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Jeremy Dehn

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For-Profit Education: Value for Whom?

Posted: 09/20/2012 4:04 pm

It was with great interest that I read David Zorn's recent piece about assessing the value proposition of proprietary, or for-profit colleges. I worked for Zorn at the Art Institute of Colorado, I taught film and video production to some of the students he mentions, and I participated in some of the debates he describes, so the issues he raises are important to me on both personal and professional levels.

Zorn's completely right about the need for clear metrics to evaluate the success of different schools, but the head of a for-profit college making such an argument calls to mind the scene from Idiocracy where Luke Wilson's lawyer goes from defending his client to attacking him because he can't seem to figure out whose side he's on. It's hard to know where to start with Zorn's impressive monument to obfuscation, so I'll just take it more or less in the order it appears:

As soon as he can squeeze in the request, Zorn pleads that we shift the debate from ownership structure to national workforce issues. That's probably because when you look at schools in terms of their ownership structure, it can no longer be denied that for-profit colleges are a tremendously bad investment. This issue has been covered extensively on this site, any number of news outlets, and recently in a 5,000-page Senate report, so I'll just summarize the basics and you can Google if you want the details: For-profits are much more expensive (even when controlling for subsidies to state and nonprofit schools), take far more than their share of federal loan money, and result in astronomical failure and loan default rates. They're a bad deal for students, many of whom see their financial futures irreparably harmed, and few of whom see their career prospects improve much, if at all. And they're a bad deal for taxpayers, who front 70, 80, and in some cases over 90 percent of the cost, and are on the hook in the all too frequent cases when students are unable to repay the loans. And that's before you factor in the impressive number of fraud cases faced by for-profit schools. The U.S. Department of Justice and several states are at this very moment suing EDMC, parent company of the school headed by Zorn, for violations of the False Claims Act.

In what's become the industry's go-to strategy to combat these now-undeniable realities, Zorn argues we should be "factoring in the populations" served by schools when evaluating their performance, a skillful PR gambit, because it makes his school look better by highlighting only part of the story. For-profits serve a much higher percentage of low-income, first generation, minority, veteran, and other quote-unquote nontraditional or at-risk students. Consequently for-profit colleges want things like their failure and loan default rates to be compared to community colleges and vocational programs that serve similar demographics. That's fair enough, but when you talk costs, for-profit colleges want to be compared to expensive private institutions. You can't claim that you're reasonably priced because you're cheaper than ivy-league schools, then also claim to have reasonable default rates because they're on par with community college. That's even if your comparable default rates typically don't include the fact that far fewer students at less-expensive community colleges take out loans in the first place.

Here in Denver, a resident student who flunks out after paying full price for a full-time year at the private, nonprofit University of Denver will pay about $39,000 for the mistake, assuming the extremely unlikely, worst-case scenario that a student in such a demographic didn't get any institutional financial aid. Comparatively, paying for tuition and fees at The Art Institute looks like an excellent deal at around $24,000 per year, but when you look at the state-run University of Colorado at Denver, where students will pay closer to $8,000, it's a lot less of a deal, and AI looks even worse when you place its tuition bill alongside that of Denver Community College, where Zorn and his fellow apologists imply the demographics are most comparable: less than $5,000 per year. And all of this is before you consider the mind-boggling implication that there's no difference in content from an Ivy League to a community college education. Having also taught at both UC Denver and DU, both of which provide students with a much broader general education that makes them employable in any number of fields beyond that of their degree specialization, I can affirm that there is a difference from one program to another.

I will concede this: Zorn calls the demographics in question "underserved," and while this smacks of the for-profits' dickish, guilt-tripping PR strategy of claiming to provide choices in educational opportunity for students who aren't being served well by traditional higher education, there's more than a little truth to this term. Traditional higher ed is not doing enough to reach poor, minority, veteran, and other nontraditional students, and it's to the great shame of the American higher education system that this is the case. But it's to our even greater shame that instead of finding a genuine solution to this difficult problem, we've left these populations with little recourse but to be snapped up by predatory for-profit schools that will gouge them on price, leaving many of them in even worse shape than they were before they attended. By neglecting these students, we've inadvertently created a market in which the students in most need of a fair price in education get the worst possible product in terms of price to value. In what universe is this either ethical or fiscally responsible?

