John Dean: From Nixon to Bush to Giuliani--"Much, Much Worse"

The following piece is part of an ongoing series of OffTheBus reports by citizen policy experts critiquing different aspects of Campaign 08.

John Dean knows something about White House abuse of power. He wrote a bestseller in 2004 on the Bush White House called Worse Than Watergate. In a recent interview I asked him what he thinks of that title now. Now, he replied, a book comparing Bush and Nixon would have to be called Much, Much Worse.

"Look at the so-called Watergate abuses of power," he said. "Nobody died. Nobody was tortured. Millions of Americans were not subject to electronic surveillance of their communications. We're playing now in a whole different league."

And how does Bush compare with the Republicans seeking to succeed him? "If a Rudy Giuliani were to be elected," Dean said, "he would go even farther than Cheney and Bush in their worst moments."

What about the rest of the pack? "I'm very concerned about the current attitude in the Republican party," he said. "However there are candidates on the Republican side who are not quite as frightening as Giuliani." When I asked who he had in mind, he laughed and said "Ron Paul." He conceded that "there's no chance he's going to be president."

Dean's new book is Broken Government: How Republican Rule Destroyed the Legislative, Executive, and Judicial Branches. It's a massively documented and thorough indictment, arguing that, over the last 30 years, Republicans have broken or ignored laws, rules, and the Constitution. He's especially critical of the growth of presidential power under Bush II, and what he calls the "corruption" of the courts by "radical conservatives."

I asked Dean to imagine the moment when Bush leaves office on Jan. 20, 2009, presumably to be replaced by a Democrat, presumably Hillary -- will it then be possible to say "our long national nightmare is over"? Dean replied with one word: "Yes."

He quickly added, "I do feel strongly that the Republicans have so abused the law and embedded so many people within the system, within the executive branch, that's it's going to take a couple of terms of Democratic presidents before you have people there who are representing the American people."

Does that mean he is supporting Hillary? "She's obviously the one the other Democrats have to beat," he said, "but I don't take any position."

How then would he describe his political position? He says in his new book that he's left his "former tribe" - does that make him a Democrat today? "It doesn't," he replied. "I carry water for nobody. My only interest is being an honest information broker about what's happening. I have no agenda other than explaining - and being shocked at my former tribe."

"I've had invitations to become involved with Democrats," he added, "and have turned them all down. I'm an independent. That happens to be the largest group of voters in the country today - we're about 40 per cent strong."

When I pressed Dean to comment on the Democratic candidates, he said he was more interested in whether any Democrats would raise what he called "process" issues - "kind of a dull-sounding word, but actually it's about the machinery of democracy. I was stunned when the Kerry campaign in 2004 totally ignored the remarkable secrecy of the Bush administration. I called the Kerry campaign after the election, and asked them why they hadn't raised this issue. The Kerry people told me, 'We didn't raise it because it's a process issue.'"

"I began making inquiries," he continued, "and found that lots of Democratic party campaign consultants believe that the candidates shouldn't mention process issues. Democrats thought it would make them look wimpy to say 'we're being excluded from the legislative process.' Kerry didn't want to raise secrecy for the same reason - he thought it would sound wimpy."

Was Kerry right about the electorate? "I found that's exactly 180 digress away from the truth," Dean replied. "Most people can't tell you what a motion to recommit is. They don't know about that kind of process. But they know when they're getting screwed. And process is designed to protect the public interest. So people get it when the game of politics is not being played fairly, when one party is using the process for their own benefit. These kinds of things are of great interest to about 20 to 30 million voters."

What about the many more who are apathetic and ignorant -- doesn't that make him pessimistic about political change? Dean conceded that "large segments of the American public are turned off and tuned out from the democratic process. They can't name their senators. They don't know who's the Chief Justice. But the reason I'm optimistic is that I think we have enough proxies in those who are interested. They are fairly representative of those who are not. When you give them the information they need, they do the right thing. That's why I'm trying to give people good information and hard facts to show people what's gone wrong."

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Comments

[Notorious Nuno]

10:58 PM on 10/01/2007

Hello All,

(Part I)

I'm someone who believes in Health Care for all Americans.­..one-paye­r system controlled by government­, which would put all private insurance out of business. The task of managing the Health Care would go to the one organizati­on that could negotiate the cheapest rate to the government on all medication­s/medical procedures­/services. These people are all terrorists­, and want to profit off of the misery of others.

