HuffPost Exclusive: My Interview with Naomi Klein

I sat down with Naomi Klein to talk about her new book, The Shock Doctrine: The Rise of Disaster Capitalism. This revelatory work belongs in that rarefied air with A People's History of the United States by Howard Zinn and Witness to a Century by George Seldes.

Videography by HMS Media.



Here is some of the advance praise Naomi and The Shock Doctrine:

"Naomi Klein is an investigative reporter like no other. She roams the continents with eyes wide open and her brain operating at full speed, finding connections we never thought of, and patterns which eluded us. She shows us, in clear and elegant language, how catastrophes -- natural ones like Katrina, unnatural ones like war -- become opportunities for a savage capitalism, calling itself 'the free market,' to privatize everything in sight, bringing huge profits to some, misery for others. To ensure the safety of such a system, it becomes necessary to constrict freedom, to assault human rights. The torture chambers for some then match the torturing of the larger society. This is a brilliant book, one of the most important I have read in a long time." -- Howard Zinn, author of A People's History of the United States.

"Naomi Klein is one of the most important new voices in American journalism today, as this book make clear. She has turned globalism inside out, and in so doing given all of us a new way of looking at our seemingly unending disaster in Iraq, and a new way of understanding why we got there. And she does it in a lucid, reader-friendly style that almost makes it fun to read." -- Seymour Hersh, Pulitzer prize winning investigative journalist

"Naomi Klein has written a brilliant, brave and terrifying book. It's nothing less than the secret history of what we call the 'Free Market..' It should be compulsory reading." -- Arundhati Roy, author of The God of Small Things

And this was my take on the book:

"This masterful book is a measured but furious call to arms. Naomi Klein is Antigone before the King, the antidote to the feeling of inevitability that says that we must accept murder as a legitimate economic policy. She has the audacity and the courage to chronicle the human costs of an ideology in which worshiping the markets is not enough; you must actually kill to feed them. Klein is the vanguard, the fire, the resistance and she challenges us not to join the suicide club that enables corporate cannibalism. A spectacular triumph."

So, what to do? Arundhati Roy points us home:

"Our strategy should be not only to confront empire, but to lay siege to it. To deprive it of oxygen. To shame it. To mock it. With our art, our music, our literature, our stubbornness, our joy, our brilliance, our sheer relentlessness - and our ability to tell our own stories. Stories that are different from the ones we're being brainwashed to believe. The corporate revolution will collapse if we refuse to buy what they are selling - their ideas, their version of history, their wars, their weapons, their notion of inevitability. Remember this: We be many and they be few. They need us more than we need them."

To read Arianna's take on Naomi's book, click here.

To see an exclusive clip from my upcoming film, War Inc., click here

To see the trailer for War Inc, click here.

Comments

[BTN]

Name one thing the government can do better than the private sector.
Name one.

You can't.

Government (by definition) is destined for waste, inefficiency, fraud and abuse.

Who in their right mind would want the government to be in charge of things and to help people?

These are the people that brought us FEMA, Amtrak, bankrupt Social Security, the DMV, etc.

[Katboy]

Health.
Education.
Infrastructure.
Public transportation.
Law enforcement.

There. We can.
There's a long list of other things, if you'd like.

There are many vital services whose function is NOT to generate profit. That may be hard to understand in the land of Freebase Capitalism, but it's undeniably true. No sane country wants private interests profiting from its most basic or important infrastructure.

We may be able to agree that the these fundamental building blocks of society are appallingly done in the US (whether private or public), but in most other industrialised nations, the state takes care of these things and does a damn good job.

Your problem is that you live in a country where the ruling class seems hellbent on convincing the people that democracy and government by consensus are useless and flawed.

[ZingoBonMot]

Interesting. Pull up BTN's Profile and scroll down.
If the company is paying him by the piece, they're getting ripped off.

[racetoinfinity]

Government under people like Bushco who WANT it to fail, "to drown in the bathtub" arch-right winger Grover Norquist famously said.

For fraud and abuse, in the U.S. and W. Europe, nothing beats big multi-national corporations. You must be blind.

