Don't Mess With Texas... Especially Its New Gun Law

Texans and guns.

Back in 2006, Dick Cheney shot a man in Reno, err, Kingsville, in South Texas. In the face, while hunting quail in an open field. On a 53,000 acre spread.

He claimed (and experts disbelieved) to be at least 90 feet from his victim, an elderly hunting partner. No charges ensued, and it was played for laughs nationally because nobody died. Still, the guy got seriously riddled in the face, head and upper body. He was in the hospital for weeks and will carry shrapnel the rest of his life.

That near-tragedy happened in a largely unpopulated environment. Today, vast suburbs now exist that were rural two decades ago, so the following was bound to happen: Some years ago, 3,000 mainly undeveloped acres were annexed by the city of Fort Worth and placed under its urban firearms ordinance.

This didn't sit well with the gun lobby. As far as they were concerned, rules for how close a hunter, on city land, could be to a home or school shouldn't be determined by the, um, local government.

Fourth of July fireworks near homes and businesses certainly matter from a safety standpoint, but guns? What are you, a communist?

So in '05, the legislature co-opted municipalities by setting the limit on hunting in these areas: not within 150 feet of "homes or occupied buildings." That's right: just 50 yards, half a football field. Great quarterbacks are known to throw the ball farther than that, and I guarantee you their arm velocity is much less than a Remington 12 gauge over and under.

The upshot? Since the law passed four years ago, the Dallas Morning News now reports:

{E}ach year ....frantic callers have flooded North Texas 911 lines on the opening day of dove hunting season with complaints about noise and the proximity of hunters to their homes.

Police Chief Todd Renshaw of Frisco {north of Dallas}, said he knew of no related injuries, but in some cases shotgun pellets rained down on homes and businesses.

And to him that means hunters are simply too close.

"I'm a hunter. I hunt dove. But there are places in Frisco where I have hunted that I don't any more, because it's just too close to civilization."

A pending bill in the current session of the legislature increases the distance from 150 to 1,500 feet for schools, day care sites, residential subdivisions, apartment complexes, parks and outdoor recreation areas. The Texas State Rifle Association (the Lone Star wing of the NRA) has supposedly signed off on the increase, and that's a good thing.

Ah, but they're happy to be magnanimous for a big reason. The more important law they want from the Texas legislature is almost in the bag: the right to bring a gun to work!

There's already a state law -- fairly recent -- allowing concealed weapons, yet one of the exemptions lets employers choose to keep guns off their private property, whether an office, chemical plant, factory, etc. The new law will take away the bosses option, granting workers the right to keep guns and ammo stored in their vehicles, parked on-site.

The argument offered for the change by supporters, with a straight face, is that driving to work in these tough economic times is just too dangerous, and people need a pistol to get to their job alive.

It's going to pass despite opposition from the powerful business lobby.

Hey, Bob in accounting? Your days of complaining about overtime pay may be finished. And when that creepy co-worker gets the pink slip, try to be away at lunch.

POSTSCRIPT: Pro-gun forces are pushing several other pieces of legislation that have been filed this session. The most disturbing would actually repeal the existing requirement that when stopped by law enforcement, a Texas concealed handgun licensee must show their permit if they are carrying their handgun.

In other words, a person with a loaded gun in the car -- and a permit to carry it -- won't have to let the officer know they're packing heat when pulled over at, say, 2:00 AM after a night of drinking. Currently, those carrying have to show their permit so the officer at least knows the full potential of the situation he or she is dealing with.

We already know cops are armed. It seems only fair they should know if we are, and many in law enforcement think this bill is terribly misguided.

The Texas arm of the NRA, however, proudly endorses it on their website. Then again, they loved cop killer bullets, too. The "true colors" of these gun obsessives are showing.

Comments

[Miss Mamselle Hepzibah]

This post has nothing to do with state vs. federal. Has nothing to do with the second amendment, either.

