Arabs Should Act Now -- Not Wait for Obama
Because expectations across the Middle East are so high and the need for change is so great, during the next two months, all eyes will be focused on the early decisions made by President-elect Barack Obama. But precisely because the need is so great, I believe that the region's leadership should be more than spectators during this critical transition period. This is especially true with regard to efforts to achieve an Israeli-Palestinian peace.
The damage done by eight years of the Bush administrations' neglect and recklessness is all too clear. The Palestinian house is in disarray, with leaderships in the West Bank and Gaza both physically and ideologically divided. Gaza, under the control of Hamas, is being strangled by an oppressive embargo, with an on-again, off-again truce punctuated by periods of rocket attacks and Israeli assaults. The West Bank, itself, is being slowly strangled by never-ending settlement growth, hundreds of intrusive and humiliating checkpoints, and an oppressive wall/barrier snaking in and out of Palestinian lands.
The paths chosen by the two leaderships, though contradictory, are both flawed. Hamas has made a religion of "resistance" which has won nothing but death and hardship for Palestinians, and insecurity in Israel and reinforcement for hard-line Israeli policies. Meanwhile the Palestinian Authority's commitment to negotiations, while commendable, has become pointless, since negotiating without leverage (and without control over the constituency for which they are negotiating) becomes an empty exercise.
On more than one occasion, Barack Obama has stated that he would make Israeli-Palestinian peace a priority, and that he would take a different course than that of his predecessor. But, if we are to be honest with ourselves, we must acknowledge that when Obama takes the oath of office on January 20th, he is likely to find a rather unappetizing situation laid out before him in the Middle East.
If nothing changes in the next two months, the Palestinian house will still be divided, and the Israelis will still have no government and no clear mandate (elections, there, will occur on February 10th, and all signs point to either a hard-line Netanyahu victory or the cobbling together of a weak centrist-led coalition).
The question, therefore, before the new administration will be: can anything be done, and, if so, how to start? Because I believe that steps can be taken, at least on the Arab side, to put their house in order before January 20th, the region's leadership ought to use the next two months' time wisely.
The first priority must be to achieve Palestinian reconciliation, and the establishment of an effective and unified Palestinian government that can command both popular support and the respect of the international community. This will require more than a redux of the Mecca Accords. The current draft proposal being circulated in Cairo provides a useful framework, with its focus on rebuilding a consensus government and an Arab-trained and supported internal security force. Compliance by both Palestinian leaderships is, of course, essential, but has thus far been elusive. Instead of the current rather hollow threats of sanctions or "naming names," the Arab leadership ought to create incentives for acceptance.
Clearly what the West Bank and Gaza desperately need are job creation, infrastructure and capacity-building projects, as well as immediate relief. The Arabs do participate in international efforts to subsidize the Palestinian Authority budget, but that merely maintains the unacceptable status quo. To move the process forward, I would propose the creation of a rather massive multi-billion dollar "Peace and Reconciliation Incentive Fund" that would provide immediate relief and job-creating investment once the parties have agreed to a Cairo-like consensus. The bottom line purpose of the fund is to support the Palestinian people, and to create the incentive and pressure for their divided leaderships to agree on a new government, which, with Arab backing, is ready and able to make peace.
In addition, the Arab League, instead of merely reaffirming their 2002 and 2007 peace plan, would do well to enlarge upon it by putting, as it were, "meat on the bones." They could, for example, spell out in greater detail the types of investment and/or trade incentives that would accompany final peace and/or normalization. And they could even create a staged sequencing (for example, with the signing of an Israeli-Palestinian framework, stage one will occur; with removal settlements and checkpoints in compliance with agreement, stage two will occur, etc.). The Arab plan has attracted interest not only with the incoming U.S. administration, but among many in Israel, as well. Spelling out, therefore, the benefits and vision that accompany final peace would be of enormous benefit.
