Did Gun Sales Really Spike Because of the Election? Not Really, it Turns Out.

I thought all those stories about the bang up business at gun stores after Obama's win sounded hokey.

And they are, according to Jack Schafer at Slate, who he has numbers to back him up. First, gun sales in the past sales period were no higher than usual. They were, in fact, lower than some other years. Gun ownership is down in general, from half of households to a third since 1977. There are a fifth as many dealers today as well as there were two decades ago. The last time we heard a wave of these stories was 1993, when the incoming Clinton administration supposedly scared people into their gun stores as well. 1993 was the year gun violence peaked, as it happens. It's been a downhill slide since. In many ways, luckily, 2008 is not 1993. Feel better? I do.

Cross posted at home.

Comments

[research]

Gun Control:

Hitler was for it

Gandhi was vehemently against it.

Gandhi:

"I used to issue leaflets asking people to enlist as recruits. One of the arguments I had used was distasteful to the Commissioner: 'Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest. If we want the Arms Act to be repealed, if we want to learn the use of arms, here is a golden opportunity.

If the middle classes render voluntary help to Government in the hour of its trial,

distrust will disappear, and the

ban on possessing arms will be

withdrawn.'

http://www.mkgandhi.org/autobio/chap151.htm

Plenty of us Liberals defend the 2nd amendment for it's deterrence to tyrants, not just for self defense and hunting.

[Berettasskeeter]

Slate? That notoriously anti-American rag? No wonder they couldn't find any figures. They're in the habit of making theirs up! Here in Memphis, all the gun shops are doing land-office business, particularly in AR-15's (and lookalikes). I just bought a stripped lower (the part with the serial #), and will build it to suit myself over time.
Semper fi

[mliam]

A good source of sane info about guns:

http://www.gunfacts.info/

It certainly gave me a more balanced perspective on the issue.

The writer seems to be a pretty reasonable fellow judging by his blog.. Certainly not the foaming-at­-the-mouth wingnut going on and on about his cold dead hands; a stereotype some may assume given the subject.

[CanisLatrans]

57 million gun owners in the USA, with about 120 million guns between us.

10,000 gun deaths per year due to crime. Crime which may have also been done with knives, etc, because the object of the crime was to obtain money or drugs, not "caused" by guns.

2.5 millions crimes per year PREVENTED by civilian gun owners.

Do the math. Gun owners are not the problem. The problem is criminals, and the social conditions that cause crime. The existance or non-existance of guns won't make crime magically disappear.

[Toonadude]

My fellow Americans and gun owners, one thing is for certain........we must thank George W. Bush for defending our 2nd Amendment right to have guns.

When you are unemployed and need to sell your guns to make another mortgage payment...... you need to thank George W. Bush for defending your 2nd Amendment right to have those guns.

When you run out of unemployment insurance, have not landed another job and need to sell your guns to feed your family..........you need to thank George W. Bush for defending your 2nd Amendment right to have those guns.

Just think my fellow Americans and gun owners........where would we be right now without the vision and leadership of George W. Bush on our 2nd Amendment rights?

[EmilyU]

President Bush did nothing to specifically defend our Second Amendment rights. If anything, he was neutral.

[Toonadude]

But then we had the Gonzales / Lautenberg Bill introduced on Bush's watch.
A Republican gun grabbing move.
Maybe "neutral" is being too generous.

[HisXLNC]

Economic problems are temporary. An abridgment of rights is permanent.

Right now, i'd take as many years of Bush as needed until a competent president can be found to replace him.

[Toonadude]

A few more years of Bush and you will have no more rights and probably no means to pay for your guns. Or maybe you think when he abolishes the Constitution he will do it for all but the 2nd Amendment ?

[Michale32086]

@Dystopic

}}}}
yep. Gun shows should be banned, plain and simple.
{{{{

Of course... And, since cars kill MANY more people here at home than guns, we should also ban Car Shows as well, eh?

Michale.....

[Trevilly]

I feel a little silly even bothering to point out how naive that comparison is Michale, because I am sure with some more thought you would also conclude that there is none. Cars are built for a harmless, but extremely benign, albeit, useful purpose and almost all deahts are accidental. Guns were designed and built for the express purpose of killing or disabling, and while many deaths are accidental, the sole purpose of a gun is violent, no matter what the circumstances, even self defence, that is there only purpose. Hence tha comparison is just, well, silly.

[Michale32086]

I agree..

The comparison WOULD be silly if all one concentrated on was design.

Do you think it really MATTERS to all the dead, what the instrument of their death was actually DESIGNED for???

If you simply look at the surface, yes the comparison is silly..

But, if you look deeper you will see that the point is, we need to stop blaming inanimate objects for the flaws in our own characters...

Michale....