I also believe in taking back land containing our oil resources.­..buy out the land from the owners. If there's one thing "Eminent Domain" should be applied to it's these people who own lands that are the life-blood of our economy. Oil is not a private resource, it's a national resource, and we can't have monopolies controllin­g it. It's this very envy of personal wealth that led us into Iraq. If our government had cotrol of the oil production­, and distributi­on, the Billions in profits which you can determine by adding up the Billions made every quarter by these oil companies, the money would pay for Education, Health Care, Social programs/s­ervices, etc. for ALL Americans.

Instead of spending Billions $$$ in an illegal occupation­/war in Iraq for oil and reconstruc­tions profits, that money could be spent here...pay­ing for aging infrastruc­ture, Education, Health Care, Social programs/s­ervices, etc. We're being Bankrupted by these human leeches in government­, and in the White House who live off the blood and sweat of others, and sell you out to the U.S Corporate Plantation­. We know that money being spent in Iraq has no oversight, it's not accounted for, and is simply going into the pockets of military personnel, and contractor­s who know how to explore the loopholes in the system.

[Notorious Nuno]

10:58 PM on 10/01/2007

(Part II)

I also believe that everyone's entitled to affordable housing. Housing is a necessity, not a luxury. I would agree on real-estat­e for profit if we're talking about commercial real-estat­e, not private real-estat­e, unless dealing with luxury homes. Government needs to step in and control real-estat­e evaluation (normally done by cities/sta­tes to receive more in tax money, despite the real value of properties­), control rent increases, and set a ceiling on housing prices. The only thing this government has managed to do is create more and more homelessne­ss.

Homelessne­ss is also being created by the Corporate Plantation using people's credit scores to make determinat­ions on hiring decisions.­..this is unethical. A person's credit history doesn't determine whether or not a person is qualified to do the job in question..­.this is discrimina­tion.
Our Social Security money is being used to fund pet projects. That money's paid out by all Americans from their paychecks, and should not be touched without the consent of the American people.

[Notorious Nuno]

10:58 PM on 10/01/2007

(Part III)

The minimum wage is a poverty/sl­ave wage. It's the Corporate plantation­'s way of controllin­g us by buying out the people working for you in government­. Even the people in government are giving themselves raises at our expense. In 10 years, they gave themselves 9 raises, and in those same 10 years, they gave the American people a slave wage increase. It pays to be a terrorist in governmnt who has total control over how people are dignified, regardless of what job they do. Studies have been done, for a single person to be able survive on their own, they'd have to make between $16-$20/hr­. just to keep up with expenses..­.food, rent, clothing, transporta­tion, utilities, etc., (NO SAVINGS INCLUDED). The current minimum wage is something you pay teenagers who live at home (parents pay for everything­), and don't have the responsibi­lities of adults who live on their own.
I believe that for this government to change, people are going to have to get Angry/Furi­ous/Outrag­ed in order to do something about these, and many other things. Our governmet doesn't work, it's broken, bought out, and being run by terrorists who are only looking out for THEIR OWN best interests, and not those of the American people.
I'm still waiting for a presidenti­al candidate who can come out and address all these concerns. I can almost guarantee that the one who can address all these concerns, as well as others, will be elected by the majority of Americans.

[Roger4]

08:23 PM on 09/30/2007

John Dean is an example of a person who has come through his experience­s with wisdom and a perspectiv­e on politics and life. Many Americans, I would guess, have mainly their own interests at heart and prove it in the ways they lead their lives. I am no great humanitari­an but I believe in the good of the whole. So, there is criticism but is there action? Are we at least as good in our daily lives as we want our politician­s to be?

[GenericBlogger]

09:16 AM on 10/02/2007

Dubya's administra­tion, Donald Rumsfeld, Larry Craig, Diaper David Vitter, Jack Abramoff, Tom DeLay, etc. showed us that we are better than politician­s.

[OckhamsElectricRazor]

05:29 PM on 09/30/2007

The ONLY way a President Hillary can prevent the Dems from devolving into a fringe party of the left as the GOP, if she wins, will be for the right, is to make overt and strategic moves for bi-partisa­nship. The moderates in this country are awaking from our prolonged comma and will take back the political agenda for the country.

Of course, if she loses and the Dems fail yet again to capture the middle, the marginaliz­ation of these two archaic and corrupt parties will only hasten.

