“Yes, and you are completely wrong, and I'm right.
Please try to keep up”
angerona on Dec 31, 2013 at 08:49:16
“Famous last words?”
angerona on Dec 9, 2013 at 08:55:36
“I think we have reached Nash Equilibrium.
To be brutally frank, from the quality of your responses, I am finding it increasingly difficult to believe you were ever an “economist”. You were certainly never an academic -- you simply don’t know the literature.
You seem blissfully unaware of the rules of argumentation. Your strategy throughout has been to try to defend often patently absurd positions through:
1. An interesting variation of the logical fallacy argumentum ad verecundiam. I’d call it braggadocio (e.g. “I am an economist” or went to Business School; therefore who are you to question me?).
2. Appeal to authority-- name dropping (Friedman, Sowell, Krueger, etc.) who you obviously have either never read or simply do not understand.
3. Make up “facts” to suit your argument -- like your assertion that Krueger validates Friedman’s position on the minimum wage, when precisely the opposite is the case.
4. Insult (Argumentum ad hominem) -- Anyone with the temerity to point out the obvious flaws in your argument is ‘$tupid’ (love the dollar sign -- very classy)) or ‘a clown’ or a ‘liar’. Rousseau sums it up nicely, “Insults are the arguments employed by those who are in the wrong.”
5. Changing topic. If you get caught, you change the topic. My initial reply was to your statement “Repeat..wages are paid up to, and equal to the employees MPL. Nothing more.” MPL not MRS. Despite your erroneous assertion we had, sometime in the past, discussed MRS, we have not.
“Ya got me! I accidentally said macro not micro...clearly that means it's a principals class and not a theory class, right?
Pal, you can't win. Every link you copy and paste further proves I'm right. Which is common theme when we debate.
taught graduate courses....lol, that's rich”
angerona on Dec 6, 2013 at 23:01:28
“I said "Anyone who has taken Econ 101 knows how to compute an MRS" If you had read the syllabus you would know that anyone who took the course can run the numbers. In fact, anyone who can run SPSS could probably do it cold.
However, as usual, you missed the point -- a simple one at that -- It is not the ability to run numbers that makes a competent economist; it is the ability to comprehend what they say. That is the point where you fall down.”
“hahah you are so $stupid!! Did you happen to read the title of the class?? "Macroeconomic theory"!! Which is exactly what i told you. That's not your principals class, you CLOWN. You are just making this way too fun :)”
“No, you didn't, and quit making that so obvious.
You don't teach MRS in econ 101. Econ 101 is a principals class, where as MRS is taught as intermediate-micro theory. This is standard University progression. Consumer, producer, and game theory aren't taught at the 100 level, you clown.
Please, if you are going to lie, be a little more prepared. :)”
angerona on Dec 6, 2013 at 13:42:23
“The reason I have to spend time googling is that you will not believe anything not documented. I found a half dozen ECON 101 courses teaching MRS in their syllabus in about three minutes. Surely, you can do better.
“I think we both know that's a lie; as you spent the majority of the time on google during our last economic debate.
Remember..You didn't know how to compute or define the MRS?”
angerona on Dec 6, 2013 at 12:18:15
“I taught at graduate level. Anyone who has taken Econ 101 knows how to compute an MRS -- personally, I find it typical of a kind of naive business school economics that it is hardly worthy of serious consideration.
All I did was point out that you didn't even understand the flimsy theories that underpin it. Apparently, from your comments, you still don't.”
“WAGES=MPL Basic economic principals. You simply aren't educated on the matter.
Proven huh?? Well Dr. Friedman, the most credible and celebrated economist of our time, through years of statistical regression analysis, concluded that the minimum wage caused more harm than good by nearly doubling the unemployment rate of minorities and the youth. It's no coincidence that after the MW was enacted, the Unemployment rate for blacks and the youth has been consistently double of the national rate. In addition, Chile used a similar experiment in the 70's of eliminating the MW, and experienced the most significant economic growth in their history.
I do this for a living, so please be careful what you say. I'll destroy you, as I have countless statistical resources and computed data to prove you wrong in every capacity. ”
angerona on Dec 6, 2013 at 08:49:23
“Chile in the 70s? Great example? Pinochet eliminated a lot more than the minimum wage.