[ZingoBonMot]

B T N ZZZZZZZZZZ­ZZZZZZZZZZ­ZZZZZZZZZZ­ZZZZZZ

[Tiberon]

One of the few things I remember from reading Gone With the Wind many years ago is disaster capitalist Rhett Butler explaining that, while there is plenty of money to be made building up a civilization, it pales in comparison to how much can be made off the destruction of one.

Yup.

[vzn]

some misc links on the subj of "disaster capitalism" others may find useful

"fractional reserve banking as economic
parasitism" .. on "economic warfare" etc
http://econpapers.repec.org/paper/wpawuwpma/0203005.htm

The Shock Doctrine: Naomi Klein on the Rise of Disaster Capitalism
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=07/09/17/1411235

Confessions of an Economic Hit Man: How the U.S. Uses Globalization to Cheat Poor Countries Out of Trillions
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/11/09/1526251

John Perkins on "The Secret History of the American Empire: Economic Hit Men, Jackals, and the Truth about Global Corruption"
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=07/06/05/149254

Video, senator/pres candidate Dennis Kucinich
at last years 2005 Monetary Reform Conference
http://www.monetary.org/video/kucinich/win_broadband.wmv

Money as Debt, video by Grignon
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279

[racetoinfinity]

The book - "The Global Class War" by Jeff Faux -

http://www.amazon.com/Global-Class-War-Americas-Bipartisan/dp/0470098287/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-2314266-5968009?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1190975769&sr=1-1

[bluescat47]

What a broad, sweeping, and ultimately unsatisfactory narrative. There is little substance here, to say the least. The past 10 years have been one of the largest economic growth periods (especially in the 3rd world) in world history. Hundreds of millions of people have been brought out of poverty. The reason? The decline of statist policies, which reward often corrupt bureaucrats (in China, India) and the opening of economies to global investment and trade. Klein is about 20 years too late in her thinking; statism failed, just look at Great Britain now and prior to Margaret Thatcher. We need a large social welfare net, trade adjustment assistance for workers, etc to compensate the losers from free markets,on that I would agree with Klein. Also, the "savage capitalism" that some French criticize- guess what, their system doesnt work. Sarkozy is trying to free up labor markets so that workers can work more than 35 hours a week if they choose. France was 7th in the world economically 20 years ago, and 17th today, and falling. If you dont have relatively free markets, you will end up with an economy like Russia's.

[Issak]

Does not seem like you bothered to read the book- the basic point has gone over your head. Your Reagan pink glasses don't really help anybody see the world.

Did you even hear what Milton Friedman's last piece of advice was before he -thankfully-left the planet? no?

Here's the deal, we don't really have "free" markets, we could start with the criminal enterprise that is the Fed.

BTW Sarkorzy is another clueless dolt infecting the treupossibilities of the 3rd millennium.

[BTN]

Honest and brilliant and very true.
Common sense comments like that prove you have no future on this site.

[WorkingClass]

I have learned a lot from this discussion. Thanks John and Naomi and Arianna. Thanks also everyone on the thread. I will read the book and stay tuned.

[2Truthy]

Excellent interview, John.

Thank you Naomi Klein for having the guts to assert this brilliant thesis, which hopefully will inspire Democrats to unite against these Disaster Capitalists who are waging war on the middle class by selling out our jobs and infrastructures for personal profit.

http://tootruthy.blogspot.com/2007/09/shock-doctrine-rise-of-disaster.html

[chazaroo]

I consistently refer to the neo-cons as fascists, and some posters thought I was being extreme. Any further questions? I have one. Can anyone, or any movement turn our country back into America?

[KosmicKat]

Yes, we can stop big business excesses by a national strike. Nobody shops, nobody stops for gasoline. The big business bastards who want to turn the world into a shopping mall full of trash would take notice.

[Tiggy]

I seem to recall; years back, when airline workers where driven to the brinks of a strike, the government intervened. Sadly, the government is not going to allow the will of the people to stop the cash cow, even if for a day. As to the gas prices, several hurricanes back gas prices went up in the event the offshore oil facilities received damage. Wonder why the prices did not go back down after the storm blew over without damage to the facility? What is more alarming is the congressional hearings regarding the increases in profits for the gas and oil companies without a resolution. Must be that capitalistic society we live in.

