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Juliette Fretté

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Why Women Are Mean to Other Women

Posted: 09/26/2012 2:24 pm

Oh, how natural it seems when women and girls are so damn mean to each other. Seemingly more mean, underhanded and brutal than men are to one another. More deliberate. Yet often more unconsciously, horribly, mean.

Of course this is a sweeping generalization. There are a lot of good people in the world. Good women, if you will. And there are certainly men out there who can rival the biggest drama queen you've ever seen. But that's not the point.

The point, actually, is that in general, modern women do not possess the solidarity you might hope for or even expect in a world that is supposedly heading toward gender equality.

Without question, the notion of woman vs. woman is not particularly new. Many often laugh it off, deferring to our curiously 'natural' state of being. As if it is in our DNA to compete with one another. We are known to do it for men, friends, jobs, attention, recognition and self worth. Things you can actually win and things you can never win. The tangibles and the intangibles. We'll launch silent daggers over petty issues such as clothing, mimicry and appearance faux pas -- all fodder for cannon balls of hatred for fellow females to fire. We even squabble over the things that are entirely nebulous, the ideas in the back of our minds that are more like phantoms than actual live gains. Not many question it. We make fun of it, acknowledge it, disparage upon it, but we don't really ask ourselves why and how we got here. How did we get this bad?

That's just how women are ... Supposedly.

Well, that might be true, but only as true as the belief that 'boys will be boys.' But really, truly, boys will be boys and girls will be girls in the context of certain power relations and social structures.

Call it natural if you like, but it can be changed.

Now before you start planning your rebuttal to this notion, I didn't say that this was going to be easy. And I'm not necessarily talking about a widespread campaign of 'awareness' so that we can initiate the healing process one-by-one in our own psyches. Well, in a way I am, but in another way, I'm not. Based on my research in academia and general observations, I find this to be a more simple problem than we think -- albeit one with widespread and complicated ripple effects on society as a whole.

Think about this: What is the only problem that seems to persist in spite of women's economic advancement, educational progress, sexual freedom, access to technological innovation and relative (though increasingly tenuous) reproductive rights? What is it about our worth as individuals that inspires our insecure animosity?

It is kind of miraculous if you really think about it. Unbelievably, this very real issue can not only interfere with how we feel about ourselves, it can also affect how others feel about us, thereby influencing how we live our lives!

It is so silly, so obnoxious, so superficial, but painfully true.

Alas, it is all about beauty and body image. Or more specifically, beauty in the context of our persistent inequality to men, and our disproportionate body commodification that ironically feeds the fire between us and our sisters.

Yes, oh yes, in spite of how far we've come, our looks are still up there on the checklist of our success as women. It is on our checklist in an arbitrary omnipresent way that we did not necessarily invite. Perhaps we once made it a priority. Perhaps others made it a priority and we correspondingly internalized it by default. We might even occasionally boycott it, hoping to escape this particular paradigm of self worth and success. But either way, whether we imposed it upon ourselves or someone else did, it's there now and has been for a long while. I would love to cite a ton of sources here to underline this concept, but that would make this article two million pages long.

The truth is that we know it. We see it, live it, breathe it, watch TV about it, read about it. We see how Hilary Clinton, Sarah Palin, Michelle Obama and others are irrelevantly defined by it in the political sphere when there is hardly a media whisper of George W. Bush's, Bill Clinton's or Mitt Romney's appearance. Every once in a while we might hear about Barack Obama's ears, but that's about it. Looks do not define men like they still define women, even in the most serious platforms in the world. This is a beautiful but ugly remnant of a time when women were the trophies and property of men, when our entire worth was once based on appearance, pedigree, purity and child-bearing ability.

Now let me explain why this lame vestigial problem is creating the massive divide and how serious the implications are.

As a disclaimer, this is not to say that we cannot or should not take care of ourselves, that we cannot or should not care about fashion, beauty, fitness, glamour or sexual appeal. All of these interests are fun and worthwhile. We should be free to indulge and revel in them. So should men. We should be able to honor all beauty in all forms whenever possible. It gives life extra spice and flavor. When we can appreciate the range of beauty wholeheartedly and appropriately, it has the power to enhance our spiritual experience.

Nevertheless, when the notion of 'hotness' or 'not-enough-hotness' breathes its muggy breath into our ability to get a job, keep a job, get along with people on the job, be liked, be unliked, be taken seriously or not-taken-seriously, there's a problem.

Think of looks as a resource. Just like education and money and charm. A resource to get what you want. A commodity, if you will. We are living in a capitalist society, after all.

Right about now, some people might want to chime in and blame capitalism for this problem, this commodity-possession-ownership-hierarchy-resource-consumption problem, akin to all other problems in the world. And they might be right. But for now let's keep it simple. Looks are resources. Resources that are inherent and cultivated alike.

