Ira Forman

Ira Forman

Posted: July 1, 2008 08:54 PM

McCain, Iran, and the Jewish Vote

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Senator John McCain's favorite former president is Teddy Roosevelt. However, when it comes to policy towards Iran, McCain is no Teddy Roosevelt -- he speaks loudly and carries a small stick. A few days ago, my organization, the National Jewish Democratic Council (NJDC), joined Senator Frank Lautenberg, Senator Ben Cardin, and five members of the House, in a press conference to point out McCain's hypocrisy when he talks tough on Iran, but votes against Iranian sanctions in order to protect corporations like Halliburton.

McCain has run a campaign in the Jewish community in which he claims to be Iran's worst nightmare while proclaiming Senator Barack Obama as dangerously naive. In McCain's interview with Jeffery Goldberg of the Atlantic, Goldberg reported that "McCain took a vociferously hard line on Iran" and he was applauded by many of his supporters for a speech he gave to a largely Jewish audience last month. However, a few years ago, McCain voted against an amendment (S.Amdt. 1351 to S. 1042) introduced by Lautenberg that would have made "U.S. businesses and their subsidiaries liable to prosecution for dealing with foreign businesses which have links to terrorism or whose parent country supports terrorism." Instead of voting to strengthen sanctions against Iran, McCain sided with most of his Republican colleagues to vote against the amendment and protect the Republican Party's favorite company, Halliburton (Obama voted for the amendment). McCain's campaign defends this vote by claiming that his meaningless support of the Collins amendment, which had no material impact on Vice President Dick Cheney's Halliburton, was equivalent to voting for the Lautenberg Amendment (the neoconservative columnist, Frank Gaffney, and the Center for Security Policy disagree).

McCain's demagoguery in the Jewish community goes beyond just charging Obama with being untested. The McCain campaign and its conservative allies have turned 'guilt by association' into an art form by detailing the imperfections of every Obama supporter, adviser, or friend that the community disagrees with. However, by these standards McCain himself has his own Iran problems. McCain's Chief Economic Adviser, Carly Fiorina, was CEO of Hewlett-Packard (HP) when the company surreptitiously avoided the trade boycott of Iran. McCain, who has been calling for further divestment from Iran, picked Fiorina to be his top adviser on the economy while she is also serving as head of the Republican National Committee Victory Fund. It was under Fiorina's leadership as CEO that, according to an April 19, 2004, Forbes article titled "Trading With The Enemy," HP traded with the Iranians.

If you want to get around export controls, just sell the product to a front company in Dubai. The middlemen will take it from there... Hewlett-Packard, Dell and Microsoft, among many other U.S. companies, keep Dubai offices and are favorites these days among Iranian traders in Dubai. (Swibel, Forbes, 4/19/04)

If the McCain campaign continues to attack Obama with charges of 'guilt by association,' they should also address questions surrounding his Chief Strategist, Charlie Black. Black has lobbied congress on behalf of companies that do business with Iran, including Chinese oil conglomerate CNOOC. In fact, the deal Black lobbied for was defeated by Congress in part because of CNOOC's ties to Iran.

Charlie Black, working for his firm Black, Kelly, Scruggs & Healey, was paid $60,000 to lobby the U.S. government on behalf of the Chinese oil conglomerate CNOOC...But the bid ultimately fell through, in part because of objections over the China oil industry's ties to Iran, a country in which it had already invested tens of millions of dollars. (Stein, Huffington Post, 6/2/08)

The CNOOC deal even elicited outrage from über conservative Representative Joe Barton, then Chairman of the House Energy and Commerce Committee. In a June 27, 2005 letter to President Bush, he was "compelled to express deep concern about the proposed acquisition of Unocal by the China National Offshore Oil Corporation" and that "this transaction poses a clear threat to the energy and national security of the United States." Given their roles in the campaign what kind of positions would Fiorina and Black have in a McCain administration?

McCain and the bully boys on the right employ a strategy to paint Obama as weak on Iran and an enemy of the Jewish community. They use 'guilt by association' to scare Jewish voters. However, the Jewish community has a clear choice in this presidential election. On the one hand we have two candidates (based on voting records and public positions) who are supportive of a strong U.S. - Israel relationship and a two-state peace process. On the other hand we have a choice between one profoundly conservative candidate who opposes reproductive freedom and believes the United States is a Christian nation and a staunchly progressive candidate who is pro-choice and a believer in the separation of church and state.

