Why Women Gladly Date Ugly Men (And Probably Even Prefer Them)
It's a pretty well known fact that most women - attractive women - will happily date ugly men. We see it on TV -- in shows like King of Queens, though I would probably argue that Kevin James is kind of a stud, and really, that's exactly the point I plan on making-- and we see it in our friends.
There are plenty of studies on this strangely anti-Darwinian phenomenon - studies which I think don't answer the question as well as I, with my oh-so-steadfast opinions, can, do, and will.
So let's talk about this. Let's talk about what exactly is wrong with these conventionally attractive men, and let's talk about what is right about these, well, conventionally un-attractive men.
Anecdotal evidence aside, I know for a fact that I don't find "hot" men attractive.* Let me clarify - I find them pleasing to the eye, and every so often quite tempting, but I don't find myself actually attracted to them. And here I have to admit that I am undoubtedly judging their books by their covers, but I have yet to find the exception to the rule.
To explain: These high-school hotties are used to having the sort of unadulterated, fawning adoration that the symmetrically blessed always get in high-school, but the problem is that it doesn't do them any good. In fact, it's fair to say that it categorically does them harm.
They're trained from a young age to be (often) unjustifiably self-assured, to eschew personality and affability for cocksure confidence, and to generally treat people like the feudal system is alive and kickin'.
Am I making a sweeping generalization? No doubt. Can the same argument be used against women? Sometimes. But I find that women are much more inclined to date with their emotions - to pick a man that is funny, comforting, kind, and generous - and they'll often pick one or all of those traits over his looks.
I also have a little (and relatively untested) theory. I believe that women tend to come into themselves -- appearance-wise -- much later in school than men. And because of this I think women tend to retain some memory of what it means to be liked (or disliked) for who one is, not how one looks.
The bottom line: Ask any woman who she'd rather have as her boyfriend -- the lovably awkward Albert Brennaman (aka Kevin James -- told you he was the crux of the arugment) from Hitch, or Hugh Grant's wholly irredeemable Daniel Cleaver from Bridget Jones' Diary?
So -- let's start here. Which one would you pick? Did I just set womankind back a generation? Or do you wholly agree? Please share. I'd love to hear your thoughts.
[Disclaimer: This post should in no way indicate that my boyfriend is ugly and/or unattractive. In fact, I find him rather dashing.]
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I think a sense of humor or the ability to make a girl laugh.. is the single most appealing and attractive trait that a man can have. Handsome men who are funny are also very attractive to women (a la George Clooney). The second most attractive trait is a man who actually enjoys the company of women.. a man who likes women and I don't mean likes to sleep with them.
no one is going to watch if the guy good looking or not is kissing an ugly wife
the supporting characters can have a quirky or odd looking mate
but the main female character must be attractive
even Rosanne Barr is pretty in the face
the woman always has to look good but hollywood does't want her to look perfect so they have her be a little short or flat chested or dress conservatively.
plus they want to show the average guy can get a hottie
why, they know men do not obsess so much over their bodies to look like a guy on a magazine cover
woman do and put their self worth over it if even one guy finds them unattractive
but men move on as long as they thing their might be one out there!!!
I'm a short, fat, balding, sweaty and greasy, ugly dude who can't attract anything female. I'm also flat broke.
It's all about unresolved childhood wounds anyway, according to Harville Hendricks.
The peptide-adrenalin mix wears off after 3-6 months and the serious work of being in relationship begins. Relationship guru Terrance Real asks this question. Can you hold your partner in warm regard in the face of their imperfections?
