Re: "We've run a clownishly bad campaign and yet we still nearly beat Barack Obama. He's never faced a tough election in his life -- how will he fare against the honed GOP attack machine?"
Good point. But that backfires when you factor in how much she money spent just to hold her head above water through Super Tuesday. It wasn't "clownish" at the beginning--she ran a full-throttled, extremely well funded, sharply focused campaign, employing all the power of the famed Clinton campaign apparatus, and Obama stood up extraordinarily well against it. In fact, I doubt that the "Republican attack machine" could be much more daunting. He successfully forced the Clintons to pull in their horns in South Carolina, and that's pretty amazing in and of itself. So, yeah, he's shown he can squelch down-and-dirty politicking while also standing up to two of the fiercest political animals in American politics, Bill and Hillary Clinton.
I'd rewrite your script as follows:
"We've run a clownishly bad campaign and--for all our money, connections, and experience--could not beat Barack Obama. He could not have faced a tougher battle than the one we gave him within his own party, and he won. That should help him fare well against the honed GOP attack machine."
Hillary's Stumbles Should Worry Obama's Supporters
From a pure political junkie/electoral schadenfreude perspective, Thursday's NYT pre-postmortem of the Hillary Clinton's presidential campaign is good for a chuckle: Oh look, they were arrogant but proved to be buffoons. Ho ho ho. (Note: That's "ho" as in laugh, not "ho" in the sense David Shuster might use it.)
But in a perverse way it reinforces the doubts that the Clintonites have been sewing about sudden front-runner Barack Obama: He's never run a tough campaign.
To wit: According to the Times, the Clinton campaign can't afford direct mail in Pennsylvania (which if things break for her could close out the primary season Iowa/New Hampshire style) and made a pathetic effort in Maine. What's going on, observers ask.
The answers go to the heart of Mrs. Clinton's current political challenge. She and her team showered so much money, attention and other resources on Iowa, New Hampshire and some of the 22-state nominating contests on Feb. 5 that they have been caught flat-footed -- or worse -- in the critical contests that followed, her political advisers said.
She also made a strategic decision to skip several small states holding caucuses, states where Mr. Obama scored big victories, accumulating delegates and, possibly, momentum.Her heavy spending and relatively modest fund-raising in January compounded the problems, leaving the campaign ill-equipped to plan after Feb. 5, advisers and donors say.
"It sure didn't look like they had a game plan after Super Tuesday," [Pennsylvania Gov. Ed] Rendell said in an interview on Wednesday.
The article goes on to detail the Clinton bungles. No field offices until recently in Ohio (you know, the must-win state)? Check. Skipping caucuses that Obama contested? Check. And ... so on.
Could this all be part of the Clinton master plan to make Obama look bad? Will they start running negative commercials along the lines of: "We've run a clownishly bad campaign and yet we still nearly beat Barack Obama. He's never faced a tough election in his life -- how will he fare against the honed GOP attack machine?"
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Barack Obama gets a lot of credit for his willingness to go up against long odds in challenging the Clinton machine -- willing to use money and power and do and say anything to achieve their goals. In this phase of the competition, the Clinton's are doing everything they can to distract focus on the decline of Hillary's "inevitability". It is Barack Obama who has faced serious opposition and long odds. Hillary Clinton has shown an inability to handle setbacks.
Hillary's problems show the problems of having Democrats in charge: they can't have enough of your money as they piss away all that they get as fast as they get it.
Bill was actually paying down the deficit that Bush I and Reagan created. The last president to leave us in the black was Carter. I prefer those 'tax and spend' Dem's to 'borrow and spend' repubtards any day. The problem with you guys is you spend it BEFORE you even have it. Kind of like a 7 year old with a credit card, no personal responsibility whatsoever.
Barack Obama has divided the Democrats into two opposing camps and the millions of the losers are going to vote for John McCain in November.
Barack Obama poured more fuel in the flames of hatred against Hillary Clinton.
The Group Dynamics of the GOP will favour John McCain.
The wind of change blowing in Iraq will favour the Republicans.
John McCain's win-win strategy will give him victory in the presidential election.
I believe that John Edwards took the wrong step when he withdrew from this race.
Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton are becoming too desperate and tearing the Democrats apart.
Their egotistic behaviour is doing more harm than good to the chances of the Democratic Party in the presidential election.
John McCain is not under pressure.
He is having fun watching Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton doing the dirty work for me.
John McCain can pull the red carpet from the feet of Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton.
The political strategists of the GOP are wiser than the political strategists of the Democratic Party.