Given McCain's 'tough guy' posturing it is fitting to point out that Mr. Straight Talk prefers protecting the Halliburtons of the world to really getting serious about the Iranian threat. In coming months, the NJDC intends to continue to bring the full story of Republican hypocrisy and smear mongering to Jewish voters.

Senator John McCain's favorite former president is Teddy Roosevelt. However, when it comes to policy towards Iran, McCain is no Teddy Roosevelt -- he speaks loudly and carries a small stick. A few day...
Senator John McCain's favorite former president is Teddy Roosevelt. However, when it comes to policy towards Iran, McCain is no Teddy Roosevelt -- he speaks loudly and carries a small stick. A few day...
 
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McCain represents the most radical extension of the military industrial complex. That is nationalist socialism of the purest, most ideological and dangerous form. It is the thing that is attacking the pillars of American democracy. As it grows in strength, individual rights and freedoms weaken as there is a global shift in the wealth distribution curve that favors the Corporation. Today, that Corporation has infiltrated Congress with tentacles reaching deep into McCain's politic.

He now longer represents the individual, which should be of great concern to citizens of Arizona and every citizen in the nation who considers representative government at the heart of our democracy.

McCain modus operandi takes the form of the Likud because it is profitable to do so. His Corporate ties do not prefer negotiated settlements but bottom lines; preemption over peace. Were he to take the position of statesman, he would reflect the wishes of the majority-whether Israeli or American. But then that would diminish profit and allow peace to grow. Corporate would never endorse that. They, not the People of Arizona, call the shots.

http://www.light-to-dark.com/Mad_McCain.html

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:32 PM on 07/06/2008

There are many reasons I would not vote for Obama. I disagree with most of his political views. But even if I agreed with his politics I would never vote for him because of his conection to anti-jewish (not only anti-Israeli) pastor.

His pastor of 20 years praised Farakan whose views on Jews (not Israel) are well known. I am not saying that Obama shares Farakan's views. In fact I am sure he does not. However, it is clear that such views were not important enought for Obama to be uncomfortable in that church. I am not blaming Obama for his pastor's actions. I am blaming Obama for his own inaction. I even understand why Farakan was honored in Obama's church. After all black community sees Farakan very differently than Jewish community (and to some degree rightfully so). However as a Jew I can not support a person who in his private life chose to be silent.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:47 AM on 07/03/2008

Teddy Roosevelt would be insulted.
On social issues he stood for everything McCain is against: unions, protection and rights for workers, government regulation of the stock market, corporations and the wealthy classes to protect the majority against economic exploitation.
Speeches by Roosevelt late in his career have been recorded, and they are far to the left of any Democrat in congress today.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:18 PM on 07/02/2008

I apoligize for the misspelling in last post.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:07 PM on 07/02/2008

I have always wondered, why it is any of our(America's) business what Israel does or doesn't do and I do not want to hear any half-baked comment about there being Jews here, so what? They are many different nationalities here and we do not go getting into their countries business.
What we need to do is start worrying about AMERICA first and once we get this figured out then we can go out and play 'god' if we want too....

SAVE AMERICA NOW

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:06 PM on 07/02/2008
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Amen. let's put our own house in order. Let's have a foreign policy that serves our own interests. And stop intervening when we only make things worse.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:25 AM on 07/03/2008

Great idea. Here's a road to peace.
America stop all help to Israel.

Iran, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Syria Libya stop arming, financing and training Palestinians.
Viola. Let them sort it out.

P.S. Arvay, is there a reason you seem to be neurotically preoccupied with what Jews do or do not do around the world?

Do you have the same preoccupation with Cuban lobby or Saudi Lobby ?
Think about, if you're able.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:55 PM on 07/03/2008

McCain's music preferences conform to his Ads is ABBA. But it wasn't approved by ABBA and the Majority of Swedish Peoples in Sweden prefer OBAMA as President of the United States. Now, T. Roosevelt. Well McCain seems to like the opposite of himself. It can be a sign of Insecurity compared to who He is. Funny!

