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Paying for War at the Pump
What's it got to do with the price of gas? Would some reporter with access to the Republican presidential candidate please ask John McCain why he wants to continue President Bush's Mideast policy when it has proved so ruinous for American taxpayers? Because McCain is determined to ignore our economic meltdown and shift the debate to foreign policy, shouldn't he have to explain why an open-ended military presence in the Mideast will make us economically and militarily more secure when the opposite is clearly the case?
Let's not waste too much time on the military side of the equation. The argument that troops on the ground have made us militarily more secure is absurd on its face. American resources and lives have been squandered in an inane effort that McCain aptly criticized before becoming a presidential candidate. As a Senate watchdog, he distinguished himself by sharply denouncing one defense contractor boondoggle after another in cases involving hundreds of billions for modern weapons that had nothing to do with fighting cave-based terrorists. But as a presidential candidate, McCain now unabashedly apologizes for every twist of the downwind spiral of the Bush administration foreign policy, from wasteful weapons to inhuman torture.
McCain's strategy is clearly that of distracting attention from the calamitous economy by sounding the demagogue's alarm about enemies at the gate. This week, McCain again blasted Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama on the grounds that he underestimated the threat from Iran while ignoring the vast increase in Iran's power -- an increase actually resulting from Bush eliminating Iran's only effective enemy, Saddam Hussein. The other winners in this folly have been the oil kingdoms that Hussein periodically threatened, led by the Saudi royal family. Seizing upon the opportunity presented by the 9/11 attacks, Bush knocked off not the Saudis, who had produced Osama bin Laden and 15 of his hijacker minions, but rather the royal family's sworn enemy in Iraq, who had absolutely nothing do with 9/11.
And how did the Saudis thank us? Just check the price of oil, which has increased more than sixfold since 9/11. On Friday, Bush went to dine at Saudi King Abdullah's bizarrely opulent horse farm and pleaded for an increase in oil production, but to no avail. Bush received the same rebuff in April 2005, when oil was selling for $54 a barrel. On Tuesday, it sold for $129, and the price rise is a good measure of Saudi gratitude for the Bush family's unwavering support over past decades. Saudi Arabia's oil minister, Ali al-Naimi, couldn't have been more condescending when he turned down Bush's request with the observation that "presidents and kings have every right, every privilege, to comment or ask or say whatever they want." He added at a press conference, "How much does Saudi Arabia need to do to satisfy people who are questioning our oil practices and policies?"
Enough to get the price back down to where it was when we saved your sorry oil-well excuse for a country, you ingrate, Bush might have retorted. But our bold leader was too polite for anything like that. "He didn't punch any tables or shout at anybody," said Saudi Foreign Minister Saud al-Faisal. "I think he was satisfied." Why? Instead of pointing out that the Saudis could easily open their spigots in gratitude for our keeping them in power, the president threatened the Saudi king not with an invasion but with a US recession. "My point to His Majesty," Bush warned in an interview with The New York Times before encountering the great man himself, "is going to be, when consumers have less purchasing power because of high prices of gasoline--in other words, when it affects their families, it could cause this economy to slow down. If the economy slows down, there will be less barrels of oil purchased."
He'll show them -- we'll have a recession, our families will suffer and, boy, will the Saudis be sorry. A regular Teddy Roosevelt. There is no better measure of the failure of Bush's foreign policy than that, five years after we conquered the second-most important pool of oil in the world, the American taxpayers who paid for this grand imperial adventure are rewarded with skyrocketing prices at the pump.
At least when Bush first hyped his Iraq invasion plan, he had Paul Wolfowitz telling Congress that Iraqi oil would more than pay for it all. Not so McCain, who is so charged with imperial hubris that he is willing to commit to a 100-year lease on Iraq without expecting a penny in oil revenue in return.
Robert Scheer's new book, The Pornography of Power: How Defense Hawks Hijacked 9/11 and Weakened America, will be published June 9 by Twelve.
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I have no doubt that the Saudi's are showing their displeasure in the policies of the Bush Administration by failing to turn on the pumps.
They are seriously pissed about the Catastrofuck next door. They fear, rightly, that if peace ever comes to Iraq the insurgents will move next door and tear the Kingdom apart.
They told Bush not to do it. They advised him every step of the way. And Bush, or rather Cheney, has repeatedly ignored them.