Most of those voting for Barack Obama against Hillary Clinton out of spite have nothing against John McCain.
Note the following:
1. The National Rifle Association (NRA) is going to endorse John McCain.
2. Most of the Roman Catholic voters will vote for John McCain.
3. Most of the Latinos will vote for John McCain.
4. Most of the Southern states will vote for John McCain.
5. Most of the older American women will vote for John McCain.
6. More Independents and American Jews will vote for John McCain.
7. The GOP has the machinery to regroup and support John McCain.
Senator John McCain will beat Senator Barack Obama if Obama is the presidential nominee of the Democratic Party.
Personally, I will appeal to Benedict XVI to send out a letter to the Roman Catholic voters in America to vote for Senator John McCain, because Senator Barack Obama is anti-Roman Catholic. His votes on abortion and gay marriage are anti-Roman Catholic.
How about petitioning the Pope for tickets to the Vatican? Church and State cain't make it here.
I've got a song for you, Orikinla: Dream, dream, dream...dream, dream, dream... dreeee.eee.eee.eee.eeem...
I can't tell whether Mr. Schlesinger is writing a spoof or whether he is really serious. Clinton is going to deliberately give Obama a 150 delegate lead in order to make a strong comeback later? Oh my what will they think of next?
When I think about these supposed allegations that Hillary is a tough candidate, as a New Yorker I remember she buried two non-entities who have never been heard of before or since. (In case you never heard of them: Rick Lazio and Alan Keyes. Who, you ask?) She was the wife of an ex-president for heaven's sake. Obama is the first tough candidate (he's from Chicago!) she has ever faced. Obama's toughness is hidden by an affable exterior but he is as tough as they come. In fact Hillary's supporters think he is too mean to her, like snubbing her at SOTU (she even made an issue of it -- "I offered my hand"--proving her fragility at these imaginary slights).
As far as Hillary's being able to weather a Republican shitstorm better than Obama, consider that Obama has some baggage, but compared to the two Clintons combined, he is like a newborn babe. They have tons of it and the Republicans will use it all.
As far as toughness, what comes to mind about Hillary as a campaigner are Bob Dylans's words: "she talks like a lady but she breaks like a little doll."
Well said. As my senator, I know Hillary hasn't done much more than win against two no-name opponents and then go with the flow of the Republican Congress. When she claims she has weathered Republican attacks, she fails to mention that her poorly managed universal healthcare plan was the casualty of those attacks. She didn't get it passed - why should she be able to now? If she does, it'll be thanks to the Democratic Congress, not her.
". . . her poorly managed universal healthcare plan was the casualty of those attacks."
Many powerful forces have tried to attain universal healthcare, going back to Truman. It wasn't that Hillary managed it poorly.
Healthcare is just a red meat issue for Democrats like abortion and gays are red meat issues for Republicans. Neither Clinton nor Obama is going to get universal healthcare through congress, especially with tweedle dee and tweedle dum as house and senate leaders.
I am a Hillary supporter, Obama cannot count on my vote. I will join the McCain effort.
well said gomez. Me too. I will not vote for BO if he gets the nomination.
atlantaboy and GomezAdams, WHO CARES? There will be at least two more hillary supporters that will see the obama light and replace you two party jumpers. Good day guys, OBAMA '08
I am a Hillary Clinton supporter but I will support Obama for president if he should win. Now with that said....
It's hard for me to believe what I have been reading from lots of supporters for Obama. The nasty name calling about Hillary is uncalled for. You can disagree with Hillary Clinton as I can disagree with Obama and that's ok.
If this nasty name calling about a candidate you don't support continues, we will pay a huge price come November election.
A word to the wise to Obama supporters. Barack Obama can not be elected President in November without the support of Hillary Clinton backers. So, think about this the next time you say something insulting about Hillary Clinton.
The republicans will be nasty enough, so let's leave that to them. Remember, insulting Hillary Clinton will not make her backers feel better about Barack Obama.
I'm going to keep saying this until the cows come home...
Why is it that this "New" Avenger can't even do the right thing? Why is it that he can't even put his hand over his heart during the National Anthem?
Everyone else does...
Or is it because of something else?
Sometimes the tiniest things make a difference...
the photo you are referring to was taken at the Tom Harkin Steak fry n Iowa in December.
It was taken during the singing of an anthem NOT during the pledge of allegiance.
This is a "small" part of the ongoing smear campaign to prevent clear thinking people fromlooking at and deciding on the issues who whould be the next President.