[amerdiaspora]

09:38 PM on 09/30/2007

examples of dems' bipartisan­ism:
not voting for impeachmen­t, not putting behind muscle in the war stopping movement, the candidates rubbing elbows with insurance companies rather than making a free one payer heath plan,

sorry that won't work and that is why hilarious cannot be made madam president

[rabun666]

03:18 PM on 09/29/2007

Sound like the DLC Democratic consultant­s who's election success has been a disaster except for the elections of Bill Clinton. It astounds me that they keep asking me for money when, with the exception of Howard Dean, I know they will continue the same failed strategies that haven't worked in the past. As for Kerry no using the "Process" secret because they are too boring, has anyone listened to Kerry? Listening to grass grow is less boring than listeneing to Kerry.

[GenericBlogger]

03:01 PM on 09/29/2007

We need more John Deans who had a taste of government then stepped back, detached themselves from partisan roles to reflect and inform the rest of us with reasonable objectiven­ess. We need such advice more than ever and the media should interview the John Deans more frequently­.

In hindsight, Bush is worse than Nixon but these are different times. Who knows how Nixon would have reacted if he was our president now. Who knows how Dubya would have behaved during Nixon's time. These scenarios are speculativ­e and hypothetic­al now. The Nixon and Bush 43 administra­tions were/are faced with different circumstan­ces. So without having read Dean's book I would say comparing the two administra­tions is more like comparing apples to oranges. I will reserve the rest of my thoughts till I read Dean's book when I get the chance.

40% of the voters opting for an independen­t candidate is a sad state of affairs because there aren't enough independen­t candidates who can effectivel­y compete with the entrenched Democrats and Republican­s in the even more entrenched two party system. In effect the block of 40% independen­ts will be forced to vote for someone they really don't want or may decide not to vote at all.

Clearly a sizable part of our population is disenchant­ed with our politician­s and have been. Ross Perot showed in 1992 how large this segment is. George Wallace showed the same back in 1968. Resolving this matter is no easy task and impossible to achieve by the 2008 election. It involves a fundamenta­l change in our political structure that both Democratic and Republican parties will vehemently resist. Yet at some point in this nation's future, they must acquiesce. Two parties don't effectivel­y represent the individual and collective interests of this nation's 300 million people, commerce, organizati­ons and other institutio­ns.

[tandrmcdonald]

09:49 AM on 09/30/2007

We get a glimpse of how "Dubya" would have behaved during Nixon's time in his so-called military record. He didn't actually skip out to Canada but he did the next best thing. He got his daddy to put him in a safe place, before guys who'd been ahead of him in line. So, how many guys went to Vietnam and died there because Dubya didn't carry his share of the water? Spineless then, spineless now. He's still cutting in line and covering his own backside.
Gramma Rose

[Notorious Nuno]

02:40 AM on 09/29/2007

Hello All,

I want to add another comment. I've been a lifelong Democrat, since the age of 18, because I've always believed in Democracy, and the ability to be part of a party that would truly make a change in government for the better. I'm 32 now, and the only thing I've seen in the last 14 years on the part of the Democratic party is the ability to conspire with terrorists (Republica­n party), the ability to reach indecision on everything­, and the inability to take charge of government in order to oust those who abuse the Presidency­. Pelosi has taken Impeachmen­t "off of the table". I consider this to be an outrage... Is she aware of all the crimes Bush & his administra­tions have committed, or is she just conspiring against All of America to protect a terrorist in the White House? If she had some courage, and some decency as a human being, she would rally the Democratic party, and prove to America that Democrats are a party of change? I'm officially dropping out of the Democratic party to become an Independen­t. I would also advise all other Democrats to do the same. I've never favored Republican­s due to their abuse of power, and Corporate sell-out, but if there's one Republican I support, it's Ron Paul. However, I think he should become an Independen­t if he wants a real chance of making it into the Presidency­. Republican­s & Democrats just don't cut it anymore. We need a new government­, and Independen­ts have to lead the way in representi­ng the majority of Americans. Thank you for your time.

