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Penny Herscher

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Engineering Is the Way to Bring Jobs Back to America

Posted: 10/25/11 08:57 PM ET

We are facing an ongoing threat to America's global economic leadership and increasing the number of engineers in our workforce is one powerful way we can change our destiny as a country.

In Silicon Valley we have one engineering job open for every two engineers that are employed -- this means it is hard to find enough qualified workers and so companies move jobs offshore to India and China where they graduate many more engineers than we do. Today we simply do not have enough people trained in the "STEM" areas to staff the technology build up that is happening globally (STEM -- Science, Technology, Engineering and Mathematics).

When Steve Jobs met with President Obama earlier this year he made this case strongly. From Walter Isaacson's new biography:

Jobs went on to urge that a way be found to train more American engineers. Apple had 700,000 factory workers employed in China, he said, and that was because it needed 30,000 engineers on-site to support those workers. 'You can't find that many in America to hire,' he said. These factory engineers did not have to be PhDs or geniuses; they simply needed to have basic engineering skills for manufacturing. Tech schools, community colleges, or trade schools could train them. 'If you could educate those engineers,' he said, 'we could move more manufacturing plants here.'

But today not only do we not graduate enough engineers, women are a huge untapped resource. Less than 10% of our computer engineering graduates are women, and less than 20% of our total engineering bachelors are women -- a criminal loss of potential contribution from half our workforce.

Technology is an area that is a wonderful example of American leadership. Leadership, innovation and the place where we can say "Made in the USA" with pride. Google, Apple, Amazon and Facebook -- all are growing, innovative global technology leaders. All are changing the world today in dramatic ways. All are essentially American and all need more engineers. Google and Microsoft both invest heavily in change agents like the Anita Borg Institute for Women and Technology precisely to change the ratio of men to women in engineering and so produce more qualified engineers to grow their businesses.

Just as in the Second World War we had a national shortage of skilled workers for manufacturing, today we have a critical shortage of technology workers. Women and education are two keys to the solution.

Seventy years ago the Rosie the Riveter campaign moved 6 million women into the workforce. These women were trained and they showed that they could do the work -- building the planes, ships and munitions necessary to win a devastating war.

Senator Gillibrand of New York talks about a revival of the Rosie the Riveter campaign to galvanize women to become more empowered and she speaks about the need for women to get Off The Sidelines. She's right, and it's bigger than politics. The low percentages of women who graduate with technology degrees in the U.S. shows the untapped resource. Getting women involved and into technology creates more jobs for both men and women in manufacturing and the ecosystem around the technology jobs.

We are in the middle of a 100-year technology revolution, analogous to the Industrial Revolution that dramatically changed the Western way of life through the 18th and 19th centuries. This Technology Revolution is taking us through a series of technology innovations: the computer, the microprocessor, software applications, the internet, mobile devices and there is more to come we can only imagine.

It's time for Rosie the Engineer and Robert the Engineer. We need our political leadership to invest in STEM education, and especially for our girls to bring them into the technology field. It's time to put programs in place to motivate our students to get technical degrees so they can get jobs when they graduate. We need engineers, the technology jobs pay more, and they create more jobs in America for everyone.

 

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We are facing an ongoing threat to America's global economic leadership and increasing the number of engineers in our workforce is one powerful way we can change our destiny as a country. In Silicon ...
We are facing an ongoing threat to America's global economic leadership and increasing the number of engineers in our workforce is one powerful way we can change our destiny as a country. In Silicon ...
 
 
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11:27 AM on 10/27/2011
When I was in engineering school many of my colleagues had discovered the easy way to graduate i.e. old tests, old homework etc. One of my first jobs in engineering my boss told me he did every problem in every book when he was in school, so he would be one up on everyone else. See the difference? Today's engineers want to be the boss of everything. They don't want to engineer anything and it's only gotten worse. When a company tries to mold their high acheivers i.e. create them versus harvesting them, that company is eventually doomed. It will eventually be led by frauds. This is true for almost every American company. Leaders in America today are machined and formed, that is why they are all the same. They are within +/- .00001 of each other, every day, every minute, every second. This is predictable and controllable, the only thing that matters today.
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cyclone70
When one facepalm isn't enough
08:52 AM on 10/27/2011
here is another take on this issue

