The following piece was produced by Huffington Post's OffTheBus.
Has George Bush ever been to a bar mitzvah or eaten a blintz? Rudy Giuliani has -- dozens of times. The Bush family has been never been very popular with Jews, but Giuliani won a big majority of the Jewish vote in the world's biggest Jewish city both times he ran for mayor. He's the Republican front runner; if he wins the nomination, could the Republican relationship to Jewish voters be transformed? That question lurked in the background when Giuliani and other GOP candidates spoke earlier this week in Washington at a forum sponsored by the Republican Jewish Coalition.
The traditional Republican stance was expressed eloquently back in 1992, when James Baker, at the time Secretary of State to President George H. W. Bush, said "[Expletive] the Jews. They didn't vote for us anyway."
Baker had his facts right: Bush Senior got only 11 per cent of the Jewish vote that year. Bill Clinton got about 80 per cent of the Jewish vote in both 1992 and 1996. Al Gore got the same in 2000. Even John Kerry got 76 of the Jewish vote in 2004.
But could that pattern change if Giuliani is the candidate in 2008? He got two-thirds of the Jewish vote in New York City when he ran against Democrat David Dinkins. He got three-quarters of the Jewish vote when he ran for reelection against Ruth Messinger, herself Jewish.
The Bush family was always more pro-Arab, especially pro-Saudi, than they were pro-Israel. Back in 1992, Baker was arguing for a tougher policy with Israel, pressing them to settle with the Palestinians. He reiterated that position last year in the Baker-Hamilton report, also known as the Iraq Study Group report, which argued we could weaken the appeal of Islamic terrorism by creating a viable Palestinian state, returning the Golan Heights to Syria, and negotiating with Iran.
Rudy is emphatically not that kind of Republican. He made that perfectly clear in his pitch at the Republican Jewish Coalition. As Maureen Dowd reported in the New York Times, he reminded listeners that he refused to accept a $10 million check for 9/11 families from the Saudi prince who urged America to "adopt a more balanced stance toward the Palestinian cause." He reminded listeners that he threw Yasser Arafat out of a Lincoln Center concert held in celebration of the 50th anniversary of the founding of the United Nations.
Giuliani's pitch to Jews is all about Israel. "If I'm president," he said this week, "I'm not going to let any man destroy Israel" -- just in case you were wondering about that. He draws an analogy between the situation in Iraq and Gaza: if we pull out of Iraq, he says, Iraq will end up looking like Gaza after the Israelis pulled out. It will become another base for terrorists -- but one that is much bigger. And, of course, he talks about Hitler: "If Europe had confronted Hitler at an earlier stage," he said, "there would have been millions and millions of lives saved." That's why he would refuse to negotiate with today's Hitler, located in Iran.
Nevertheless it's unlikely that any Republican candidate, even Giuliani, will win Jewish votes away from the Democrats because of their positions on Israel. First of all, the Democratic candidate will be 100 per cent "pro-Israel" (meaning they support the parties on the Israeli right).
Secondly, only a handful of Jews vote on the basis of the candidates' "support for Israel." "Jewish voters look like other voters with high levels of education," says Ira Foreman, co-editor of Jews in American Politics, writing in the Israeli daily Haaretz. The main difference is that they are more liberal: "Jews place more emphasis on civil liberties than their non-Jewish counterparts. Jews support abortion rights at higher levels than other Americans. Jews support the concept of separation of church and state. Jews support gay marriage and civil unions at higher levels than non-Jews."
Finally, when Giuliani won those Jewish majorities in New York City, the city was in a steep economic decline, the South Bronx was burning, the crack epidemic seemed unstoppable. Rudy's tough-guy stance worked in that context, but the country has different concerns today. In 2008, the great majority of Jews once again will vote for the Democrat, even if the Republican is Rudy.
As for Rudy. He had several things in his favor not mentioned in the article. First he ran as a pro-choice, pro gay rights, pro gun control candidate on the Republican AND LIBERAL lines. Second, his competition was lousy: first, a mayor who, while well-intentioned, had a record that was far from stellar and second, a woman who was stridently left of liberal and hardly popular. You could say that NYC Democrats were the architects of their own failure, which is how we've now ended up with ANOTHER two-term "liberal" Republican mayor.