Sorry you were fooled - now you can rethink your position -- here is link to non partisan Annenberg Fact Check to suppport what we said:
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/sliming_obama.html
Exactly when did Hillary face a serious Republican challenger? Guiliani backed out early in 2000. Rick Lazio? He doesn"t count. Same for the unknown Republican candidate in 2006.
More importantly, and more telling, is that Obama has had to face tough challenges to get the Democratic nomination, both at the state level and when he ran for the Senate. Before Jack Ryan"s candidacy self-imploded due to his sex-club proclivities being exposed in his divorce proceedings" at which point, Sen. Rick Santorum (R-Pa.), former chairman of the Senate Republican Conference came to his defense" the Illinois Senate race was not a shoe-in for Obama.
As for Hillary, her senate nomination was bestowed upon her by no less than Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan (the man she was to replace). Perhaps, because Hillary cannot seem to stand on her own" in either her Senate campaign or this campaign, without the help of a former NY Senator then and a former president now" it should be evident to anyone looking that Hillary"s campaign at present is clearly inept at confronting a challenger in the presidential primaries (not to mention Hillary's overspending and ignoring the smaller primaries).
Why? Because she has never faced one before. This campaign is slowly revealing Hillary Clinton's less than stellar record in managing and enduring her own political campaigns, even while riding the advantageous nepotistical coattails of Bill Clinton.
Why there are still far too many voters willing to support Hillary" with all her baggage and Bill"s, too" is mystifying.
But, but, but....she has 35 years of experience! AND she's ready to go on day one!
Let me clear the mystery. Jack Ryan imploded before they even had 1 debate. So he never was much of an issue in the campaign. Barack Obama won his election against the Republican carpetbagger, Alan Keyes. The Republicans were in disarray in Illinois after the former Gov. George Ryan was up on charges of corruption, and then the Jack Ryan mess came along. To counter Obama the Republicans couldn't find a candidate, so they put in Alan Keyes. He came in from Maryland to establish a residency in Calumet City, IL in 2004, he was not a resident of Illinois. If anyone EVER heard Alan Keyes speak, you'd know he's a kook. Sooo, Obama won some 70+% of the vote. He had no realcompetition from the Republicans at all. Now you know the rest of the story... from an Illinois resident who voted for Obama. But I support Hillary Clinton and Obama for VP, a President-in-Training.
Sorry PracticalMagic, that was a nice spin to try and put obama as the vp. Do you work for camp clinton? He is in the lead, in popular vote and pledged delegates. Can it possibibly be clinton could be the vp, or president in training. Nice try though OBAMA '08
True Alan Keyes is a kook, but he had outspent Obama in that election by a ratio of 6 to 1. I don't know if that denotes his insane unelectability or Obama's toughness.
"He's never run a tough campaign."
Yes he has. This one was rough, with all of the race-baiting in South Carolina from Bill Clinton, and the recent comments from both Hillary and Ed Rendell. Plus there's more:
(1) An anonymous Clinton aide said that Obama Is For People Who Want An "Imaginary Hip Black Friend".
http://tpmelectioncentral.com/2008/01/clinton_aide_obama_is_for_people_who_want_imaginary_hip_black_friend.php
(2) In addition to Hillary sophomorically attacking Obama for an essay he wrote in Kindergarten, Bill Clinton calling Obama a "kid": http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/01/the-bill-factor.html. (Many people are tired of the Clintons making him out to be a young boy, when he's a grown man)
(3) Hillary Clinton dismissing Martin Luther King Jr., by comparing Obama to MLK "the dreamer", and herself to Lyndon Johnson "the do-er": http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/01/was-hillary-dis.html
(4) Clinton Surrogate Francine Torge, comparing Obama to John F. Kennedy who "was assassinated", and doing it in front of Hillary Clinton, whose "expression did not change noticeably when Ms. Torge made the comment": http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/07/civilrights/
(5) Clinton friend Bill Shaheen (who is husband of New Hampshire Govenor Jeanne Shaheen) floated the notion of Obama being a drug dealer and pusher: (http://thinkonthesethings.wordpress.com/2007/12/13/video-evidence-that-attack-on-obamas-drug-use-was-deliberate/)
(6) Bob Kerry trying to smear Obama by repeatedly mentioning Obama's middle name: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ari-melber/clinton-backer-bob-kerrey_b_77249.html
(7) Two high-level Clinton volunteers were vilified in the press for attacking Barack Obama with an "Obama is a muslim terrorist" e-mail smear campaign that has been both disproven and discredited, and a third volunteer knew about the e-mail - http://hotlineblog.nationaljournal.com/archives/2007/12/third_clinton_v.html
So you're wrong. Obama is definitely "battle tested", coutesy of the Clinton Slime Machine.
