In response to my post "'It's no sin to be gay.' See how easy that is, Andrew Marin?" folks have made the point that Andrew's work is valuable, because he is "building bridges" -- because he is, as one reader put it, "creating stepping stones from one end of the spectrum to the other." They appreciate Marin establishing a neutral, non-judgmental, values-free middle ground where parties on either side of the gay-Christian debate can meet to together discuss and explore the issue.
And I'll be the first to admit that sounds great.
The problem, though, is that when it comes to the issue of LGBT equality, there is no such thing as a values-free middle ground. There can't be, because that is a moral issue. And that means it's about a very definite right and wrong.
And it's a moral issue of no small consequence. There couldn't possibly be more at stake. The people on one side of this debate -- the majority, which wields all the power -- are claiming that, in the eyes of God, those on the other side are less than human.
Whoosh. Good-bye middle ground. On a matter of such magnitude -- not to mention such immediacy -- morality of consciousness demands, at the very least, choosing a side.
No matter how strenuously he or she might deny it, the fact is that any Christian who does not forthrightly and unambiguously assert that there is nothing whatsoever inherently immoral about same-sex relationships has chosen a side in this conflict. To a starving man, the person who can't decide if they want to share their food is no better than the person who refuses to.
I'm all for conversations that are about exploring critical moral issues. And of course I in every last way encourage people on opposite sides of this issue to reach out to one another; it feels like about a fourth of my life is spent carefully and thoughtfully engaging with Christians whose theology is different from mine. (For over four years I've blogged on ultra-conservative Crosswalk.com, for goodness' sake.) But in order for such conversations to be of any genuine value, they must be intentional. They must explicitly have resolution as their purpose. A bridge that goes nowhere or stepping stones that quickly circle back to their starting point are useless.
When it comes to weighty moral issues, there's nothing wrong with traveling across the middle ground. But it's at best folly and at worse a harmful lie to maintain that it's morally feasible to remain in that middle ground. No one wanders the desert forever.
It's true that on the issue of LGBT and Christian relations I am impatient. But I'm impatient for a good reason. Christian leaders on the right do not hesitate to loudly and boldly claim their moral certitude. From the left-hand channel of that stereo, though, we too rarely hear anything but silence, or the static that almost sounds like words or music, but isn't. It's time to dial that station in, hit the button from "mono" to "stereo," turn up the volume, and start broadcasting the message that it's perfectly okay to be gay.
Christian leaders who persist in doing nothing more than "elevating the conversation" succeed in doing nothing more than alleviating the pangs of conscience that Christians on the right should be encouraged to feel for clinging to their convictions that same-sex relationships are an abomination before God. Instead of evading their moral responsibility, they need to once and for all, forthrightly and unequivocally, proclaim their full and unconditional acceptance of same-sex relationships. They need to do that for the sake of gay people, and for the sake of the millions who have lost their faith in God because they cannot reconcile the gross disparity between a clear moral precept and the only thing they ever hear Christian leaders say.
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Almost all Christians believe a personal choice was made, and not that people were born this way. Born this way implies the "hand of God," choice implies that "you did this to yourself." People MUST be challenged on their denial of the overwheming amount of scientific data available. Only then will the morality arguement be met on an appropriate footing.
Google all of the churches that support GLBT (gaychurch.org). I am a member of one. Every one of these comments is anti Christian and John Shore I am calling you out for not being more of an aware adult and for pointing a finger in such a general direction. To honestly say all Christians are anti gay is like saying all Arabs are Muslim. If you have a problem with the Christians that don't believe LGBT is more than a life style choice then sound off with A/THE NAME and go from there. Don't condemn all Christians especially those you did not mention that support GLBT or Gays who are Christians.
Perhaps your faux pas here could be used as a teaching moment about how anyone should carefully read articles (just like scripture) to make sure one discerns the true meaning.
Well, I'm hoping so anyway. :-)
The issue is equal rights in a civil society. We are not free to discriminate without any rational basis. Scripture written a century after Jesus, in many languages, which has been translated many times by patriarchs, with disputed books and versions running around, with many internal contradictions are not a rational basis in a non theocracy.
Of course the people we're speaking of do think the US is a theocracy. It will take some time to disabuse them of this notion, as in making sure secular employees have every right to demand birth control coverage in their workplace health insurance plan.
I am not sanguine about it, but I'd be happy to be wrong.
Meanwhile, what we should be most concerned about is changing our laws to reflect the modern, and more enlightened attitudes towards LGTB folks that are increasingly the norm in the western world.
If people want to hold onto their crazy, barbaric religious ideas, ultimately that's their business. Just don't tread on me, or anyone else either.
I wonder if there's any way to legislate them so they'll just have to shut up... without infringing on their freedom of speech, of course. :-)
It just becomes that much more important for the rest of us to deconstruct what fools say, so it doesn't become the law of the land.
but in the end it leads to death."
In summary, if biblical scholars disagree over the meaning of scriptures written in ancient greek and hebrew (with historical and cultural context being key and the fact that the meaning of words change over time), how can you be so absolute with your current english translation when Mr. Shore has clearly shown in his writings there are valid and logical reasons to not be? Are you substituting your own prejudice for what you think God wants?
Consider this statement I read somewhere once: "We have sufficiently created God in our image when He hates the same people we do."
And you know what? I respect that, they can believe and interpret whatever they want but at the same time I ask for the same respect. Outside the church: constitution rules, human rights rule, free will rules.
They have "warned" us, we heard them. Hell is our destiny according to their teachings. Now step aside and let ME manage my relationship with God. Step aside and let the countries offer human rights for all AND let each one of us decide if we marry or not, if we engage in a "sinful" (for them) relationship or not.
I guess, it is so simple that it would be boring. Then they would have to practice the Golden Rule, and that's too much work and doesn't pay as much...
Lastly, a true "Christian" would accept with blind faith that anyone who says that they were made by God this way, would not be lying about it, for any reason, and they can accept that on faith.
How is there, in holier than thou-ville?
From a gay perspective, the only emotion I am capable of mustering toward christians these days is pity.
You spelled prejudice wrong.
Most of the support for civil equality for GLBTQ people in the U.S. is from Christians. Not all of the opposition to civil equality for GLBTQ people in the U.S. comes from Christians - there are plenty of atheists and agnostics who are openly homophobic, and even more who promote anti-gay theology, endangering the lives of GLBTQ people, to press their war on Christians.
I never see any support from Christians. Any. Ever. Where is this support for civil equality? You can't just claim it to be there and there it is.
It's quite possible that there is some quiet support. But that frankly isn't working.
The whole name of Christianity has been truly hijacked. We're waiting for the normal Christians to take it back. And it looks like they aren't up for it.
So by 2020, I bet, Christianity in the US will be synonymous with anti-gay, anti-women's rights, anti-science, anti-tax, anti-secular education, and anti-Islam. And it will mean nothing else.
Anytime in my life that I have experienced abuse, it has been at the hands of a heterosexual christian. Every. Single. Time.
Your post makes me feel nauseous. It should make you feel that way, too.