It used to come as a shock to me to hear presumably grown-up American public officials refer to "good guys" and "bad guys", as if world affairs were a space opera, and you could tell the evil dudes by the odd placement of their eyeballs. We're way past that point now, with evil empires and axes of evil and evildoers dominating our discourse about the world beyond our borders.
So, this weekend brought something of a challenge to that worldview, two different statements from representatives of two different governments about the notion of torture being used or condoned by their regimes. First, from Iran, the admission by a senior official of the judicial branch that protesters arrested in the wake of the apparently fraudulent election have been tortured. A highlight from his statement:
...the prosecutor general, said "mistakes" had led to a few "painful accidents which cannot be defended, and those who were involved should be punished."
Then, from London, a statement by high officials of the British government on persistent allegations, including some from a Parliamentary committee, that the government has winked at, colluded in, or approved torture of certain detainees. Here's the most salient graf:
Whether passing information which might lead to suspects being detained; passing questions to be put to detainees; or directly interviewing them, our agencies are required to seek to minimise, and where possible avoid, the risk of mistreatment. Enormous effort goes into assessing the risks in each case. Operations have been halted where the risk of mistreatment was too high. But it is not possible to eradicate all risk. Judgments need to be made.
Reverse the sources of those two statements, and it helps to cement our notion of good guys and bad guys -- the former admit mistakes and call for punishment, the latter weasel around with bureaucratic obfuscation. But that's not the world we're living in. Meanwhile, speaking of torture, what's happening at Bagram?
I SEE THAT IRANIAN GOVT WASN'T [QUICK] in the {RAPE } CASES IN THEIR [ADMISSION] ??
SAVAGE RAPED BY THEIR PRISON GUARDS[ PHYSICAL &MENTAL DAMAGE .[ how the good guys
vs bad guys ?] those responsible will be punished [or] JUST COVERING THEIR ASSES ?
GET YOUR EYES WIDE OPEN TO REAL [EVIL] !FOR THE IRANIAN GOVT TO [CONFESS] TO TORTURE OF THEIR OWN PEOPLE- PEACELY ELECTION PROTESTER]J UST SEEKING -JUSTICE]
IS SOME HOW { NOBLE } OF THEM ??? TELL IT TO THE [BEATEN] & [RAPED } VICTIMS IN PRISON !
************************************************* PLEACE POST IT !
Sorry, it just ain't true.
The roots go back to 1946.
School of the Americas (still in business)
Project MK Ultra
Psychic Driving
Vermont State Hospital Experiments
The Phoenix Program
Meanwhile, speaking of 'challenges to world views', who says older guys (I resemble that remark) don't rock? Mike and Chris and you were AWESOME on the Daily!
For Iranians to have fought their Revolution and then preaviled against Saddam at enormous cost only to put up with an oppressive dictatorship is not the Iraninan way.
In case you missed it, all those people out on the streets were deamnding fair elections and the rule of law. Which they expected the revolution to have won for them.
So I don't find it strange at all that officials would condemn torture in Iran of Iranians.
Holder only reinforces the truth about the fact that America's legal systems are totally bankrupt and corrupt when he states he only wants to prosecute a few lowly war criminals instead of all those who were mainly responsible for these war crimes like Cheney and Bush.
America's legal systems have become politicized in other words unjust and corrupt.
As long as America's laws do not apply to everyone we don't have a Republic.
The Iranians would have us believe that they are taking simple direct action and "punishing" offenders (by torturing them?). They want to be seen as quick, decisive and harsh.
The British lie is evasive, cowardly and finally rejects mea culpa, basically concluding that torture itself is unavoidable, like car accidents or spelling mistakes. They want to be seen as foolish, dithering and incompetent.
Though they may use such phrases amongst themselves, I cringe every time I hear them. War should be officially publicly depicted with respect and solemnity deserved for an activity consisting of the organized mass killing and maiming of other humans. It's not a video game nor a high school football tournament.
While the use of torture does separate us from the civility of most of first world nations, we are far different from the rest of the world that utilizes such methods.
Remember all countries involved in counter insurgency campaign have used torture. It is only until now that torture has been scratched away from tactics to use in counter insurgency warfare.
ALL CAPS EMPHASIS MINE:
Bold statement. I guess the only law enforcement who torture anywhere else (or in the states) is on police television dramas. Thanks for enlightening us.
And there I was telling people that torure was wrong.
barely-touted report out this week about bush citing Gog and Magog as very real reasons to invade iraq.
what's going on at bagram? exorcisms.
Oh Ma Gog.
Man our media is so fail.
But he did do some interesting musing on the will of God and just whose side God was on.
Ought to look it up and read it.