“When I think back on moving in with a 'family' already in place, I was the 'stranger' and I expected everything to be so different than it turned out to be. Finding when and where to place the Boundaries is indeed the issue!! I'm pretty sure that if I had Not thought - that I was 'treating them like they were my own' - that maybe I would have had better boundaries too, instead of trying to be 'nice', waiting for their father to speak up for me, and yes, kids will be kids!!! I think had I been more candid with them, actually treated them 'like my own' and raised a little hell from time to time- it may have set things at a different pace. It's not easy stepping into the life of a ready-made family. The growing and learning together still takes time and isn't as automatic as the newly acquired parental status.”
“Absolutely Clairenb - the whole point IS the KIDS... and blaming the other parent, or just plain being disgruntled because of the Stuff and its whereabouts, is just plain superficial. Having the maturity and the courage to deal with life on a daily basis in a civil manner, putting our differences and personal needs (not to mention thoughtlessness) aside, and put the kids needs first. Helping them learn responsibility and pleasant behavior as well as what they learn in school, sports, activities. Asking for tips on the ways to handle the pesky details... you'll find there are plenty of people here to help lend a hand with that.”
Nastasia on Apr 4, 2011 at 07:45:50
“Hi CD, since there was no reply option, I'm responding here to this comment, “That - is by far, a good plan - one central home for the kids, and parents switching in and out, but how does that work? Three homes? One for the kids, and one each for the parents?"
I've heard of different arrangements when the kids keep the house: 1) each parent gets their own small/studio apartment for their non-parenting time, 2) together the parents rent a two bedroom apartment/house where they live when the other parent is in the house with the kids, and 3) the parents each have private space within the home.”
“That is so true, if more people would be more upfront with their own selves and their feelings first, without being shady and having affairs and acting out rather than sharing communication it would be so much better overall. Yes, it's still going to hurt the other spouse, but communication and working through a peaceful divorce is far better energy spent - as well as better role models for children involved, than to be dishonest and burying the real issues. Finding out that you can't fulfill a promise you made, and owning up to those feelings beforehand, still shows far more integrity than trying to fill a black hole of personal emptiness with betraying your spouse and family. Which only leads to engaging in screaming matches and other bad behaviour. Nourishment and fulfilment comes from within - each of us are responsible for our own... the spouse who cheats, isn't being honest with his or her self first, and there is not going to be anything the innocent spouse can do to fill that void. The best one can do should they feel the need to back out of a relationship of any kind, would be to face up to self responsibility and help coordinate an amicable split. Less emotional abuse, less irrational behaviour, all in all, a better way to show caring for the rest of the family as well.”
If the single worst nightmare you have about post divorce is about "stuff" and the location thereof... consider yourself a lucky person with a mere challenge of organizing a little chaos from time to time. There exists far deeper, worse nightmares for others that involve the hearts”
Susan Shaffer on Apr 4, 2011 at 00:40:22
“it is not just about stuff (and i am not negating the rest of your comment which is valid) but that there is too much stuff.
ever bought an old house and seen how small the wardrobes were?
kitchens in these old places are lucky to have one power point.”
Nastasia on Apr 2, 2011 at 09:25:17
“As usual, the HuffPost teaser headline is misleading. The article specifically cites the l"ogistical nightmare". Yes it's just about stuff but I do believe it is valid and helpful for parents in the process of separating their lives to account for and try to mitigate negative impacts on the kids when they can. It's a Herculean task to ask with the incredible pain the parents are going through. Still, usually the best thing to come of a marriage is the kids. It's worth it to try to look out for their best interests.”
“You are extremely lucky, to have some fond memories to hold as well as a 'different' yet a relationship, nonetheless. Feel fortunate of what you do have.
As for my experience, it's strictly business until kids pass the age of 18. Nothing personal at all, fond memories were wiped away before the divorce when the bad points outweighed the good, hence the divorce. Business as usual, keeps the peace.”
MollyLive on Apr 2, 2011 at 08:01:26
“The business model works well for many divorcees, and if it helps to avoid the anger and hostility, then it is wonderful.”
“Who are these women you speak of??? And, no I don't even understand the temptation or reasoning?!! But what you're looking for in a partner - I do understand that, and hopefully we all find that at least once in a lifetime... I have to believe in that.”
Indie Mom on Apr 5, 2011 at 23:12:58
“Exactly. What caused me so much anger during our separation and pending divorce is that this woman who cheated with my husband (and who has teenage daughters of her own) could possibly influence my youngest son during visitations. Nearly drove me insane.”
“Wake up and smell the coffee??!!! Come'on.. this isnt' ANYthing new, has anyone really been shopping with a young girl, after toddler clothing, it's pure 'Lolita's Closet' out there.
