be right; whereas a clock that doesn't run at all will be right twice a day.

[William1950]

things you won't hear from either side...
we need a flat tax with zero exemptions­...
the world is becoming functionally smaller, maybe it's time for one world govt.
that blind religious faith is bad for us, and that no morals is worse.
that everything we think we know could be wrong.

[EtTuBrute]

Things you won’t hear:
FROM THE LEFT:
1. Dick Cheney actually had some valid points and good ideas.
2. Perhaps corporal punishment for children misbehaving in public school wasn’t such a bad idea.
3. It’s obvious that police officers should have more resources available to them to deal with the horrible position we put them in. We should make free counseling throughout their lives a mandatory part of any program employing them.
4. Not every environmental activist should be presumed to have a valid point or to be right when advocating against a conservative or government position.
5. Evangelical religious groups are doing a great deal of good for the country in their own way.
6. The right-to-life groups actually have some valid concerns about abortion.
7. There is obviously significant fraud by recipients of government programs such as public assistance and the medical programs, and we need immediate tighter controls to stop this.
8. Conservatives who stress individual responsibility rather than group responsibility are certainly performing a public service.
9. Yes, every child is special, just like the other six billion people on the face of the earth.
10. I am going to urge my son / daughter to pursue a career in the military.

[EtTuBrute]

Things you won’t hear:
FROM THE RIGHT:
1. (Once they staunchly aver their “support for the troops”) We have obviously dismally failed our commitment to veterans in the past and continue to. We should spend and do whatever it takes to rectify this situation immediately. Congress, start appropriating.
2. We need to institute a national needle-exchange program immediately, as Richard Nixon suggested, in order to combat the national health issues that lack of such a program allows to continue.
3. The war on drugs was profoundly irresponsible and has resulted in the criminalization of an entire segment of our society. We need to halt this ill-advised venture and determine the best way to decrease the prison population and create greater economic opportunity for ex-convicts and any segment of society over-represented in the prison population.
4. Why do we need military bases and troops in over 120 countries? We need to re-evaluate this situation immediately.
5. It is possible that those seen as activist judges by some are actually faithfully interpreting the Constitution as envisioned by the founding fathers.
6. Just because someone belongs to the Federalist society doesn’t mean their opinion has merit, or that they are qualified to hold public office.
7. Money isn’t speech. Especially corporate money.

[EtTuBrute]

Things you won’t hear:
FROM EITHER SIDE:
1. What do YOU think? How can we reconcile all these different positions so we can really accomplish something?
2. Who cares about the lobbyists, PAC money, and re-election? Forget it, and let’s do what is right for the country and the people we were elected to represent.
3. We should immediately prosecute and imprison all the members of Congress, and staff members of the Executive and Congressional branches who have violated the law or their oath to “support, protect, and defend” the Constitution, or betrayed the public trust.
4. We need to institute public campaign financing immediately, outlaw ANY corporate contributions, disband the FEC, and find unconstitutional all state laws which restrict political debate and participation to the two political parties.
5. Mr./Ms. (fill_in) is obviously a decent, intelligent citizen deeply concerned about the nation, and should not be attacked in such a manner. For you to do so is reprehensible.
6. Any ethical violation over a certain threshold should automatically disqualify that person from holding a government position again, or working for any firm which receives public monies.
7. Eisenhower was right. We should read his farewell address publicly once a month to educate the public and promote examination of government.

[thinkagain2]

"1. What do YOU think? How can we reconcile all these different positions so we can really accomplish something?"

Best one yet!

[CIgarCityGirl]

The problem with education, I think, is not so much the teacher's union, as the inability of a public school to deny access to truly unruly children from uncaring homes. This situation creates havoc in the classroom for ALL students. Rehabilitation of these students is messy. The frustration teachers feel about having no control in their classroom manifests in demands made at the union level for "other" things that translate to the respect teachers feel they are denied. There are no teachers who do not WANT to teach. There are students who come to our schools from environments that see no value in learning.

Might that be considered racist or cold hearted? Probably..­.which is why neither side would dare mention it!

[sandiegodreamer]

You are absolutely right on CIgarCityGirl! I am so sick and tired of people who have NO idea what is going on in classrooms today spouting off about teachers' unions being all the problem in education. I am a recently retired high school teacher. I have friends who are still teaching. I can tell you, the problem isn't teachers' associations. The problem is a general cultural decline which manifests itself in unruly students who come to school with a "I dare you to try and teach me something" attitude, parents who don't care, or can't control their own children, schools and teachers being slapped down for trying to establish order and discipline in classrooms. I can't tell you how many times I have called home about a student and the parent has told me that they don't know what to do, and can I please do something with him/her? We need parents to parent their kids so we can teach! Frank, I challenge you to spend a week in an inner city highschool class, get down in the trenches. Again, it's not teachers' associations that are to blame for the so called crisis in education, it's a culture that expects teachers and schools to parent, teach and be all things to all people. If you want a better education for students, you need to start holding parents(and I speak as a parent), and school districts accountable for readiness to learn and DISCIPLINE. Remember that old fashioned word?

[booksnmore4you]

WON'T HEAR FROM THE LEFT:

Not expecting all students, regardless of background, to excel to very high standards is, racism and classicism.

[reharmonizer]

I very much agree that it would be nice if we heard more self-criticism, or more searching criticism, instead of party lines and certified correct answers. I have a quick comment about the first item, though--it seems to me that you missed your target on that one.

A few years ago a lot of people thought it would be huge favor to Iraq if the US invaded and deposed Saddam. You're flirting with the same logic. It seems to me that the only people who can say what would be a favor to Zimbabwe are Zimbabweans. They're also the only ones who can pronounce on "better off." And anyway, the point (I think) is that Mugabe has done more damage to his country and is more contemptuous of most of the population than the British colonials were. The bit about being recolonized is just pointless provocation.

[wisewomcat]

Frank, as always, I thoroughly enjoyed this.

Things you'll never hear either side say: "I could be wrong about this...."