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Clinton as V.P.? Grrr... Well, OK
I think we're feeling a huge amount of residual fear and loathing of the Republican hate and slime machine; and a similar size helping of non-confidence in how Democrats have responded to it in the past. Both feelings are totally justified.
Will America vote for an African-American? Better to ask if they'll vote for someone with brains.
First of all, there is at least 20% of the population of the U.S. who hate black folks, always have, always will. Ingrained bigotry is a part of human nature that will always survive. Face it. There's nothing we can do about it. Write them off. They were going to vote Republican, anyway. Republicans have portrayed themselves as the party of hatred and bigotry. Let them have it their way.
The ray of hope is that, except for those 20% (who believe that Obama is a Muslim, and all the other Rovian lies), none of the Republican slime has stuck to Obama.
Will America vote for an African-American with a woman as his running mate? If that woman is Sen. Clinton? As much as it pains me to say so, Obama would do well to swallow the bitter pill and take her on as running mate. And send Bill to be ambassador to anywhere.
It's a good thing that "white working class men" weren't watching the proceedings on TV Saturday when the Florida and Michigan votes were settled. Trust me on this, and men you back me up. There is a gut reaction in men, not based on logic, but solely on emotion, to women like the ones who wouldn't shut up, and kept screaming. Any man who has ever had an acrimonious break-up with a woman knows it and felt it as they watched. I know I did.
The male brain goes, "Will you please just shut the fuck up and leave me alone! Go away. I can't stand this shit anymore. No, really! You're driving me out of my mind. Do whatever you want, just shut up and leave me alone!" But they don't. And you feel like you want to run and never stop running just to get away from it.
This male reaction takes place no matter who is to blame, or if both are to blame. Maybe it's a female weapon. Did they talk about that in Sex and the City? It just IS. This isn't sexism. This is based on experience. If there are men out there who haven't experienced it, God love ya.
That is part of Obama's Hillary problem, if he offers her the V.P. slot. I never understood why the right-wing hated her so much. I have a better idea now. She has waged a dirty campaign, not based on issues but on character destruction. I'd rather see Kansas Governor Kathleen Sebalius as his running mate, but I understand that sixteen million people voted for Clinton. I just don't know why.
The other part is what does he do about her Iraq vote?
As the campaign begins, I'm trying to hold to my original belief, that the Democrats could run a dirty catbox and win this year. Running a man with the intelligence and compassion of Obama almost seems like too much to ask for.
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NOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!
One thing we should all remember about Sen. Clinton. A judge has given her until November, but then she must answer charges of campaign fraud. Fox News did not report this because they WANT her on the ticket with Obama - they are Republican partisans. CNN and MSNBC did not report this because they are corporate owned and corporations rightly feel some discomfort with Obama. But it is a fact, nonetheless. So, if Obama doesn't want to appear weak; doesn't want to negate his message of change; doesn't want to cave in to egregious blackmail; and doesn't want his administration to be hit with the cancer of scandal right off the bat, then NO Clinton as VP.
Sen. Clinton as Obama's running mate? Grr....NO!!!!!!!!!!!!
She waged a dirty campaign, and all this refusal to concede is blackmail. As Lincoln said of Seward, "I can't let h[im] take the first trick...". Just say NO to blackmail.
Hillary isn't the strongest choice and she is on the verge of a political blackmail... if the DNC wants her voiters... give her the slot (or 40 mil to pay the bills).... this is wrong and the Dems have moved away from dubious politicking of the past... she is not the message that best represents the party today... and the party changed so that it can fight off the GOP machine... keeping Hillary who has already caused so much damage to Obama is not wise for him... I wouldn't even trust her to be satisfied as VP... she got into politics on her husbands back and it doesn't seem so much of a stretch to see her aim for the Presidency on Obama's able back.... keep her away.... best for the future of the democratic party.... safer for Obama too.
New Yorkers Chet Arthur and Teddy Roosevelt did all right as Veep, right?
Tom it's the emotional factor, they win here every time.
Sebelius would be a better choice. The racists who voted for Hillary won't for Obama no matter who is running mate is. Hispanics may not blacks, but the GOP is anti-immigrant so they'll vote for Obama. Catholics may think Obama isn't a real Christian, but Sebelius is Catholic. Hillary isn't. The elderly will like Sebelius just as much as Hillary. They're both 60. Women who dream of seeing a female President will will be happy with Sebelius since she's a woman and would be poised to run for President after Obama's terms are up. So what does Hillary bring that Sebelius doesn't? Bill and the ability to inspire high Republican turnout to vote against any ticket with her on it.
You said it. I agree with your post 100%. Sibellius is a much better choice for VP.
You hit the nail on the head! Obama/Sebelius is the winning ticket for November.
Let's hope Senator Obama dumps the Clinton baggage and get's on with the campaign. How on earth can she even say she would accept the VP if offered when she won't even endorse Obama as Pres?