[EmilyU]

"Cars are built for a harmless, but extremely benign, albeit, useful purpose "

And yet they are involved in far more deaths every year than the supposedly harmful, not benign firearms.

"Guns were designed and built for the express purpose of killing or disabling"

You have never seen Hammerli pistols, have you?

[EmilyU]

"And they are, according to Jack Schafer at Slate, "

Well, maybe Mr. Schafer needs to double check his numbers because at all our local dealers' stores, sales are definitely up.

[CanisLatrans]

You know, another thing to bear in mind about "other countries" and crime rates is that many "other countries" have social safety nets (such as health care) so that the poor never really become so desperate that they find crime to be a worthwhile alternative.

It's not just "guns", it's many things-- primarily the economy, the needs of the poor, and other things that make crime seem like a reasonable risk. Eliminating guns won't eliminate desperation-- or crime.

[shanghaislim]

I live in two distinct cities. One Communist. Shanghai. One British Commonwealth Based. Hong Kong. Both have incredible systems for providing that security net, from free health-care, subsidized housing, support for the poor elderly and disabled.

Crime in China is about 1% of what it is in America. One can walk down the street or through any park at 2am and feel as safe as in your own home.
Hong Kong is almost as safe.

Canis-you are dead on about the causes inherent to crime. Well said.

[Michale32086]

}}}}
Crime in China is about 1% of what it is in America. One can walk down the street or through any park at 2am and feel as safe as in your own home
{{{{

Yes, totalitarian dictatorships are notoriously crime-free..

I honestly don't believe the trade-offs are worth it, though...

Michale.....

[mliam]

I bet you could get that number to just above 0% if anyone suspected of any crime were summarily executed by the police. How much liberty are you willing to give up for a bit of safety? Would you trade in our justice system for one like the Chinese?

My wife grew up in Spain under Franco. She and her parents sometimes comment about the low crime rate during that time. They often tell a story of how La Guardia Civil busted down the door of a good friend of thiers and hauled him into the night, never to be seen again and nobody knew why. Perhaps he said something he shouldn't have.

Is this what you are advocating? 'Cause it kind of sounds that way.

[InofTouch]

so should I trust slate...a mainstream media :P

[BatedBreath]

There were articles in the local oklahoma papers about aspike in the sale of automatic machinegun guns. Whether you had a spike or not probably depends on where you live. When you are in the middle of a hive of militiamen and such then they're gonna want their guns.

[CanisLatrans]

You do know that "automatic machineguns" (that's redundant, BTW) are illegal to sell and have been since 1934, right?

[EmilyU]

"There were articles in the local oklahoma papers about aspike in the sale of automatic machinegun guns"

LOLOL! Sorry, but no.

[Michale32086]

}}}}}
There were articles in the local oklahoma papers about aspike in the sale of automatic machinegun guns.
{{{{{

"In the dictionary under redundant, it says, 'see redundant'."
-Robin Williams

:D

Michale.....

[PallinAround]

Obama's election and the promise of tighter controls on ASSAULT weapons is spurring the fearful, paranoid portion of the population to buy more guns and to buy ammo for the guns they've already got. What is driving a much more significant part of the increase in gun sales is the overall TANKING OF THE ECONOMY, and as people get laid off, the crime rate is going up and more people want to protect what they have vs. losing it to all the desperate, destitute homeless people who have little left to lose so turning to armed robbery, home invasions, etc. is going to seem like a plausible option. That is what is really behind the increase in gun sales.

[Digeeedad]

Gun dearer's internet report:

In the third quarter of this year, ( JULY THRU OCTOBER )
We sold the following
7.62X39 Ammo......­..........­361 CASES
AK 30 RD Mags......­..........­..........­..........­.783
AK Rifles (All Types ) ..........­..........­.....243

By Comparison, In the 10 days since the election we have sold:

7.62X39 Ammo......­..........­1218 Cases
AK 30 RD Mags......­..........­..........­..........­.3855
AK Rifles (All Types ) ..........­..........­.....572

[Dystopic]

I live near Springfield MO. I was at a Bass Pro about a week after the election, and according to the salespersons, gun sales were up 30%. It is / was close to deer season here, so maybe that s normal.

[Lolotehe]

I dunno. I think there is an effect, considering there was no ammo to be had at the gun show this weekend.

[STG 44]

Well, last Saturday and Sunday two larger gun shows in Central Florida had the longest lines and most crowded aisles that I've ever seen, so I'd say a lot of people are looking. Waits for Brady call-in checks were also the longest in memory, so they must be buying too. If you are against allowing the government to snoop around in your bedroom you should also want them out of your gun closet too.

[theMightyT]

loopholes for sales at gun shows might explain it

[Dystopic]

yep. Gun shows should be banned, plain and simple.

[EmilyU]

Except that there are no loopholes for sales at gun shows.