So, McCain, we better like him as a Viet. Hero... but
Now he is better known for all Errors and Gaffes he still does
Don't tell me Why...!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:55 PM on 07/02/2008

Numerous feelers have been put out by Iran, through intermediaries, indicating that Iran would accept Israel within its pre-1967 borders, if Israel ended the occupations of the West Bank and the Golan Heights, and if the Palestinians accepted the mere 22% of what was Palestine under the British Mandate, that would be represented by the Gaza Strip and the entire West Bank.

Demonizing Iran has been a strategy of Israeli religious fanatics wanting to hold on to as much Palestinian and Syrian land as possible, no matter how many trillions of dollars the US must spend in order to protect an expansionist Israel. John McCain obviously is a total idiot regarding how best to deal with Iran, and the Jewish lobby in American continues to press Barack Obama into following in McCain's footsteps.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:29 PM on 07/02/2008
- jmad I'm a Fan of jmad permalink

The U S has long been hostage the by Zionist Israeli influence block. At risk of being labeled anti semitic, american jews seem to support Israel right or wrong. With me or against me.
Israeli treatment of Palestine is at the heart of the present mid-east conflict. If you think oil,then you miss the real root of this conflict.
America has once again been snookered into fighting someone else's fight.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:03 PM on 07/02/2008

As opposed to the Saudis and other arab countries who have been such supporters of us.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:31 PM on 07/02/2008

Ah, another "Jews are controlling my country" libel proponent.

How about Cuban Americans who hijacked U.S. policy regarding Cuba and help oppress Cuban people?

Are they also traitors to America?

How about Irish Americans who controlled our policy in regard to IRA's Irish terrorists and gave millions to them?

And how about Armenians who almost caused a war with Turkey to push their political agenda through Congress ? Are they also traitors to America?

Learn to think for yourself before aping other people's racist propaganda.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:21 PM on 07/02/2008
- Yish I'm a Fan of Yish permalink

Although I don't find your statement to be anti-semitic, I do think you are wrong. There are many Jewish Americans who are critical of Israel and of U.S. administrations that support a right wing Israeli agenda. While your comment is not racist (anti-semtic), it appears to me to be ignorant, especially in light of the article it is attached to -- the article articulates a strong and immerging Jewish American voice -- did you even read the article before you commented?

I want to point out that Jews worldwide see Israel as the safest place in the world. This sentiment does not justify the injustice sufferred by the palestenians, cbut an you blame us for having such a fear abd sebtiment? At the very least, try to imagine yourself as a Jew whose family was erased by "enlightened" Western Europe. I urge you to be more compassionate -- and try to understand the mind-set behind the sentiment of fear, which undoubtedly has been manipulated by the Israeli political establishment over the years.

Lastly, the U.S. supports Israel in large part because it views Israel as one of its only reliable geo-political allies in the oil-rich Mid. East . Not to mention the U.S. military industry interests in arming Israel through U.S. tax-payer subsidies. Or the Christian right that "supports" israel's occupation because of its (ironically) anti-semitic dooms-day agenda.

Faulty analysis leads to faulty conclusions and faulty policy.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:30 PM on 07/02/2008
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"Faulty analysis leads to faulty conclusions and faulty policy."

Yes.

"I want to point out that Jews worldwide see Israel as the safest place in the world.'

Really? It's the most likely place for Jews to be killed, anywhere, including Iran.

" the U.S. supports Israel in large part because it views Israel as one of its only reliable geo-political allies in the oil-rich Mid. East "

Israel is the reason the US has so few friends in the Mideast. The countries of the region have made this very clear to us. For example, the recent Israeli bombing of Lebanon destabilized the pro-Western lebanese government, cobbled into place painstakingly after Israel's last disastrous invasion.

US support for Israel costs us dearly, and we get virtually nothing in return. Maybe the Pentagon gets to test some high-tech weapons the Congress won't fund.

The Israeli government, as you point out, constantly manipulates the fears of Israel's Jews, and as a result, it's the most unsafe for Jews to be in the world. Plus, they've re-ignited anti-Jewish hatred that might have been shamed into non-existence after WWII.

There is a kind of anti-Semitic rant that starts with the statement that Jews are very smart or clever.

