Talking with Terrorists? Happens All the Time
LONDON -- There he goes again. George Bush. Talking the talk to create bloodshed where he never has to walk the walk. And scoring cheap political points while doing so.
President Bush calls people who talk to terrorist groups appeasers and implies Barack Obama should wear a Scarlet A where his American Flag lapel pin ought to be.
Well George, what did you call your good friend Tony Blair then? He spent most of the first years of his time in office talking to the IRA's political wing Sinn Fein. And managed to negotiate a peace deal, the Good Friday Agreement, that was approved by the people of Northern Ireland even though the IRA was still armed to the teeth -- most of its weapons purchased from rogue state Libya. You going to call Tony Blair an Appeaser, Mr. President?
I was in the House of Commons the day Blair's predecessor John Major said it would turn his stomach to talk to the IRA. It was just weeks after the IRA had blown up a fish and chips shop on the Shankill Road killing many people. I had watched Gerry Adams carry the coffin of the bomber through his neighborhood. The atmosphere was feverish. Yet newspapers were reporting that talks were on-going... and so Major had to give a speech to parliament. I have no doubt Major felt nauseous about talking to terrorists, he had personal friends who had been murdered by the IRA... but the papers were right, talks were going on. You going to call John Major, who the IRA mortar-bombed in Downing Street, an appeaser?
The planet is covered with terrorist groups, many of them holdovers from liberation struggles of the post-colonial era. They all have political wings set up specifically to do the kind of negotiating Sinn Fein successfully did. If you want to resolve their conflicts you have to talk to them... sometimes on the QT, sometimes through the media, sometimes face to face. But in the end you talk.
You know it, Mr President, and if you don't, in Israel they do. Call up Shimon Peres and ask him about it. Call up any senior Israeli politician, Likud or Labour, and ask them. They spent decades saying they would never talk to the PLO, but in the end they did. Some day, sooner rather than later, they will talk to Hamas. Because peace does not mean justice. Peace means simply the space to breathe. Peace means crimes go unpunished ... but people have space to renew their lives.
For more on Israel-Palestine on the 60th Birthday of the founding of Israel go here. Spread the word.
And as for states like Iran -- disgusting as the Ahmadenijad regime is -- you talk. You talk because no government is forever -- even those without term limits -- and co-opting that kind of regime is easier than invading it. Too bad you never learned that.
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Appeasement
Wasting 8 years speaking to Yasser Arafat the Father of Modern Arab Terrorism
Appeasement
Giving the Father of Modern Arab Terorism is NOBEL PEACE PRIZE for strapping suicide bombs on children suicide bombers.
Tony Blair was a Liberal in the UK. Of course he talked to terrorists
What about John Major? He a liberal in the UK? Did you even read the article?
I would bet that Israel is talking to Hamas right now.
I certainly hope that Israel is talking to Hamas - and Hezbollah. And I hope that the US is talking to everybody we deem to be terrorists. If we talk to them, there is a slight but finite chance for at least an uneasy truce. If we don't talk to them, all that's left is to try to kill them. Killing them won't work.
Thank you, Jimmy Carter, for at least talking to them.
I agree. Those factions in Israel that want peace would be doing this--particularly with their elected officials. Jimmy Carter says that they would be willing to recognize Israel. When will Israel stop expanding their illegal settlements into Palestinian territory? The Likud faction has frustrated movement toward real peace. Hamas is wrong when it commits violence. But this feud that has gone on for over 60 years now can end if Israel is willing to compromise in both actions and words. That has not been the strategy of the extremists in either Hamas, Fatah, Likud, etc.
There are so many interesting books out there on this subject, e.g., Treacherous Alliance, The Lemon Tree, The Iron Cage, and, of course, Carter's Peace Not Apartheid.
Your points are valid but the damage has already been done.
Those who read the Huffington Post and watch the Daily Show are not the same who listen to Rush Limbaugh or the CBS nightly news.
There will always be a segment that think Obama is a muslim and Saddam bombed the World Trade Center. There is nothing we can do to convince them otherwise.
Shrewd propagandists know this, a simple word used effectively will make voters in West Virginia think Barak Hussain Obama is somehow related to Osama and Sadaam. It is much easier to create this kind of ignorance than to eradicate it.