The problem of educational access is a thorny one, and I won't pretend to pose a comprehensive solution, but here's a jumping off point worth considering: 20 years ago the public University of Colorado system received over $9,000 per student from the state, and today that number is less than $4,500 (Source: University of Colorado press materials), figures that have unfortunate parallels across the country. These figures also go a long way toward explaining why tuition is rising at so many state schools, understandably angering most of us who support better access to higher education. If we make a proper investment, we'll have the right to start demanding, among other things, that more of our investment goes toward access. It's also worth considering how much good the $32 billion in federal money currently going to for-profit colleges could do in the much more cost-effective state and community sectors. Zorn acknowledges cuts in state funding, but it takes real balls to acknowledge how state schools are hurting for cash, and then offer as a solution a school that costs two or four or more times as much and has demonstrably worse outcomes.

Speaking of spending, Zorn is proud of the fact that over half of AI Colorado's revenue goes back into the classroom. "Back into our school" is the kind of nebulous phrase that could mean anything, and since I was faculty when I worked for Zorn, rather than budget office personnel, I can't really translate it into anything meaningful. The most complete picture I've seen of for-profit education spending practices comes from a Senate report about Bridgepoint Education's Ashford University, which found that, per student, $2,714 went to recruitment of students, $1,522 went to shareholders, and only $700 went to education.

I don't know how closely the Art Institute and Bridgepoint models mirror one another, but I can affirm that Zorn's failure to mention faculty at all in his article is one of many hints that for-profit colleges may not be prioritizing educational quality to the extent they should. The financial investment Zorn's school makes in faculty is another such hint. Here's the salary comparison from the period when I taught at Zorn's school: for teaching a single course in an 11-week quarter at AI Colorado I'd receive $2,000, but that same 11 weeks at the private nonprofit University of Denver paid $3,000, and a 15-week semester at the state-run University of Colorado was over $4,000. If Zorn wants to claim that his school provides a market-based choice for students (and for this we'll temporarily suspend disbelief and buy into the notion that a college that gets well over three quarters of its revenue from public money can be called a "market-based" institution), he should consider budgeting such that the school can pay a market-based salary to attract and reward talent in the classroom.

On a slightly more personal note, and perhaps as disclosure, I should add that my career ended at the Art Institute of Colorado when I wrote an op-ed making similar points to those I'm making now. Despite consistent employment every quarter for over two years and my excellent annual reviews, there just suddenly weren't any courses for me to teach. Zorn's people apparently expected me to believe that my termination's coming on the heels of my op-ed was just a coincidence. It's more than a little ironic that Zorn's school, which subjects its students to required reviews of their creative work, can't itself take a critique.

So after all of the above it's hard to take seriously Zorn's central argument that we should try to figure out ways to more precisely measure success. I don't disagree with him on this, and I do think we should try harder to measure college success. But again it's very difficult to look past the source of the argument and see anything meaningful as a result. First, Zorn's industry has shown itself adept at manipulating accountability statistics to the point that they're completely unreliable. See various attempts to dramatically inflate career placement numbers and undercount student loan defaults, again to say nothing of recruiters' misrepresentation of costs and student loan terms. I'm skeptical given this history, but if Zorn and his industry are actually serious enough about a truly honest conversation here, I suppose it might work. In Catch Me If You Can, Tom Hanks works successfully with Leonardio DiCaprio when he convinces the master grifter to turn his skills toward catching fraud rather than committing it, and that movie, not unlike many of the statements of for-profit recruiters, is based partially on true events.

The other big problem with for-profit colleges' alleged support of increased accountability across all colleges and universities is that it's yet another position that reeks of PR posturing by emphasizing some details at the expense of far more pertinent ones. I could write plenty about what's wrong at state and private nonprofit colleges too, but to place traditional higher ed's comparatively smaller problems -- things like sometimes bloated tenure structures, troublesomely low numbers of students in science and engineering, and over-reliance on adjunct labor -- alongside the institutionalized predatory behavior and systematic fraud that's rampant in the for-profit sector, and to pretend these problems are in the same ballpark, or even on the same continent, is the very definition of false equivalency.

The idea of equating two things that don't belong together brings me to the quote in Zorn's piece that's most problematic of all:

"We realize that our success is inherently tied to that of our students and alumni. In fact, as part of a for-profit education system, the interests of our investors are aligned with those of our students. That is why we have had the luxury of being able to continue investing in our school despite the challenging economy."