In addition to the January 20th swearing in of Barack Obama as the 44th President of the United States, there are two other deadlines fast approaching. A Palestinian agreement must be reached by January ninth, the formal date of the end President Abbas' term, or the already fragile internal Palestinian situation may become more conflicted. Equally important is the February 10th election in Israel. Rapid movement toward achieving Palestinian consensus and an enlarged and enhanced version of the Arab peace initiative would both remove the dangers presented by the first date and could have a positive impact on the latter.
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Hello Zogby
I do not expect anything new from Obama , after i heard his speech at AIPAC and the Knesset In Israel . my hopes were totally dashed , I had to face reality , if a US candidate wants to win (long term) he has to swear allegiance to Israel FIRST . the Arabs are not going to do anything , the Dictators (protected by the big powers and their intelligences ) because they are not free , the Leaders simply Obey the white house . Just look at the Huge one million Dollars Party at Duba 2 nights ago , while people in Gaza starve and die because of Israeli /and Egyptian siege . Mubarak and King Abdullah depend on the US donations , so they wont do much either . the saudis are the Biggest Allies to the whitehouse and the saudis have always acted AGAINST the Arabs interests for over 40s years . the saudis even arm and arm Salafists groups to cause trouble in Lebanon and syria . So i have no hope .
Sadly Zogby, your opinions are in the minority of Arab Americans and those who are suffering in the conflict will not settle for 21.4% of what used to be all theirs.
If you want to talk about "what was theirs"--all of Isreal, Palestine and Jordan belonged to the Jews long before there were any Muslims.
Jews were not alone on that Land , the canaanites (palestinian origin) the Amorites, the Hittites , the Hivites , the Jebusites , were there BEFORE the jews .
An Israeli scholar, in a recently published book said that he could not find and documentation of the exodus. He also speculated that the original Jews in the Holy Land converted, and are todays Palistinians.
Actually, all investigation of the historicity of the Jews invading and conquering Palestine has found no evidence it ever happened. In fact, the leading anthropologists now think that at the time David and Solomon supposedly ruled in Jerusalem, the area supported no cities at all... just some nomadic wanderers. So, if there was no Jerusalem there at the time, all the stories which have been called history are lies, aren't they?
Israel will give up their land to the Arabs one day after the U.S. gives back America to the Native Americans. At least the Jews can point to the fact that this was their historical homeland. The Americans can make no such claim.
Your point is well taken. The problem is that the Indians gave up, signed peace treaties and are content to run gambling casinos and enjoy citizenship in the USA. The Palistianians haven't given up and there is no indications that they will as long as they have minimum support outside the west bank. Their toy rockets will get more accurate and deadly. Israel has more to lose in the long run. They are running out of time.
how about we clean up our own mess first
That is right, clean up our mess first, then we are strong enough to bring attentions from both sides. They will not listen or give-and-take until uncle Sam is strong and pwerful. We lost our levergae to negotiage after Vietnam War.
Brothers, listen, this is the best plan for both of you.
How can there be peace until both sides recognize each others right to exist? How can there be peace when the Palestinians cant even find peace among themselves? The Israelies are moving on with their lives, they are living in freedom and enjoying the fruits of the incredible modernization of a once barren and desolate land. They are going to schools, raising families and pursuing their dreams. Does anyone honestly believe the Gaza embargo would still be going on if rockets werent landing near preschools or that there would be a wall around the West Bank if terrorist Palestinians didn't strap bombs to their chests and walk effortlessly into Israel with the intent to kill? They need to unite as a people and demonstrate themselves commited to peace and not destruction. How can there ever be a Palestinian country when half of it won't even take the most basic of actions of acknowledging the other sides existence. These actions only feed the Israeli right wing and justify its positions, Which hold everybody back. No amount of aid can equal the amount of wealth the Palestinans stand to acquire once they have a safe state of their own. There needs to be, a people wide understanding that THEY are the key holders to their own state, their own freedom and their own futures. When the Hamas want freedom for their people more then they want the destruction of Israel, only then can their truly be peace.