Israeli policy is an excellent antidote to that stereotype.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:17 PM on 07/02/2008

you asked him to imagine himslef as a jew,whose family was erased by enlightened western europe.

i ask you to imagine yourself as a palestinian whose home and land has been stolen from under his nose and his wole family displaced,and alienated,and forced to live under occupation of their land i ghettos..i ask you to ask the european jews who stole another persons land,how it felt when the evil hitler made them live in ghetos,took all their possesions and property,then finnally gassed most of them.
and the ones that survived,went and did thesame to other people,and made them into refugees.
this is a no win situation,let the palestinian jews live in palestine,and let the european and russian and american jews go back to their original homes,and countries,after all jews is not a nation,but a religion.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:14 AM on 07/03/2008
- rroy I'm a Fan of rroy permalink

I think I'm a pretty reasonable and balanced individual.I try to stay informed on the state of the world,our history,and Middle East history.Although I was born and raised in the U.S.,as was my father,I often try to get a grasp of "how the other guy,in other parts of the world feels"!
When I do,I have a very difficult time trying to comprehend,just what the hell Iran has done to the United States that makes them such a threat to our securety,and you know what,I can't!
Iran is not a member of Al Quaida! Iran is a large sovereign nation that has been in existance far far longer than the U.S.or Israel!
Iran has not sent,so called,"Settlers"to a neighboring nation to populate it and brutalise the people who have been in the area for centuries.
Iran just like Israel(which for some strange reason is called a U.S.ally)has every right to conduct it's own affairs including chosing means of protecting it's sovereign status.That,as far as I'm concerned includes Nuclear Research and development.
I know in my heart that if I were young enough to get involved in an Iran vs U.S,conflict,I would refuse to serve regardless of the cost!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:48 AM on 07/02/2008
- 1099 I'm a Fan of 1099 permalink

That's very patriotic of you.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:16 AM on 07/02/2008

Look up the the words "Atom Bomb" and then understand why Iran cannot posses such devices to kill millions. Israel has enough Nukes to Glass Iran and parts of Syria. That is one big reason all the terrorist states have not attacked and pushed the Jews to the sea as they want. Settlers are not storm troopers and also a different issue. Iran has no "right to atomic bombs" Look at some nations now with the bomb such as Pakistan and understand we have enough nuts with nukes. Iran has sent mission in Iraq to kill US soldiers, this is a fact not Hamas propaganda.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:49 AM on 07/02/2008
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This is hilarious.

"Terrorists," not states, attack Israel regularly, from inside and adjacent to its borders. These atomic weapons are useless against them. If Israel invades Lebanon again, Hizbollah will again administer a stinging loss. Even if Israel occupies south Lebanon, as it did years ago, it will only suffer the same attacks and eventual humiliating withdrawal.

These attacks are going to continue and grow, because of the unresolved Palestinian grievances and the ever-growing Palestinian populations in and surrounding much of Israel.

Neither Syria nor Iran is crazy enough to invite nuclear retaliation. If Israel nukes Syria, the fallout will go to Iraq, where US troops are stationed. If Israel attacks Iran, the region will explode and oil will go and stay at $500 a barrel.

Unless Israel exterminates them, the Palestinians aren't going anywhere, and will continue to struggle for John McCain's next 100 years. At some point, the young and talented of Israel will decide things are better in the US and emigrate.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:43 AM on 07/02/2008

What are the us soldiers doing in iraq,playing football with the iraqi's??
your bush oil mission,has totally distroyed the crdle of civilisation,damaged the infastructure,created terrorists (by the way bin laden and saddam are american products).you have damaged their culture KILLED their people from old ,middle age to young & infants,yiu have humiliated them and made them unemployed,yiu have abused the prisoners of war,or the innocent people from men,women an children locked up in abu ghraib.
i know some iraqi shite ho used to hate saddam,they sit now and remenicense to the good old day's of saddam comparing to what the americans have created in iraq. i could go on and on.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:32 AM on 07/03/2008
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For decades, American Jews lectured their fellow Americans on their defective Christian morality, chiefly on race relations (they were correct).

But with their uncritical support for any and every criminal, oppressive act committed by Israel, they have shown themselves to be moral hypocrites.

"My people right or wrong" seems to be the operational principle. Contrary voices from this community are vanishingly small.

After the massacre of jews in Europe in the 1940s, Jews had the world's sympathy. After 60 years of Israeli neo-colonialism and apartheid, they have much of the world's distrust and even hatred. The US' reputation has taken a simlar course as we've hewed to the AIPAC line.

I'll quote a bt of Christian scripture to my Jewish fellow-citizens.