And he will be our next president.
Obama baby!!!!
No one gets out of Harvard Law without some ability to talk circles around the less attentive.
That's the given. The ability to go for the jugular is what is forgotten. I know that some of you think that Hillary got the better in the debates, but that is just indicative of the level of attention you give to anything, never mind your country going down the tubes in full view of the rest of the world.
You just must be thinking that the Black guy won't be able to handle himself. Those scary republicans will give him the what for. He'll fold like Al and John did. I think not, fellow citizens.
He wipes the floor with McQuack. The debate in Texas, Hills is finished. "I look forward to receiving advice from you, Hillary." Obama scares the hell out of America. The boogey man's apotheosis. The last chance for this nation to be great. To act human.
These are high stakes, US of A.
Of course, you'll settle for McCook and enjoy the rest of the long walk off the short plank.
Fools.
Well, I think you managed to insult just about everyone. Nice work.
President Bush has come out in support of the Clintons. Saying "I don"t think Bill is a racist", (talk about triangulation), and that "Obama has no experience". WAKE UP PEOPLE! The Repubs want the Clintons to get the nomination. It"s now CRYSTAL CLEAR! It"s obvious and shame on us if we can"t see them for what they are. Just because we"re paranoid of them, doesn"t mean they"re not manipulating us. The radio news reports (AP news) of the election is playing only Hillary sound bites, listen carefully. The Right control most of the Radio networks. It"s starting to NOT go their way, and their only hope of winning is to run against the Clintons. Don"t be stupid & fooled by Coulter, Limbaugh and the rest. They"re actually saying they"ll campaign for her. They know she"s their only shot. I like her too (inspite of all the scandals), but no one will admit they"re really voting for Bill. She feels like the safe bet, like when you're playing not to lose. But energizing the right and dividing us into red & blue is exactly what will happen & what the Right wants. What we need is courage to change it all (she"ll be a part of it, but not front and center), to diffuse any power they have left. It will then be between new and really old, real change and another Bush term. That we can win on. Even Ann Coulter knows it..
So, to apply your reasoning to sports:
If a batter can hit a pitch thrown at 60mph, we can assume he will have problems hitting a pitch thrown at 75mph. What rubbish.
Simply because Obama has managed to weather the pressure from Hillary's campaign, which not been entirely inconsequential, doesn't mean he cannot handle whatever the Repugs throw at him.
While he has not ALWAYS risen above negative campaigning, he has clearly adopted a strategy of focusing more on the positives of his candidacy than the negatives of his opponent's. I have seen nothing to demonstrate that he is incapable of continuing to do so.
All of you Hillary-haters are disgusting!
you can be for something without being against somesad -- thing --
the "Hillary hater" line is sad because it seems to e another way to garner "sympathy" for a strong woman who can stand up for herself but consistently chooses/uses any opportunity to play the gender issue.
Plenty on supporters of all the cnadidates say mean and stupid things -- but there is no society of "Hillary haters" who use that as a reason to support other candidates
The problem with posts like yours is not realizing the reality of Sen CLintons almost 50% negative rating in this country --
People may really just prefer the other candidates
That doesn't make them Hillary haters.
It makes them thinking people
... and since you don't identify any "Hillary-haters," I take it you assume they'll just know who they are.
I sort of see Obama like a subprime loan everybody is signing without reading the fine print on this guy.But it sounds real good. No substance down, will see later... But can we afford him? One thing about Hillary everything about her has been in big bold letters. I know exactly what I am getting.
there were bsically two types of people who used the subprime loan oppotunities --
(a) poor and uneducated peple who did not know better and were preyed on by lenders
(b) people who knew what they were doing but wanted to game the system - many refinancing good loans to free up more cash or buy an investment property or a second home
-------------------
I see Hillary in terms of the sub price loans as
(a) appealing to poor and less educated people by preying on their personal woes and falsely leading them to believe she is Bill Clinton and this is 1992
(b) a person who knows what she is doing and tries to game the system
Many people have read and know the fine print on Sen Clinton -- which is why they are supporting Sen Obama
PODdem,
I'm curious. Have you spent even five minutes on Obama's website? If you had, you'd know that in addition to an overall Blueprint for Change, he provides detailed statements on twenty key policy areas, giving you at least as much insight into Barack's positions as you get from Hillary. But reading and replying to all that would take time and effort, and why go to that trouble when you can just repeat the meme that Hillary has more substance, right?
Posted February 15, 2008 | 01:47 AM (EST)