Quote : The Israelies are moving on with their lives
sure, on someone else s misery . they are Occupying someone else home , vineyard, orchard , roads , someone else fields , they are stealing someone else s water so they can have lush lawns . someone from Moscow or Casablanca or Djerba comes and enjoy interest free Loan and live in the westbank , while the Palestinians whose grandparents are buried in Hebron faces 700 Checkpoints DAILY , and pregnant women bleed to death or lose their infants at those checkpoints too . shame Shame shame .
bravo! well said.
Misery that i self inflicted.
They continued and still do continue to try and destroy Israel instead of coexisting. They elected to lead them a terror organization that has vowed NEVER to make peace or recognize Israel. Hamas vows to NEVER give up their Jihad and NEVER rely on any negotiations or peace talks ... would you like to see it written in their words?
""There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors. "
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/hamas.asp
Someone from Moscow? How about the half of Israel that comes from the surrounding Arab countries who were thrown out after their property was stolen from them? What of them. Much of the dreaded Likud party in Israel is made up of Arab Jews ...
And what of the Jews who were murdered by those Hebron Palestninans.
Hebron was a city with a majority Jewish population ... where'd they all go?
There's an awful lot of myth making on this site ... and before people congratulate eachother for well said posts, perhaps they ought to fact check them.
It is a shame that such a positive approach as Zogby presents is met with so much petty sniping. Instead of looking at nits to pick in what he has written, it would be so much better to provide comments that enhance what he has proposed.
It's time to look for what can be done rather than focus on what hasn't been done.
I'm sorry to disappoint you, but Zogby's idea here just isn't going to work. You can bring the entire Arab world on board and it won't matter one bit because Israel will torpedo the entire peace process if it suits them, because they believe the US will back them up without precondition because since the Reagan adminstration, we always have.
Dewey eyed optimism is nice. Plausible solutions would be better.
Oh will you get over yourself already and actually try! There is and always will be plenty of blame to go around in the conflict, Israeli and the Arab world but nothing will ever come of it. That's borderline insanity if you think it will versus Dewy eyed optimism.
Arabs are dreamers.
I like Zogby's suggestion for setting up a "Peace and Reconciliation Incentive Fund" for the Palestinians. But I think it should be matched with a "Peace and Reconciliation Dis-Incentive Fund" for the Israeli's, whereby the US gradually reduces military and economic aid to Israel unless she participates in peace talks in good faith, and unless she starts removing the illegal settlements.
I've read articles where Israel has tried just that... and got shot at by the settlement residents. It's like trying to tame the wild western frontier out there... can't always place the blame on the Israeli government for not trying.
If Mr Obama is really interested in "change" we can believe in then he needs to "change" the same old rhetoric, and dogmatic, unquestioned, unconditional support of Israel. Level the playing field and be an honest broker of the "change" he is espousing. Obama is no fool but it sounds like AIPAC is doing their best to bias Obama to be an Israel firster.
I will be proud of the day when the President can put the interest of America before the interest of Israel and not be crucified for it. It's a shame that American politicians are selected, not on their commitment to the best interests of America, but by vowing to put the interests of a foreign nation, Israel, first. The oath of allegiance that I said everyday in school was not to Israel, or any country but America.
A true "friend" of Israel would tell them they need to end the occupation of the West Bank, stop repressing the legitimate national aspirations of the Palestinians, and stop warmongering. The time has come for the US to stop pandering to Israel and it's destructive, belligerent, failed policies.
Israel 'preconditions' for "peace" are outdated, irrelevant, and biased towards Israel. Why is Israel allowed to lay waste to every international law and convention without criticism and their "enemies" -read Iran,Syria, any one against Israel's failed policies are not entitled to raise a hand in their own defense without raising Washingtons hackles? I hope Obama smartens up.