"What you sow, you reap."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:33 AM on 07/02/2008

Jews have been hated since long before the Holocaust, obviously during same, and even now decades later. Israel has just become the convenient target for today's anti-Semites, like the idiot named Arvay above.

Israel's actions, never perfect, are far less egregious than what the USA has done in Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan.

And just like the USA, she acts in her own self-defense, but unlike the USA, her wounds are taken every single day. And her enemies are around and within her.

Anyone who can simultaneously deplore Israel for its behavior and laud the US for its action embodies ignorance, hypocrisy and abject anti-Semitism.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:20 AM on 07/02/2008
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I'll quote a bit of Christian scripture to my Christian friends: "Judge not, lest ye be judged."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:56 AM on 07/02/2008
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Cute, but irrelevant.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:57 AM on 07/02/2008

Iran...where women are stoned to death for "adultery," where gays are hanged in the street, Iran, bastion of Western values and freedom! What a great ally the Iranian government would make for the United States! No wonder so many "liberals" are bending over backwards to defend the mullahs.
Meanwhile, little Israel, the actual democracy in the Middle East, will be left to hang in the wind.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:35 AM on 07/02/2008
- rroy I'm a Fan of rroy permalink

WHAT PURE UNADULTERATED BULLSHIT!!!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:56 AM on 07/02/2008

Or really Reary,

...Iran says a fatwa issued by Ayatollah Khomeini ordering the death of British writer .Salman Rushdie still stands after the author's knighthood by the Queen.
Tehran Radio quoted Ayatollah Khameini as saying the decree by his predecessor Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini "remains unchanged even if he repents and becomes the most pious man of his time".

Also a call on Muslims to murder Rafiq Tagi, who writes for Azerbaijan's Senet newspaper, echoes the Iranian fatwa against Indian writer Salman Rushdie.

It was issued by Grand Ayatollah of Iran Ruling Council Lankarani calling for the death of the writer and also the person responsible for publishing his articles.
The Iranian cleric had offered his house as a reward to anyone who killed the Azeri writer.

The Iranian leader, Ali Khameneh"i, refreshed an old nationalistic aspiration of pan-Iranism by threatening Azerbaijan "We remind Baku's politicians that today the Islamic Republic of Iran is powerful enough to realise historical claims of the people".

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:32 PM on 07/02/2008

The head of Iran's Interpol bureau believes that the sex slave trade is one of the most profitable activities in Iran today, and government officials themselves are involved in buying, selling and sexually abusing women and girls.

Some may think a thriving sex trade in a theocracy with clerics possibly acting as pimps is a contradiction in a country founded and ruled by Islamic fundamentalists. In fact, this is not a contradiction.

First, exploitation and repression of women are closely associated. Both exist where women, individually or collectively, are denied freedom and rights. Second, the Islamic fundamentalists in Iran are not simply conservative Muslims.
Islamic fundamentalism is a political movement with an ideology that considers women inherently inferior in intellectual and moral capacity.

http://www.womensenews.org/article.cfm/dyn/aid/1708/context/archive

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:35 PM on 07/02/2008

"First, exploitation and repression of women are closely associated. Both exist where women, individually or collectively, are denied freedom and rights."

Are Orthodox Jewish women treated much better than Muslim women? Will you say they are separate but equal?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:21 PM on 07/02/2008

Jews who support true American leaders are honorable patriotic citizens. They vote for some one who would put American Interest before Israel"s interest. For example when it comes to Iran, Israel"s interest and American interest do not coincide. Since Iran has been isolated from American Businesses, the big gainers have been mainly China, India and Russia. At the time American businesses were prohibited to do business in Iran, Chinese and Russian businesses have been signing multi-billion Dollars contracts. If US-Iran relations is ever improved, Iran would make a strong and effective US ally in the Middle East and US may not have to rely on Israel so much. Consequntly there would be no longer any reason for billions of Dollars of annually financial and military US aides to Israel. For that exact reason, every time there is a chance that there could be some improvement in the US-Iran relation, the process is sabotaged directly by Israel or indirectly via Israel"s special interest groups such as AIPAC.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:15 AM on 07/02/2008

AIPAC, Israel, Israel blah, blah. Some see a Zionsti under their bed.

This paranoia is laughable.