The second amendment confers a right to keep and bear arms. It doesn't preclude rules and regulations related to the keeping and the bearing, and it certainly doesn't say a thing about any "concealed carry" right that a state may or may not choose to enact. Jesus.

The Texas concealed carry law has only been around 14 years, and as Mr. Williams clearly states, one of the exemptions has always been for a business owner to keep weapons off their own private property if they so choose. Period. That's the only "right" at issue here, and that's the only "right" being taken away by the proposed change in the state law. The "pro gun" types who have commented on this entry are way, way "off the mark" on the subject matter. They're suggesting that a concealed carry law somehow trumps private property rights, and trumps a business owner's right to tell his employees not to bring weapons onto the property.

It does not trump that. Or rather, it shouldn't, anyway.

MMH

[OdinsEye]

"This post has nothing to do with state vs. federal. "

Correct.

"Has nothing to do with the second amendment, either."

Debatable.

"The second amendment confers a right to keep and bear arms."

Common mistake. The 2nd "confers" nothing. It recognizes and protects.

"The Texas concealed carry law has only been around 14 years,"

Again, not germane to the subject.

Again, the issue here is one of overlapping property rights and whether or not a business can restrict what is a lawful activity when away from the company property.

A vehicle is personal property. A firearm is personal property. A parking lot is company property. Concealed carry with a permit is a legal activity.

So, if an employee has a concealed carry permit, but has to park in a company parking lot, company rules about not keeping a CCW firearm in the car restricts the employee's ability to exercise their legal activity of concealed carry to and from work.

[LeftRight]

The property rights of the company ARE stronger than your personal right to have a gun in your private property that you park there. You can have a concealed gun in your car parked on PUBLIC property, but the company's rights are more important on their property. This is the same reason that there is no first amendment rights at your job!

[docwindprod]

I imagine that an employee who takes issue with company parking lot policy in this area would have three choices:
1) Park offsite
2) Find employment elsewhere, or
3) Shoot folks until he gets his way.

There's plenty of choice here.

[1differentdrummer]

I saw a road rage incident the other day and I hate to think of what it would have been like if the big clod had had a gun. The little guy, making his exit, wouldn't have gotten away. Of course, if the little guy had had a gun the big clod might have been cold meat, but that wouldn't have made it right. Who knows where stray rounds will go?

[OdinsEye]

It is pretty rare for a CCW holder to misuse their CCW firearm.

[rosiebond007]

Oh pleeeaaaase ! Grow up - accidents happen ALL THE TIME

[mommadona]

ONE MORE REASON why Texas should be returned to Mexico, ASAP.

ONE MORE REASON why mega-churched American Taliban have a safe haven.

ONE MORE REASON why that Texas motto needs to be taken seriously

'Texas - ANOTHER kind of country'

STATES’ RIGHTS - THE TENTH AMENDMENT - Township News

"Three State of Texas Congressmen introduced on Feb. 17, 2009 a Concurrent Resolution that Texas was putting the Federal Government in Washington, D.C., on notice that Texas was reclaiming its Tenth Amendment Rights as laid out in the .... The Resolution concludes with a powerful declaration, saying that any act of Congress, any executive order of the President of ...

http://townshipnews.org/

[OdinsEye]

Good for Texas and those other states who have had enough of the erosion of their powers and the blurring of the formerly distinct lines between the state and federal tiers of government.

[docwindprod]

Hoping you're living there, Odinseye.

[HisXLNC]

If Texas were returned to Mexico, Mexico's violent crime rate would probably drop by 50%.

[grimus]

It wasn't long ago when it wasn't against the law to have an open container of alcohol in your vehicle.

[blues101]

If i were to pick, i'd prefer the guy in the car with the open container of alcohol. My chances are better.

[OdinsEye]

Not really.

[JnrNorman]

Its good that Texas isnt getting wimpy on guns.
Its narco violence and gangs shooting people over a pound of marijuana or less.
Its the failed drug war.
Cut gang income 70% LEGALIZE MARIJUANA AND TAX IT!

http://video.aol.com/video-detail/the-obama-deception/1757361927

[dadw5boys]

ALL THE THINGS REPUBLICANS COMPLAIN ABOUT HAPPEN MORE IN RED STATES THAN ANY OTHERS !!!!!!!!

