Arizona Immigration Enforcement Bill Rejected By House

PHOENIX — The Arizona House has defeated a bill that would have made it the only state in the nation to criminalize the presence of illegal immigrants by expanding its trespassing law.

The House voted 26-15 for the bill to expand Arizona's trespassing law Wednesday morning, but that was five votes short of the 31 needed for passage. The Senate approved the bill 16-11 earlier Wednesday.

Supporters say an expanded trespassing law would provide a second layer of enforcement to help local police catch immigrants who slip past federal agents.

Opponents predicted it would lead to racial profiling for thousands of Latinos who are U.S. citizens.

Illegal immigrants account for an estimated 500,000 people in Arizona's 6.5 million population.

Comments

[Disuberence]

How will they tell all the illegal white people from the legal white people? That would be a logistics mess! I sense another Spanish Inquisition.

[nee]

When someone is hired for a job check the social security numbers.

[Rule Of Law]

Let's see--you break the law by entering the country illegally.

You've performed a criminal act.

Why would you need another law to tell anyone that the person who does that is, in fact, a criminal?

[Michael Lorenzo]

....probably because it's defined as a civil violation rather than a criminal offense. Immigration courts are not criminal courts.

[Gasparilla]

It's hardly the same as a speeding ticket, as some like to suggest. You can be picked up at any time, and jailed, for being here without permission.

[XLintLuvR]

You just don't see the irony in that statement considering we've entered a country illegally, ousted their leader because we didn't like his policies. Put him to death, destroyed their country, stolen their resources, killed their people in crossfires, destabilized their economy and wouldn't leave when we were asked. Oh, you mean that it's only illegal when someone does it to us minus executing our leader but when we do it on a grander scale forcing people out into the wilderness and creating an atmosphere of fear they've got no right to gripe. Oh, before you say a word I'm a US Marine...and we've got "illegal immigrants" serving in our military. What have you done to earn your citizenship other than being born here? How about you stop showing your pre ju dice?!

[Rule Of Law]

No, I don't see any irony at all. And it is not in any way comparable to the war crimes we've committed in Iraq--or elsewhere around the world, perhaps even Honduras where the new "President" is a graduate of the School Of Americas (or as many call it, the School of Assassins) that sparkling institution funded by our tax dollars that has provided every dictator in mid and south America for decades.

We destroyed Mexico with NAFTA. We should help rebuild it so their people can stay home, where they would prefer to be. Won't happen, but it should. So we can only deal with what we can, and that means enforcing our legal national right to a secure border.

As for your veiled slam about my alleged ra.c.ism--I don't make any distinction between a flood of Canadians sneaking across into N. Dakota any more than I do boatloads of Asians or people who overstay their visas. They are all here illegally. And, for earning the right to be here? I don't have to. I was born here legally. But if you want to compare scars in the service of--bring it!

[slarabee]

The thing about the illegal immigration problem is that everybody wants to complain about it and bigots love to rant about it but the solution is simple. Make it a felony to employ illegals. Of course no one will do that.

[Gasparilla]

The problem is not just illegal immigration. We have enough people in this country already, and it's legal immigration that is fueling our population growth the most. The southwestern states don't have the water as it is to support their populations. Nor do many areas around the country.

[LeftLeaner]

Bologna, it's illegal immigration that's dragging us down.

20+ million illegals in this country is nothing to sneeze at - and that's a low end estimate.

[kforce]

A felony? Really? So what would be the penalty? Fines? Prison (lord knows we have TONS of room in our scantily populated prisons)? Business shut-downs? Any or all of the above?

Who would be considered the responsible party? The person who did the actual hiring? Their superior? The general manager? The corporation? The CEO or CFO?

What about partnerships, where one partner or limited partner can act without the other partners' knowledge or approval. Is just one of them responsible, or are all?

What about franchises? Is the individual franchise manager responsible, or the owner, or the brand owners?

What about illegals with fraudulent papers, and employers who make honest mistakes?