Now fathom this: In a culture where patriarchy is still alive, endearingly belting out delusions of grandeur, thrusting a withered cane into the air from its convalescent bed, dinging the bell for the nurse, at least one crippled mythology has remained -- the story that women are not fully worthwhile unless they are amazing at everything AND beautiful in the eyes of others. For some, external beauty in the eyes of others and oneself is success in and of itself.

Regrettably, this fact alone has helped turn women against one another, a trend that started centuries, if not millennia ago. Poignantly, this is the one major factor that still determines our well-being in the public eye whether a woman is gay, straight, bi, white, black, brown, etc., a veritable competition whose competitors are by default only women in a world still ruled by men.

So when an attractive woman strolls around your workplace, if she is prettier in your eyes than you are -- or in someone else's eyes -- she might inspire your jealousy. And if you're that kind of woman, even if only for the day, you might treat her differently. She might as well be parading a better resume in front of you. Look at me, I can get a better man, a better job, a better wardrobe... a better life.

In a world of squirrels, she might as well have been the squirrel who collected more nuts than you. You might even try to steal her nuts. Or tell the other squirrels how she came about those nuts in a suspicious way. Either way, this squirrel is perceived to have more resources than you, even if some of those nuts are spoiled. Then again, how would you know what kind of nuts she has? All you can see is her pile of nuts. And that's all that matters. Perhaps you should take notes from this fabulous squirrel, maybe even do laps around the tree to get that squirrel's thighs. Perhaps you should kill the fabulous squirrel. You just don't know what to do!

Now imagine that you are the beautiful squirrel with the pile of nuts. Now you're getting a little anxious. Now you feel like you should give some away to diminish the danger or perhaps alternatively guard your nuts more fiercely. You just don't know what to do! But why should you give away your nuts? They didn't climb that tree to yank them from the branches. Perhaps they don't have your scampering ability. Perhaps the tree liked you better. Either way, they're your damn nuts, you shouldn't have to make excuses.

Now if nuts represent success or self-worth in the human world we've been trying to create (you know the one with 'gender equality'?) there should be nuts for everyone, and we shouldn't have to get them from men, so to speak. Even though we know they have them!

What we really need, is to stop fighting with each other over the nuts. Instead, we should all collectively attack the tree together.

Bottom line: As women, we need to stop fighting over the scraps that are left to us by those in power. Jealousy over looks is only a symptom of everything else we still do not have, one of which is the ability to shed beauty and body image as all-powerful dictators in our lives.

It is so easy to forget who the real enemies are, and thus we cannibalize ourselves on the way to what we hope is a better life, even if only in the form of vicious shit-talking to alleviate our fleeting anger at what 'Miss Thang' represents to us in the world. She is not the one to blame, unless of course she really did something horrible to you. But then you might ask yourself, Was she horrible to me because... of this exact issue we're talking about? Is she fearfully scrambling for beauty commodity in herself and projecting it outward? Like the rest of us are grappling with in some form every day?

On the flip side, having perceived good looks can drag a woman down in ways that are similarly unfair and unearned, namely when other women do their best to sabotage her progress, her job, her advancement, and her happiness based on jealousy of her collective resources or perceived ability to acquire *nuts* as it were.

When women can finally relegate beauty to a fun life expression, rather than a prerequisite of success, it might be safe to say that we will see less tension between our sisters. I would like to think that when women occupy enough power positions in every sphere, we will no longer question where our real worth lies, at which point we might see an end of the extreme jealousy trend between women as we know it.

So let's pretend that when we as a gendered group achieve more consistent success equaling men, we will treat each other differently indeed. Imagine that we will even help each other more. We can even start now, as it would surely support the cause if women helped other women advance for a change. Or at the very least, we can try our best to disparage upon each other less (tempting as it is). Because one fine day, beauty will not be our unwitting default scapegoat for why we aren't successful or happy.

To some degree, there may always be a form of tension between everybody, women and men, with or without the commodity of beauty playing a role. But I think we all can agree that the world would still be a much better place, even if fraught with endless problems to resolve, if women were nicer to each other.

 

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Oh, how natural it seems when women and girls are so damn mean to each other. Seemingly more mean, underhanded and brutal than men are to one another. More deliberate. Yet often more unconsciously, ho...
Oh, how natural it seems when women and girls are so damn mean to each other. Seemingly more mean, underhanded and brutal than men are to one another. More deliberate. Yet often more unconsciously, ho...
 
 
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12:46 PM on 09/28/2012
Why is grass green?
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HUFFPOST BLOGGER
Carolyn Ziel
12:06 PM on 09/28/2012
My experience has been that this meanness has more to do with brain than body. Image yes. Not looks, beauty, clothes, etc. but about how smart, savvy, and successful in business or in life or spirituality even.

