Apr 1, 2008 at 19:44:03
Don't blow a gasket. I am just taking the 1% from the post I commented on-
"if there was a 1-2% of the population that had contraindictions"
Now I could have said 2% so chill as this is a discussion and not a debate, right? -no conspiracy here and to suggest otherwise is just the usual crap from you and some others in pushing the envelope to excite and anger. I'm not biting. Let's just try to be civil, ok?”
Apr 1, 2008 at 18:56:54
“Thanks Kim for writing this. There are so many more Leilas and Davids which is why we all fight like hell. My Meg is 15 now. We have improved her quality of life 10x over as she is not in constant pain, seeks us out for attention and affection, can be out in the community more (albeit with construction hedphones to reduce the noise) without flipping out due to panic, and is just more comfortable and joyful in general. This is due to diet and biomed.
The future is what I fear each day when I awaken and each night as I fall asleep.
Who will be me?
Apr 1, 2008 at 01:33:51
You are a bull in the china store with your prepared agenda. You have your loyalties and I have mine. I am a parent to a child, severely autistic. Who are you ? If all you have is what Paul Offit offers, then you have lies, my fellow blogger. Equal sport.....
ThoJ on Apr 1, 2008 at 14:39:39
“Dr. Offit is not a researcher in mitochondrial disorders. Dr. DiMauro is. What he has to offer is very much of concern in this discussion.
Dr. DiMauro is definitely highly regarded in the field. In the area of mitochondrial disorders and autism, he is a coauthor on one of the major papers, "Mitochondrial DNA Abnormalities and Autistic Spectrum Disorders". It is worth reading. It is interesting that they state:
"Offspring of mothers carrying the A3243G mtDNA mutation can also present with autistic features, even when the mutation is undetectable in easily accessible tissues."
So, even though the mutation was not detected in all the children, it appears to be a factor in the children's autism.
Also, there is no mention of how this mtDNA mutation affected the mothers. If the mothers have detectible mtDNA mutations, but no or less severe autistic symptoms, that would be very relevant to the Poling case (and future cases).
Two of the patients in that study had noted medical concerns with maternal relatives. For one, four maternal uncles were noted. Wouldn't that be an intersting line of inqiriy?”
You didn't even come close to answering his question and the rest is gibberish speculation. Your continual, abrupt, incongruent posts tell us nothing about science but lots about your cheerleading efforts in the name of PHRMA.”
Scote on Mar 30, 2008 at 14:21:58
“Cheerleading for rational inquiry and sound, rigorous science != cheerleading for corporate pharmaceuticals.
Are the pharmaceutical companies perfect? No. Do childhood vaccines cause autism? No.”
Is there more to this? I am not seeing your point. Looking at that list of symptoms, I could include my daughter and about 85% , possibly more,of the kids I know with autism to have had almost all those symptoms. That is why DMS is completely inadequate as these kids have such medical problems not ever discussed by the media, their peds, CDC and interestingly, from your camp.
foe2Hg on Mar 30, 2008 at 11:24:28
“I wrote DMS as I was copying from you but we both mean DSM IV, Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, 4th Edition. In case anyone needed clarification.
“It is incredible that Julie is able to keep up her act, still. She does appear to have changed her script a bit but it and the pink do little to put her on the roster of government officials who did their job. She and Paul Offit remind me of the pod people in "Invasion of the Body Snatchers". No emotion, robotic lies, and will do whatever it takes to convert everyone. Is there a pod under your bed?”
Mar 28, 2008 at 22:03:29
You are a GREAT mom and writer! It IS like a tilt-a-whirl and when you throw in the uneducated/ (uncaring ?) docs, the conflict of interest politicians, the "ties with PHRMA" media, and the crazed "vaccines save lives" (though they're damaging dozens for each "saved" )mr and mrs usa, it can feel more like the Fun House.
Thanks for continuing the fight to educate and stop this dang ride.
Mar 28, 2008 at 19:46:06
“Well, that was creepy. The link took me to your page where you slice and dice J. B. and lots of others. I'll take a pass dr. Orac as I enjoy nonfiction rather than the fictitious and bizarre life you lead.
Here's a better link ~
Mar 28, 2008 at 00:28:52
“"Depends on what you mean by safe. Lots of things we do everyday carry some risk. "
Vaccinating is not everday and is a medical procedure. I define safe meaning that there is confidence that injury is not obtainable. Please don't waste our time by doing the "anti-vaccine" gig...ie conspiracy theorists, litigious, anti-mercury, small/vocal, diet fad, Wakefield supporters, parents vs research, ad nauseam .......rerun.
On this day doctors gave Poling nine vaccines. In a way July 19th was D-day for the Polings, the day their daughter departed their lives.
Terry Poling described her daughter's severe reaction to the vaccines.
"She was screaming, arching her back. She had a high fever. When I spoke to her she would not respond to me," Terry said.