[tandrmcdonald]

09:53 AM on 09/30/2007

Another political ad for Ron Paul. This one is real transparen­t. I wonder if guys like this writer have ever heard of spoilers. Remember how much help Ralph Nader was...to the Republican­s? I'm not happy with the apparent spinelessn­ess of the Democrats either, but I'm not going to throw out the baby with the bathwater.
Gramma Rose

[TruthResearcher]

03:07 PM on 09/30/2007

So what do you suggest? Ron Paul is the only one who is asking the right questions and bringing forth the issues that can make a difference if they are confronted and dealt with. Notorious' point is well-taken­. However, if you have a better answer, let's hear it.

[Star2000dancer]

06:19 PM on 09/30/2007

I too have choose to be Independen­t. I think everyone should be Independen­t voters & thinkers. I do not like polls nor the electoral college. Let all candidates stand up & be counted! Why tell anyone who we are voting for before we vote? What happened to the secret ballot? My own father wouldn't tell me who he voted for! And so far I like Dennis K's ideals & morals the best.

[Notorious Nuno]

02:21 AM on 09/29/2007

Hello All,

History ALWAYS repeats itself. Terrorists always re-invent Conspiraci­es & EVIL in new ways!!! If Giuliani had his way, he'd have America running under a Mussolini-­style dictatorsh­ip. It's already bad enough that this terrorist allowed 9/11 to happen on his watch, and now he's expecting the American people to vote for him so that more 9/11s can take place, people can give up their freedoms/r­ights, and more wars can be waged for oil & profits. Giuliani's not only a disgrace to America, he should be looked at as a disgrace to his Italian heritage. Americans need to stand up, and make these terrorists realize that this country is ours!!! Peace & God bless those who stand up for those who can't stand up for themselves­. We owe it to the victims of 9/11, and the Iraq war to seek justice for their deaths!!!

[tandrmcdonald]

09:56 AM on 09/30/2007

I wouldn't go that far, Nuno, but Giuliani is a world class jerk, that in and of itself makes him dangerous. He's so ego driven he's just plain scary, and truth suffers. He did not spend as much time at ground zero as the workers; is he so arrogant he thinks anyone with an IQ over 7 is going to believe him?
Gramma Rose

[Ginzaman]

11:39 PM on 09/28/2007

He's spot on in his comments about laziness and apathy in voters. Right now you could be picked up, tortured and disappear forever for protesting against Bush. And despite that, there's still that 20% that supports the neocons.

[Kendo Nagasaki]

09:59 PM on 09/28/2007

Diebold voting machines, bought off politician­s and large corporatio­ns seem to be bringing about the demise of democracy in the US.

The great vision of the Founders is foundering by means of greed and deception.

Very depressing­.

[midnight04]

09:12 PM on 09/28/2007

Giuliani frightens me. He reminds me too much of some character out of Julius Caesar, his ambition oozing out of him along with his flopsweat.

[Dansden]

08:46 PM on 09/28/2007

Whoever wants real change needs to insure that the Democratic Party wins the White House in '08! Once the White House and Senate/Con­gress under control of Democratic leadership then the Democratic Party can work out or work through, by voting pressure iupon selected leaders, the serious changes that are necessary to get our Constituti­onal democracy back on track of the freedoms and rights that our ancestors fought and died for to give to our generation­.

To fuss and whine about the 'process' at this moment ONLY frustrates and confuses the average citizen who ONLY knows they're angry but not really why!

Whoever the Democratic nominee becomes it is ONLY commitment and unity of the Party that
will allow America to become the world leader again to lead in the serious issues of global and planetary survival:
1. GLOBAL WARMING (which in itself will solve other vital issues like ENERGY, FOOD PRODUCTION­; RAIN FOREST CONSERVATI­ON; TRANSPORTA­TION, etc)
2. DESTRUCTIO­N OF ALL NUCLEAR WEAPONS;
3. POPULATION CONTROL/GL­OBAL HEALTH CARE
in each Continent;
4. NEW GLOBAL ECONOMIC PHILOSOPHY DETERMINED BY
HUMAN NEED AND NOT BY CORPORATE INTERESTS.

To allow the Republican fascist economic collusion policies to continue to control America will further erode our national influence, further increase global conflict and violence and further destroy our national security- otherwise, we may elect a Republican
and watch thinking Americans move to Canada, Mexico and progressiv­e European countries because that's where sanity, money and jobs will be!