[ContraEgoiste]

None of this will make any difference if John Q Public doesn't know, and John Q is pretty disengaged. This is a subject that the masses MUST be made aware of.


OK boys and girls, time to put your money where your mouth is. Time for action.

Email-it to everyone you know and push for it to be aired.

But be polite and professional.


NYT:
TO WRITE THE PUBLISHER OR PRESIDENT
Arthur Sulzberger Jr., Chairman & Publisher: nytimes.comytimes.com.
Scott H. Heekin-Canedy, President, General Manager: nytimes.comytimes.com.
NEWS DEPARTMENT: nytimes.comimes.com or leave a message at 1-888-NYT-NEWS.
The Editors
[e-mail]
[e-mail]


=== ABC:
http://abc.go.com/site/contactus.html
For ABCNews.com - http://abcnews.go.com/Reference/story?id=54216
For ThisWeek - http://abcnews.go.com/ThisWeek/story?id=64596


=== MSNBC:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10285339/


=== NBC:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10285339/
http://www.nbc.com/Footer/Contact_Us/

NBC News - http://www.msnbc.com/news/435157.asp
NBC News
30 Rockefeller Plaza, New York, N.Y. 10112

Meet the Press: nbc.com.com
Weekend Today: nbc.comcom
Dateline: [e-mail]
Today: nbc.combc.com
Nightly News: [e-mail]


=== CBS:
Feedback:
http://www.cbs.com/info/user_services/fb_global_form.shtml

CBS News.com
http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/feedback/fb_news_form.shtml

Face the Nation: cbsnews.com.com
Face The Nation with Bob Schieffer
2020 M Street NW, Washington, DC 20036
[phone]

CBS news investigates: [e-mail]

Evening News: cbsnews.comnews.com PHONE: [phone]

Weekend edition: cbsnews.comnews.com PHONE: [phone]

CBS News Main Number: [phone]
555 West 57th Street, New York, NY 10019

CBS Television Network Main: [phone]
51 West 52nd Street, New York, NY 10019

more - http://www.cbscorporation.com/contact_info/index.php


=== CNN:
http://www.cnn.com/feedback/

Time Warner Company:
http://www.timewarner.com/corp/contacts_support.html
Time Warner News Room:
http://www.timewarner.com/corp/newsroom/contacts_resources.html

[ContraEgoiste]

.
This is system that they have worked on for the last 40-50 years in various countries in South America. And now that they have just about got it down perfect, they plan to install it everywhere else, including their own citizens here on the US (or I should say; especially here in the US). And just like it operates there, a faux Democracy that hides a well established plutocracy, there will be a slowly but steadily transformation to this here. They will create a sedated and apathetic populace that will see no choice but to accept the status quo.

Yes, there will be some individuals who will at first protest and cry out and write about it, etc, but just as with the Patriot Act, Spying, Habeas Corpus, Freedom of Assembly, etc, etc, people will become increasingly accepting of it and continue to believe that it is out of their hands and there is nothing they can do about it.

I'm writing this because, unless we stop it NOW, it becomes exponentially harder to stop it later and almost impossible to reverse it!

Any one who has traveled to some of these countries will casually notice the VAST gulf between the haves and haves-not. The feverish adherence to religion and a blind acceptance of their lot.

It wasn't so at the beginning, and to say that any uprising was brutally put down is an understatement. They would find the most heinous and savage method, so as to make an example of the individual or individuals opposing this, and do it in the guise of containing "Communism". A handy label that can be easily applied to any movement that attempts to gain a equal footing for the population. And had it existed then, they would have used it to label the founding fathers when they said "All men are created equal".

So for those who say "there is nothing we can do about it", or are ready to give up the fight, DON'T!! This is the world your children and grandchildren will live on.
.

[ContraEgoiste]

Disclaimer:

No, I'm not a communist nor believe in it, I find it to be the opposite side of the same coin. And yes I'm aware there is a vast difference between Marxism and Communism, but still believe that Marx's ideas are not feasible due to human character (perhaps a few more thousand years of evolution…) as others here have pointed out.

