Brzezinski: Russia's Invasion of Georgia Is Reminiscent of Stalin's Attack on Finland

On Sunday I talked with Zbigniew Brzezinski, the elder statesman who was national security advisor to President Jimmy Carter, about the Russian invasion of Georgia. He long tangled with Soviet power. Now he takes on Putin:

Nathan Gardels: What is the world to make of Russia's invasion of Georgia?

Zbigniew Brzezinski: Fundamentally at stake is what kind of role Russia will play in the new international system. Unfortunately, Putin is putting Russia on a course that is ominously similar to Stalin's and Hitler's in the late 1930s. Swedish foreign minister Carl Bildt has correctly drawn an analogy between Putin's "justification" for dismembering Georgia -- because of the Russians in South Ossetia -- to Hitler's tactics vis a vis Czechoslovakia to "free" the Sudeten Deutsch.

Even more ominous is the analogy of what Putin is doing vis-a-vis Georgia to what Stalin did vis-a-vis Finland: subverting by use of force the sovereignty of a small democratic neighbor. In effect, morally and strategically, Georgia is the Finland of our day

The question the international community now confronts is how to respond to a Russia that engages in the blatant use of force with larger imperial designs in mind: to reintegrate the former Soviet space under the Kremlin's control and to cut Western access to the Caspian Sea and Central Asia by gaining control over the Baku/ Ceyhan pipeline that runs through Georgia.

In brief, the stakes are very significant. At stake is access to oil as that resource grows ever more scarce and expensive and how a major power conducts itself in our newly interdepedent world, conduct that should be based on accommodation and consensus, not on brute force.

If Georgia is subverted, not only will the West be cut off from the Caspian Sea and Central Asia. We can logically anticipate that Putin, if not resisted, will use the same tactics toward the Ukraine. Putin has already made public threats against Ukraine.

Gardels: What, if anything, can the West do to contain this revived Russian behavior?

Brzezinski: Not only the West, but the rest of the international community, must make it clear that this kind of behavior will result in ostracism and economic and financial penalties. Ultimately, if Russia continues on this course, it must face isolation in the international community -- a longer range risk to its own well-being.

The United States, particularly, shoulders the major burden of mobilizing an collective international response. This invasion of Georgia by Russia is a very sad commentary on eight years of self-delusion in the White House regarding Putin and his regime. Two memorable comments stand out. First, when Bush first met Putin and said he looked into his soul and could trust him. Second, not long ago, Condi Rice claimed that American relations with Russia have never been better in history!

Gardels: John McCain has already suggested that Russia be expelled from the G8. Is that something you would contemplate?

Brzezinski: The G8 is an impotent fiction anyway. But It has to be much more than
that. It has to be a concerted effort on all levels -- at the United Nations, in the Atlantic Council, in the EU or in NATO, in consultation with the Japanese, the Chinese and others -- to convey to Russia that, whatever grievances it may have, it cannot resolve them by a deliberate policy of dismembering an adjoining state and
trying to obtain political domination over it.

Gardels: Is the West obliged to help Georgia resist the Russian attack with some kind of military support?

Brzezinski: The question is not what obligation the West may have at the moment. The question is about our longer term interest. If a Russia, which misjudges its power and its capacities embarks now on a blatantly nationalistic and imperialistic course, we will all suffer.

Therefore it is all the more important that Russia be stopped now by mobilizing a concerted, global effort to oppose and condemn the Russian invasion. Ultimately, that could lead to economic and financial sanctions, though one would hope that other Russian leaders, including its business elite, will have cooler heads and be more aware of Russia's own vulnerabilities. Russia is not ready to sustain a new cold war.

Gardels: Should the Atlantic Alliance urgently induct Georgia into NATO as one response?

Brzezinski: The West desisted from extending the NATO "membership action plan" to Georgia -- a preparatory stage for becoming a member -- out of deference to Russian objections. It is now clear that the deference shown to Putin, in the face of his obvious ambitions, has been counterproductive. In view of what has happened, NATO ought to extend the membership action plan to Georgia, therefore reinforcing the commitment NATO made in Bucharest last March
to the effect that NATO intends, at some future point, to include Georgia.

Gardels: You haven't mentioned Dmitri Medvedev, the the Russian president, once, but only Putin. Does Medvedev have any function in this?

Brzezinski: As much to do with it as the formal head of state of the Soviet Union in 1950 had to do with the running of the Soviet government. Does anyone remember his name? But the real ruler of the Soviet Union had a name that most still remember -- and it rhymes with Putin.....

Comments

[jen472]

Maybe we should look a little closer. I think Georgia picked this fight for U.S.

