“I think it is not the "regular" people who do that. it is -- more like hate groups , like nativitist and fringe groups like hate group FAIR that demonizes illegal immigrants, and have special interest, they work online promoting hate toward immigration reform, they are extremist restrictionist and advocates of rounding up 12 million people, and taking citizenship away from native-born US immigrant children, some of the republican party are actually part of this group so called FAIR, make no mistake about it, some politicians have an agenda against reform that is why the issue is harder than it would normally be. like rep. Brian Bilbray and Sen Jeff Session, rep Brain is on the FAIR members board. I wish they would actually debate and get to a consensus and just say no no no and use fear mongering and demagoging.”
Norski on Jul 15, 2010 at 18:44:07
“If you want to discuss fear mongering and demagoging there is enough blame to go around. For every instance cited on one side there is another instance coming from the other. For example - a recent Pew Center Study says 78% of all Illegal Immigrants are Latino. Therefore there is no way possible for ANY enforcement to escape the label of Racial Profiling because this concept is based on the incorrectly simple idea that if statistics show more people of one ethnic group are affected than any other it must be racist. This has been demagogued to death.
Another example is the phrase "reasonable suspicion". The words "reasonable suspicion" actually appears in the United States Federal Code of Regulations 174 times, across all forms of law enforcement. Why is this phrase suddenly a problem now and only in connection with the Arizona Immigration Law enforcement when in fact it has been upheld by the Supreme Court? Yet this phrase has been fear mongered to death.
And then there is the “breaking up families” mantra. In fact, Law Enforcement breaks up families every day while doing their job. Many Robbers, Con Artists, Drunk Drivers, and even Murderers have families. Yet all are routinely jailed thus “breaking up families”. So why is it the only violation of Criminal Law that causes people to decry “breaking up families” is the violation called Illegal Entry into the United States of America?
Those who live in glass houses should not throw stones.”
Appleblossom on Jul 14, 2010 at 20:32:05
“The thing I do not get is if your only solution is "deport them" without bothering to pay attention to the fact that most humans are not stupid enough to turn themselves in if it means going back to the same situation they just crossed a burning hot desert to get away from.
I have no problem with a person turning their self in, being verified they are illegal, fined a huge amount and then while they are paying the fine off they are given a legal status. Once they fail to pay and keep the court handling it updated with their address, then deport them. Otherwise you will not get them to self surrender-just will not happen. There must be an incentive to doing so.”
“What the heck are you talking about Rob? The people are sick and tired of congress not addressing the issue, all the opposite of what you are saying. What do you mean "with us" you mean, you? and why are you making up shi!? is the the miss information you are spreading? I am conservative but people like you just make me sick polarizing the issues.”
“"but giving people a pass because it would be to hard to enforce the law is not what America is about. "
DREAM ACT students are not asking for a free pass. They have definitely earned what they are asking for, and all they ask for is an opportunity to be equal the same as their peers. What is unfair is denying them the opportunity to fully participate in society.”
“"Providing an easy path to citizenship to individuals who have come her illegally is unfair"
Since when is life fair?
"It is unfair to say to the peoples of India and China that because they cannot walk here they must go through the regular process,"
Not sure what to tell you but that has nothing to do with anything. And definitely has nothing to do with the DREAM ACT, and there are DREAM ACT students from these countries you mentioned.
"while we tell the people south of the boarder that if you can walk here then you can stay here."
Again, this has nothing to do with the DREAM ACT.
"While the DREAM Act has admirable aims I would rather spend our time and resources getting the millions of American college kids lower debt and more degrees."
Everybody is already doing it. DREAM ACT doesn't stop other students from getting degree. These students at least most of them agree with the DREAM ACT as far as I am concerned. Are you saying they are less capable of DREAM ACT students?
"Liberalism use to be about fairness and equality, there is nothing unfair about our immigration process, "
Really? you must live under a rock, no offense, or lack of a lot of knowledge about the subject.”
“"They aren't just "out of state", they are out of COUNTRY. But I guess that concept is foreign to you."
Out of country fees are called international fees. And DREAM ACT students would pay the same the same as anyone else if they move to a different state.
So are you trying to say "citizens" will pay more because they more to a state where DREAM ACT students reside?, - no offense but your argument is ridiculous. An if DREAM ACT students move to where citizens live, they would pay more. So that sounds like the same to me.