(http://www.slate.com/id/2172705/) Slate magazine ran an article back in 2007, and it's pretty much what's out there. And you wonder about the parents who buy this stuff? The kids feel peer pressure to get it. My daughter's middle school (5th grade "Back to School Night") had Abercrombie & Fitch mannequins dressed to the hilt with clothing from their store, to 'depict the school standard' for dress code. First thought was - who's going to afford this stuff? Second thought was - have you seen some of the other clothes at that store?? It would be one thing if the 20-Somethings' were buying and wearing these clothes (I'm talking college-age and older)... but no, 5th graders. It's pretty tough to buy clothes for kids without them looking like little pagent queens, but seriously... try taking a 10 year old out for a shopping event, and find nothing that "fits" - and I'm NOT talking about SIZE. What's appropriate? Where did the femminist movement go? Does beauty come from within? (and no, I'm not one of 'those' Plain Jane women myself). I believe in Style, I believe in Fashion, and this - isn't. Sell a pig a ham sandwich.”
“Art direction at its finest.
Splendid idea... or shall we pass it off as ... eh... you're just reading too much into it.
Let the viewers decide for themselves, and all the whooohaaa about it - just ruins the brilliance.
Shall we look at all the advertisements now? I''m sure there's a few liquor ads that have the word 'sex' in the ice cubes.”
Susan Shaffer on Mar 29, 2011 at 05:21:22
“not to mention that revolting turkish liquor called keuck which with a little colouring can be made into another word
still don't want to drink it
quality wins out always
you might get an initial sale after that you have deliver something that people want”
“I second that, agreed. Denial of sexual preferences and denial of infidelity - attributed to the sexual preference. He could have shared his innermost feelings and thoughts, whether she would accept him for that, will remain unknown. His cover for 'not cheating' doesn't fly just because it's with a man.”
“Another issue is the hiding of a sexual act from a partner, no matter the sexual preference, says he has a need for (exhilaration and excitement) that feels necessary, like an obsession or a fetish. Objectively speaking, it may be that the ‘cheating’ was rather the thrill of the secret encounter, added to his relationship with her may have enhanced (his only) sexual excitement. Possibly to ‘spare’ her from knowing that he indeed enjoyed the sexual aspect with a male as well. Some people cheat to get out of where they are. This man carried on for years apparently, she stated they had ‘perfectly normal’ sex as well, which doesn't seem that he had an intention of cheating to leave her. There are several ways to look at this issue, and his need/obsession with the thrill of the encounter may have added to his sex life with her, she was apparently pleased, and yet she had no idea he was acting out alone with others. It’s possible that he was embarrassed to share that with her (his preferences) for being misunderstood… Sex is an interesting aspect of life, definitely, and maybe in his eyes, cheating was something he felt obsessed to do in addition to continuing on with his wife. His largest regret must be Not sharing his needs with her, no matter the outcome (losing her once telling her about it) -so all in all he did want his cake and eat it too, and it didn’t work.”
“Good point! I suppose I’m looking at not being ‘advice’ but more of ‘my two cents’ – I believe that if I had that in my married relationship, things may have been better, but in my particular case, nothing would have made a difference because I chose the wrong partner. Maybe what would stave off the divorce rate is to make sure you have a partner that cares about what is important to you, and vice versa. Sometimes when things go wrong, you can see clearly after the fact of what Not to do!”
“I can't go by my own married relationship (which I miserably made the wrong choice for a partner and didn’t have successful date nights…) but I look at what my parents had. 'Date night' didn't have a label to it, but they definitely went out, sometimes it was something big, at other times it was just a little time together away from the house, either way it was designed to enjoy each others’ company. Within the house they each had their own 'space', a place for retreat; somewhere they would pursue their work or interests. They were very happy, showed affection openly and often, were happy sitting in the same room without having the need to interact all the time. There was a unique balance there, and their date night-time was definitely a boost to their relationship. As a child it was fun to watch them get ready to go out; getting dressed in nicer clothes, my mom with the hair-do and perfume, dad getting the car cleaned up and ready to go… I say it’s a MUST for a great relationship”
“What a great relationship to have, not only with your mother-in-law, but as well with your estranged husband (you're not divorced, but separated?). Libby sounds like one in a million, how lucky to have had the experience. You never did say whether you are remaining seperated and are moving in which direction with Yash, towards divorce or to be together? I wish you well, and no matter your outcome, having the opportunity to have love touch you in a profound way will always guide you towards peace and happiness even if you had to see it through sorrow.”
“I'm right there w/ you on this one, wish I had this info on HCP behaviour when I was going through it all. What works is deal with everything in a businesslike manner, taking nothing in personally. I stop, listen, and most often take the ex's rants with a grain of salt. Responding to the behaviour in any way shape or form feeds into it, creating a vortex with no escape. Good luck to those currently experiencing the madness... Remaining calm will be challenging at best, coming back up to the surface for air can be done if you remember to not be sucked-in by the HCP's need to take over. It takes a while, and accepting that's just the way he is and it will not change, you have to be the one to change- to not react, it's all business.”
