How harmless is it to post an article about why people should read the bible on a site devoted to religion? I did on this very page, and it evoked more than 2,000 responses, most of them angry. I had previously written a similarly gentle article about how God should be taught to children that evoked more than 1,000 responses, almost all negative and many downright nasty.
It is curious that a religion site draws responses mostly from atheists, and that the atheists are very unhappy. They are unhappy with the bible ("foolish fairy tales" is one of the more generous descriptions), unhappy with the idea of God (the "imaginary dictator" whose task in human history, apparently, is to ensure that oppression and evil triumph) and very unhappy with anyone (read: me) who presumes to offer religious advice to the religious. Only the untutored assume that religious people predominate on websites (Huffington Post Religion page, On Faith in the Washington Post, Beliefnet.com) devoted to religion.
In the past when I have debated noted atheists -- Christopher Hitchens, Sam Harris and others -- the audience was heavily weighted toward my opponents. That makes sense. Each of these men -- like Dawkins, Dennett and others -- brings with them a large following. But why seek out a religious site solely to insult religion? I wondered: Why are atheists so angry?
Here are four reasons, none exclusive of the others:
1. Atheists genuinely resent the evil that religion has done. No one can seriously deny that religion has been guilty of wickedness in this world and has provided cover for wickedness. I refer not only to abusers who hide under the cloak of clergy, but religious persecutions, the stifling of speech and dissent, the mistreatment of women -- the crimes are legion. While as a believer I think there is much more to be said about this topic, it is certainly reasonable for people to be angry at religion for its abuses, particularly people who have themselves been victims.
2. They are convinced that religion is a fairy tale made up of whole cloth that impedes science/progress/rational thought. No avalanche of counterexamples, from noted scientists who are believers to the way in which the scientific method has flourished in the monotheistic west (as opposed to say, the non-monotheistic eastern societies) will serve to dissuade. That which is understood to have happened to Galileo is all, apparently, one needs to know.
3. Here is where I make my bid for more obloquy to be visited on my head. There is an arrogant unwillingness to engage with religion's serious thinkers. Too many atheists assume that a couple of insults will substitute for argument. They suffer from the incredulity of those who cannot believe anyone would disagree. It reminds me of the most self-assured of the faithful, who suffer the same intellectual imperialism. "I am right," a statement we all identify with from time to time, becomes "therefore you are stupid for disagreeing." A disagreeable sentiment, to say the least. And a narrow, thoughtless one, to boot.
4. Finally, I will go so far as to say that there is sometimes in the atheist a want of wonder. In a world in which so much is still not understood, in which multiple universes are possible, in which we have not pierced the mystery of consciousness, to discount the supernatural is to lack the openness to mystery that should be a human hallmark. There is so much we do not know. Religious people too should acknowledge this truth. Epistemological humility -- the acknowledgment that we are at the very first baby steps of understanding -- is far wiser than arrogance on either side. After all, we comprehend with our brains, and who knows how limited are our only organs of understanding?
So please, feel free to vituperate, argue and belittle. But understand that the religious dialogue is not advanced by shaken fists and snide asides. To quote the prophet, "Come let us reason together (Isaiah 1:18)." All of us ought to be astonished by our miraculous ability to talk, think, dream and disagree. Our first response to life should be gratitude and wonder that we share this remarkable world so far beyond our poor power to grasp. Now, let the derision begin!
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The anger seems to come from an inability to distinguish between these two quite different things.
On point 1- it is not just damage Christians have done in the past- they continue to spread hate and intolerance rather than adopt a Christ-like message of tolerance, acceptance, and love.
On point 2- yes, the west has flourished. But now the evangelicals here would take us backward. They want creationism taught in public schools- it is not the job of taxpayer funded schools to teach religious dogma.
On point 3- that is how we see the Christians here. Try to discuss an actual history of biblical times with one of them- their stance is that the bible is god's word, not that it is a reording of stories done many years after the death of Christ for the most part. And for goodness sake, do not question any of the basic tenets of faith.
On point 4- again- just how we feel about most Christians. Things that should fill you with wonder are either of course, God did that OR they don't even want to discuss it (like dinosaurs) because it doesn't fit in with their creation myth. They are given a book with pat ansers- god did it, and most have no intellectual curiousity.