First off, Zorn's school gets the overwhelming majority of its income from federal student aid, the availability of which is unaffected by downturns in the economy. In fact student enrollment, really the only relevant requirement to accessing student loans in this discussion, tends to increase as the un-and under-employed take the opportunity presented by a down economy to beef up their educational credentials. Knowing this, the shameless assertion that AI Colorado has somehow managed to, through sheer force of awesomeness, sail above the troubled economy is ludicrous to the point of being deeply insulting to both students and the taxpayers who invest in them.

Far more importantly, if you look at the many, many cases of enrollment and recruitment fraud, encompassing false claims on everything from costs, to career placement, to the types of financial aid available, to programs and equipment offered by schools, to probably even what kind of food is available in the student cafeteria, you'll see that the problem is that these shareholder and student interests are absolutely not aligned. For-profit colleges are incentivized to enroll students in big numbers, and they're incentivized to enroll the poor, minority, and veteran students who come with the greatest percentage of free federal money. But until the recent adoption of the Gainful Employment Rule -- a rule that was hardly stringent to begin with and was further watered down after a multi-million dollar, mostly-taxpayer-financed lobbying effort on behalf of for-profit colleges -- there was neither carrot nor stick to incentivize outcomes. Outcomes are all but irrelevant to the success of the business model.

What's left is a business model that's become very effective at siphoning money from an education sector already starved for cash. Given this current state of affairs, I'm all for Zorn's idea of improving our methods of evaluating success, preferably with the intent of eliminating funding to institutions with persistently poor records, and redirecting their funding to institutions that clearly do better. I'd even go further than Zorn and take a broader view of what constitutes "success," including obvious factors like the graduation rates and lifetime earnings he suggests, as well as less tangible and harder to quantify factors like personal satisfaction and civic engagement. My belief in education's power to improve lives in these and other areas is the reason I spent so long on my own education and the reason I became a teacher.

But until Zorn and his ilk change their business model to close the atrocious gulf between the needs of students and taxpayers on one hand, and the currently very contradictory needs of shareholders on the other hand -- or more likely, until more substantial regulation is imposed upon the industry to close the gap between student and investor interests, debates about accountability involving for-profit colleges will remain in the realm of creative fiction that I used to teach at Zorn's school.

 

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It was with great interest that I read David Zorn's recent piece about assessing the value proposition of proprietary, or for-profit colleges. I worked for Zorn at the Art Institute of Colorado, I tau...
It was with great interest that I read David Zorn's recent piece about assessing the value proposition of proprietary, or for-profit colleges. I worked for Zorn at the Art Institute of Colorado, I tau...
 
 
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04:06 AM on 09/23/2012
Education is very important. But I think most of us who are educated know that in hindsight college had little to do with it and these days colleges are doing a terrible job of serving the community. We need more ad hoc approaches and the government or third party should give the degree, not the college. There is just too much money involved for colleges to have monopoly control over your degree.

We need something like an Open Source University. Just take the required classes(at any accredited school, online, cafe, etc) and get your degree from the accreditation giving body.

This would revolutionize education and greatly drive down costs.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
wayne the pain
06:16 PM on 09/22/2012
When education is for profit it is profit and NOT education that is the goal!
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
drkazmd65
Mom Taught me - Question Everything - Thanks Mom!
05:01 PM on 09/21/2012
I found this reqoute of the Zorn piece quite disturbing and oxymoronic.

"We realize that our success is inherently tied to that of our students and alumni. In fact, as part of a for-profit education system, the interests of our investors are aligned with those of our students. That is why we have had the luxury of being able to continue investing in our school despite the challenging economy."

Especially this single sentence seems counter-intuitive:
"In fact, as part of a for-profit education system, the interests of our investors are aligned with those of our students."

Actually - the interests of the investors and mamagement is in milking the financial resources available to prospective students for every cent it can, while simultaniously cutting educational resource costs per student to the bone. It's a "Wall-Mart" model of business, not an effective educational model for most potential students.

The interest of the student is to get as much effective access to information, and to instructors help and thoughts as they can get, so that they can develop marketable job skills and make a living post-graduation. This is hard to do when resources and time with instructors are limiting, and when you are competing with a horde of other similarly inclined students trying to do the same thing.