Israel can take care of Iran, us meddling in the middle east only destablalizes it, makes Israel less safe. Ron Pauls foreign policy is good for Israel and for America. It is such a shame that the RNC set up taking away NH & SC delegates where RP is a shoe in to win. He's won the straw polls in most of the states who's delegates are being cut.
Now Turkey will invade Iraq with weapons WE GAVE THEM FOR FREE! Ron PAul said on the floor of the house in 1982 When we gave UAE and Turkey weapons that it was a bad Idea and they would some day be used against our interest. That is happening today. It is likely that if Armageddon did break out that Americans would be killed with American guns and Bombs that our govt gave away.
Photo album of women and children killed today in Iraq in a raid on "criminals". http://www.uruknet.info/?=m37424&hd=&size=1&l=e
There are more Taliban than when we started this war. If I was an Afghan I'd join the Taliban. Bush expands the war on drugs over there instead of buying their crops for medicine as their is a world shortage as Afghan farmers had hoped.
It is the Evangelicals (i'm one and not popular right now, in fact i get looks for supporting Ron Paul) The truth is Israel probably wishes the Israel "lobby" would go away as they cause big problems for Israel. They want Armagedon.
Iran is 2-8 years from a Nuclear bomb they know if they ever launch one their entire country would be anhililated.
Dennis Kucinich is the liberal candidate. I strongly urge all Democrats to support his candidacy.
When I first heard he was doing so well among Republicans, I looked the guy up. Don't worry, I'm not "fooled."
I won't be supporting Kucinich either, sorry. He has other deficits, imo, which I won't be going into here.
The last time I was enthusiastic about the candidate was in 2000, when I voted for Al Gore, who I'd also voted for in the NY Primary in 1988, which he lost to Dukakis. How did tht turn out, by the way?
I haven't decided who I'm voting for in the primary, but I expect that I'm going to end up voting for Hillary. Kucinich doesn't stand a chance. This would be like voting for Nader, even if I liked him, which I don't.
First of all, I emphatically disagree with you. And second, just who do you think the "pro-Israel" lobby is? Those calling themselves pro-Israel can be evangelicals, true, but also liberals and conservatives. Certainly I wouldn't have voted for my congressman, Jerry Nadler(D) or my Senators, Clinton and Schumer if they weren't "pro-Israel."
Being "pro Israel" does NOT ipso facto mean supporting the war in Iraq or wanting "Armageddon." That's just preposterous.
As far as there being more Taliban than before, no argument.
I understand that Ron Paul is speaking for a lot of folks that the MSM is ignoring. From that perspective, he's interesting to me.
lol! How about BEFORE WW2. BEF0RE 6 million were slaughtered! seriously? The American public in general didn't want them then and I'm betting they still don't.
"[Expletive] the Journalists, Professors, Professional Journalists and Journalistic Professors. They don't vote for us anyway."
;-)
He is transparent.
The second issue is the amount of information that is pro-israeli, which is to say that all of the information disseminated is pro-israeli.
The third issue is that newsrooms and entire networks (Fox) are geared towards pro-israeli wars and anti-Arab, anti-Muslim coverage.
The fourth issue is it is insincere at best and intentionally dishonesty at worst, to claim that Jews dont vote Republican because irregardless of the candidate elected, they will answer to Israel and their lobbies and their supporters.
Finally, the constant hysteria about Hitler reveals that Jews are not beneath exploiting the past to further their agendas in the present and future. Proof of this? We were told Saddam was Hitler and now we're being told that Ahmedejinedad is Hitler all in a concerted and highly organized effort to attack yet another country for Israel.
The bottom line is this: the Zionist Jews and the zionist Christian fundamentalists are partners in this pro-israel campaign and they dominate the entire conversation regarding middle east foreign policy.
Mr. Wiener, your post is intellectually dishonest and contains suspicious scents of revisionism.