Hannah's parents hoped her condition would improve. It didn't. The little girl who had, until this point, been at the 95th percentile at every doctor's visit, stopped eating, stopped gaining weight, stopped growing.”
Orac on Mar 28, 2008 at 10:21:50
“"First, it is so tiring to hear the term "anti-vaccination" when we parents just want safe vaccines. Can you come up with something more meaningful like "pro safe vaccines"?"
No, calling you "antivaccination" is usually quite appropriate:
Oct 1, 2012 at 20:47:08
“Thank you, Kim. I had to do this two years ago. It is emotional on so many levels. The number of courtrooms doing this in Chicago is steadily increasing as the tsunami of the autism epidemic begins to hit. Since there are so many medical pieces to autism, especially the immune system, we need to keep hammering prevention - treatments - cure for sure! We are with you!
Oct 18, 2010 at 07:20:03
“Good Morning, Sheldon.
It has been since the 1943 paper by Leo Kanner, that parental concerns have been overlooked and/or dismissed in autism. Kanner, too, did not see connections that were there, though many of those parents reported how sick, physically ill, their child was:
- there were frequent changes of formulas. “Eating,” the report said, “has always been a problem with him. He has never shown a normal appetite.
- large and ragged tonsils
- He vomited a great deal during his first year, and feeding formulas were changed frequently with little success.
- She nursed very poorly and was put on bottle after about a week. She quit taking any kind of nourishment at 3 months. She was tube-fed five times daily up to 1 year of age.
- His father said: "The main thing that worries me is the difficulty in feeding. That is the essential thing, and secondly his slowness in development. During the first days of life he did not take the breast satisfactorily. After fifteen days he was changet from breast to bottle but did not take the bottle satisfactorily. There is a long story of trying to get food down.
- "the feeding formula caused much concern
Their concerns are finally being taken seriously.”
Sheldon101 on Oct 18, 2010 at 12:28:02
“Good morning, foe2Hg. I'm a foe of mercury as well. That's why, I'm not going to put my old mercury type thermostat in the garbage, but have it disposed of safely.
Your response is that Kanner didn't take seriously the observations of parents which you specify. I think you go further and say because he didn't take those observations seriously, he missed out seeing connections. Based on what you've written, I don't see how the word concerns, which you later use, means more than the observations made by these parents.
Parents have observed a regression into autism after their child has been vaccinated. Some chose to blame vaccination. The observation of regression after vaccination lead to a lot of work into the origins and cause of autism and whether vaccines were involved. That work has concluded that vaccines do not cause autism. The serious concerns of parents have been investigated. Aside from a flu vaccine given no earlier than 6 months, thimerosal has been removed from routine vaccinations given to children from 0 to 6 years.
The concerns of some parents based on their observation that regression occurred after vaccination has been taken seriously. While one may follow the other, the evidence is that vaccination does not cause autism.”
Oct 18, 2010 at 01:31:50
This was perfectly said. The Sheldons of the world though are not happy as you give evidence and "mommy" logic which wins over the plane-a-way, foreign, epidemiological nonsense. The safe vaccines side seems to be winning against the...anti - safe vaccines side or are they just pro -profit ..? Thanks for advocating for Megan and all of the kids who have been harmed and those who are still in harms way.
Looking forward to hearing Dr. Wakefield Monday night and then this next weekend, also will be attending in Chicago, a book presentation by our other autism truth-seekers, Dan Olmsted and Mark Blaxill. Their book, like yours, gives a real flavor of this autism epidemic. Their journey back to the original Kanner 11 and the connections to mercury in history and medicine, leading up to the introduction of thimerosal in fungicides and vaccines, is truly amazing. Thanks again for speaking up for the concerns that parents increasingly have about vaccines.”
Sheldon101 on Oct 18, 2010 at 03:43:13
“What a great comment. Thank you.
Parents, see for yourself how vaccination opponents ridicule epidemiological studies. You know, like John Snow's famous study of the cause of cholera in 19th century London that proved that it was contaminated water that caused the disease. There's a great map of what Snow found here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epidemiology And of course, it was these types of studies that linked lung cancer to tobacco smoking.
And what do they offer you instead? Repetition after repetition of what some parents (are they in the minority or the majority?) believe caused their child's autism. They want you to go back before the era of John Snow to the time when no one knew what caused cholera and use simply what SOME people choose to believe as a guide to what parents should do when it comes to protecting their children.
An awful lot of work has gone into understanding vaccines and vaccination and immunology and public health and infectious disease and the causes of autism. That information has been developed over decades and all around the world. There just isn't evidence that vaccines cause autism. That's based on a lot of studies, including epidemiological studies.
How desperate are vaccination opponents? They are still relying on Andrew Wakefield despite even Thoughtful House and him parting ways (where is he now?) and being dropped from the board of Autism Insights journal. And that's what his former friends did.”