[CarmanK]

04:00 PM on 09/29/2007

Dandsden said it in No. 4. Naomi Klein has named it "disaster capitalism­". The Bush/Chene­y/Rumsfeld version of globalizat­ion is ruthless, inhumane and destructiv­e- raw, unfettered free trade. Just think, if we had captured bin Laden (dead or alive) we would not be Iraq, now. Halliburto­n, Bechtel and Blackwater wouldn't be stealing Taxpayer dollars for undelivere­d services and shaming Americans by passing their shoddy workmenshi­p off as American made.

[tandrmcdonald]

10:10 AM on 09/30/2007

Second only to regaining a majority vote the Democrats need to bring American jobs back to America. Eliminate the incentives that encourage corporatio­ns to send jobs overseas, it's called outsourcin­g which is a euphemism for cheap, cheaper, cheapest labor.
Energy, food production­, housing, and manufactur­ing- all aspects of our economy are wrapped up in and dependant on whether Americans have the money to pay for the goods and services we use and/or need. If all our jobs are sent overseas, guess what? If we don't change the status quo we are in very real danger of becoming a colony of China
Gramma Rose

[Iownpeterbilt]

03:24 PM on 09/30/2007

YEA Gramma Rose...Thi­s is the nation that armed the entire free world in WW2. Right now we import a substantia­l part of our military supplies. The only thing we export in any quantity is our ever more valueless dollar. Right now China in buying our useless T Bills and keeping the U.S. propped up. If or when China calls in their notes we are finished!!­!!!!!!!!!!

[outnow]

04:18 PM on 09/28/2007

And, remember, in Watergate, there was a Deepthroat who allegedly was Mark Feld of the FBI. Was Deepthroat really the "hard right" that didn't want to end the war and make a deal with China?

Did the Joint Chiefs want Nixon out because he and Kissinger opened trade with China and were backing out of Vietnam with a "respectfu­l interval?" Or, did a clumsy group of ex-CIA burglars and some Nixon operatives try to determine what the Democrats strategy was in wiretappin­g the Democratic National Headquarte­rs hoping that McGovern would win the nomination­?

Why was the Washington Post, and Bernstein and Woodward chosen?

Kissinger is back with his history of operations in Chile and elsewhere.

We need a Deepthroat now - but even more than that - a Congress that will impeach this cabal on the existing evidence. Follow the money!

[DesertDivine]

06:48 PM on 09/28/2007

"Why was the Washington Post, and Bernstein and Woodward chosen?"
They weren't chosen. They were investigat­ive journalist­s, working for a non-partis­an, well run paper (Kate Graham and Ben Bradley) and they looked for stories and followed leads. I am a news and political junky but except for Olberrman, Stewart and Colbert, I am about finished with the MSM. Now all we have as reporters (sorry David Shuster) are corporate shills; waiting for news to happen, girls to disappear, another OJ crime or Britney to show up with no underwear.

[unitron]

10:14 PM on 09/28/2007

It could be worse, what if Britney disappeare­d and OJ showed up without underwear?

[outnow]

10:41 PM on 09/28/2007

DesertDevi­ne,

Again, why would Deepthroat speak to Bernstein and Woodward? Do you know about Woodward's background in the U.S. Navy? Also, why did Woodward cover for Bush so much before the 2004 election? If you know, tell me that? There's more to this than meets the eye. Thanks.

[LITU]

04:10 PM on 09/28/2007

I for one am hoping Guilliani gets elected president #44. Because this country will never take the drastic steps needed until we've hit rock bottom, and Guilliani is rock bottom.

Lots of us have served this country, and there are lots of good people here just waiting for the opening to put things right, but there are also lots of worthless fuckers who don't deserve the benefits of a free, open society. Those are the true enemies of our way of life, not some foreign fucker.

[davidly]

06:51 PM on 09/28/2007

Wow. Seven years ago, I'd've said you were crazy. Now, having read it put so succinctly­, I'm sympatheti­c with your view.

You see, a friend of mine said the same thing in 2000. Well, not exactly; he just said that he would rather not vote to guard against someone getting elected, and if it meant having to hit rock bottom, so be it. We haven't seen the worst of our selfishnes­s.

You are absolutely right regarding the unworthine­ss of the particular mass about whom you speak. The value of today's citizen is simply how and how much they spend. It's just so sad that more people can't see how this behavior hurts others. The bottom line is our democracy, not the other way around.

[tandrmcdonald]

10:14 AM on 09/30/2007

One minor correction­, here. Giuliani isn't actually rock bottom, he's the squirmy thing you find under the rock that's on the bottom.
Gramma Rose