But you are making it look like DREAM ACT students should have less rights and they "would never move" and that they would pay less than citizens which is not the case at all. They basically pay the same. You move you pay more, regardless of status.
again, misguided information.”
dtairtime on May 18, 2010 at 09:33:56
“Not misguided. Again I give the example of a person who admittedly is a resident of another state. But that persons parents and themselves all pay taxes (both federal, state and local) While the illegal does not pay taxes in most cases and if they do likely pays very little or due to their high birth rate gets more back in EITC and deductions then they pay in.
The bottom line is that this roach motel is fast becoming full. the last thing we need are people like this to stay here. Millions across the world would LOVE the chance to come here, PAY FULL PRICE for their education and never break our laws. So there is NO REASON to give it away to criminals!”
“"At least be honest and say so if that is your idea! But don't complain when 20 or so years down the road we have 50 million illegals and 450 citizens, no water, no energy sources (except countries that hate us), no sewer systems, no good schools, etc. Because we can't keep up now how could we even stay close if we open the floodgates? "
This is obviously misguided information and has nothing to do with the DREAM ACT students. And these are anti-immigrant hate group talking points, and we are talking about students that already live in America an do nothing but contribute to society. There are 65,000 students graduating each year, there are like 300 million people living in the US. Logically speaking - 65k derivatives would never be like 300m that are able to bring family here, since everyone is descent from immigrants at some point. If you read a lot anti-immigrants hate group site like fairs, you are going to probably find a lot bs like that, which DREAM ACT students have no say about, and don't don't change the main topic which is about the DREAM ACT students. Is like saying, we shouldn't make more cars because the streets are full of them, or we shouldn't make more cloth because we already have plenty. So is misguided information and the topic here is DREAM ACT.”
dtairtime on May 18, 2010 at 09:30:36
“It is as relavant as saying that we also don't give the children of other criminals a freebie because their parents commited a crime. If a bank robber were to get caught we don't allow his kids to keep the money he took - even if it makes the kids life better.
There can be NO rewards for illegals. No drivers licenses, no jobs, no welfare, no DREAM ACT, no amnesty. If we do any of those things nobody outside of a very naive person should be surprised when they keep coming.
The relevancy is that we have already thrown hundreds of thousands of TAXPAYER money away to educate these kids. A gift to them to take back to THEIR country to make IT better.”
“"Puns aside it just makes no sense to continue to reward to reward and encourage behavior that is either unwanted or illegal. "
I have yet to see any regards for DREAM ACT students. As far as I am concerned DREAM ACT students have not committed any crimes. You can't hold a children accountable by what their parents do. And this is the case.
If your logic makes sense in your head, alcohol and cigarettes would be illegal now since they are heavy "unwanted " by a lot of people.”
dtairtime on May 18, 2010 at 09:26:06
“Luckily it is not your concern - If it were we would have no borders, tens of millions of uneducated people poring in and within a short period of time the country would no longer exist.
At least we no longer subsidize cigs or alcohol. We used to and the result was more alcoholics. If we keep giving illegals things that make life easier and better for them then we will have more of them - again luckily that is not your concern either.”
The anti-immigrant propaganda makes up every excuse to make the dream act seem as a bad policy for America but what they won't tell you is, that they are fully formulated on lies and misguided information... you know the usual with fox news.”
“:The dream act is a bad dream for citizens. A tax paying, legal citizen can't send their kids a few miles across a state line without paying extra. Yet an illegal alien (it really doesn't matter what his sexual preference is) can pay less. Either lower the rates for all or let him go home and get his education. "
The older arguments which are false.
First of all
"The dream act is a bad dream for citizens. A tax paying, legal citizen can't send their kids a few miles across a state line without paying extra. "
That applies to everyone. Even DREAM ACT students.
"Yet an illegal alien (it really doesn't matter what his sexual preference is) can pay less. Either lower the rates for all or let him go home and get his education. "
That is a big fat lie.
anyone who moves out of states will pay more. Regardless of their status.”
dtairtime on May 18, 2010 at 00:50:29
“They aren't just "out of state", they are out of COUNTRY. But I guess that concept is foreign to you.
Puns aside it just makes no sense to continue to reward and encourage behavior that is either unwanted or illegal. Unless you want illegals and want it to be legal. At least be honest and say so if that is your idea! But don't complain when 20 or so years down the road we have 50 million illegals and 450 citizens, no water, no energy sources (except countries that hate us), no sewer systems, no good schools, etc. Because we can't keep up now how could we even stay close if we open the floodgates?”