You say "The only issue is how the Zionist and pro-Israeli lobbies bully, terrorize and threaten politicians into voting to support Israel all the time, at all costs. "
How exactly do they do this?
An then You've said "The second issue is the amount of information that is pro-israeli, which is to say that all of the information disseminated is pro-israeli. "
To which I say nonsense. There are numerous lobbies that argue quietly about against Israel and have since it's inception. It is very much the reason why there is a pro-Israeli lobby.
In addition to that, the Palestinian's situation is more publicized than any number of populations whose situations are far more dire. Show me one forum where the victims of the Congo's war (where 4 million people have died in the last decade of wars) have been given the attention that the Palestinians have. Moreover, since we're talking about Israel, tell us how often you hear who is responsible for the death, destruction and mass sexual violence that has been going on there.
How often, in the press, have you heard of Indonesia's transmigration program? It's a program by which the central Javanese government has relocated Javanese folks out of crowded urban areas in Java and given them lands in Islands that were taken and occupied (like West Paupa). That program has moved millions of Indonesians onto lands that previously belonged to other people in ways that are more like colonialism than what Israel has done.
I'm not saying that any of that should change the standard that Israel is held to. What is wrong is wrong and when compensation is due, it should be tendered.
However, the idea you put forth "all information disseminated is pro-Israeli" is a completely untruthful statement.
Oh really? And where is the aclu - good question.
Jews support the concept of separation of church and state.
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/rosnerBlog.jhtml?itemNo=890017&contrassID=25&subContrassID=0&sbSubContrassID=1&listSrc=Y&art=1
The Ben-Gamla school controversy: Money trumps Church-State separation
The Broward County School Board in South Florida approved this summer what will be the nation's first Hebrew-language charter school. Charter schools are publicly funded but privately run and must adhere to all school board regulations and to state requirements. The last two obstacles to the school were removed this past week. The Ben-Gamla Charter School will be operated by a private company, Academica. The students will learn Hebrew, Jewish culture and Jewish history for two hours a day. The curriculum will not include religion or prayer, unless it is organized by students voluntarily. Many of the people attending the school will be Israelis living in the area. They will get what many Jewish parents in this country want: an affordable alternative to the Jewish day school.
"Would you expect to hear the following sentences in a publicly funded school?
"Our Holy Torah is dear to us."
"God created man on Friday."
"Man is redeemed from his sins through repentance."
These sentences come from a textbook that will be used in the Ben-Gamla Charter School.
the fact that the principle of the new school is an Orthodox rabbi, Adam Siegel, formerly a head of the Yeshiva Elementary School in Miami Beach.
They don't send their kids to day schools in big numbers and don't need to struggle with the heavy cost.
Supporters of the school say it could serve as a national model, providing families with a financially accessible option. Many non-Orthodox households, they believe, are opting not to send their children to day schools because of the cost. Some of those people can be persuaded to come back to this moderately Jewish option.
The above could be considered normal---but its stupid for the uSA to get in the middle and give ISRAEL money to bomb its neighbors with --- and annoy its neighbors to the point they hate us too.
Jewish voters look like other voters with high levels of education," says Ira Foreman, (etc)
A few years ago, the prime minister of Malaysia said, in an anti-semitic statement, "we're up against people who can think!" People who don't think or don't care to think or are too lazy to think, hate and fear people who do think. Remember what happened to child geniuses in school?
A few years ago, the prime minister of Malaysia said, in an anti-semitic statement, "we're up against people who can think!" People who don't think or don't care to think or are too lazy to think, hate and fear people who do think. Remember what happened to child geniuses in in school?
I believe many of our foreign policy blunders are a direct result of subordinating most other ethnic groups to this one. Also candidates are typically well rewarded financially for adopting the "correct positions." I will undoubtedly be called an anti semite for this position. However, I am joined by many other Americans of Jewish descent, including Noam Chomsky who have shared the same viewpoint, so I am in good company. Giordy
"There are pro-Israel groups, not just Jewish - many of them are Christian fundamentalists, that believe in supporting the Israeli government no matter what it does and no matter what it wants. These people are all upset and excited about Iran and are pushing hard for a confrontational stance." - Barbara Slavin