Seems to me,... there is essentially no alignment at all between the interests of the shareholders and the interests of the students in the short-term.
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Wayne Caswell
Consumer Advocate & Founder of Modern Health Talk
12:01 PM on 09/21/2012
Gone are the days of lifetime employment at one company that invests in your personal development and continued education. Now they layoff workers as one project ends and hire new workers for the next project, demanding specific new skills rather than training existing workers. Retooling skills is now YOUR responsibility, but that's not easy for someone working full time in a city with no university. Distance Learning through the Internet can help, and as some have said can be even more challenging and with more peer student interaction. As a nation, we need to rethink the role of formal (and continuing) education and how to develop the right workforce for our rapidly changing economic environment. One step is for employers to look beyond the accredited degree and also consider experience, accomplishment, and character, factors that resume scans often ignore. Social media and personal networks help.
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Wayne Caswell
Consumer Advocate & Founder of Modern Health Talk
11:46 AM on 09/21/2012
What exactly is a for-profit university? Does it include MIT, Harvard, and Stanford? I attended FIT (Florida Institute of Technology) and American University, and I surely felt their profit motive. I had had been in the military, and with travels had accululated three Associate degrees and more than enough credit hours for a Masters. American gave me credit for most of those courses but still required that I take "x" number of hours there, so they could make "y" dollars in profit. Since I had already taken most of the undergrad courses, or was qualified to teach them, so I ended up taking all graduate courses to earn my Bachelors degree. That experience helped form my perspective, which favors community colleges and online courses teaching skills that local employers need. After all, the objective of affordable education should be to provide a skilled, healthy and productive workforce that can compete with any nation, and to lead through innovation and entrepreneurship.
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whyus
San Francisco native
10:38 AM on 09/21/2012
For Profit means the bottom line is profit, not education. Go to a Junior College first, to see if higher education is right for you.
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realitytrumpsbull
Two 'alves of coconut!
09:22 AM on 09/21/2012
Maybe we're going about this education-thing all wrong. It's said that they, whoever they are, can measure electrical activity within the brain. So, if you've got electricity here, and the ability to induce an electrical current externally, as with magnets, what you REALLY need to to to get that data flowing, is figure out amplitude, and frequency, and how to put the focus on the right part of the brian, and start the download. After that, education can take like, an hour, it'll be an outpatient procedure, 2 weeks recovery time, the whole thing will be a lot cheaper, and more effective. Never say never, it could happen.
08:00 AM on 09/21/2012
Here is the deal. You have to do your homework. You need to know what you want to do and go looking. Look to see if the school is accredited by one of the regional accreditation agencies. If it is not, then walk away. If there is then you have a pretty good chance of not getting ripped off.

As an adult learner, I have not found a not-for-profit, i.e. state run school, that could offer me a chance to get a higher degree without having to move or travel a ridiculous amount of miles per week. This is the 21st century. There is very little need to jump in a car and drive 40 miles to get to a school when you can get everything you need online. Before the education establishment gets into a tizzy here let me explain that I have taken classes in just about every format that exists. My first degree was at a brick-and-mortar. My second was through an online school. There was more interaction (that was on topic) at the online school then there was at the old-fashioned brick-and-mortar. The work was harder and unlike the traditional setting there was no place to hide online. It is time for the traditional "non-profits" to wake up and get back into the business of teaching people, because in today's world many of us will need higher education well beyond our early to mid 20s.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
mass maritimer
The cake is a lie
03:07 AM on 09/22/2012
I suspect this is a plant.....
07:48 PM on 09/22/2012
You suspect wrong.
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thereisonlyoneparty
more amazing than you
03:26 AM on 09/21/2012
For profit colleges are not necessarily a bad investment. It is likely a problem of the people utilizing their services. For profit colleges offer opportunities that normal schools do not. Real schools are offering more online courses, but the availability is nowhere near that of the for profit schools.

Value is an odd thing to look at when it comes to schools. The problem is that value is never actually considered for any school. Students accept exaggerations of value because everyone "knows" that they true. High school students do not seek college because it is a good investment. They do it because they are told that they need it and that it will be a really good time. Student life--essentially sex, partying, and drinking--is a major component of college life and how universities are sold. A new student union and recreation center is more important to most perspective students than advanced laboratories and internationally known faculty.

