The MoveOn Dust-Up, the GOP's Self-Righteous Indignation, and Winning the White House
"How many times do we charge up the hill and run straight into enemy fire before we figure this shit out?"
I remember an angry Republican asking that question to no one in particular in a crowded GOP conference. The government was shut down, the public was testy and Bill Clinton was once again pounding a GOP Congress more interested in ideological purity than practical results.
This week's Moveon.org dust-up reminded me of that time when we Republicans led with our hearts and got pounded in our faces. We loved bathing in self-righteous indignation. Our base loved it too. But the practical results were always the same: we scared little children, household pets and crossover voters. It was a really great way to alienate the voters we needed the most.
Whoever dreamed up the ad questioning the loyalty of Iraq's top soldier would have fit in great with those of us who drove the political agenda in 1995 -- and guaranteed Bill Clinton's re-election in 1996. While I'm sure Move On's ad locked down the base in Manhattan and Madison, Democrats need to be more concerned with wooing voters in Tampa and Toledo.
I know this post will generate nasty emails. Every time I dare to tell Democrats how they can avoid the mistakes we Republicans made in the past, I am told to mind my own business. To those who are so offended, my apologies. Go ahead and spend the next year kicking around Generals and God. While you're at it, attack the Boy Scouts and burn a few flags for the hell of it.
You're right. Great election strategy. What was I thinking?
But for those who who actually want to win the White House in 2008, call your friends in liberal organizations and tell them to take a deep breath before they decide again to attack soldiers in a war zone.
Come on. This really shouldn't be that hard. The White House is the Democrats' to lose.
The president and his war are overwhelmingly unpopular.
The social issues that used to pull conservatives to the polls (guns, gays and God) are now so overshadowed by Mr. Bush's war that a pro-choice, pro-gun control, pro-gay New York mayor is running away with the GOP primary.
Add in the fact that Republican senators are getting caught in bathroom stalls and whorehouses and one wonders what the Democrats could possibly do to give George Bush the upper hand with swing voters.
Oh yeah. They could attack a highly decorated general.
Ugh. It's deja vu all over again.
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Come on MoveOn post another ad that pisses the RepubliCONS off. Let them pass another one of their silly resolutions.
Every time they pass one of their dumb ass resolutions condemning MoveOn it just increases the donations to MoveOn.
Lol, the RepubliCONS are daily increasing donations to an organization they hate.
JOHN EDWARDS IN '08
When Admiral Fallon, CENTCOM chief, met Petraeus, he called him, to his face, an "ass-kissing little chickenshit" and added "I hate people like that."
I guess the senate should censure Fallon.
Very well put!
I disagree with you, Joe, as I almost always do. I refuse to watch you on TV anymore.
The ad served to notify people to beware of the hype and to listen carefully to what the General was saying, and to question his motivation.
The hoopla surrounding the ad is helping, not hurting, moveon. Those who express outrage are laughable. The more the right complains about it, the more free publicity for moveon. Go guys! Great ad!
Joe, you can compare the self-righteous indignation of a costly investigation into Clinton's sex life to Congress' self-righteous condemnation of truth if it's spoken about a soldier. But not to the ad that spoke the truth. Thanks for your concern, though.
You've inspired me to donate to MoveOn. I can't count on even a Democratic Congress to spread the truth, much less Republicans' "hearts" (who knew they had one?!) so I might as well support those who will.
I just ask myself, "Do I value advice or analysis from someone who voted for George Bush TWICE?" Ummm... no.
Divided we fall. The war in Iraq is lost because we are divided over it.
Thank you.
We lose.
The war in Iraq is lost because it was based on lies in the first place. This type of war can never be "won".
Absolutely correct, but so correct that too few will see, read, grasp, and heed. The greatest thing the GOP has going for it in '08 is................the Dems !!
They ---the Dems---just don't get it, have really never gotten it, and probably will never get it. I used to oppose term limits; but they're the only way to cleanse a political system that is 99% constipated.
Sadder but wiser in America & a " moderate"
"Oh yeah. They could attack a highly decorated general."
I am sure Hitler had highly decorated generals. This idea that the military is above criticism is obscene. You neo cons just don’t get it. Of course neither do the demos.
One more time. This war was started on lies and more lies. It is an illegal war what is so hard to understand about illegal. And one of those liars was a former decorated general. Vietnam was full of generals that lied during that other illegal war.
As far as attacking god I am sure god is worrying about being attacked.
In my mind god made neo cons first and then looked at its creation and said to itself: well that did not work those folks like killing one another and they put profits over the good of their brothers and sisters. So god made liberals to balance it out so liberals think they can solve all the problems in the world by talking and spending others money to fix social problems.