I'm with you on all these points... also Pelosi is Catholic and she is largely responsible for the democratic party's new life and new vision of change, which is the message of Obama. Sebelius will serve all the good that Hillary can do, without any of the bad that she would also do in alienating voters.
But, overall, I think the white males are going to be the hardest to win over and they can't vote for a black AND a woman... so, please, just give them good strong white male with a splash of military...that is probably Obama's best bet.
I like Sebellius but there are 2 things that could damage him with her.
1. She has little foreign policy experience (that I know of but please correct me if I am wrong). Obama needs someone with strong foreign policy experience. And isn't there an issue about her vetoing something like an energy plant recently that has caused some strife?
2. It will be seen as a direct slap in the face to Hillary supporters. Although I don't really care about this and in fact like the idea of slapping them back, the pundits will and will use it to tear him apart.
But I do like her. I also like Joe Biden.
so even if she is more qualified it will seem sexist?
She is still trying to run the show and there is no reason not to believe that she (and Bill) will continue to do this if she were the vp. The Clintons are waaay too high maintenance to have in that position and I seriously question whether she would be loyal to him after the horrible tactics she has used in the campaign. Plus I know many crossover voters who are ready to vote for Obama, but dislike Hillary so much that they will go back to the GOP and McCain if she is on the ticket.
There are plenty of other well-qualified people who can run on the ticket. Hillary would be a huge, and I mean hugely huge, mistake.
I am not a big fan of Hillary Clinton, but she is a force to be reckoned with. Her supporters are not to be brushed off. Obama and Clinton have similar views on the policies. If we are all Democrats, we should be able to accept them as a team. Of course there were many hateful and divise things said by both sides during the primary. This was a competition for the highest position in the land and it is not for the faint of heart. We, as a party and as American citizens, need to look past the arguments of the primaries and focus on the GE. We cannot afford four more years of a Republican White House. Look at where we are now...its not pretty. If Barack and Hillary can come together for the good of our country, we would be petty to oppose it. We need to win this November. We need to think about the future of our nation. I believe that, if Barack and Hillary can do this together, we should trust them to work together to get our nation back on course. We need to stop infighting and focus on the main goal.
Obama does not need Clinton. I would not have that woman as VP so please acting as if Hillary is the crutch that Obama needs.
Obama mostly needs a strong white male with military... too hard for many voters in this electorate we are struggling with to accept both black and woman....
I think he's got time to say, "She is on my short list, but I have a lot to think about."
It's too early and why have him look forced into it?
He should take his time on this one, and he should talk to people who have actually worked with her in the White House.
This is just more Clinton spin and divisiveness. She lost. She lost a long time ago. She did it to herself. It's time, Tom, to look forward and get behind the effort to address the Repug travesties that will be dumped on us after the election. Don't look back. It is self-defeating.
Clinton would be his worst possible choice as she is so very much a part of the problem that this country faces.
This abomination of "Dream Ticket" is a delusion, or symptom, of the very corporatized, technocratic view of politics that Obama is supposedly repudiating.
I write "supposedly" because I'm not an Obama supporter, although I consider him far superior to his corporate-media anointed "viable" rivals. I just want to make it clear that I'm not swept away by him as others have become.
So, even though I recognize that Obama isn't necessarily as squeaky-clean as his idealistic oratory would suggest, I also recognize that everyone except simple-minded lesser-evilist partisan Democrats will see this for what it is: a hideous marriage of convenience for the sake of the presidency. Technocrats are cool with "marriages of convenience" and don't see a down side, since they're all about "the art of the possible" and "not letting the perfect being the enemy of the good".
And IF this debacle took place, it's a foregone conclusion that Obama would put his rhetorical gifts to use with a seemingly heartfelt declaration of the propriety and viability of this special partnership. I mean, it's not as if they both can hold their noses and stand at arm's length from each other.
Obama in particular risks being seen through as just another bullshitting politician-- not so much Hillary, whose supporters apparently admire her hard-working, fighting equivocation as evidence of political savvy-- and his quasi-fanatic constituency is smart enough to jump off the bandwagon as enthusiastically as they jumped on.
..uh, will "ditto-head" what you put forth and even double down on it all !! IF they mistakenly take the Clintons for the VP spot, the Dems will definitely lose it bigtime !! It would simply mean NO REAL CHANCE OF CHANGE and just a continuation of Washington as usual, status quo and the MAJORITY OF US DO NOT FIND THAT ACCEPTABLE and why we 're willing to "roll the dice" with Obama.
Hillary? VP? NO!
drkazmd65--well-said. I completely agree. Senator Obama needs to deal with Hillary from a point of strength.
"there is at least 20% of the population of the U.S. who hate Black folks"
Where did you come up with that insane number? Did you pull it out of your a** perhaps?
"83% of statistics are made up on the spot to 'prove' a point."
That's just one example of many absurd generalizations you make. Wish I had the time and the space to point them all out, but I get the feeling it would be futile anyway.
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