Even amongst women (or especially women) in their 40’s. I find the cattiness is about someone’s business, what they do, how they run it, their success, or pretense, of success. I’ve been on the receiving end of this nastiness when a friend started a fight out of the blue on my Facebook page because she thought I was ‘stealing a phrase’ she had coined. She continued the fight via text. The cause of the fight: her insecurity in growing her business and finding her own footing as a business owner. I don't think she even knew what she was doing or why.

In high school, the girls that were the meanest were the prettiest and the most popular. Maybe it was those girls who had to ‘develop’ their personalities were the threat because they were maybe smarter, more focused on learning and growing and that was the threat.

So, I think this is a good article, but I think it's more than just looks.
11:17 AM on 09/28/2012
I actually enjoy a good cat fight. As long as I'm a neutral spectator.
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jf12
Esta vez saldré como las otras y me escaparé.
12:17 AM on 09/28/2012
I wouldn't say the reason that women are mean is that they *have* nuts, but that they *are* ...
RealistBC
Micro-bios must pass muster.
11:20 PM on 09/27/2012
I wish more women could be as honest and aware as Ms Frette. Everything she presents I can recall seeing in practice, and have occasionally been told by women. Guys could learn a lot about women by reading this article.
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tazmodious
Left Hand of Darkness
10:32 PM on 09/27/2012
""Alas, it is all about beauty and body image. Or more specifically, beauty in the context of our persistent inequality to men, and our disproportionate body commodification that ironically feeds the fire between us and our sisters.'"

Also, let's not forget women's hyper concern with how much money the guy makes.

My uber feminist girlfriend/partner, the one who created huge feminist rallies in California, is currently having a very female response to my current state of underemployment. I'm currently inbetween good paying career jobs, having a tough time, but I at least took a job at Home Depot to at least be able to pay my share of the bills and not get soft. I refused to take unemployment.

However, that just isn't enough. Oh no. It's not at all about finding a career job that I really want and am passionate about. It's about me not making enough and I don't love her because I haven't done enough to find any good paying job.

I've learned that feminism is pretty much a farce. The Disneyland dream of the dashing wealthy prince who will take care of all her(all women) needs is still very much alive and well.
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shortguy54
Short, balding, brilliant... (well, maybe not so)
03:35 AM on 09/28/2012
I sympathize, guy. One thing that feminism has accomplished is that we men today have a better awareness of the pressures and problems over on the female side of society. I don't have the feeling the women understand the pressures on men as fully.
01:31 PM on 09/28/2012
"I don't have the feeling the women care about the pressures on men as fully."

Fixed that for you.
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tazmodious
Left Hand of Darkness
10:19 PM on 09/27/2012
"Alas, it is all about beauty and body image. Or more specifically, beauty in the context of our persistent inequality to men, and our disproportionate body commodification that ironically feeds the fire between us and our sisters.'

When it comes to body image, it's all for other women. Women are far more concerned about each other's looks than guys are.

The guy's point of view is that women in general are beautiful in every shape, size and color. Sure, we may have preferences, but we (men) are really not that picky.

What we men are more concerned about is how well women treat us. The ultimate find is not the hottest, but the one who loves that we are men and she lets us be men. Lets us be ourselves.

Most men learn pretty quickly (get burned by the hottie who is also the meanest B***H in the world) that this quality in a woman trumps beauty any day.
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shortguy54
Short, balding, brilliant... (well, maybe not so)
03:36 AM on 09/28/2012
That pretty much hits it on the head. Good comment!
11:18 PM on 09/28/2012
"Hotties" are usually normal women who have to fight off tons of predatory men, so "bitchiness" is necessary. They also have women fearing them, hating them, or trying to grab some of their popularity. It's a no-win situation and anybody who doesn't understand that is still stuck in their own insecurity from their plain childhoods when they couldn't get the "hottie" to look at them -- which they wanted JUST because of her looks, not because they actually liked her. So, you got what you deserved and you learned nothing.
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tazmodious
Left Hand of Darkness
11:19 AM on 09/29/2012
I learned a lot. I've dated "hotties" in my youth and I no longer choose to pursue them. Furthermore, the same women exhibit the same characteristic "bitchiness" amongst each other in middle school where I've taught the last 3 years . Not really a time where boys are feigning all over them as most middle school boys still don't have much interest in girls yet. You are blaming men for personal insecurities and behavior probably learned from mom and her female friends long before boys started noticing her. I agree that men have and still do treat women horribly in many parts of the world and even in our culture's recent past. However, some of these worst attributes discussed in the article are passed down by women to girls as is evidenced by the fact that men in the US treat women fairly equally compared even to other Western Culture nations.
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White Raven
Eyeballs are tasty
04:43 PM on 09/27/2012
I don't know why women are nasty to each other but I don't think looks has a lot to do with it. I do know that women hold each other back a lot more than men do these days, and that's unfortunate.
03:33 PM on 09/27/2012
OK, OK, I get it.
I'll share my nuts.