More people killed by hand guns, more teenage mothers, more drugs, more corruption, more drunk driving and more people in prison. That is what Red States do.

[MacQ]

You want to back up your assertions with some kind of reference, or did you just pull that fact out of your very own somewhere? That's what I thought.

[rosiebond007]

dadw5boys - great comment - no need for figures, just read the paper.
MacQ - read the papers - even settling an argument, on old grudge or "correcting" a pink slip in Texas requires gunpower? Pathetic !!

[linux]

States ranked by rates of live births among women age 15-19 (births per thousand):

1. Mississippi (71)
2. Texas (69)
3. Arizona (67)
4. Arkansas (66)
5. New Mexico (66)
6. Georgia (63)
7. Louisiana (62)
8. Nevada (61)
9. Alabama (61)
10. Oklahoma (60)

I don't know about you but I see Red

[docwindprod]

The same applies to pornography.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn16680-porn-in-the-usa-conservatives-are-biggest-consumers.html
Of course, conservatives don't believe in science either, so I guess you already have your rebuttal mapped out for you.

[Human-Being]

What do you expect out of a state that gave you Bush?

[NTexasHillbilly]

The only saving grace for us there is that he is a New England transplant. He bears the silly bumper sticker that says "I wasn't born in Texas but got here as fast as I could."

[mexamerican]

that's awesome. more dead texans.

[Rog49Thomas]

This entire argument of course misses one very salient point and that is the intent of the Founders.

Back when the Constitution was agreed, a simple musket was a substantial weapon. There were no semi automatic or automatic weapons. Folks were pretty well matched in terms of firepower versus say the local government or a foreign invading army.

Today a handgun or rifle really doesn't afford much protection. And frankly even an automatic weapon is scant protection against a uniformed military or even a modern day police force.

When you think about that carefully like I have, it's pretty clear that sober minds would have to agree that our Second Amendment Rights have not kept pace with technology.

There's really no reason why we shouldn't be allowed to have other weapons -- howitzers, flame throwers, RPGs, shoulder launched Stinger missiles, etc.

And clearly to make sure our militia is ready to stand up to a domestic tyrant or foreign aggressor, it's pretty clear that a tactical nuclear weapon is required. I'm sure the NRA could work up an appropriate self-study home schooling program.

And since one never knows when the "fiend" will strike, we should be allowed to take these weapons to work, to church, to sporting events, etc.

Our very freedoms are at stake.

[picard922]

With due respect, this is not about the right to bear arms which is well supported in Texas. It is about a company's right to stop people from bringing concealed weapons into the workplace. Who's ox is being gored?

[Rog49Thomas]

Our liberties are under attack. Today is no different than that cold winter in Valley Forge long ago. Summer soldiers and sunshine patriots are the first to cut and run.

Many have posted here about how the Second Amendment has prevented our own government from enslaving us.

What's not known is that the Second Amendment is not an absolute guarantee of our rights.

But the the treachery of Smedley Butler the peoples' militia would have marched forth and stopped the Tyrant in Washington from imposing Social Security on us.

My grandfather's brother - Al - tells how the First Pennsylvania Fusiliers under the command of Colonel Hezikiah Santorum were ready to step forward when this modern day Benedict Arnold struck. They were quite a bunch of fearless patriots and handsome men as well. Red great coats, blue breeches, white knee socks, and honest black leather shoes with silver buckles. While only Colonel Hezikiah was allowed to wear the helmet with the one foot tall purple plumes, the rest of the company didn't mind. They wore the red white blue cockades in their hats with immense pride.

Later Colonel Hezikiah fell struggling to prevent the onerous tolls on the Pennsylvania Turnpike. But that is another chapter in the glorious history of our well regulated militias.