I'm not sure what the female equivalent of my attractiveness range is, but I guess most, though not all, of the women I've been in relationships with have been more physically attractive, to varying degrees. As time has gone on I've found that I feel more confident attracting women I may have once considered "out of my range" physically, and I have to admit that this has also made it less likely that I would "settle for" women I've been in relationships with in the past. But this also corresponds with what I look for emotionally, intellectually, etc. I wouldn't settle for the "hot" but frustratingly incompatible women I have been with in the past. To me, it's all just a learning experience, and as time goes on, I'm finding my happy medium. In fact, I feel more confident than ever that I pretty much know exactly what I'm looking for, which is great because frankly I'm totally sick and tired of putting all of my energy into propping up relationships that were doomed from the start.
Beautiful women can be with men that are not as good-looking for one simple reason-fidelity. It's better for a relationship because the man is happy with his beautiful wife and the woman is happy with her faithful husband. It's a win-win.
fidelity? You think only good looking men cheat?
I think good-looking men have way more opportunities to cheat. I don't see women throwing themselves at an average looking man.
How abt. us plain looking women? No hope for us?
Yes. In fact there's MORE hope for plain looking women. Because men are pretty simple, they respond to sex and food. A pretty girl may reject them, but they're not waiting around 10 years for the next pretty girl who won't. They'll accept another girl, who provides them with their basic needs. Men, unlike women, do not choose a mate to revolve their life around. They have a job, sports, buddies and take out pizza. The female adds to their life by providing regular sex, better food, children of their seed, and they clean up after them. Many women can fit this bill, so there is no "perfect girl" out there for most men. If they're a man, they'll react biologically and that's the end of that.
If you mean hope in having a good relationship with decent guy that might not be chiseled, most definately! I spent about 15 years chasing what I thought were gorgeous women and having relationships with litte more than sexual appeal. I finally met a less glamorous woman who I was lucky enough to marry. In spite of the effects of aging and teenage kids, she gets more beautiful to me as time moves on.
"And, women want a man with the money, honey. Simple as that, and always has been. Looks have nothing to do with it."
Somebody in this thread said this. I disagree.
I have always dated and married good looking men, but only the first one was primarily a physical attraction thing, he had no money.
Second husband super attractive, had a great job, owned three houses, was upbeat and funny while dating, but a deadly serious Nazi once married.
Then I dated a guy for a long time who was heir to the Del Monte Foods fortune and good looking. Nice guy but not quite it. We became engaged but before we could marry I met a guy, seven years younger, KINDA good looking but the NICEST GUY I'D EVER MET.
All he had was a surfboard, some clothes; he lived in a room with another family. He did have two jobs, but no car, no money.......I married him within two months. We've been married 20 years.
So I left a guy with money to burn to marry a guy with zero money but with a heart of Gold.
Not all attractive women are shallow.
What a beautiful story, well told. I bet you have a heart nof gold as well.
I think the point here is a relationship has yin and yang. There can only be one star in a relationship and that's the more attractive or more successful partner. If you put two stars together, they get in each other's light. This is evidenced by many of the Hollywood marriage disasters.
I also wonder, have many men read this article? Most men I know think that you have to be a football star or a millionaire to date a beautiful girl, despite what you can see everyday on the street. I'm starting to think those men are retarded. The truth is, if you are "frog like," you are more likely to date and marry a super model than if you too are a super model. Case in point Seal and Heidi Klum.
Women are valued in looks and men are valued in terms of success, ambition and yes sometimes bank accounts and penis size. That gives men so many more options for success with MATING. Women in this culture just have one thing LOOKS...that is it! Everything else is icing on the cake. Men only bother to find out what a woman is all about if she IS beautiful. I work in the fashion industry and put a few gorgeous models at a party and even the ugliest guy there trying to outshine in wit and personality to catch her attention. Because of her LOOKS he is actually interested in finding out what makes her orgasm, laugh, feel good etc. When you live in a culture that holds men in the highest esteem for anything that actually "matters" then how can anyone claim that any of our choices are related to instincts? What about all of the people in arranged marriages? We think we are participating in the liberated world because we get to "choose" our mate based on feelings. But how many of our "feelings" are the direct result of the society in which we live? In a culture where women can earn a decent living wage without a partner there is no need to find a man that is an aggressive wage earner. We need to stop pretending that we are anywhere near instincts when it comes to selecting a mate...
uhh.... All women are inherently beautiful. At least our chauvinistic (human, that is) minds are programmed to admire the beauty of the female form. And as the old saying goes, "when the lights go out, they all....."