No one wants to end the occupation of the West Bank more then Israel - lets remember how and why they came to occupy it in the first place Poster ... and lets remember there's at least close to a majority of Palestinians that have voted into power a terrorist organization/political party sworn to reject any peace with Israel and above all never recognize Israel as the Jewish State it was re established to be. Hamas has vowed to destroy the State of Israel and yet here that small fact seems to have slipped your mind Betz - must be clouded up with all of that AIPAC demonizing that so many of you are poisoned by.
and FYI If you'd like to see real influence peddling that's gone on for decades influencing everythimg from the price of gas at the pumps to what your kids are taught at Universities ... just look into the Saudi Arabian lobby which makes AIPAC look like a PTA bake sale ...
Finally ... great post James. I completely agree with everything you've written here. I think it would go very far giveing the Israelis food for thought before they vote Bibi back into power since most can't stand him to begin with so it wouldn't take very much to encourage them to vote for Livni. Sounds like a bit of meat on the Saudi plan could give them some reason to hope that trust in this new US environment could work now.
The price at the pumps is set by US oil companies, ultimate. Granted, it's not Arab oil-producing companies don't influence the cost, it's not as if US companies would price below that and take a loss. Quite the opposite -- the oil companies have so wide a profit margin that they made record-breaking, even bank-breaking (literally!) profits.
You know? Why don't you actually attend a university before you make insinuations about what's taught there. And Saudi Arabia makes AIPAC look like a bake sale? Really? Do you think Joe Lieberman kept his chairmanship after turning completely traitor on his own political party because of Saudi influence?
Your neoconservative fantasies to blame "brown people" for all of your problems is kind of disgraceful, you know.
It's not helpful to continue to refer to Hamas as a "terrorist" group. The Zionists in Palestine had underground groups like the Irgun and the Stern Gang that committed acts of violence that today we would describe as terrorist because they targeted and killed civilians. The fact is that Israel won its war in 1948 and so its acts of violence became meritorious acts to create the nation and the Palestinians lost the war and so their acts of violence to undo the new state became and still are condemned as terrorist. Israel has little incentive to pursue peace because its opponents are so weak. What Israeli is doing now in the West Bank with its settlements and wall is a kind of war of attrition against the Palestinians that leads them to prefer exile outside than life inside in terrible conditions of underdevelopment. So the maximalists Israelis want to wait until the Palestinian population declines to the point that incorporating the West Bank into Israel formally will not make Jewish Israelis a minority in Israel. Look at a map of Israeli settlements which are everywhere on the West Bank and what you see is one large Israeli state from the Mediterranean to the Jordan River. This is what Jimmy Carter called "apartheid." This is why Israel's only incentive to create a Palestinian statelet would be to counter a unified Palestinian movement demanding citizenship rights in a multi-national Israeli state.
GZLives said : No one wants to end the occupation of the West Bank more then Israel
rubbish ! why do they continue buidling settlments all around Palestinians towns and villages and multiply new homes , and allow new posts by new settlers ? (this was against the road map too > ) they have no intention of giving up the westbank . they are too greedy and no one is going to stop them .
they have done the same in the Golan heights , Syrian Land .
You know what's sad? I don't think Israel can even negotiate in good faith anymore. Even if you get them to sit down at the negotiating table and pretend to behave, they'll just raise a huff and run crying to the US government when they don't get their way. Which means as long as Israel has our unbiased support, there will never be a such thing as peace.
Israel cannot survive without the United States. Likewise, the United States cannot survive without the rest of the world. If Obama can't legitimize his professed mandate of change, the rest of the world will give up on us -- Obama's our last, very last chance, I think. If he can't change things, no one can. And everyone knows that. If we can't regain the trust and support of the rest of the world, the US can't survive. And if our economy collapses, Israel will be dragged down with us because they don't function without US handouts.
I'd hate to think that's the way this will play out, and maybe I'm being to cynical for even thinking it. But I don't see any evidence yet the Barack Obama is keeping his promise to the future of America. Maybe it's too early to really tell. I hope so, I really do.
btz55,
Bravo. You said it all. Thank you.
I bet you will be soon charged with "anti-semitism" as I have for years for calling for "just peace" and balanced approach to the question.
Well said! The US MUST free itself from 'The Israel Lobby's' political blackmail!