[foreffectivegovernment]

It is completely ironic that the Texas Concealed Handgun Permit Law came into being because a crazed gunman was able to drive his vehicle through a Luby's Cafeteria window and start shooting patrons like "fish-in-a barrel" and numerous people had handguns in their cars which was semi-legal in Texas at the time.
.
A young female veterinarian, who was having lunch with her parents, had a handgun in her car as did a group of lawmen next door in a Motel meeting room. The lawmen were alerted but the time that elapsed while they were retrieving their firearms from the trunk of their cars allowed the gunman to shoot and kill this young ladies parents.

She was elected to the Texas State Legislature, introduced the Concealed Handgun Carry Bill, and was instrumental in getting it passed.

Even she could not persuade the Legislature that "gun free zones" that exist today around schools give crazies the same opportunity that nut had to kill defenseless children and teachers.

No, I do NOT advocate arming every 18 year old in Texas as most people scream when this is mentioned. Just allow law enforcement and licensed permit holders a chance to reapond with force when these events occur.

[HisXLNC]

"Today a handgun or rifle really doesn't afford much protection. And frankly even an automatic weapon is scant protection against a uniformed military or even a modern day police force."

Try telling that to the Federales, because the drug cartels are making short work of them with weapons allegedly purchased in the US.

"There's really no reason why we shouldn't be allowed to have other weapons -- howitzers, flame throwers, RPGs, shoulder launched Stinger missiles, etc."

You are allowed to own a flame thrower. In fact, they aren't even considered firearms and are exempt from any federal legislation. Howitzers, RPGs, and Stinger missiles can also be legally purchased, provided you fill out the appropriate paper work and have enough money.

[itschuck2c]

Whats the big deal..we can do that in kentucky. KRS 237.106 effective july of 2006. In fact the law states that if the employer infringes on this right then said employer can be sued in civil court.

[Geoffreys]

From Odinseye: "I am saying that first of all, there is an issue of overlapping property and second there is an issue of if my employer can do things which affect me exercising legal powers off their property."

--------------------

It has long been established in Texas that an employer can restrict your legal actions when you are off your property. An employer may decide their employees must be non-smokers - so they cannot smoke offsite. An employer may decide their empoyees must not be gay - also a legal 'activity' ...

Why should carrying a gun wherever one wants be so sacrosanct? The gun lobby amazes me with their stand that guns are only used for the purest, most ethical reasons and as such should have no restrictions placed on them.

BTW, are you a Texan? I am and I don't want that law passed. I do not think allowing everyone to carry a weapon makes us safer in any way.

[OdinsEye]

"An employer may decide their employees must be non-smokers - so they cannot smoke offsite. An employer may decide their empoyees must not be gay - also a legal 'activity' ..."

Not quite.

[smithshaw08]

Exactly! Why do you think Wyatt Earp banned guns in town?? Because some people couldn't behave when they had guns on their waist!

[Rog49Thomas]

Actually, Earp was one of the first Bilderbergers in our great nation as is pretty clear from his attack on the Second Amendment.

It took the people of Arizona almost fifty years to restore Constitutional Government after he was removed from office.

Many brave patriots perished in that struggle: Ike Clanton, Billy Claiborne, Frank MacLaury.
It's also a little known fact but Jebediah Galt (the great grandfather of John Galt) is also one of the honored names among this group. His name is on the Plaque of Patriots at the rotunda at the NRA HQ. I must admit that a tear came to my eye when I saw his name.

[GrahamInCanada]

You need unions.

As far as Odinseye's argument, I have the right to own and possess shampoo, and to use shampoo on both sides of an airplane trip, off the airlines property, but somehow these days I do not have the right to bring shampoo onto the plane.

I find this quite as ridiculous as Odinseye's argument, which if extended, would mean he or anybody could bring their gun onto the plane.

[Rog49Thomas]

one has to be ready to protect one's freedom at all times.

What if one of those "jack-booted thugs" (as Wayne LaPierre EVP of the NRA called them) working for the USA Govt accosted you on a flight? Without your handgun, how are you going to protect your rights?