Thank you moveon.org for having the courage to do this. The demos don’t have the courage to stand up to the alpha dog bush jr. can the demos lose in 2008? You bet if an anti war third party enters the picture. Would serve them right. Cowards.
The demo congress ratings are now at 11% and that seems high to me. Playing politics with this war by pretending to try and stop it by votes. Defund it period.
Blood on their hands just like bush and Cheney.
I like what "researcher" said above. "highly decorated general". We are so differential, reverential, submissive, impressed with and respectful of titles and uniforms. I usually am. I would like to be again. But this gang has done nothing to deserve this. You've got to earn respect, not just expect it to come with the office. It was, as a gushing rightwing radio host after the 2000 fiasco-called-an-election who described the Bush ascendancy "like a corporate takeover". Boy, he was SOOOO "right" and so correct! I really feel for people like Gen. Petraeus and those that came before them, whose careers are now tainted because of coming into contact with this CEO of the USA. I'd like to give him a break on this one for not knowing any better.
I'm an Indpendent, but quit voting for most Republicans after the party got hijacked by the Freedom Foundation years ago. Larry Falwell was the worst thing the Republicans ever embraced.
MoveOn's name calling was as massively stupid as anything Brother Jerry ever said. It is just as idiotic to shoot the messanger as it is to charge straight into the guns.
While Bush's ratings are low, Congress' ratings are even lower. Both parties better snap out of it. I wouldn't be at all surprised if a new Populist party arises and takes over- it's past due, and maybe this would put both the Big Boys back to respecting and opposing each other equally, like it should be.
I contributed to MoveOn. Again.
I am single, no kids.
Fearless.
I am not immortal, and have no desire to be so.
I am a happy person, but if I were allowed the pleasure of obliterating modern American Fascists; I would volunteer in a heartbeat.
These killer clowns, from bush on down, must be attended to.
Jargon, wristslaps, even prison will not do.
These monsters are beyond reform.
Hard to believe a catch like you is single.
Congressional Democrats in Washington couldn't care less about its constituency...they care only about not upsetting Republicans.
MoveOn.org speaks for its constituency.
Let your $$$$ do the talking, because these blogs, letters to the editors, e-mails and phone calls do nothing to get the Democrats to straighten up and fly right.
Forget the talk and send the $$$$ to MoveOn.org. Let the Democratic party know it!
I think most people understand the difference between a General and the troops... just like they understand the difference between a CEO and the workers.
I actually agree with you Joe. This may be the one and only time. The onus on this war belongs with Bush and Cheney. If the ad said "President Betray Us" with a picture of Bush, I'd have been ok with it.
Joe:
Now Come The Hell On Man, You Know You Did Not Believe This Dung Before Your Sit Down To Write It.
I Mean Get Real Here, The Attack Against The General Was Well Warrented And We Both Know It Will Not Have Any Affect On The 2008 Vote Casting, This Is Common Sense Man.
But I At Least Can Join You In Your Way Of Thinking Because I Too Am A Strong Republican, I Respect My Republican Base, But This Does Not Mean I Will Not Use The Better Judgement When Meaningful Issues Arrive No Matter What Base I Am. After All Isn't All About The Well Being Of American And Not About A Political Peronsonal Gain?
Oh And Before I Forget Due To You Truely Throwing Me Off By Writing This Bunch Of Dung In The First Place, I Just Want To Say We All Miss Scarborough Country.
Once the Chinese stop loaning us money, the huge American military is going to cease anyway, regardless of who wins the elections.
Scarborough is clearly posting flamebate - and I do not understand why Huffington allows him to troll here, particularly given his intolerance for MoveOn's free speech.
But there is some sort of a point involved here. Liberals should more actively seek non federal solutions to their problems either state and local or international and transnational. I predict that our current problems with the Democrats will continue regardless of what may or may not happen in 2008. And also, the Chinese really are going to cut off the funding - which means that the federal government is going to become a dead duck pretty soon anyhow.
"Once the Chinese stop loaning us money, the huge American military is going to cease anyway, regardless of who wins the elections."
100% correct, and what do you think would cause China to retaliate against us economically? Um, lets see ... perhaps an unprovoked attack on Iran? Far more likely than China getting upset about us criticizing their tainted products.
I hope the Bush Adminstration is considering the "China Blowback" as they draw up their illegal attack on Iran.
" the federal government is going to become a dead duck pretty soon"
MISSION ACCOMPLISHED said the Republican Party.
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