They are showing their displeasure in the way they know will be understood. Standing by and watching oil prices go into the stratosphere.
They could bring them down tomorrow. But they aren't, are they?
Oil prices are a bubble. And the Saudis have the ability to puncture that bubble at will. I bet they don't until Regime Change has been accomplished in Washington D.C.
Actually, I think by keeping the spigots turned down, the Saudi's are actually doing Bush's bidding: the Shrub's base, as he said so himself, are the "haves and have-mores". In this he follows in his father's footsteeps: GHW Bush had the Saudi's throttle production to help lift the oil industry out of the oil-glut. Jawboning the Saudis for increased production is just more of the Shrub's propaganda.
Naw, I don't buy that theory. I think they went to Iraq to corner the oil supply. And failed.
Not even Bush and Cheney would want to tank the US economy to pay off their friends. And their oil friends have been well paid anyhow.
And the most compelling argument against your thesis?
It would mean Bush was successful at SOMETHING.
I can't buy that.
Is it too much to ask that those who publish their complaints about the surging price of gas mention the need for behavioral adjustments on the part of we citizens? Fossil fuel is not an infinite resource and a sustainable existence cannot be derived from it. In major metro areas, for example, lots of folks drive 80 miles, one person to a car to sit at a desk in city centers 5 days week. If this is not an abject waste of a precious resource, then what is? We have to start planning for the reality of diminished fossil fuel availability now. The longer we wait, the greater the pain and turmoil.
Considering how much of our tax dollars go to military spending in the Middle East, we've been paying a much higher premium for gas than we've believed for the past few decades. The fact that there's an additional amount appearing at the pump is a matter of coincidence.
And not just tax dollars are spent on that illegal, immoral, despicable, evil war in Iraq -
Think of all the precious petroleum wasted there. Just yesterday, the Wall Street Journal reported that 340,000 barrels of petroleum a day are wasted over there in Iraq. Well, not exactly wasted. Our country is using that petroleum to demolish any standing Iraqi structure, build those HUGE cement walls all throughout Bagdad (and don't forget our humongous embassy - the largest in the world ever built), drop lotsa bombs from on high all throughout Iraq, fly home our wounded and dead troops. Why there's no end in sight (Ask John McCain.) to our using up this decreasing resource in pursuit of what????? The American people, when we voted in 2004, chose WAR instead of PEACE and this is only the beginning of what we chose. Don't feel bad about what we're experiencing these days. It will only get worse!
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HEY! Where's my reply?
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And not just tax dollars are spent on that illegal, immoral, despicable, evil war in Iraq -
Think of all the precious petroleum wasted there. Just yesterday, the Wall Street Journal reported that 340,000 barrels of petroleum a day are wasted over there in Iraq. Well, not exactly wasted. Our country is using that petroleum to demolish any standing Iraqi structure, build those HUGE cement walls all throughout Bagdad (and don't forget our humongous embassy - the largest in the world ever built), drop lotsa bombs from on high all throughout Iraq, fly home our wounded and dead troops. Why there's no end in sight (Ask John McCain.) to our using up this decreasing resource in pursuit of what????? The American people, when we voted in 2004, chose WAR instead of PEACE and this is only the beginning of what we chose. Don't feel bad about what we're experiencing these days. It will only get worse!
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It's too bad, as I have suggested before, that just after 9/11, the Federal tax on gas and diesel wasn't doubled or tripled to pay for the additonal security costs and reduce demand. Better would have been to raise the tax when the decision was made to go into Iraq to pay for it - that would have curbed people from supported it. It also would have meant paying the real cost of oil in what it costs for an extensive military to keep oil flowing.
Can you give us any examples of how increased prices have curbed demand? I kind of doubt that people can stay home from work or school, and everyone I know already combines trips to the extent that they can.
As for increasing taxes to pay for the war, how about decreasing spending to pay for the war. Eliminate so much of the waste that now occurs in government, eliminate those departments that have no record of success in their endeavors. I like this better.
Semper fi
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5ivIOr372BLFPhMRFPkW7HZgEEAyQD90D1J2G0
AP: Airlines Slow Down Flights to Save On Fuel
There you have an example of reducing demand in response to higher prices. Don't you love the fact that the airlines don't waste time quibbling about a gas tax holiday or the miniscule percentage previously diverted to the SPS?
