Tonight, I spoke with retired General Wesley Clark and wanted to get his reaction to comments made this evening on ABC News by Vice President Dick Cheney following news of the 4000th U.S. fatality in Iraq.
The full conversation airs tonight on PBS.
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The only honest thing Wesley Clark said is that "I have not talked to Obama about Iraq." And he should have ended their. But he didn't. He went on to give the Clinton talking points. And insinuated that Hillary had experience, even though the Clinton Bosnia tape is out, and that she has Character, Character?, after aligning herself with McCain even though she is a McCain wannabe. Part of what use to make Clark appealing was his pragmatism, and he proved the opposite with this interview. Sad, I thought he was his own man but I guess now he is just a good Clinton soldier in Clinton Country or Hillaryland.
Actually he said many honest things. Such as "The families bear the greatest burden" or "The president bears a great burden of responsibility and guilt for the war"
The families bear the grief, those that enabled this war and the President also bear the burden and should own it. It's not Bush's War its OUR WAR. It's not going away after he leaves office. That's the precipice we're in.
I am still waiting for the former Secretary of Defense, Richard Cheney, to admit his ignorance.
He said that on one occasion, on the approach to National Airport in D.C., he felt remorse for all those heros of previous wars evidenced by the hundreds of CROSSES that mark their place.
He later became CEO of Halliburton and today is the Vice President and, apparently, still fails to acknowledge that there are only HEADSTONES there.
Admittedly, this is a minor issue, but just one of many that demonstrates his personal involvement of war is only hell for someone else, but is OK to become a millionaire in the process.
How can a man too cowardly to serve his country in Vietnam possibly understand what our troops are going through. He is single minded in his devotion to greed. And the single issue voters (anti abortion, pro NRA and anti-Gay crowd) don't seem to care about the ethics and morals of their commander in chief as long as he pushes forward their agenda.
Dear General
Given Cheney's own record of sacrifice on behalf of our nation I suspect he defines volunteers as suckers and chumps.
Thank You PBS- esp for Frontlines' 'Bush's War' will be wtaching Travis, the News Hour & Part 2 tonight. Not to mention all the other great shows- Nova etc. I will have to send some more $$, it's worth far more than I could ever afford. And Certainly our last resource for News and real information. As Fro Wesley- the only interests We have in that Region are OUR Troops. The rest are Corp Interests- let their 'Army' defend them and try to seize the Regions resources on their Own. Those are the Real Volunteers for this Invasion- EAch one of them has the Right to quit when ever they want.OUR Volunteer Army is being held Captive- far longer than the Iranian Hostage Crisis. Let Our People Go!
Here is another form of Independent Media - Democracy Now w/Amy Goodman - Link TV - all independent television, not supported by any sponsers. Seek the truth and you will find the truth. Spread the word.
Where is the coverage from mainstream media about Cheney's comments -- "they volunteered" for his and Dubya's quicksand strategy in IRAQ??? I hardly heard any mention of Cheney's remorseless comments on ABC, NBC, etc... and there's no way the Dems can allow this quagmire to continue after Jan. '09!
General Wesley Clark ? This is the same General that was nearly releived of command for the sorry state of preparedness of American forces prior to the Kosovo intervention. I know, I was stationed in Germany when the call went forward to move forces into theater. The attack helicopter units took months to assemble due to a poor state of readiness. Clark botched nearly every aspect of that deployment, including having no clue as to how to respond to the Russian counter moves, which allowed the Serb forces to easily avoid retribution for the genocide they had inflicted. Those that tout Clark as a knowledgable military source are delusional.
Ah yes, war = theater. What a strange way of describing war. As we lead into November, the Neocons will make a meal out of attacking Clark. The question is - why aren't the Neocons and the corporate media questioning the several other retired military officers who also endorse Clinton over McCain? And if Clark botched nearly aspect of the Kosovo intervention, then why did " operation Allied Forces" succeed in forcing the Serb troops out of Kosovo -- without a single combat casualty?
Having never served in the military, I don't have the perspective that others do but I respect the sacrifices that people in uniform make for this country. What I do not respect are neocons like Cheney putting soldiers in harm's way without having that perspective of sacrifice. I believe Clark does have that perspective, and I admire him, and others like him, who have the balls to speak truth to power. Whether or not he can be classified as a military expert, I leave to others, but I also find it curious that he might be criticized for the Kosovo operation when the whole thing was pulled off without American casualties.
No different than a lot of other high military ranks. The politicians make bonehead decisions, and one or two of the top guys gets to make excuses and shoulder the blame. If they don't play ball, they get put out to pasture like Powell or Fallon.