What if someone attacked your honor on a cross country flight? Are you going to duel with
plastic knives? A man's honor demands instant satisfaction?

What if you were on a plane coming back to the States from Toronto and noticed it was full
of treacherous Canadians planning to attack Buffalo? How would you protect Old Glory?

And if a terrorist followed you home, what are you going to do. Invite him in for dinner?

[OdinsEye]

You can take your shampoo to the airport and leave it in your car even if it is parked on airport property.

[OdinsEye]

"I find this quite as ridiculous as Odinseye's argument, which if extended, would mean he or anybody could bring their gun onto the plane."

Nope. But I could take my concealed carry firearm to the airport and leave it in my car parked on airport property. Which, BTW, is exactly what I can do in 48 states.

[randyjet]

Just HOW do you think you can BAN guns in people vehicles? That means that the employer may search your car at any time it is on company property and remove objectionable materials such as drugs, alcohol, guns, pornography, and union literature. THAT is NOT a liberal position to grant corporations such "rights". I too am a liberal Texan, and I support the bill.

[OdinsEye]

And if they can search your vehicle, that means they have a security force.

And if they have a security force, it really is not that hard for them to put in place an armory where a person may check in their concealed carry firearm upon arrival. I have seen other companies do it and thus not impede the lawful carry of a concealed carry firearm off the premises.

[Forsetti]

This bill sponsored by the U.S. Postal Service.

[Mack20]

Awww, you beat me to it! LOLOLOL.

[Rog49Thomas]

If postal workers were allowed to carry while delivering the mail, crime in the usa would drop dramatically.
So too I believe would be postal worker on postal worker violence.

Guns - the solution for just about everything. And what guns can't cure a tax cut can.

[LeftRight]

First, you HONESTLY think that crime would go down were Postal Workers to suddenly start packing heat???????

Second, if there were any truth to your post, then you wouldn't have included that last line, since we ALL know that tax cuts don't work!!!

[mariegachelin]

Hunting can be a lot of fun and I don't see what the big deal is with hunting rifles.

Nonetheless, I just can't see what hunting has to do with carrying a concel weapon to work. If you work in a war zone than of course you need a weapon. if you don't work in a war zone and you feel that you need to protect yourself, your town needs to hire more law-enforcement people.

[djkrlsn]

Last time I checked--young minority men are safer on a percentage basis while in the military in a war zone than they are in gang areas in cities like L A, Chicago or D C

[AmandaBabe]

And that means we should keep the country in a war zone and keep that war zone stocked with young minority men. Brilliant! Why didn't I think of that?

[cloudminder]

in florida

Crist signed into law a controversial measure that tells employers and business owners they can no longer bar their employees or visitors from having guns locked in their car on their premises so long as the employee or visitor has a concealed weapons license. Concealed weapons license records are not available for public inspection, this then would not allow employers and businesses to confirm status.

[OdinsEye]

"Concealed weapons license records are not available for public inspection, this then would not allow employers and businesses to confirm status."

Um, asking the employee to produce their permit will allow them to confirm status. The carrier is required to have their permit with them while carrying.

[Jackson Williams - Huffpost Blogger]

OdinsEye,

I think you've precisely characterized the situation in your prior comment: "by the current rules I can't exercise my legal activity of concealed carry while going to {or} from work because I can't leave my firearm in the car since the car is on company property. That is all this law is meant to change."

That's correct. But you're suggesting this new change is somehow minor. You're suggesting that the concealed carry law is more sacrosanct that a business owner's property rights.

I certainly don't agree.

The state of Texas didn't even have a concealed carry law until the mid 1990's. The question of where -- and where not -- a person who carries a legally concealed weapon can carry that weapon is a perfectly legitimate question.

The idea that the concealed carry law now trumps private property rights is quite a change from how this law was sold 15 years ago, and exemptions have slowly been stripped away ever since.

[cloudminder]

Charlie Crist already passed and signed a law like this in Florida--

it is ridiculous