I believe you are completely underestimating the value of a woman's personality and mental attributes in finding "a mate." To begin with, there is the old, "if we were the last man and woman stuck on a deserted island" model. In society, we all create our own little islands, little backwaters from the roaring currents of "the greater society," whether those personal refuges are in church, in schools and colleges, in our work community, or in our after work pursuits. (If you are into backpacking, for example, that will of course be an entirely different community than if you were into yachts & powerboating.)
I've heard women say that most girls and women (given a choice one over the other) prefer good looks over money when they are young, and prefer money over good looks when they get older.
As to "women prefer ugly men", you must read Jared Diamond's Pulitzer winning book(s), "Guns, Germs, and Steel," & the related "Third Chimpanzee." In his extended discussion on mating in the later, he determines that beauty is in the eye of the beholder... and that we select mates who are as close to our own physiology as we can find.
And that race and skin color are a function of SEXUAL PREFERENCE!!
Interesting, 2lipsinholland. But we are not that far from our evolutionary roots. Sure, there is societal pressure, but the basic dance is the same. Women have more than looks, they have the whole ball of wax. Females hold the key to reproduction, to passing on the male's genes. They hold the promise of mating, and all the pleasure associated with it. Females of any species need to do nothing except choose wisely. That's why I think the article is bogus, because women do not intentionally seek ugly men. Females of any species want the best looking, strongest male around and that's what they choose if at all possible.
I saw Heidi Klum on TV not long ago and she said the first time she saw Seal was at the gym and the first thing that impressed her about him was his "package." There's your case in point.
You assume she was telling the truth.
I've never really been much to look at, but my wife of 24 years is a former Vogue model. There's just something about a Love that defies comprehension. She may have had better looking boyfriends before we met, but I won her heart fair and square.
This is a bit off-topic, but several have mentioned it and Verena did as well: when did "makes me laugh" become a trait that women seek in men? Is this a new type of gender behavior in which women prefer to merely REact as men ACT by displaying their wit and humor? Are these women deliberately trying to appear empty-headed?
Also, to judge a potential mate by how funny he is seems to lose sight of what really matters in a man: character, stability, and maturity. A man with those qualities may not make you laugh, but what's even better, you'll laugh together. And best of all, he'll make you happy.
Lilliput
It's not empty-headed at all for women to find men who make them laugh attractive. It's smart.
If a man is making you laugh, it shows he has a sense of humor, and it's hard to be funny AND in a murderous rage at the same time. Top criteria in mate selection for human females is the confidence their much larger, stronger, and more aggressive mate will not kill them and their children.
Some one once said the thing men fear most about women is that they'll ridicule , scorn and reject them. The thing women fear most from men is that they'll physically attack and/or kill them. While maybe not absolutely true, it has a certain ring of truth.
Hey women,
Same thing goes for us guys, just takes a bit longer...
We will gladly chase and bed a hottie, but give us a nice woman for a mate/wife/soulmate every day.
Apologies to all the vapid, shallow, and vain women out there...
In my teens and 20's I was smokin' hot, and I only dated smokin' hot guys, who I now realize were not only shallow and not all that bright, but who were sometimes abusive and usually lousy in the sack. Then in my 30's I met Mike, who was the ugliest guy I'd ever seen but he was rocket-scientist brilliant. He was also amazing in bed. This guy had me screaming for mercy, but most women wouldn't give him the time of day.
From then on I was hooked. Brains before beauty. Now I'm married to a man who is also brilliant but you'd never notice him on the street. We couldn't be happier. He feels he's got a trophy wife with brains and I've got husband who is brilliant, funny, comfortable with who he is, and does calculus problems in his head...for fun! He's a great provider and...he's a killer in bed!