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dean-baker/a-generation-of-ceos-who_b_1030485.html?
09:27 PM on 10/26/2011
It seems like every conversation that I've had (of which there have been several) regarding the outsourcing of engineering tasks all come to the same conclusion - don't give any task to a foreign engineer above the abilities of a new grad to 3 year vet. The quality and ability of Chinese and Indian engineers is sub-par at best. I guess the old adage "you get what you pay for" holds true, so maybe companies should stop whining and start paying.
11:29 AM on 10/27/2011
If you were getting paid 1/10 of what you were worth, what kind of quality work would you produce? Sabotage is not indigenous to Louisiana. It is worldwide.
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doublehappi
12:53 AM on 11/07/2011
I can bet that you are not an engineer.
07:36 PM on 10/26/2011
I was laid off software engineer 3 times, 4 years I sat out. I have found a perm job but at 2/3 my old pay. I am very glad, because I am sorry there are not the jobs, maybe in Silicon valley but who the heck can afford to live there? I had two job offers there in the 90s and it was impossible to maintain my standard of living I already had. This is just large companies making excuses to hire more H1B visas or ship jobs overseas. There are many engineers out of work. Why would any young person follow their parents into a tech fields when their parents have been laid off in that profession. My current company is a very large company has a huge off shore support and development, we have a "sister" group development. They hire there, we tend to just move the effort there if someone leaves. Of course we have to clean up their messes. Ya get what ya pay for.

Soon this country will not be able to build or design anything.
07:09 PM on 10/26/2011
I've been an engineer for a number of years. Companies complain about not having enough engineers and then turn around and lay them off. Every time there's a downturn they're some of the first to go. I've been lucky and have never been laid off. I can't say the same for a lot of my colleagues.

If companies want more engineers, they need to make the career more attractive. This means more stable employment, higher wages, and more respect.

I've had young people ask me if they should major in engineering. I warn them that the field has been historically very cyclic and that we are not as well respected as the other professions (doctors, lawyers, finance, etc). It's a good choice if you really love math and science. It's also one of the harder majors.
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Haditup2here
8 Years of Insanity and now you're mad?
08:38 PM on 10/26/2011
Thank you for your honesty. I am also an engineer. Although I am fortunate to have a position, it wasn't always easy. When I started out as an undergraduate, many of my internships were associated with manufacturing and quality control. However, I wanted to be involved in design and development and eventually Energy upon graduation and after graduate school. Based on that experience, it is my belief that many industries and business could care less when it comes to training at the entry-level. So, to get into the energy field (research and development), I had to almost start over again --through internships and hopefully towards a permanent position.
For the most part, I think you pretty much have nailed it. However, for me, it is the lack of respect that gets me more than anything. The engineering profession is still treated as a commodity and many CEOs continue to talk out of both sides of their mouths. On one hand, they claim that there are not enough engineers and people in the math and science fields -- but then they turn around and lay people off to turn a profit. If people "really" cared about the U.S. competitiveness when it comes to technology, the would do something about the inequity of school systems and would treat vocational courses as important as courses in the Arts and Sciences --but then that would not be as attention grabbing as spreading propaganda about the lack of engineers and technical talent.
09:22 PM on 10/26/2011
I started off working for a "big telecom" company. As a matter of course there would be regular layoff that hit both manufacturing and engineering. People were like cattle to these folks. I read a trade magazine somewhere that said that anyone considering engineering as a field should get used to the idea of layoffs because the average is 4. Don't expect a lot of people to be lining up for a career like that.
05:53 PM on 10/26/2011
I agree. The cost of a college education has increased by about a factor of 10 just in the last 20 years. Doesn't look like the government thinks education is all that important.
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cyclone70
When one facepalm isn't enough
10:04 AM on 10/27/2011
That is so true

I went back to the local campus this year of the big ten school I graduated from in the early 80's to take some course to hopefully strengthen my standing at my current position or perhaps make me more marketable should the worst happen.

Major sticker shock. When I first went to college at this big ten school the in state tuition was around 21 bucks an hour now its $252/credit hour and it was just announced will be going up another 8% for spring!

My question is what value has been added to the college degree that can possibly justify a 10-12 fold increase? way beyond any measure of inflation over that period of time? one might make the case that the value has diminished since so many of these jobs have been offshored and wages have largely stagnated or even declined
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gerald4
licensed mechanical and electrical engineer
04:28 PM on 10/26/2011
US government administrations of both major political parties have created "Free Trade" legislation that has killed and eaten that golden goose that laid those golden eggs (that created new wealth) that won WWII, and then created the abundant lifestyle that US citizens enjoyed for a couple of decades after WWII.

This continued until the US government de-emphasized science, technical, engineering and mathematical (STEM) educations.
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gerald4
licensed mechanical and electrical engineer
04:16 PM on 10/26/2011
When my daughter started (UT Austin) college and selected Mechanical Engineering as her major, my wife told her to be nice to those engineering students but do not date any of them, because she might fall in love with and might marry one of them.

My wife told her that all engineers are just like her daddy and his engineer friends, hard headed, know it alls, and that you cannot tell them anything.