As a wise Syrian ambassador in the 60's once said at a talk I attended, "God is not a real estate agent". This was in response to the Israeli ambassador's claim that God gave Israel to the J ews.
I wish so much that the American media would give this issue the sort of attention it deserves. Most American's are inexcusably ignorant as to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and the plight of the Palestinian people. Unfortunately it seems they prefer to dwell on countless vapid issues--such as Sarah Palin, the private lives of the Clintons, and worse. It's really shameful.
As the King of Jordan said to Obama when he was visiting in the Summer: the Israeli-Palestinian issue is the most pressing issue of our time. Our new administration must have this at the top of their agenda, despite the financial crisis, because it's every bit as important to our future. As an American, I do see some growing awareness of this situation--mostly because of the Internet--and a somewhat increased awareness as to how our country has helped worsen the problem. This will be Obama's big test. He has proclaimed himself as someone who can bring people together to resolve disputes. Let's all hope this was not just campaign talk.
A good start is if Hamas and it minions drop there call for the annihilation of Israel. Until that happens why would Israel even consider negotiations.
...and Likud can go right on calling for the destruction of Palestine. It's not like having the whole conservative bloc of the Knesset mobilized for settlement won't torpedo the peace process. Yeah, that sounds /real/ fair.
The Hamas of yesterday is not the Hamas of today. Hamas is ready for peace and the 67 borders. The Israeli leadership refuses to acknowledge the concessions. Hopefully, sooner rather tnan later, Israel will accept the Saudi Initiative.
The Palistinians will not be united until the US government allows it. It's well known that Abbas is our puppit. It's also well known that he is corrupt.
OH PLEASE .,,,,, Annihilation with what ? rockets made from Carnation cans ? Israel is a nuclear State since the 50s .
Hamas has Changed its speeches a long time ago , but i dont blame you your Media (zionist controlled ) wont tell you the truth . Hamas is wiling to accept 1967 borders and Khaled Mishaal often said so . the Annihilation was mention by an israeli Rabbi though (but your media wont be outraged)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/1270038.stm
"but i dont blame you your Media (zionist controlled ) wont tell you the truth . Hamas is wiling to accept 1967 borders and Khaled Mishaal often said so"
hamas is NOT willing to make a long term peace, not willing to recognize Israel as a Jewish State and Khlaed Meshaal will also tell you - or actually won't tell you since that's always been the tactic ... you know, we didn't fire the rocket, Islamic Jihad did ...
This is a cancer in the Middle east and until its eradicated, no peace will come to Israel or Lebanon or even Iraq ... these Islamist militia thugs will never allow it
I hope Obama focuses on the US first. We can't afford to be drained of time and money in these other countries any more. Its time for change.
I said it before and I repeat: To sit down and wait for a HANDOUT from any American administration will get the Arabs nowhere. You have been waiting for this handout for the past 50 years or so, it will never happened. As long as you are ruled by the likes of Saud Family, Mubarak, Khadaffi, et el. No body will respect you or give a damn about you crying and begging for help. Help yourself. Rise up. You are very rich people with great history and yet you are at the very bottom on every scale of social, economics, and defense developments for the past 40-50 years. Get rid of these corrupt, ugly, rotten regimes that had been ruling your people forever. Build up your countries, be self reliant, marsh forward. Maybe then the world will respect you.
"Yeah.Only the Israeli's got handouts from the United States. See... they're white and you're not, Arab world"
Stay classy, Ohdingo. Stay classy.
Mr zogby
Barak obama will do nothing,it will be the same as if bush was still in the white house,especially now he wants hillary clinton s.o.s...who us arabs know she loves isreal to death ,and abhors us.
so we will just carry on the way we are either isreal or god will take our humiliated souls.
I read your post and started to cry. It is those that herd people into camps, rape, starve and kill that have humiliated their souls.
Bravo !!!!!!