Now we have a son who is not only smokin' hot, but he's also exceptionally bright. Maybe that's the real biological imperative. Females seek out the strongest seed. Beauty helps attract a mate, but it's the intelligent ones who survive and advance the evolution of the species. Their time is spent expanding the mind and building the character, rather than simply building the body. If more women realized this and started choosing men for who they are rather than what they look like, there would be fewer divorces and way more happy marriages.
gmlaster, what if your brainy guy was lousy in bed? Think you'd be with him? lol. Look, in our teens and 20's girls can have their pick of smokin hot guys. By the time we're in our 30's many guys are married. The pool is smaller. Plus, don't forget....they're older and maybe they were "hot" younger but now not so much. Same thing with our own gender. So if we're 30ish or 40ish, we're looking at people our own age are used to the physical flaws. Unless of course, we want to go cruising around the high schools and colleges. But we don't....so we get accustomed to our own age group. No way is this to be interpreted that we're choosing less attractive men. There's also the pavlov factor. We pick up cues which either repel or attract us to men, through past experiences. For example, a guy may be average looking, but he has a cute southern accent and reminds us of a great experience with someone else. Or, the guy is great looking but has a familiar flaw. There's also life choices. Guys in their early years haven't chosen much. Later on they may have a kid, may be in the military, may travel too much, may be republican...lol. So if we're going to be with THAT good looking guy, we're going to have to accept his life choices. And so maybe we don't.
Aren't you basing this "perception" on a fictional TV show? "King of Queens" was written by some 40 year old fat guy who still lives with his mother. In my experience the "ultamate guy" is usally as dumb as a box of rocks or gay or both, but I have seen very little evidence that women still don't chase after him. But women over 30 are usually so desperate that they'll take anything, also a bad choice. If anyone thinks they can go through life depending soley on their looks they have a rude awakening coming, because A) looks fade, and B) looks were never that important anyway, 30 years down the road.
Jeremy I perfectly agree with you. King of Queens is fiction. It's the ugly guy's fantasy. They can't get the hot chick in bed in high school, so they grow up to write up the scenario on tv. ( We lost the war in vietnam, so we write shows and movies with chuck norris and sylvester stallone winning it for us, same concept). NO woman is ever going to choose an ugly man over an attractive man, assuming all other factors are EQUAL. When all over factors are NOT EQUAL, such as the ugly guy having a lot of money, or whatever, then the choice can change.
In my experience, women under 30 go for the traditional "hotties," while women over 30 go for the "nice guys," who are frequently *not* hotties.
I have met far too many beautiful cheerleader types who never looked twice at the non-hotties in high school and yet ended up marrying nerds to think it's not a trend.
Thats becase the nerd will have a much higher paying job than the high school hotties.
Isn't it possible that good-looking younger women may prefer ugly men? It is completely Darwinian. As a species we look for partners who will up-grade the gene pool. Nothing does it better than an ugly man who has loads of money. It's obvious. Gorgeous, vacuous young super-broads with a great grasp of street smarts are always looking for sugar daddies with squillions of dollars to feather their nests. The fact that the men are ugly is preferable as hopefully, they will not be too much of a magnet to other women. Super-clever, ugly old men, with absolutely no street smarts- except in business- want spectacular looking young women to act as coat-hangers to show off the most expensive rags and jewellery which they can purchase in order to prove how rich ugly men can be. Think 'trophy wives'. It's not unlike the syndrome of the very short man who will give the object of his affection long-stemmed roses. This borders on obscene but that's how it is.
Cheers
"Isn't it possible that good-looking younger women may prefer ugly men? It is completely Darwinian. As a species we look for partners who will up-grade the gene pool. Nothing does it better than an ugly man who has loads of money."
You need to read up on Darwin.
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