Happy now?
RealistBC
Micro-bios must pass muster.
11:21 PM on 09/27/2012
You can't offer to take care of more than one at a time - unless it's their idea.
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Sheila Kelley S Factor
Pole Dance Fitness
01:50 PM on 09/27/2012
Amen sister! The feminine collective consciousness is alive and kicking. Your article mirrors an editorial S Factor founder Sheila Kelley wrote last autumn called Women Hating Women: A Recipe for Extinction . Thank you for your voice and eloquent words! - Sheila Kelley S Factor
12:39 PM on 09/27/2012
Sorry, but your theory doesn't hold up, basically because the "mean girl" idea you're explaining starts long before good looks and sex appeal enter the picture.

The cattiness (sorry to use that cliche) starts with the "you're not my friend if you don't...." nonsense in kindergarten. My own daughter got caught in the middle of this stuff when she was 5. She wanted to be friends with a new girl in her class, but my daughter's other "friend" didn't want her to be friends with her because of something so trivial it's long forgotten now.

So my daughter's dilemma was: keeping playing with and having lunch with the new girl and lose her friend or stop being nice to the new girl to stay friends with the mean-girl-in-training. At my wife's advice, my daughter tried including everyone, but that didn't work. So eventually the "old friend" was out of the picture after my wife very eloquently explained that someone who is a true friend doesn't put those kinds of rules on the friendship.

I've also talked to many kindergarten, first, second grade teachers who have said the same thing -- girls at that age can be brutal. They can be sweet and the most wonderful creatures ever... but they can also be deadly.

Boys can become bullies, but there are far fewer head games among little boys. And the mean girls in elementary school seem to carry those traits with them a long time.
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tazmodious
Left Hand of Darkness
09:53 PM on 09/27/2012
Believe me, girls are a lot worse to each other in middle school. They're absolutely vicious to each other.

As a male teacher it was eye opening and a bit unnerving thinking these are the future women who will someday be running the country.
RealistBC
Micro-bios must pass muster.
11:23 PM on 09/27/2012
I have noticed that the mothers of such girls are a lot like this themselves. I can't say that this is a universal truth, just what I have seen myself.
08:33 AM on 09/27/2012
Terrible article. I and all the women I meet on a day to day basis are supportive to each other, treat each other well and are not mean at all. Have no clue what you are talking about, other than spreading a nasty stereotype. Maybe it's based on the way you feel about other women? Perhaps it's time to take a look at yourself and not tar other women with the same brush.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Karen G Villatoro
Just thinking...
11:44 AM on 09/27/2012
I also work in a wonderful little mecca of female comaraderie...but alas, it wasn't always so. I know exactly what world this lady is talking about, and to deny its existence is futile. Is it based in beauty? I don't know. But I know there was a time when I too clamoured for female solidarity, only to wake up to a cold, cruel reality. I mentor young women today as a volunteer, and I am always emphasizing the importance of being nice to one another and helping one another as women. I do this because I recognize the defecit in current existence, and I want to do something to change it.
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01:39 PM on 09/27/2012
Consider yourself lucky, because not every woman who works in an office with other women finds themselves in your situation. I used to work for the District Attorney in NYC, and the girls in that office were horrible -- absolutely vicious, including the supervisors. Two girls in particular were the head mean-girls and their group of underlings would follow, usually ganging up on new staff by writing really nasty notes and leaving them on their desks, not-so-quietly whispering nasty comments in front of them, running to the supervisors to tattle everytime a slight mistake was made, telling other girls how beautiful their clothes were before turning around and making a gagging face, etc. Interestingly, I was telling my grandma about all this and she said the same thing went on when she worked in an office with all women back in the 1940's -- she was thankful she never had to work after marrying just to avoid that type of toxic environment.
07:48 AM on 09/27/2012
See: Proverbs 31:10-31.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
MissTake1989
Equal means equal, hypocrites.
07:12 AM on 09/27/2012
Every evil awful thing that every single man does is to please a woman somewhere...

They do it because they are competing for those women.

Who is to blame for the awful things that men do in order to compete for those women...the men or the women?
RealistBC
Micro-bios must pass muster.
11:28 PM on 09/27/2012
I am myself male, and I have to say the males are to blame for not knowing about the dark side of women. There is no excuse for fathers not to warn their sons before they get caught up in the sensual snares of witches.
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FangedShui
49% evil, 51% good. Don't push it.
11:02 PM on 09/26/2012
"What we really need, is to stop fighting with each other over the nuts. Instead, we should all collectively attack the tree together."

Agreed. Very good article!
RealistBC
Micro-bios must pass muster.
11:28 PM on 09/27/2012
Yeah, cut down the tree, and have no nuts. Great idea!