To suggest that the Palestinians and the Palestinians alone are responsible -- or even capable -- of moving the peace process forward during the transition is absurd. Israel has been openly sabotaging any attempts for Palestinians to achieve any level of stability or security since before it was legally recognized as a country -- besides what you listed in the article, there's also the arrests of various Palestinian politicians, the blockade of economy and communication between the various territories, and the bulldozing of homes and farmlands on a regular basis. And that doesn't even cover what Israel does under the cloak of secrecy with black ops and the generation of false information and propaganda.
Chaos .. I think you left out the daily rocketing of Israeli cities, the theft of tractors that are then driven into Israeli civilians in Jerusalem, the Iranian support of Hamas and Hezbollah and the calls for the "complete liberation of Israel" ... which is to say the same rhetoric the Arabs have been using for 60 years that have gotten them nowhere.
The Israelis for the most part react while the Arabs initiate. The wall is a reaction to the suicide bombers, the checkpoints are a reaction to the terror.
Its called self defense and if Arab terror would end, which it hasn't in 60 years, surely Israel's response would no longer be necessary.
No one likes to discuss how it all began, but had the Palestinians opted for a State in 1947 instead of opting to destroy Israel which they were certain they would do with the help of 7 Arab armies, they wouldn't have to be claiming they are suddenly the victims. They are ijn fact, the victims of their own self inflicted wounds ...
You're just flat out wrong, quite frankly. Saying that Israeli policies are "self defense" is like saying that having African American prison populations of 50% in our country when they only make up less than 15% of our population is "justice"
No one likes to discuss how it all began? No wonder. It's because US and British business interests made deals with Israeli militants in 1947 to abandon the Palestinians in favor of a Jews-only country club state. You really should go up on the British Mandate -- read up about Jewish terrorism (against British citizens as well as Palestinians), about nakba and about the sum of international ruling on Israel -- much of it critical of Israel and much of it ignored because we shield them.
Yes, I understand that part of the motivation for forming Israel was because we thought we we making a safe place for Jews. But that never gave us the right to steal land from another ethnic group. And anyway, it's been a failure -- Israel's one of the /least/ safest place to live, even if you're Jewish. There are Jewish populations across the Middle East, and even those communities repudiate themselves from Israel for its war crimes.
GZLi.
You forgot the TANKS, FIGHTER JETS, BOMBS, MISSILES, MINES, ETC.ETC.
Oh wait. These are used by Israel against unarmed stone-throwing youths. A home-made missile here and a hand made granade there.
Israel engineered the current situation -- they withdrew from Gaza, unilaterally and without any sort of reasonable warning or cooperation, because they knew a power vacuum would result in the political rise of Hamas in the face of Fatah negotiations being left out to dry. They then used that as a pretext to wall the Gaza strip off and turn it into one large prison camp. And now they're doing the same thing, slowly but surely, in the West Bank, squeezing the Palestinians between tighter and tighter walls. The Israelis are at least as culpable for the lack of a united Palestinian government to form, if not more so.
And all of this happens on the dime of the US taxpayer -- $3 billion a year in military aid to be exact, billions more in loans and favored trading with us. You tell me who's really responsible for the failure of the peace process in the face of all of that. It would be idiotic for Arabs to take any steps forward until they could be sure whether Obama was going to decry, ignore, or endorse Israel's activities to impede any change in the situation that doesn't further their interests.
“Gaza, under the control of Hamas, is being strangled by an oppressive embargo, with an on-again, off-again truce punctuated by periods of rocket attacks and Israeli assaults.”
I think this sentence needs to be rephrased. I don’t believe you meant to say it, but putting Palestinian rocket attacks before Israeli assaults creates the false impression that it is the Palestinians who are violating the truce accord and the Israeli army is rightfully reacting, when in reality it is the other way around.
“The first priority must be to achieve Palestinian reconciliation, and the establishment of an effective and unified Palestinian government that can command both popular support and the respect of the international community.” But there was a unified Palestinian government but the so called international community refused to respect it by refusing to engage with ministers which were members of Hamas who had just won a democratic election. If a few nations using the pseudonym “international community”, while preaching democracy continue to refuse to acknowledge the will of the Palestinian people then neither this priority nor peace can be achieved. Clearly for such a government to be effective the difficulty in uniting the popular will and the interests of the “international community” should be overcome. But which side should make the concession and for whose sake? When the people speak those who have ears should listen.