Increased prices always curb demand.
That's Economics 101. Go back to school if you don't know that.
said Saudi Foreign Minister Saud al-Faisal. "I think he was satisfied."
Of course he was satisfied; he's getting richer every day off his oil company stocks.
This is economics 101:
Demand for oil has increased....ergo price goes up.
We refuse to allow anyone to drill on our own soil.....supply is not increased....ergo price goes up.
War in Iraq does present a somewhat destabilizing influence......has some impact on supply...maybe...I would give it some minimal impact due to expectations of traders playing the oil commodity market.
Another impact....devalued dollar has had a significant impact on what we pay for oil.
Why is the dollar devalued?....huge borrowing by our government driven by pols who want to hand out government goodies and an electorate that likes low taxes. Also, an electorate that loves credit cards and cash out refi loans.
If you think "we refuse to allow anyone to drill on our own soil" I suggest you take a road trip to the San Juan Basin of New Mexico and Colorado. There you will find a well on every 160 acres. Or less.
And for some reason, since we consume NOTHING BUT DOMESTIC OIL, our gasoline prices are routinely above average. Often much above average.
Would someone explain that to me?
Ah we import over 50% or the oil we use. In the 70's we imported like 20%. I know we have existing wells pumping but we have not drilled very many new ones in the last 30 years. And also, we have not built a new refinery in the last 30 years. This is lunacy.
Sorry for having to bring this up, folks, but we know since 1956 that the world's oil production will peak this decade. That we are at war at the same time (and what a stupid war it is) is simply a coincidence. If we take the war out of the picture, we would still consume/waste the same amount of energy and oil wells would still run dry at the same rate.
Having said that, Republican ideology, of course, is not well matched to this problem. After all, their economics theory is based on just as much ignorance as their foreign policy. But if we are to emerge from this time of resource depletion economically whole, we need people at the helm who prefer to look at the data and act accordingly instead of making up their conclusions as they go.
Oil supplies are depleting only to the extent that the free liquid in the ground is. Oil shale, and deep drilling, objected to by the Left, can provide decades of oil. But, we have no political will!
Semper fi
Try to take an objective look beyond those political sunglasses and you will note the Asian per capita consumption of petroleum products is a small fraction of that of the USA. Given a reasonable estimate of those consumption figures increasing a rate less than it has over the past view years (something very unlikely) and you will arrive at a TOTAL oil depletion in approximately 2042. That includes estimates based on currently tapped, known but not tapped and estimated unknown.
Before that happens there will be a greater likelihood for resource-wars.
And oh yes, I am a LEFTIST, a LIBERAL and do not regret it for a second.
Supply & demand. Raising the price on their finite resource is their perogative. We haven't really stopped buying it, so why should they stop? If we don't buy it, someone else will. Rather than worry about the price of oil, perhaps we could stop the occupation of Iraq and devote all the money we would spend on that to develop ways to completely stop using all fossil fuels. Result: no more concerns about protecting our interests in the Middle East.
Robert with all due respect have you noticed who is married at the hip with McCain lately? Yes, it's Lieberman who has a singular devotion to Israel over American interest. He undoubtedly has convinced McCain that continuing to attack Muslim countries will bring the historic Jewish Democratic vote to the Republicans.
And with Clinton all but out of the running he may well be successful.
There is apparently no requirement that you actually know what you're talking about to blog at HuffPo.
If the Saudis pumped more oil, where would it go? Since all demand is being met, it could only build more inventory, floating around in tankers at sea.
The real cause of the spike in oil prices is the fall of the dollar and speculation in the commodity markets. Caused by Wall Street and their enablers in the government.
See Senator Dorgan's comments on the floor of the senate:
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/record.xpd?id=110-s20080428-16
Apparently there isn't...
The rise in food and oil is a direct attempt by this hapless regime to keep us out of a recession...technically.
51% of Americans have curtailed spending, and since one of the things that determine if we're in a recession is how much money you and I spend each week, a slowdown in spending would surly send us into a devastating recession one that would forever undo the GOP fairytale of "trickle down economics."
That is unless we"re gouged when we buy gas and food; the two things Americans can't do without.
Simply force us to spend our hard earned money on $4.00/gallon gas and over priced food and you can tell the critics; "Nah, nah, we"re still not in a recession...Americans are spending plenty!"
