This is typical of when we contract government work to the private sector. The private sector always fails and over charges to fix its own 'errors'. This is just typical private sector failure to do the government's work.”
“I don't know if it is a twist, but not more than 3 days ago the President went on the tonight show and claimed that the US does not spy on its citizens. I am curious as to the sincerity of his call for reform if he doesn't believe that the spying is going on in the first place.”
“You have provided some good data, but I believe that you have drawn incorrect conclusions based on that data. There is no rational economic theory that believes taking money out of a system will lead to growth. In fact, the opposite is true. That is why you will hear Keynesians shouting about stimulating aggregate demand by injecting "temporary" funds into the economy. Therefore, you are absolutely correct in saying "Despite the tax hike, we managed...".
Why is it you believe that if A) taxes are raised, is followed by B) jobs are added, that the notion that tax hikes kill jobs has been debunked? For example, if without tax hikes we would create X jobs, and with tax hikes we would create 3X/4 jobs, you would still have to conclude that X/4 jobs were lost as a result of the tax hikes. As you can see, in order for this notion to be defeated, one would have to prove that the same or a greater number of jobs would have been created in spite of the tax hikes. That is impossible to prove.”
ContrarianbyDefault on Aug 3, 2013 at 22:31:15
“* this part didn't get included....
If W didn't go to war, didn't cut taxes (unnecessarily/arbitrarily -- both), we'd be looking at a 5-7T debt.”
ContrarianbyDefault on Aug 3, 2013 at 22:30:11
“On the macro, taxes have never hurt job creation in America. In fact, every time our country has raised taxes (in order to pay for things like war, depression, etc. -- things that require extra revenues), it has never led to further economic turmoil. FDR raised taxes, spent infinitely more than Obama (adjusted for inflation), and America gave birth to the American middle class -- GI bills paid for college, more money was being injected into the economy, more people were improving their lot. I'm not calling for Rooseveltian level spending or taxation, I'm just simply wishing that all of the 'fiscal conservatives' out there would simply refer to history and realize that short term tax hikes, possibly in tandem with reform, often help stagnant economies find their legs. George HW knew this. Despite campaign promises, he raised taxes/created new taxes. Why? Because the economy lulled into the end of Reagan's run and revenues were dropping. HW had to pay for wars and hurricanes just like any president, and he took the fiscally responsible route. Cost him the election, but it gave way to Clinton raising taxes further to their modern peak of 39%. As our books started getting balanced, we rode a great economic wave from 92-2000. He threw a bone with cap gains tax cut (and later Glass Steagal repeal, huge mistake), but that didn't come until his 2nd term. By then the economy already added several million jobs and was on course to add several million more).”
“Please explain the rational behind your thinkinf that raising taxes leads to increased economic output.”
ContrarianbyDefault on Aug 3, 2013 at 01:15:40
“1992 - 2000.
After lowering taxes beyond a long-term/sustainable level in the 80s, first George HW Bush, then Bill Clinton, both raised taxes, and Clinton's was raised up to 39% for the top margin. Though Clinton lowered Cap Gains taxes, he did so in 1997, and the economy was already on the same trajectory of creating 20+ million jobs from 92-2000. Just saying -- we raised taxes -- and our tax base expanded more than it ever had in American history. Despite the tax hike, we managed to create 20+ million jobs. Kind of defeats the notion that tax hikes 'kill' job creation.”
“Lets focus on the whole game. The tax cuts on income over $250K only "cost" around $700B. Cuts on income below $250K "cost" around $3T. The crash was caused by the housing bubble, which didn't have anything to do with the tax cuts. The housing bubble was inflated due to the policies of universal home ownership over many administrations, starting with Carter and jump started during Clinton. In fact, the current administration is re-implementing many of those same policies that led to the bubble in the first place. There are no rational economists that think the economic crisis was caused primarily by the Bush Tax Cuts.”
“Well we have those higher taxes now. How is that working out?”
ContrarianbyDefault on Aug 2, 2013 at 10:52:04
“We actually don't, but thanks for kind of paying attention.
We raised the top margin back up. That's all. Comparing an 8 year economic period to a 1.5 year economic period (in which the economy is depressed) is hardly an accurate measure for success/failure.”
“How was economy following the '03 Bush Tax Cuts?”
pb28 on Aug 3, 2013 at 22:17:57
“To you facts are convenient things you choose to ignore like the fact the republican controlled congress were willing participants to this deregulation”
pb28 on Aug 2, 2013 at 23:48:21
“Republicans sure get upset when the president blames bush, and rightfully so. But they have no problem blaming Clinton who hasn’t been in office since 2000. Can you link to the article you referenced”
“You prefer to focus on the first couple of innings. I choose to focus on the final score. Tax cuts for the wealthy added trillions to our deficit combined with republican out of control sending helped cause the crash in 2008. W jobs creation record was stagnate compared to the current president. In Obama’s first four years in office he created more jobs then W did in 8”
pb28 on Aug 2, 2013 at 10:04:24
“how was it after 08”
ContrarianbyDefault on Aug 2, 2013 at 09:44:05
“Not as good as it was from 92-2000. When taxes were higher.”
andy txn on Aug 2, 2013 at 09:41:34
“For the rich great, for the rest of the average middle class harking Joe/Jane, not so good.”