It would have been more effective to completely ignore GW's speech. Now new words are spreading like a virus and people will hear what they choose to understand.
"It would have been more effective to completely ignore GW's speech. "
I have to agree. Smirky McChimp has zero credibility and his words would have been forgotten in a week or less.
Your point is valid,. When being asked if she would vote for Obama, a woman in West Virginia said "no, he is a Muslim." I was sitting in a tire store, and a 60 year old, employed, suburban white woman said the very same thing to me in Cleveland Ohio! Of course that woman, might follow my advise and check it out, (that Obama isn't a Muslim,) but she might not. The woman in W. Va. will probably never come into contact with anyone who disagrees with her, judging from the results of the primary there.
There is hope that these people might be reached, if time and money were available, and if Hillary Clinton got herself a job somewhere, and stopped acting like a Republican intent on fostering the lies and misconceptions of her "supposed" party's nominee.
No point in checking it out - those folks are already true believers in the lie. If, just by accident, they find out that Obama isn't a moslem, they'll decide that he belongs to an anti-white church. And if that turns out to be untrue (!!!), they'll find some other excuse to not vote for him. And - I'd bet that they still believe the swiftboaters' charges against Kerry.
- PlanetKansas, Tedber and Dartagnan -
I diagree with the idea of ignoring Bush and Mccain's comments. That was the mistake Kerry made and they successfully Swiftboated him. Each time the Repugs come out with an outrageous comment they should be taken up on them. We are all praising Chris Matthews for showing Kevin James for the ignorant propagandist that he is, but imagine a situation in which Matthews had "ignored" James statements on the pretext that he's just another Repug making noise.Jame
you are so right planetkansas. but at least it gets a dialog out there about this ridiculous war in Iraq and how the president allowed all those horrible goof ups at the cost of the AMERICAN people. Even the ignorant should be able to see thru that and since it represents GOP tactics it will definitely be unfavorable for McCain!
LINDAISAIAH,
THAT'S WHO KEEPS THIS WAR IN THE UNITED STATES BETWEEN PARTIES
AND NATIONALLY BETWEEN COUNTRIES GOING-THE IGNORANT.
THEY SEE THROUGH THE EYES OF IT'S MY WAY OR THE HIGHWAY.
bush doesn't talk to terrorists, he just recruits them (by attacking and occupying Iraq).
Unfortunately, the terrorists are recruited not by any one person (Jimmy Carter had more burned in effigy flags than George Bush, and Jimmy was only in 1 term) but by their concept of a the USA being corrupt, immoral society similar to Europe. Muslims in general are very devoted to their religion and see almost any religious person as warranting their respect. In America, the neo-coms want us to be secular and atheists get lots of press. Muslims see alcohol as the devil's tool. We in Amerika devour it and often combine it with sexual acts then we proudly display these "parties" in the Internet. We in America have a declining birth rate. Muslim rate is soaring. They strongly disaprove of (1) abortion (2) same sex marriages (3) homosexuality (4) divorce (5) pornography. We love these things, and we display it everywhere; in books, in movies, on TV, on radio (HS). That's a major reason why they hate us...it's our lifestyle.
My parents were union members and Democrats as were most of my family. I only voted for Republican President once, and hat was Bush over Kerry. The party has moved too far to the left for me. I will either stay home or vote McCain if Hillary is not the Democratic nominee.
Then you desrve the economy and the troubles you will get. It amazes me that anyone would want things to continue the way they are going, and unfortunatly, we will all pay the price.
Go back to listening to Lush Limpnoodle. They don't hate us for our freedoms, they hate us because our government, and other Western nations have been invading their lands, killing their famillies, and occupying their neighborhoods for generations - all for control of the oil under their sand. Read a world history book.
Okay, obviously you've been misinformed about the causes of radical Muslim anger towards the West. That much is VERY obvious.
What I don't understand is this statement: I will either stay home or vote McCain if Hillary is not the Democratic nominee.
This could also be phrased as: I will not vote for Obama.