How about U.N. Security Council? Are they controlled by AIPAC too?

Surely even a painfully preoccupied can't accuse Libya and Indonesia of coddling to AIPAC.
NEWSFLASH: the WORLD has a problem with a regressive and oppressive Iranian Ayatollahs!
Think about it, if you can.

Security Council 2008:
France, China, Russia, U.S. U.K Belgium
Indonesia South Africa Burkina Faso Italy Viet Nam Costa Rica Libyan Arab Jamahiriya Croatia
Panama
Unanimous vote against Iran on United Nations Security Council Resolutions:

UNSCR 1803 (2008) requires Iran to suspend all uranium enrichment, regardless of its location in Iran, as well as research and development associated with centrifuges and uranium enrichment.
In addition,

UNSCR 1803 requires Iran to halt its construction of the Arak Heavy Water Research Reactor and activities at the Heavy Water Production Plant at Arak.

Resolutions 1737 (2006) and 1803 (2008) include exceptions for states to engage with Iran in the limited context of support to Iran"s light water reactors, which can provide electricity for civilian use.

A ban on arms exports from Iran and a call on states to prevent the transfer to Iran of arms listed on the UN Register on Conventional Arms.

All countries to inspect the cargo of aircraft and vessels of two companies"Iran Air Cargo and Islamic Republic of Iran Shipping Lines"bound to and from Iran.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:42 AM on 07/02/2008
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Paranoia? let's ask ourselves why no nation has "called" Israel on its deployment of 150 nuclear weapons. In violation of US assistance rules and common sense.

Nuclear weapons are not cluster bombs to be used against insurgents. What are these weapons FOR, anyway? The US has long supplied Israel with more than sufficient conventional force to defeat any combination of attacks by its neighbors (not counting Egypt, which the US buys off with $3 billion per year).

Is this some kind of insane doomsday apparatus? So many Israelis seem to be driven certifiably insane by their belief that their neighbors are the new Nazis, that the rest of us have to conclude they are the LEAST stable force in the area. Their attack on Lebanon was a prime example -- non-rational and counterproductive as even a small child could have seen.

We already have an insane, nuclear-armed nation in this volatile region, and it's our ally, Israel, not Iran.

So why the silence?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:44 AM on 07/02/2008

McCain is catering to the elderly Jewish bubby's and pop-pops like my parents, who are so afraid of electing an African-American president. I can't understand why my Mother would support a candidate who vows to help his Christian friends overturn Roe v. Wade, and would like to prevent their only son (who just happens to be gay) from marrying his long term partner (who have been together 14 years, twice as long as most of my relatives my age). Oy! Any candidate who keeps calling me his "friend" is a dangerous man.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:25 AM on 07/02/2008
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Thank you, SouthJerseySteve! I had to look at your loginid after reading your first sentence to make sure that I hadn't written it myself!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:59 AM on 07/02/2008
- 1099 I'm a Fan of 1099 permalink

You mom sounds like a smart lady.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:15 AM on 07/02/2008

Well, steve, whether gay or straight, christian or jewish, it all boils down to who is more likely to cut your head off.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:35 PM on 07/02/2008

I wish you well! I hope your mom changes her mind, for your sake, and for others.

As for some of the horrid posts on this thread, I suggest the writers get a charisma transplant. Debating is healthy, but rancid baiting, whining, and wailing will only serve to make matters worse. You don't have to agree, but at least attempt to see the other person's viewpoint. Posting snide remarks will not do anyone any good.

I have to admit that I've learned a lot just from this blog this evening. I'm trying to absorb it all and try to understand my own opinions. It is a most difficult subject.

Ct Hussein Jean

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:38 PM on 07/02/2008
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Sadly, the 21st century still has a large number of people with their minds in the 19th.

Racism, homophobia, extreme nationalism, love of war, religious ignorance and the urge for conquest still try to block humanity's forward evolution.

Personally, I'm an optimist.

Especially now that the Internet is connecting people (where it isn't censored) and we can exchange views and -- most importantly -- progressives can get a sense of how many of us there are. And everyone can see the mendacity and inhumanity of the reactionaries.

Love and humanity will eventually triumph, not because they are imposed, but because they're the stronger, positive forces at work. I say that despite the carnage and bigotry we all see around the world.

Live long and prosper, the both of you.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:07 AM on 07/03/2008
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