Maybe we engineers need to be more considerate of those around us. (But maybe not.)
06:42 PM on 10/26/2011
As an EE I give your wife a standing ovation. LOL.
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gerald4
licensed mechanical and electrical engineer
11:44 AM on 10/27/2011
Thanks.
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gerald4
licensed mechanical and electrical engineer
02:57 PM on 10/26/2011
Most of the large US engineering construction firms here in Houston outsource the CADD drafting and the detailed engineering effort to India and/or Pakistan.

There will soon no technical design capability when US recent graduate engineers are not trained as engineers by performing detailed engineering and CADD drafting under the direction of an older and experienced engineer in an apprentice/mentoring type experience as required for a professional engineering license.

We need legislation to impose prohibitively high import duty tariffs to prohibit the import of technical engineering services and CADD drafting services.
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cyclone70
When one facepalm isn't enough
04:31 PM on 10/26/2011
Yep the CAD lab at the local community college is now used as a storage room

once filled to the rim classes now maybe have a half dozen students

demand for CAD drafters has gone offhsore
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gerald4
licensed mechanical and electrical engineer
04:48 PM on 10/26/2011
Marked up prints of CAD files are shipped to Asia for drawing development the same as if the CAD person was in the drafting room, and the corrected/developed CADfile is e-mailed back to the engineer/designer for further design/development from some Asian Country.

Asian CAD operators might be only 50% as productive as US CAD operators, but they will work for 5% of the pay scale.

Repetitive Engineering design and calculations are also being outsourced to Asian nations for the same cost saving reasons.

The USA will soon be void of the technical capability to create/design/develop anything to manufacture or build.
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gerald4
licensed mechanical and electrical engineer
12:28 PM on 10/26/2011
Asian countries are now producing large quantities of technically educated and competent scientists and engineers that are probably better technically qualified than the US engineering graduates, while the USA educational system produces Historians, Philosophers, Psychologists, Poets, MBAs, Economists, Social Scientists, Political Scientists, liberal arts graduates, and etc. that are generally unemployable.

The Asian and other industrialized countries produce very few of these non-technically educated students that will generally not contribute anything to the foreign trade or create wealth for that country.
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gerald4
licensed mechanical and electrical engineer
04:32 PM on 10/26/2011
The USA must create superior engineers, medical doctors, dentists, and scientists if we want to regain the technological edge that the USA has lost and purposefully destroyed in the last few decades.

This will not be easy, but it must be accomplished immediately before it is too late.

The USA has instead elected to produce large numbers of liberal arts graduates, history graduates, philosophy graduates, English graduates, foreign language graduates, economics graduates, musicians, artists, social workers, government graduates, political scientist, and/or other similarly educated US citizens that will not contribute anything to correcting the foreign trade deficit.

US financial resources for education should be spent on regaining the technological edge on the rest of the world, rather than the US government buying Wall Street created toxic assets and constructing US government pork barrel projects with US dollars borrowed back from industrial nations.

The USA must somehow create funds to finance the re-creation of a superior Human Technical STEM Database that is required to win any technology war.

We need to reverse course of our educational system and re-emphasize science and engineering to create many more medical doctors, engineers, scientists, and educators as the US educational system did prior to the 1970's, instead of non-technical subjects.
11:50 PM on 10/26/2011
Outsourced design and engineering comes without much of the benefit and HR overhead...in addition to all the other previously mentioned factors. I started with a decade in Civil Engineering, migrated to a decade in Computer Science for so called stability, went to the local government in Transportation Engineering and Stormwater management and ended up retiring after another couple of decades as a Park Manager. Along the way I did moonlight land planning and operated a sole proprietorship excavating interest. CAD is definitely a good trick to have in the bag but in current times, by itself, it's about equivalent to being in a typing pool of a couple of generations ago. I would have never been the brightest bulb in the lamp nor prescient enough to pick a single direction that would sustain for a lifetime. The point being, there may not be a single path or a straight line to financial survival. Diversified disciplines, following the money and working multiple income sources simultaneously can improve the odds...sometimes.
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jeffrey678
You don't happen to make it. You make it happen.
11:49 AM on 10/26/2011
Painting a narrative that we are short of engineers so Congress will allow more worker visas when unemployment is 20%.
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cyclone70
When one facepalm isn't enough
04:32 PM on 10/26/2011
yep - when you peel back the curtain of the so called skills shortage myth you will often find an increased offshoring or immigration agenda
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SoylentGreenIsPeople
You know how to use Google too !
11:40 AM on 10/26/2011
"We have more than doubled our employee count in India over the past year in order to meet increased demand for our services from institutional investment firms," said Penny Herscher, president and CEO of FirstRain. "We are excited about the inauguration of this new facility in Gurgaon as it will allow us to further increase our staff and better serve our client base."