You might find it more instructive to consider Mrs Thatcher's fling with Dr Friedman's economic theories during the 80s -- causing Britain’s economy to perform worse than it had during the Great Depression of 1929-32 and abandoned after two years to prevent the entire British economy from collapsing.”
shamanbart on Dec 4, 2013 at 14:47:05
“You lost me at "Dr. Friedman, the most credible and celebrated economist of our time". What utter nonsense. Actually, Friedman was the most celebrated in the 1970s and 1980s, before the consequences of his theories began to take hold. These days, the celebrated economist is Paul Krugman, who has pointed out the fallacies of trickle down economics and is warning about huge income disparities.
Even Forbes agrees that Friedman pushed a lot of nonsense:
By proven, I mean look at the economic activity of 1992 to 2000 - moderately high taxes, low unemployment, great economic growth. Excessive taxation is bad, but insufficient taxation is worse by destroying the infrastructure needed to support the first world economy.”
“I didn't blame pensions completely, sobe careful on putting words in my mouth. But clearly the generous pension funds are an issue, and it's only right they pay too. ”
mmcc193451 on Dec 4, 2013 at 13:47:26
“In many countries it is illegal to take pension money from pensioners. Aged citizens on fixed incomes are living in the deferred compensation that they earned while working. Taking money from pensioners earning $19K a year, to help pay debt they didn't create, is nothing more than common thievery and illegal in civilized nations. Something I would never accuse this country of being. Steal what you can get away with is the new American business model, followed closely by those who routinely dig deep into taxpayer pockets. Maybe before taking earned pensions from pensioners the City of Detroit could go back and ask for 10% back from all the road building, maintenance and consultants who were paid billions over the years. Same principle. Taking earned money away from those who earned it. If Detroit pensioners were making large pensions you might have an argument. Given their levels of compensation your arguments go nowhere.”
“Repeat..wages are paid up to, and equal to the employees MPL. Nothing more. ”
angerona on Dec 6, 2013 at 08:51:55
“Do you own an economics text written after 1990?”
shamanbart on Dec 4, 2013 at 12:29:45
“Also, your comment "Not their responsibility to pay you based on lifestyle." -- ha! They're not paying for a lifestyle, they're paying for mere survival -- and hardly one at that.
Wages are paid based on what the employers can get away with and the job market. If we had no minimum wage, employers would pay less than that and rake in more profits because right now, the job market stinks. Raising the minimum wage and eliminating corporate tax loopholes will force the employers to pay employees and the government what they should be paying. A better economy will lead to more business later on -- it's really a simple (and proven) concept. Unlike the Ayn Randian notions of the Teapublicans.”
“No, you aren't. Why did they have to borrow in the first place??? Because they continued to spend and give money they didn't have! Including bloated pension funds which these people don't deserve. ”
mmcc193451 on Dec 4, 2013 at 12:36:11
“You really are a simpleton aren't you? The pensions are less than 3$3B of the $15B shortfall. That's like blaming the national debt only on welfare recipients and ignoring defense spending. Just like blaming Detroit's debt issues on pensions when the debt is so much more complex than that. Of course that would require an analysis of the debt and all its causes. Much more difficult than seizing a simpleton's argument and spewing it forth with no underlying basis in fact.”
“Not their responsibility to pay you based on lifestyle. They only pay on output. ”
shamanbart on Dec 4, 2013 at 11:53:37
“Consider that American productivity is at an all time high. If companies such as McDonalds, Walmart and Target can make billions in profit and afford to pay executives in the millions, then maybe they can also afford to pay the workers that made those profits possible enough to live on. Wealth hoarding is what we're talking about here. A more equitable pay structure is beneficial to ALL in the long run.”
“Bankers?? Ugh grow up. This was misallocation of tax dollars by ELECTED officials.”
mmcc193451 on Dec 4, 2013 at 00:45:02
“I'm very grown up. You should get a clue. Every dollar taken from pensioners is used to pay for the money borrowed from banks. You should study US bankruptcy Code, and who is protected, before you make incredibly misinformed comments.”