Mar 2, 2011 at 02:27:07
“Me too!! (I think the same at home)... And there was a year when Bob Hope and Brooke Sheilds presented. It had the same corny overwritten junkety-junk then. He didn't deliver the lines any better, it was still a static overly-rehearsed overdone attempt to be amusing, and will remain that way until there's new material writers!!”
tenilla on Mar 2, 2011 at 09:08:30
“Yeah! Bob Hope outstayed his welcome, and there were several years when we all
got tired of him hosting. (Hope hosted 18 times between 1939 and 1977.) I don't remember ever getting tired of Johnny Carson.
Long after Hope was gone, maybe 25 years ago, after a really, really bad show,
Paul Newman spoke out on behalf of Old Hollywood for a return of dignity to
the show. Seems like the show got better for a few years.”
“Interesting concept and those who may view the whole Lent and Easter season as an old-fashioned convention using voluntary self-denial as a showcase for their religion haven’t looked at the spiritual meaning of Lent. To understand what someone else has experienced through suffering and pain, doesn’t always mean that you will understand exactly what they feel but a snapshot view at the differences in what is in the eye of the beholder. It’s what comes out of your mouth – not so much what goes in it. Place yourself in someone else’s shoes (or lack of shoes) not just for an empathy appreciation day, but how else can you appreciate what you do have, until you give a seriously hard look and a true understanding of what it’s like to really not have it at all?”
“Cooperation and Empathy, Yes! If there were more of it, then we'd all have a less stressful lives. Due to the lack thereof, we spin our wheels.. (time and money) going to court, and having tension rule our days. Is it that difficult to see that it's all about the kids and not you- the parent?? I'm not talking about going overboard on the support - just to even-out the imbalance of salaries along with time and effort to get them where they need to go in life... An agreement or a signed Stipulation would be welcome once in a while!!”
“I'm looking forward to your new post on that!!
I'm actually from the opposite side of the fence, and I had no idea this type of Order was even available - as I Should have had one issued. There were several services that are available that I could have used (safe transfer, temporary restraining orders issued from police call, etc), but had no idea until after the trauma/drama was past. The Court and the Attorney made such a big deal over letting the ex-husband have his rights... that it caused several other issues. I suppose if you pay up the big bucks to the Attorneys, you'll eventually get ANYthing. The best thing that happened was that I was able to request a separate Mediator session (the required session that the County covers) and that raised a few questions, that at the very least did not give him full swing on everything. We still have joint legal and physical custody on paper, but the passing of time and the child getting older has made it such that she recognizes unacceptable behavior on her own, I did and said nothing to put her father in a 'bad light'.. he did it all on his own over the course of a few years. I agree wholeheartedly, that there are several (drama queen) parents, and (greedy) attorneys that belly up to the bar on getting - sometimes the Wrong Order issued... !!!”
Terri Weiss on Feb 28, 2011 at 23:41:24
“Hope you and your family get through your ordeal relatively intact, CDsview. (Sorry about the typos in my reply to your comments.) I'd like to point you to the website of the American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers for downloadable free publications regarding parental conduct toward the children, and toward the other parent-- AAML.org
Best of luck to you -
“In the bogus use of TOP, it does hurt everyone. In a case where a TOP should have been issued and wasn't also hurts everyone. Both sides of the fence are given information regarding the legalities for both parents for their portrayal and treatment of the opposite party in front of the children. Apparently we can’t rely on some of the Judges who see this sort of daily drama within the specialty court they preside, who don’t issue an order for further mediation to find the root of the cause before issuing such a court order.”
Terri Weiss on Feb 28, 2011 at 14:58:40
“Exactly so, CDsview. And your point about the judges who issue such orders? I've already started drafting a separate, not very potically correct, post on thus one...
“I placed trust in someone showing me who they really were as true and I married him. I found out a year after we divorced that he indeed was married when I first met him. He said he was completely divorced, living separately from the ‘ex’-wife, giving me names and dates. Not only was divorce timing a lie, but living arrangements were as well. His (‘separated’) wife had only ceased to cohabitate with him TWO WEEKS before I moved-in. What is true is what my relationship lacked was connection. Can two people exist like this in a relationship? It happens all the time (key word: ‘exist’). There are people that have the need to have somebody, rather than having you in particular. Do we choose a myopic view; or demand valid proof to view what this person says is real? As I searched for any one thing remotely giving me reasonable doubt and didn’t find one, the issues within that relationship all piece together with a lack of a solid ‘feeling’ of connection 100% of the time. Will I dare have another relationship -will the next person would be truthful to me? I will be able to see clearly this time and understand what connection I have is indeed for me. When clouded by your own emotional desires… we may not see clearly that the other person may want something, but that something may not necessarily be you.”