You miss what the real problem is, though. We are tired of the lies and the hypocrisy practiced by so many who wrap themselves in the cloth of religion. And don't call us incurious- that is the domain of your kind more than ours.
Uh, most of us never even think about a god let alone argue about one ( because fanatics are deaf) until and when religious beliefs and the politicians who enforce them intrude on our lives.
And I think you miss a few important points about atheist anger. First, many atheists feel a deep sense of betrayal and pain when they lose faith. It's a hard thing to conclude that you've been lied to or misled by people you trusted, and anger at such an event is understandable. Second, we can't help but feel like we're under attack constantly. When the President claims that we don't count as citizens, and when we're demonized by the media, it's hard not to be a bit cranky.
As an atheist I don't really care if you believe what I do. . But I find the religious care about if I believe in their god.
It's not that's we're angry..(and I'm trying to write this next statement so you can see there is no underlying distain)...
But I just don't care about your religion.
It's like talking to me about designer shoes...It's great that you like them but why should I care or fein caring.
And when I say I don't care it comes across as anger...but it's just apapthy.
But if Atheists started meeting weekly and actively going out in the community trying to recruit your followers this would be a very different conversation. Then we would be in the same business and we could have meetings and discuss philosophies.
But in general we just don't care about your gods or the religions that follow them.
Atheists I know are not angry. Stating facts is not being angry. Stating facts is not attacking religion. It is not my fault that the facts contradict the Bible or that your faith is apparently reliant on the Bible being 100% true. There are religious people that do not require literalism for their belief; so facts don't shake their faith, facts strengthen their faith. I could easily say that I see no evidence of God; a true-believer would reply "That's weird, I do" and that would be the end of it. Unfortunately, for some religious people, everyone else must be proven wrong for them to have faith they are right.
Also, your second reason is not only a snide snipe at polytheism, as if it is some mutually agreed enemy of both monotheists and atheists that you can pass the buck on, it is also a bit "say", factually incorrect around the edges.
"That which was believed to have happened to Galileo"? Real nice chief.
The second mistake in the Rabbi's premise is to assume the Huffington Post Religious site is purely a religious site. The Huffington Post is a liberal news site, and most of the readers are liberal. As a group, liberals tend to be atheist (Otherwise they would be on the Religious Right). So when articles from HuffingtonPost's Religious section end up on the main page with titles such as "Why Are Atheists So Angry", they tend to attract the atheists already on the site to read and comment, not to attack religion, but to defend atheism.
My point is that the Huffington Post tends to attract more liberals than conservatives, and that atheists make up a large part of the liberal demographic, so nobody should be surprised that there are a lot of atheists on the comments threads of HuffingtonPost's Religion section. But I do agree with you that both sides need to stop demonizing each other and stop worrying about who's right and wrong, and focus on what's right and wrong.
Are folks like me are "unhappy with the Bible"? Well, I am a real fan. Personally, it guides many hours of inquiry and exploration. But that is different than saying it's "true." Yes, I find biblical literalists are by (my) definition self delusional (hey, the internal contradictions SHOULD make ones head spin). But does the text make me unhappy? Nah.
FInally, when I lay beneath the the stars, watch seed emerge, find worms churning my garden, kiss my sweetheart, examine a "grain of sand," I experience wonder and mystery and humility. I KNOW that there are forces at work that I can't understand. I am in awe. BUt I don't attribute the same to the supernatural, but merely to my smallness in the universe of things, ideas, forces.
Anger, no. But sadness and impatience at the bigotry and arrogance and ignorance of those who imagine I am categorically inferior, worthy of proselytizing.
PS. Why do I go to religion sites? Same reason why I go to philosophy, finance, science, and history pages. I am curious -- about the world and my fellow travelers.
As for the last point, I do not know of any atheist that does not have a sense of wonder. We just don't try to explain the world by simply saying "God did it", we explore how the world actually works. I will believe in a supernatural explanation for a phenomenon only if you can prove to me it is true, otherwise, my sense of wonder in how the world works compels me to find the real reason.