Why? What policy difference between Obama and Hillary has turned you so rigidly against him? Why would you vote for Hillary but not Obama? Just curious.
Amen!
Behind every terrorist is a liberal supporter.
The biggest supporter of terrorism over the last 50 years has been George Bush and his "war on terror". Membership rolls in Hamas, Hezbollah, and Al-Queida have probably tripled since we invaded Iraq.
I know his term seems 50 years long, but you might want to check your riming on that.
So you are saying that groups like the Taliban are liberal? You, like most of your ilk, have no idea of what reality is.
More Terrorists killed since 2001 than ever in history
behind every terrorist is an idiot administration and its right wing, chicken-hawk, arm-chair warrior base.
Uh, the terrorist are right wingers.Go read a book or something!
noliberals,
Does that include Timothy McVey?
Where do you GET this malarkey? Are you parroting the talk radio, or did you come up with that zinger all by yourself?
The founding of Israel just as the founding of the US is disgusting abuse, where the self acclaimed victims became the self proclaimed owners. It is unwise and a lie to label other regimes as disgusting when almost all are founded with the blood of innocents.
Our President is a LIAR, a BULLY, and a COWARD. What else needs be said?
He's stupid, foolish, selfish ...
It's easy to sit behind a computer screen and to make accusations. Especially when you have no facts to support your statement.
For one thing, Obama wants to talk to Iran ans Syria - they may have supported terrorists but they are not terrorists themselves - lots of countries do business with them. He has said he would not talk to Hamas until they recognize Israel's right to exist.
If supporting terrorism is that bad, should we support the country who carried out the 1985 Beirut bombing killing 80 mostly innocent people and injuring 200 ? http://en.
If I remember correctly all but one of the 9/11 attackers were Saudi Arabian. Have we attacked or imposed any sanctions on Saudi Arabia? Are we talking to Saudi Arabia?
Bush walks hand in hand with their King in his garden...w
http://www
15 were Saudi, Atta was Egyptian, not sure about the other 3, but definitely not Iraqi.
'Are we talking to Saudi Arabia?"
if you call begging them for oil 'talking'.
holding hands....
Brother Goldfarb resorts to the typical liberal's tactic of facts, logic and reality.
How shameful!
And how wrong!
Everyone knows that it's only wrong for Democrats to talk to "terrorists" (whatever that term may mean).
When Pan or one of his ilk does it, that's statesmanship.
It's not the action but the actor.
Hmm--maybe somebody should've told his daddy that talking to terrorists was wrong--we could have avoided the whole Iran-Contra mess.
Reagan wasn't his daddy.
"Power grows out of the barrel of a gun." Chairman Mao said it, and, although he is basically in the Soviet mold, Bush must have learned it at Uncle Mao's knee.
Appeasement in no way can be defined as "talking". Appeasement is giving in totally to make someone else happy. Diplomatic negotiations are the foundation of our global society and have been used effectively for as long as people have inhabited the earth. Bush's problem is he doesn't know was appeasement really is and, until someone educates him, he will continue to think diplomacy is a sign of weakness. The main problem in our country today, is the weakness between the ears of our "leader".
Proud like all the other worried libs are defining themselves as usual as WEAK. With a weak dove like Obama, they will lose an election that a refrigerator could win.
Like a typical repub...yo
Mick, old pal, old buddy, old idiot, killing innocent people is strength? The only thing not weak about you is the stench of moral decay.
would that be the election with old man McSame? Are you looking forward to fightin' in Iran? Yeeeeeehaw
As the late Iraeli PM Yitzak Rabin once said:
"You don't make peace with friends. . .you make it with very unsavory enemies."
"Keep your friends close and your enemies closer." -- Don Vito Corleone
This piece, Mr. Goldfarb, is admirable. Truly put.
Bush knows that! What can you call his courtship of the Sunni leaders of the Insurgency? To show some progress in Iraq - he has been willing to forgive - even pay & arm those who initiated the strife - if they would turn against the tiny Minority of (mostly non - Iraqi) Al - Quaeda.
Are there two Michael Goldfarbs? You sure don't sound like the Michael Goldfarb that writes for The Weekly Standard. Better start using your middle initial.
Read his bio....esp
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