"Gaza, under the control of Hamas, is being strangled by an oppressive embargo, with an on-again, off-again truce punctuated by periods of rocket attacks and Israeli assaults."
It's interesting to me that you found issue with this sentence, asi I did also. However, not in the same way you did. I took issue with fact that apparently, rocket attacks just happen, but assaults
are "Israeli". In fact, one could read this sentence quickly and come away thinking that Israel was responsible for both the rockets and assaults.
As for who violated truces first, unless you were there you have no clue as to who violated what. For my experience and reading, it is the Palestinians who voilate truces with rockets.
Just goes to show, it's a hard problem to grapple with when every sentence is up for debate and scrutiny.
I was looking for one intrinsic proposal by Mr. Zogby, namely who would he propose to take the leadership on for the *Palestinians*? There are not two camps, but three. There is Gaza, which used to belong to Egypt, there is the PA which consists of numerous Jordanians who were involved in a coup in Jordan and expelled and there are Jordanian Palestinians. I have not overlooked the Lebanese *Palestinians, who I believe hail from Jordan as well. A large contingent of *Palestinians* used to be Egyptians by nationality. Then there is also a group which a year or more ago was expelled from Iraq, and were then living in tents. I think that Mr. Zogby suggests that the first order of achievement is competent leadership. I suggest that that leadership be divided between the - so far unwilling - King of Jordan and the Egyptian leadership, in other words, these nations take their natives back in. Both countries have stable leadership, and both the Arab world and the Western world can deal with them and negotiate. As for the proposed funds that Mr. Zogby requests from the Arab and Muslim world, that is a great idea that I have spouted before. It should be used for education as well as for the Zogby proposals. After the first requirement hurdle is achieved, competent leadership, Palestinians should be allowed to get out of their tenements and be allowed to emigrate if they wish. This is now not allowed.
under your proposal, then, it would be fair for the israelis, most of whom are descendant from europe, russia, and the usa return to their homelands and the entire issue would be resolved.
Actually, with this rationale she's using, Israelis would need to largely return to Europe, Russia and the US and the Palestinians would get the whole shebang back. The fact that she refuses to acknowledge that Palestinian is an ethnicity and a nationality is an false attempt to generalize the variety of Arab ethnicities. Also, as you pointed out, and this almost goes without saying, but this "proposal" is blatantly biased toward Israel -- like basically everything we've done for the entire existence of the state of Israel.
mommamia
you are quite pahtetic really
let then send all the jewish people back to europe and russia and ethiopia.
you people make me laugh when you deny the truth
lets send all the jewish people back to the land of orr(( birth place of prophet abraham)
incase you dont know where orr is ,its a tiny place in southern iraq
When you are done laughing maybe you could explain what are you saying? Do you deny the expulsion of the Jews from their homeland by the Romans? Do you deny that Israel offered citizenship to any arabs that stayed. Do you deny that Israel, in fact, honered that offer and that there are thousands of Israeli-Palestinians who have full rights and are represented in the Kennesset?
Stop laughing and try to come to the truth. Nobody is going anywhere and a two state solution is the only viable path here.
Jenintah/xxnounxx ------> There are none so blind as those who will not see, and there are none so deaf as will not hear. *Palestine* was the British Mandate. It consisted of what is now Israel and of what is now Jordan, a.o. The land was divided in 1948 with the largest part for the Palestinians (78% of the mandate). Israelis and jews have been living in that territory and all over the ME forever. Zionist returned to the area in the 1800's. The population of Jordan is 76% Palestinian. Abdullah's queen is Palestinian. The issue is not territory at all. The Jordanian/Arab territories are enormous, and so is their wealth. Gaza does not only have a border with Israel; it has a border with Egypt as well. Zogby has not come up with this article just out of the blue. A concerted effort is going on. Olmert and Barack flew independently to meet Abdullah. The issue is, again, not territory, it is LEADERSHIP. That was my question. It is obvious that there is no leadership now for the Palestinians. Neither Hamas, nor Abbas exercise leadership; they are out for themselves and keep the population imprisoned. That also happens, by the way, in Lebanon with Hizbullah. I am all for helping *Palestinians*, not for keeping corruptions saddled. Muslims, especially Arab muslims should help *Palestinians* and free them to emigrate, to live where they want, to have a life, and not to murder and be murdered.