Our India operations are central to the company's overall business, rather than just an outsourcing model," said Udit Mathur, general manager of FirstRain India. "With over 100 employees here in India, our move to a state-of-the-art facility shows FirstRain's commitment to ensuring the success of its staff and its India operations. I look forward to further expanding our team in our new Gurgaon location in the coming months

http://www.firstrain.com/press/april_11_2007.php
09:58 PM on 10/26/2011
I wish she'd respond.
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Richard Bartholomew
My micro-bio isn't empty.
02:19 AM on 10/27/2011
Oh, nice catch good buddy.

What do you have to say for yourself and your company, Ms Herscher? Perhaps you'd like to recommend that US engineering curricula include courses in Hindi and Telugu.
11:36 AM on 10/26/2011
"These women were trained...­" Exactly -- the employer was willing to invest in a worker back then. Nowadays, you're expected to "hit the ground running" (assuming you can get the job).

Job postings are littered with examples of the search for the "five pound butterfly" (thanks to another post for that metaphor). The sheer volume of required skills and level of experience­, coupled with chump-chan­ge salaries is no wonder some jobs go unfilled. Instead of sweetening the deal to attract workers, businesses complain that they can't find qualified workers.

Add to that the categories of workers that companies avoid hiring -- women of childbearing age (they might go on pregnancy leave), people with less that 5 years experience (not enough knowledge), anyone over 40 or 50 (they want too much money and don't like long hours), a person who'd be taking a step downwards (they won't be happy and won't stay), ad nauseum.

Ironically­, many of the same companies that won't pay to train an employee will spend significan­t sums on legal assistance for L1's and H1B's, not to mention assistance on getting a green card. Right after getting turned down for a $900 training class, I saw a memo at work about reimbursem­ent of up to $5000 for immigratio­n legal assistance. Interesting....

Here's my solution -- for every L1 or H1B that a company adds to their rolls, they pay a tax equal to the cost of retraining one unemployed American worker for that position.
lincolnparkman
The man with a Plan!
05:36 PM on 10/26/2011
Here is what everyone is overlooking.

In the beginning of the H1B explosion, the funds received for the program were supposed to be used to retrain US Citizens in STEM.

That apparently never happened and where is the money that was collected over these decades for this?

The Gov't also shot us in the foot when they decided to give away technological secrets to foreign countries for FREE.
lincolnparkman
The man with a Plan!
05:37 PM on 10/26/2011
(Con't from previous post)... The rare skills that required investment and learning now easily became commoditized (the explosion of the free internet had to do a lot with this too).

Out of this, came easy and cheaper learning of these skills by countries with a lower standard of living, a good grasp on the English language and an ever increasing population that wants to be part of the main driver of today's skill for survival (Technology) - Of course I'm referring to India.

Corporations are hiring H1B's because they don't have the overhead (Medical being the most expensive) they would if they employed a Citizen, they work on a project basis and they can be easily removed when not needed anymore.

But the main reason for hiring an H1B versus a Citizen is the fact that an H1B worker will work 80 hours, get paid less and will do what is told without complaining.

Any complaint from an H1B worker puts him/her at risk of losing the job and being deported. If they happen to find another job, they have to start the whole H1B filing process and waiting period (I think it's like 5 years) to apply for a green card.

So the Corporations have their subservient worker for less than a complaining US Citizen worker.

This is obvious to anyone who works in technology.

The $5000.00 for Immigration legal assistance is much less than the Healthcare cost alone, plus the other costs like Training, sick time
11:24 AM on 10/26/2011
Jobs is right - there is a shortage of qualified people regardless of gender.

The key point however, is that tech-savvy and engineering folks DO NOT GET PAID AS MUCH as graduates with MBA's, so why go out and earn a wage that is going to keep that person in the hole for 10 or more years of their career WHILE they gain experience in a field that can change rapidly as technology evolves.

Of course there are a minority of people from both camps (tech and finance) that make more than average or less of course, but the averages for the two are significantly different in salaries and bonuses.
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Viable Way
Common sense is so unusual.
04:31 PM on 10/26/2011
Are you sure about MBA's? Or is it just easier to GET an MBA compared to an engineering degree?
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SoylentGreenIsPeople
You know how to use Google too !
11:18 AM on 10/26/2011
Please post the contact information for the companies that need Engineers. Should unemployed Engineers contact you directly ?
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gerald4
licensed mechanical and electrical engineer
03:01 PM on 10/26/2011
Would those jobs offer pay greater than the minimum wages that H1b engineers would accept?
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lcr999
scientist
06:48 PM on 10/26/2011
Companies are required to pay 100% prevailing wage to H1B visa holders.