[innocenti]

I really think this is the only thing that makes sense. I'd clarify by saying, not the U-S but powerful international Banking and Petroleum interests. They knew R-ussia would react this way, and they gambled with So. Oss-etian and Georgian lives to discredit the R-ussians. The main point is that G-eorgia (and their masters-I mean who really believes this operation was carried out with out previous knowledge?) decided to settle this problem militarily, which on the face of it is insane, especially as it is well known that R-ussia, with its coffers full due to its gas/petroleum riches, was resurgent. The west's big-$$ interests are nervous of a R-ussia with good Western E-uropean commercial relations.

[mayahbird]

Once again It's all about the oil.

[Bobrobert]

I thought this invasion was on par with the US invasion of Iraq.

Big military might destroys play army of rival.

Yep.

US invasion of Iraq same as Russion invasion of Georgia.

No difference really.

Big bully beating up on runt.

:-)

Pray for all the troops.

[1judy3]

In 1977, Brzezinski, as Carter's National Security Advisor, forms Nationalities Working Group (NWG) dedicated to the idea of weakening the Soviet Union by inflaming its ethnic tensions. The Islamic populations are regarded as prime targets. July 3, 1979, President Carter approves covert aid to anti-soviet forces in Afghanistan. December 8,1979, Soviets forces, lured in by the CIA invaded Afghanistan. December 26,1979, memo to President Carter gives Pakistan green light to pursue nuclear weapons program. January 15, 1998, former National Security Advisor has no regrets giving 'Arms and advice to future terrorists'. Brzezinski wrote to President Carter." We now have the opportunity of giving USSR its Vietnam War." When asked if he regrets, "Regret what? The secret operation was an excellent idea. It had the effect of drawing the Russians into the Afgan trap .. What is most important to the history of the world? The Taliban or the collapse of the Soviet empire." "There isn't a global Islam," states Brzezinski, even after 9/11. This is the man advising Obama on National Security.

[SamuelBerry08]

With the Russian invasion of Georgia, I think we have finally found a role for NATO. The Europeans, especially, should be very concerned about the oil and gas pipelines.

I propose the introduction of NATO forces into Georgia for two purposes: (1) secure Georgian airspace in all areas other than South Ossetia and Abkhazia; (2) align ground forces just north of the pipelines.

Ideally, the NATO forces should be mostly European in composition, but the US should not hestitate to move forces from Iraq to Georgia if necessary. Our job in Iraq is now essentially finished.

These defensive moves should be accompanied by continued diplomacy in the UN and bilaterally with Russia, but I do not think that diplomacy alone will adequately protect Western interests.

[Archie1955]

I thought I knew my history but I was out to lunch. I hadn't realized that Stalin had invaded Finland in retaliation for Finland's attack on Russia and the death of thousands of Russian citizens.

[MagisterLudi]

"So, if Russia is only their to protect South Ossetia, why has Russia seized control of nearly all of the country of Georgia?"
Not seized control but aatacking miltary targets and cutting supply lines and defeating the American trained and armed army. So no further aggression takes place. This is how you do it. Answer Georgian blitzkrieg with their own. Then negotiate, with leverage. Picture perfect war. This is going to be Russian version of Six Day War.
Now all the little puppet regimes will learn respect for Russian Forces from this point on. Hopefully Ukrainians and Lithuanians will derive some lessons from this. Russia is back!

[pmag88]

According to scientists, the amount of deforestation in Afghanistan as a result of the war with the Soviets has permanently altered their climate to the point where they probably can't grow enough food to sustain their people, let alone re-build their infrastructure and prosper. The forests were largely cut down and burned by Afghanis trying to survive the harsh winters through the decade long war. (Their existing infrastructure was destroyed early on and has yet to be rebuilt) They also lost two million people and many millions more grew up in a bastion of horror and destruction, giving rise to the mentality which helped foster the Taliban. Now add in 911, growing terrorism, warlordism, the growing drug trade, and the depletion of the last of their natural resources, and tell me again how this ‘charlie wilson’s war’ ended up being a good thing for anyone???

A few years ago I used to believe the proxy war thing was a viable alternative to large-scale war. Now I see it as bullshit ideology based on hate, arrogance and greed. Statements like ‘better to fight the war in their backyard than to have to fight it here’ are disgusting in the extreme. Especially when you bring the war to their backyard for nefarious reasons to begin with.

[BottomLine2008]

Maybe Bush should have DISCOURAGED Georgia from attacking South Ossetia.

Doh!

[Rule Of Law]

Maybe it's time for all of us to stop armchair generaling this little spat, stop taking the bait--laced with nationalistic cyanide, put all of our theories and historical perspectives to bed, along with our blame laying and judgement tallying, and get a grip on those swords that the government and corporations are forcing into our hands with each and every more angry response.

There are no enemies. There is no us and them, anymore, if indeed there ever was.

There are only the 1% who control the money in this world--and they all belong to the same club no matter what nation they were born in. They have found the most efficient mechanism to continue the transfer of our money into their bank accounts--War! And they play upon our evolutionary retardation, working upon our weakest instincts to fight and die for them, while the rest of us help to forge the chains in which we will be bound when the Oligarchy comes to fruition!