xxnounxx. And in case YOU do not know, Urr was indeed were the story of Abraham started AND Abraham is also the forefather of Arabs. So, a good idea, xxnounxx, let us send the Palestinians back to where THEY came from, Urr, in Iraq. Is that what you are proposing? Surely, you do not wish to deny the *truth* now do you? Your comment does not offer any thought or possible solutions. By the way, did you follow this? Just recently another *batch* of *Palestinians* was evicted from Iraq. They were living in tents all over the ME afterwards. Arabs are members of the Knesset, and if they have Israeli nationality have all the rights of any Israeli. Muslims and (Palestinian) christian can exercise their faiths in Israel. Palestinian christians, however, are being harassed by muslim Palestinians, and have left, a.o. some famous biblical sites. Jews were chased out of what is now Israel AND Jordan by the Romans when the territory was under Roman occupation, and Romans appropriated judaism and changed it into christianity. Jesus was nevr a *christian*. He was a jewish Rabbi, living in Palestine. Palestine was jewish territory, not Arab territory.
And, in more recent history, Jordanian Palestinians attempted a coup against the Jordanian government and were then chased out. Those are the *Palestinians* who are living in Lebanon, and Gaza, and clamoring for their *own state*. Many of the *Palestinians* were also Egyptian natives, causing problems in Egypt. No one wants these troublemakers. But the real problem xxnounxx is that there is no *Palestinian nation*, there is no *Palestinian* government or army, there is no *Palestinian LEADERSHIP*. There is no *Palestinian economy or industry*. These nomads need to be taken in into existing nations, i.e. Egypt and Jordan, receive an education and learn to adapt to modern society. They need to learn not to murder and maraud, to live in peace and to accept leadership. Most Palestinians want that, or they want to emigrate and start a life elsewhwere. They are not allowed.
mommamia526 your understanding of Palestinian ethnicity is flawed although far superior to that of Golda Meir who said that there are no Palestinians at all.
There are no Jordanian Palestinians or Lebanese Palestinians or Egyptian Palestinians who are "native" to Jordan, Lebanon, or Egypt respectively. There are Palestinian refugees who were displaced from Palestine (Now Israel) into Jordan, Lebanon, and Egypt. Palestinian refugees are natives of their original homeland - not the places where they ended up.
Certainly many Palestinians refugees who were displaced to Jordan, Lebanon, and Egypt did receive passports after 1948 (and subsequent offspring in the diaspora) but the idea that "these nations [should] take their natives back" is a misleading statement. If this recommendation were to be truly followed then Israel would be welcoming millions of displaced Palestinians back to their native lands.This won't happen because it would mean the end of a Jewish state through democratic means -(i.e. Palestinian vote would be the majority vote thereby changing the very nature of Israel as a state).
When I spoke of *natives* I was not referring to ethnicity, nor was I referring to religion. Palestinians are Arabs. Palestine is NOT now Israel. It was the British Mandate, which comprised a very large area, a.o. what is now Israel and JORDAN. Jordan is the British Mandate Transjordan. *Palestinian refugees* are created until this day, and are groups or people expelled from the countries where they are living (or native, born, raised, holding passports from). We have seen this when Iraq expelled *Palestinians* very recently, who had lived in Iraq for a century or longer. And, no, Israel should not take them in. And I doubt that my understanding is even on par with the late Golda Meir, let alone superior to her understanding. Do not be ridiculous.
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