I am a Socialist, by my definition of it. Which is: The advancement, enlightenment and further evolution of ALL society/humanity and the basic tenets of Democracy and equality as outlined by the founders. I'm opposed to a world of a own-all ruling class and have-nots unaware drones.

I'm however concerned that "Communism" will be how the people who oppose the "New World Order" will be attacked, and how the uneducated half will be scared and made to conform and turned against those seeking a better world. In the same vein that "terrorism" is now used.

[outnow]

You have to know it before you can change it. The United States was warned by Eisenhower that the MIC didn't have our best interests at heart. War after war has been brought to us by Walt Rostows in Vietnam and Wolfowitz in Iraq.

The oil will pay for the war, said Wolfowitz; they will teat us as liberators, said Rumfeld, a cakewalk, etc., etc. Funny how the Yellow Cake documents allegedly showing that Saddam was at the nuclear supermarket were used at the United Nations while the shrub's service records were "forgeries­."

Look what happened to Joe Wilson and Valerie Plame and Dan Rather - they were all Swift-boated. Look what happened to Daniel Ellsberg when he released the Pentagon Papers. The Gulf of Tonkin had been manufactured to start a huge war that killed over 67,000 United States citizens.

It's easier to stop organized crime than it is to stand up to your own government. Let's take the profit out of war and collect the peace dividend, Support the Abercrombie Bill making waste, fraud and abuse of our tax dollars in a war zone a crime punishable in the United States with civil damages.

The biggest "insurgency" in Iraq is the corruption. The paper trail begins here and crosses the oceans and surrounds the entire planet. It's called globalization and the GWOT.

[rbspickles]

I've read pieces of this book. Good stuff. I hope it doesn't fall on deaf/blind ears/eyes.

And John, still cute as ever ;)

[outnow]

Naomi is absolutely brilliant. You also have to understand that economic theory is what the right wing uses to keep making money using fear to rev up the MIC.

Read Chalmers Johnson, Noam Chomsky and John W. Dean. Study Where the Right Went wrong by Patrick Buchanan, even.

You will never vote for a DLC candidate again. John Edwards or Dennis Kucinich are our new leaders.

Edwards used his skills and won the debate. He has the debate skills and the experience in taking on the monied interests that the Clintons represent.

How can the federal government be a hollow shell when it runs the New World Order envisioned by PNAC and the neocons? The answer is to privatize by following the Milton Friedman "school."

This is class-warfare. There some will be the extremely rich and the serfs and peasants. This is the goal of breaking the middle class. What better way than permanent war to suspend civil rights and shift wealth upwards to the richest 1/10th of one-percent.

The Federal Reserve Board was set up by Rockefeller shock therapy. It is a private group that controls your money supply by printing it and loaning money to the government.

[krissymax]

Excellent interview. Simply put George W. Bush and Dick Cheney's greatest fear is Peace. I will definately buy this book. I noticed that NPR's report revealed that Blackwater's CEO is a conservative evangelical Christian whose income is dependent upon this sick endless war on terror. Thank you for your insights!

[Moshe]

Fantastic interview John, and fantastic book Naomi.

Fundamentalists and ideologues of all stripes are to be feared because of their propensity to use manipulation, coercion, and violent force to hammer reality into the ill-fitted shape of their ideals.

Far too often, human history has been a repeatitive series of extremist actions and reactions leaving a bloody wake of human suffering at each turn.

Naomi wisely points out that the best tool we have to arm ourselves against these shocks and the often even worse "solutions" is educating ourselves about human nature and history.

Forewarned truly is forearmed.

Thank you John and Naomi.

The great thing about being human is that we are capable of becoming something better than we are now. The tragedy of human history is that we have so often failed to realize our true potential.

The future doesn't have to be a repeat of the past, unless we allow it to be so.

Shalom to all.

[WorkingClass]

Hey Moshe. Knowing the truth is only the prerequisite for effective action. Actually resting power from the global monopolists will require years of blood sweat and tears.

Shalom back at ya.