I am a Viet Nam veteran. I served as an army Captain (military intelligence) after leaving law school. I served in the same division as Norman Scwartzkopf and Colin Powell. Not all veterans and not all generals are equal. Politics exist in the military too. General Clark was never in my estimation, a great leader. Just as in politics, there are military phonies. I could spend pages on disclosing how many deserving officers did not receive medals they should have, and how some officers received medals they did not deserve. I cringed when they talked about Senator Jerry's silver star for bravery (shooting a fleeing enemy soldier in the back) I also cringe when some one like General Clark is touted as a military expert.
Enjoyed your post, David Halberstam's book on the Korean War "The Coldest Winter" contains some interesting descriptions of the darker side of internal military politics and it's more harmful effects including as projected on Viet Nam . You must be in a perpetual cringe when you add any statements coming from Cheney, Bush, Limbaugh, Hannity, Savage or most of the other representatives and surrogates of the current administration regarding military policy. With few exceptions, unlike you and Wesley Clark and Senator Kerry, they went to great lengths to avoid service in Viet Nam or service, period. I am curious, I know Colin Powell had reservations but failed to voice them regarding our invasion of Iraq. Has Norman Scwartzkopf gone on record regarding the wisdom of invading Iraq?
You can tell by my handle what I did. I served under Carter and I had vehicles older than the old soldiers driving them. The abomination in the Iranian desert was a red flag. Under Reagan that all changed. Whoever gets in, needs to be a leader and not just patronize and lap up what the generals say. They also, paradoxically, need to listen to people like Powell when they opine that if you break you will own it. We have too many civilians making decisions with no clue to the impact or apparently no ability to solve the resulting problems [the VA for example].
Oliver North was chief operation manager for the rescue mission, where the USA's best soldiers forgot to put the sand screens on the helicopters. Sure. Secord and bunch more of the Iran Contra gang were also part of the "rescue".
RayGun stole the election by committing treason. Raygun's gang interfered with Carters official negotiations to free the hostages. The hostages were released and Iran started getting weapons as soon as Raygun was in office.
Yeah 1pappy you're right. That's why, to this day, we are still bogged down in Kosovo without help from NATO forces and this fiasco just keeps costing the USA much blood and money -no wait, thats Iraq...
Yeah, I know what you are saying, we are still bogged down in Korea after over 50 years.
No, that is why only recently has Kosovo gained independance.
Dick Cheney does not care about anyone other than Dick Cheney. His responses to Martha Raddatz reveal this. To Dick Cheney soldiers are canon fodder no sentientt human beings. No one ever volunteered to be exploited at very low wages to the point of mental and physical breakdown. Cheney avoided service during Nam because it was the duty of others to die and bleed so that he could obtain power and abuse it.
the term for cannon fodder is "fungible". Rummy used it himself. You want to hit these clowns where it hurts? Hit them in the pocket. - here's the profile from Wiki
I want to remind the folks here that when he ran for pres. in 2004, Wes Clark became one of Kerry's biggest supporters when he dropped out, and Kerry more than welcomed his support. But when he was nominated, Kerry picked Edwards as his running mate instead, despite the fact that in order to beat Bush, Kerry could have had a running made with great security credentials. Some people speculate that Kerry was not eager to have a second war hero on the ticket to detract from his own glory. We all know the outcome, or course.
Kerry made such monumental blunders I'm almost on the side of the conspiracy theorists.
Until decent men OF INTELLIGENCE and CONSIENCE like Wesley Clark play a larger role in American politics, we're doomed to coexist with the McCains and Cheneys.
I tried my best to tell people to stay out of the bush's. I warned everyone I met that if they voted for bush that everything would go to hell in a hand basket!
Tavis both you and General Clark are true Americans of the highest order. The detailed and thoughtful analysis and integrity you both maintain day in and day out over many years on every subject you cover is an asset to the country and the public discourse.
If you get another chance, ask General Clark if the fiscal costs associated with this intervention and occupation have any place in the calculation of how long we stay there. Ask him if he is concerned that the costs might very well bankrupt this nation. Ask him if he is comfortable with sticking future generations with the bill for this. Ask him if he thinks it will ever be possible, by means of force, to secure a vast territory with porous borders, where there is a vast reservoir of anti-US resentment within and without, and where a guerrilla insurgency works its mischief and then melts back into the woodwork.
Seems we should be listening to our soldiers and former soldiers more than our politicians on what it means to serve and the affect on their lives and the lives of their families.
Isnt "Stop Loss" Unconstitutional??
Yes. But the constitution was evicted from the White House when the Bush Administration moved in.
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Posted March 24, 2008 | 08:35 PM (EST)