Stop arguing about who's "right" and "wrong" here, and start looking with new eyes at the ways in which we are manipulated every single time. I can hear the sabers rattling from here, and believe me, if you fall for it too many more times, you will be no better than Pavlov's dogs.

[smedleyludlow]

The Russians invading Georgia will be known only as the second of a string of oil wars.

[goodspeed]

I agree with you 100%..

The problem is with the masses understanding the import of what you said.

I would also include to your explanation of the Oligarchy which controls the masses, that the manipulation goes higher than the 1%.

At running the risk of being labeled, (labeling is what is done by those in control popular opinion by misinformation that dissuade and manipulate thinking ability), I would include that there is an evil force that has control of this world.

The world as we see it today, with man made governments, and national sovereignties controlled by the self appointed oligarchy, is not the world the Creator intended but is a result of a rebellion to His Rule. And will soon be brought to nothing.

It was not for no small reason that the Christ said to pray for God's Kingdom of the heavens to come. And it will, and it will bring to a wholesale change by bringing to end all these "governments systems" that think they rule the earth, bar none.

Problem is, most do not believe it. But then that comes as no surprise either considering the above.

[bacaja]

Perhaps the EU can boycot Russia's oil and gas shipments, I'm sure their parliaments
and ministers will stay plenty warm though.

[MagisterLudi]

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch."

[meanguy]

"communism is like one big phone company"

[MagisterLudi]

thats right, everyone gets the same service. It's not that great, but everyone is pretty equal.

[sparafucilli]

What was it Bush once said? "....fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again." Well, it seems that you can. As for Putin who once said, "Nobody and nothing will stop Russia on the road to strengthening democracy and ensuring human rights and freedoms", I presume that this Georgia adventure is part of the journey. Those who die on the trip should appreciate the sentiment.

[geeksanta]

Stop tinkering with details, Putin is on target in invading the whole country! 1939 Stalin's propaganda painted Finland ripe to join the Communist paradise while only a small clicque of "butchers" at the top kept the true will of the people from being realized. But he was in for a nasty surprise.

Georgia is the 21st century Munich - the west appeasing naked aggression - very expensive to recover from. It also reveals how the neocons are cowards who under the first sign of real trouble throw under the bus - or Russian tank in this case - one of their very few allies who sent significant troops to Iraq. Still wondering about the shrinking list of volunteers to supporting the U.S.? This is an opening for Obama to expose how weak the GOP sabre rattling is without the accompanying courage and skill to challenge Putin at the right level. Quoting a true expert on containment of Russian aggression, the commander of the Finnish forces who stopped Stalin's 1/2 million strong Red Army formation without outside support in 1940, general Mannerheim: "The Russian goes as far as it is allowed until someone hits him to the finger strong enough".

[MagisterLudi]

Just as Georgian ( Stalin) was to blame then, so the Georgian ( Suckaawillie) to blame now.
And Georgians now were in for a nasty surprise now as their blitzknrieg has been defeated by Ossetian and Russian heroes.

[geeksanta]

You mean the Soviet Heroes in Mainila prevented the evil Finnish blitz on the Leningrad oblast that demonstrated the "butchers'" intent on destroying the Soviet Union and made just the Soviet ultimatum of a regime change into one with Otto-Wille Kuusinen as the new leader for Finland - MagisterLudi's comment just proves in its crudely funny way how accurate and timely Brzezinski's analogy is!

[mikesw]

MagisterLudi,
There is plenty of blame to share for the situation in Georgia and certainly your Russian “heroes” do not come out clean. After years of sending money, weapons and Russian passports to Ossetian separatists, they are as much to blame for the current conflict as the Georgians recently emboldened by their friendship with Bush.

It is clear however that those who aren’t to blame are the innocent civilians living in Georgia that have been killed or have become refugees.

If Russia is serious about their “humanitarian intervention” they would accept the EU cease-fire agreement. If they don’t accept this right away, they demonstrate that their interventionist rhetoric is a farce.

[MagisterLudi]

At a news briefing on 12 January 2004 , Saakashvili stated "We will not spare bullets against these people." Saakashvili added:" "now it is time for the government to be afraid of people."

Just as like the other George, Saakashvilli, usually speaks with a forked tongue.

Now it's time for the people of Ossetia need to be afraid of George-stan puppet government.

[RTIII]

Of course, this is all George's fault - if Junior hadn't invaded Iraq, we'd still be on moral high-ground AND have a ready-to-go military. We could offer Georgia NATO membership, and make serious moves to defend our NATO ally - should that be necessary, but it would NOT be necessary because Putin would have made other "calculations" on whether the benefit was worth the cost...

George, this is another fine mess you've gotten us into.
.