Sep 22, 2010 at 00:36:35
“How about out of the kalamity kichen science hour and back to sick kids with autism? Your group here is putting on quite a show.
cable1977 on Sep 22, 2010 at 08:18:14
Willow-the-witch was correct above. Kalamity kitchen science hour was in direct response to T4TN's claims above that somehow we should fear vaccines that contain mercury containing and aluminum containing compounds simply because elemental mercury and elemental aluminum have a strong reaction to on another. That is just bad science and fear-mongering as it shows a complete lack of understanding of the most very basic concepts of chemistry. The tactic I used at pointing this out is what is known as a reductio ad absurdum.
So, perhaps your target should be T4TN for posting such a misleading and misinformative video in the first place. But I somehow doubt you would do that.”
Willow-the-Witch on Sep 22, 2010 at 01:15:45
“"Kalamity Kitchen Science Hour" had a very important point that seems to have been lost on you. Mercury is *not* just mercury. When in a compound with other elements, most elements behave differently than in their unbound forms. Case in point---sodium & chlorine. (Great example, BTW, cable). Elemental sodium will explode when it meets the humidity in the air. Chlorine gas is a choking green gas that will kill you. Put them together and you have.........salt. Something completely different.
So watching aluminum and mercury react in their elemental states says nothing at all about the effects of the same elements when in molecular form and even less about their interaction within a living cell.”
Sep 21, 2010 at 12:34:39
We don't know the current numbers as CDC keeps giving us data that are on birth cohorts for previous years. What we do know is that the Age of Autism book shows the history of many neurodegenerative disorders leading up to the age of autism, a neurodevelopmental disorder. Mercury/Thimerosal and the timing of its use were traced by Mark and Dan to these families and also the beginning of the vaccine program. To look at new chemicals now, in 2010, as the reason for autism wipes out the roots to its cause. As they have stated, there are possibly newer culprits that may have added or increased the incidence but the mechanism of Thimerosal and its use still today is reason to sound the alarms for very good reason.”
Willow-the-Witch on Sep 22, 2010 at 01:39:31
“It is a bit hard to keep up-to-date with the *current* cohort cause those darn infants just keep being born all the time!
Tracing two events to the same time period does not in any way create a cause and effect relationship between the two. Considering the focus has been primarily on heavy metals, then *all* levels of heavy metals would have to be analyzed.”
Sep 21, 2010 at 11:35:26
You really need to read the book and educate yourself with the facts. Here is another great interview and Mark's response:
'In terms of teething powders, generally the exposures for children who were given teething powders were quite different. These were by and large not ethylmercury exposures, but calomel – inorganic mercury exposures. And they were generally given later in life when children were starting to cut their first teeth or later on. One of the main manufacturers of teething powders effectively marketed these products as being valuable from “teething til teens.”
The later timing and the different kinds of mercury exposure probably had something to do with the difference in the profile. That said, there were some known cases – some of the symptoms of acrodynia or pink disease were similar in some ways to autism symptoms so there were similar biological effects in the youngest of children. But I think the difference in the timing, the difference in the particular type of mercury was the difference. Calomel would be affecting the body of these children whereas ethylmercury will get into the brain and that’s probably the difference between teething powders and ethylmercury." http://www.examiner.com/dc-in-national/interview-with-dan-olmsted-mark-blaxill-age-of-autism-mercury-medicine-and-a-manmade-epidemic”
Sep 21, 2010 at 11:25:27
Your comments have attempted to negate and deny the mercury-autism connection yet here you really reinforce mercury as a major culprit. Yes, mercury/thimerosal are very capable of damaging chromosomes and causing these RARE autism-genetic conditions while the rest of the autism epidemic shows no genetic/chromosome damage yet they have autism (injury). I'm sure you saw posts regarding that on the Age of Autism blog.
I sense that you realize you have very little room to debate all of the facts in Dan and Mark's book. You are trying desperately to include environmental factors yet rule out Thimerosal. No way. It cannot be done. There is so much evidence of its damage that using the epigenetics card dashes your gene blame. You are running out of options and your strategy is failing.
Proud Contributor to the Age of Autism book and blog”
Aug 22, 2010 at 22:25:13
I am sorry so that this has happened and that there are such cruel, sadistic and criminal people in our world! She never should have been hired. In 2002, our district changed bus companies to First Student here in Chicago. A normal 40 min bus ride one way turned into 2-3 hours. They had no phone, no camera, no radio. My daughter is also nonverbal. This happened more than once with the excuse of "they got lost." I demanded that the district fire them as they could not guarantee my daughter's safety and drove her myself until they did. Cruel and sadistic people can be charming and be on that next bus as we do not do the hiring. These companies need to be held responsible and if they get sued - they deserve it, then they will think twice to hiring sick monsters to care for the innocent and frail. I'm so sorry and send prayers and support as you all heal from this traumatic and painful injustice.