The price of oil has gone up in Europe and Asia as well. US inflation is a valid point but it does not cover the whole picture. Demand is only being met because plenty of consumers have been priced out of the oil market already. One can not expect the Europeans and Americans to fold on a large scale until prices will go well into the $10-$15/gallon range for transportation fuels.
I agree agrrec.
See todays Guardian: http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2008/may/22/oil.bubble.economics
It is a bubble that, like all bubbles, is bound to bust.
WHAT?????
Your saying if we keep paying high gas prices the war will be paid for?????
There will be no National Debt because of the war????
Your fooling who exactly????
The "COST" of this war should not be confused with paying FOR the war.
Economically, a "cost" is anything you have to give up in order to gain another thing. We've had to give up a hell of a lot for this war.
The devalued dollar is a COST of this war; we are having to forgo the strong dollar to have this war. Expensive gas is a COST of this war. The 4000+ American lives and untold Iraqi lives lost are a COST of this war. All of the basic freedoms that this administration has abrogated in their pursuit of unbridled power are a COST.
And these are COSTs we will be paying long after this war is over.
Robert, you're asking Americans to connect the dots. But most Americans are either incapable of doing that because they think each issue is independent of every other issue or they connect the dots in all the wrong ways. A perfect example of that is the fact that so many Americans were quick to believe Saddam Hussein was behind 9/11. The logic goes like this. Al Qaida attacked the U.S. Al Qaida is made up of Muslims. All Muslims are terrorists and in league with one another. Hussein is a Muslim. Therefore, he was behind 9/11. Barack Obama got it wrong when he said rural white voters are bitter. They're not bitter. The rest of us are bitter. Bitter because so many of our fellow Americans are so stupid and so easily manipulated that they voted for Bush twice and allowed him to invade Iraq. I don't care if saying so makes me an elitist. If an elitist is someone who knows the facts, questions everything the media and government tells him, and dares to use reason instead of being spoonfed his thoughts by Fox News, then I'm an elitist. The ignorant voter is the most dangerous creature in America.
You shouldn't call yourself a dangerous creature, I'm sure you're an OK guy.
"Robert, you're asking Americans to connect the dots."
Well, he is asking Americans to connect the wrong dots, again. And they will gladly follow all the way to the wrong conclusion. Barack Obama will bring the war to an end and oil prices will keep climbing. I wonder what other wrong explanation Americans will come up with to explain that...
An elitist is merely someone who doesn't drink lite beer.
The dollar keeps shrinking. We pay more at the pump. Duhhhhhh--oohhhhhhhhh. Nothing makes my day more than laughing at someone with a huge 4WD SUV festooned with a Bush/Cheney sticker putting more than $100 worth of gas into his or her rolling behemoth. The look of sheer, unmitigated agony on the faces is.... PRICELESS!
So you get pleasure off of more and more struggling Americans . . . life must be good for you.
Hey, not fair... I do drive a 4wd SUV, but with gas prices these days, i sure as hell wish I had another option... but i don't have any money to replace it with something with better gas mileage (and before you accuse me of making a bad choice in the first place, I didn't... I needed a car, had no money, and my parents gave me their older SUV
So, now we're all in this together huh?
The past 8 years have seen the neo-cons sysmtectically divided this nation along regional party lines, probably for all time, and now you're complaining about us not being united?
If they have a giant SUV with a Bush/Cheney sticker on it . . . I doubt they are suffering much.
My favorite are the 6 passenger pickups with dualies on the back.
A vehicle suitable only for loggers.
Paying for the War at the pump?
Not exactly. Since the War funding is not even in the federal budget, for the most
part, we're just running up the National Debt tab, funding it by borrowing, which means
mostly from China & Japan. Apparently Saudis don't even 'own' a lot of US debt. Not such
a sound investment, perhaps. Our kids & their kids will pay for the war, one day.
You will notice that gold prices (in US $) have tripled over the span of the Bush era.
The value of the Euro has increased against the $ by about 50% in the past year or so.
The reason why oil prices have shot up would seem to be that the Suppliers appear
to be determined to continue to receive the same VALUE for their product. That's a
much higher price in terms of devalued dollars.
Your name belies your excellent reasoning.
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Posted May 21, 2008 | 01:35 AM (EST)