The real failure for all schools is that they do not have to be good businesses. Students do not car about job placement rates. Most do not consider them. Student do not care about the strength of their program either. That does not matter. Why should it? They are not paying. Their education is either financed through loans or by their parents. They are putting up nothing. Schools can charge anything without having to worry about finding students. They money is always going to be there.
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Zilo
Indie--The GOP opposes critical thinking
06:06 AM on 09/21/2012
No, they're usually scams. Their degrees are virtually useless in the real world. And most of the time the education they give you is inferior.
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Mike HeXt
Common sense: a free service I offer
11:11 AM on 09/21/2012
Bull. I went to *2* for-profit colleges. Their only motivation and goal is to extract government money. I was given the WRONG DEGREE by one of them. They both lied about job placement and used the same tactics found by the GAO.
07:49 PM on 09/22/2012
Were either of them accredited by one of the regional bodies?
10:14 PM on 09/20/2012
Anyone who goes to one of these needs their head examined. Pure scams.
09:39 PM on 09/20/2012
I have gone to for-profit and not-for-profit colleges. I noticed that the for-profits will let just about anyone into the school, accept transfer credits that shouldn't be due to how long ago they were taken or the poor grades earned, and their quality of education is much worse. While going to a for-profit school, I felt like I needed to get an "A" to have an equal understanding of the material as a "C" at a not-for-profit school. I also found "A's" a little too easy to earn. I was especially shocked at my poorly educated peers in teh classes and absolutely HATED the team environements. I went to school to earn my own grades, NOT earn the grades of everyone else on my acedemic "team". These classmates of mine would have NEVER been accepted into the public schools I have attended.As for the for-profit school, I never ever recommend it to anyone and discourage people from going. BTW, I've been to four different schools and have earned 310 credit hours. I also teach as a side-job.
08:56 PM on 09/20/2012
"Traditional higher ed is not doing enough to reach poor, minority, veteran, and other nontraditional students, and it's to the great shame of the American higher education system that this is the case."
The last time I checked, anyone can attend college and they have the same access to federal aid, scholarships and work study programs. I'm sick of hearing the "it's the establishment" excuse, when it's really the individual that's the problem. And how is a poor or minority person a "nontraditional" student? There is absolutely nothing stopping someone who has the will and the determination to get an education. The only thing stopping them is themselves.
08:45 PM on 09/20/2012
I have worked in for Profit educaton for years. Take you average Univ of XXXX, their graudation rate is about 43%. When the 43% graduate, the university takes stheir money and sends them, immediatley, a request for Alumni funds. They do not try to get the average student graduate a job. Its a handshake and see ya later! When the For Profit School has a class, at least 75% OF THAT class must graduate, or the school is shut down. Out of that 75%, at least 80% have to be employed within 90 days. Its the facts....................How many Mich State students actuallly work??????
01:27 AM on 09/21/2012
Private sector service delivery is always more efficient and effective.
Only those personally invested in the public education bureaucracy could want to justify government provided education as a competitive offering.
Private education responds to their true customers, the kids and their parents.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Zilo
Indie--The GOP opposes critical thinking
06:13 AM on 09/21/2012
And yet charter schools do just about as bad as public schools where I live (in a Republican state). The Republican teachers in the public schools are no better (meaning they sit and read the news while the students fill out work sheets. This is when they're not ranting about how incompetent Obama is to 6th graders).

Republican-owned businesses are just as apathetic towards people as the state-run services as well, I've noticed.

I think you guys live in fantasy world where you only see the confirmation you want to see.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Zilo
Indie--The GOP opposes critical thinking
06:10 AM on 09/21/2012
Lol I don't believe that at all. For profit schools have pretty bad drop out rates. Because people realize most of them are scams like halfway through.
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booksnmoreforyou
Progressive educator, activist for good government
08:06 PM on 09/20/2012
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/06/26/1103368/-The-One-Comic-That-Explains-Just-How-Screwed-America-Is is a comic the best summarizes how awful for-profit schools are for the country. MUST SEE!
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
jwilson1
07:41 PM on 09/20/2012
OK For Profit colleges for Profit for John Boehner and Goldman Sacks.

Nov 2006 John Boehner deregulated Por Profit colleges and one month later Goldman Sacks bought controlling interest in the second biggest For Profit College. They fired all the sales staff and put in high pressure guys and they committed fraud by promising guaranteed job placement among other lies.
You see back then in order to be a accredited FPC and be able to get your student loans you had to have a 65% placement rate that did not happen and now even you don't to have that either! Goldman and their FPC drove sales from 1 billion to 5 billion in 6 years truly making it a FPC for Goldman. Oh did I tell you John got a graet campaign contribution from Goldamn Sacks and he even invested in the stock making more. This is the type of corruption that runs Washington. Vote him out please he is a thief.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Mike HeXt
Common sense: a free service I offer
11:15 AM on 09/21/2012
Goldman Sachs owns 43% of EDMC who owns the Art Institutes