The thing about the illegal immigration problem is that it is complex, difficult, has real human costs, and far -reaching effects involving illegals, residents AND citizens. It can be solved by a simplistic, knee-jerk reactions.

[eagleclaw]

How is this for "simplistic"?

If you hire someone, you being the manager or HR or owner or whoever hires, YOU ARE THE ONE RESPONSIBLE.

That particular person who signs off on the employee is the ONE who will be held accountable.

Simplistic, yes. But not impossible. There is no way that a persons legality to reside and work in the U.S.A. cannot be verified.

There are many excuses why it cannot be done but you cannot give me one REALLY GOOD REASON why it can't be done!

Let these lazy assed bureaucrats earn their money. This will give them something to do and if they can't handle it FIRE THEM!!!!

Enough with the entitlements!

[Bexstarr]

Immigrating illegally into Mexico is punishable up to 2 years in prison. That being said, if you are going to crack down on the individual immigrant then we have to go after the companies that employ them and give them hefty fines per illegal immigrant they hire. There are no real consequences for companies that hire illegal immigrants so they continue to do so.

[LeftLeaner]

Yeah, you can thank the anti-U.S. Chamber of Commerce for one for exerting their powerfull $$$ to lobby Against any kind of enforcement for the illegals.

After all, they're cheap labor, and let the American public worry about the rest - like paying for the illegals free health care services, free education for their kids, the judicial system, etc., etc.

Yeah, I just love paying those extras for people who are doing Nothing to improve the quality of my situation - just lessening it.

[greyhound2]

Not to worry. Arizona still has tons of laws which have been on the books for years which have not been enforced either! Illegal aliens already have proven that they have no respect for our laws and do not play by the rules. So how about adding even more laws for them to ignore.

[BlueMist602]

Oh, but guns in bars are okay? This backasswards state makes me sick! I live here and I am sorry, but SO many crimes are committed by these citizenship challenged individuals. Even without direct enforcement this law would have sent a strong message that would have helped to reduce our criminal population and deter any others from wanting to come here.... DAMN!!

[XLintLuvR]

Yeah, because creating laws have done so much to prevent people from going to jail so far.

[LeftLeaner]

citizenship challenged individuals - I love it!

Well, all I can hope for is that my state doesn't get overrun with them as yours.

My landscaper is an American citizen, hard to find these days, but I like to support my economy.

[peterbrady]

Even if they were, we destroyed them in a war and it's our land now. What you want to give it back to them observer? You're not too bright..

[an observer3]

Aren't these so called illegals the original americans?

[nee]

No anobserver3 - the "original Americans" were Native Americans. Not all ILLEGALS come from Mexico. The US owns this land now and makes its laws. It is ILLEGAL for anyone of foreign citizenship to enter the US ILLEGALLY. It doesn't matter who your ancestors were.

[propitiousmoment]

It's illegal, but it's civil, not criminal. Would you like to got to jail and be excoriated by the rest of the population because you are suspected of speeding?

[bma83]

How so? Please explain.

[nee]

If they put the matter up to the people of Arizona I think there would be a much different result.

[hotseat]

Well, well. Is this an example of clear thinking? Dayum, I hope so, although I doubt it.

[peterbrady]

None of you are probably from Arizona. Well, I had to sell my house at a loss because Illegals took over the neighborhood and eventually, I come home from work one day and police are there because my 2 illegal next door neighbors were murdered in the front yard. Please get these blood sucking leaches out of here. They come and destroy neighborhoods and rape and pillage our country. If these Mexicans spent as much energy jumping the border as they could trying to fix their own damn country, both Americans and Mexicans wouldn't have this problem. And they have the nerve to fly the Mexican flag at protests. Give me a break. This is a joke, let's do whatever it takes to get them out of here.. Please before they bankrupt the country. All they want is handouts. This stimulus is only enhancing the problem. Probably why they did it, to help illegals and screw Americans. This is insane..

[nee]

All ILLEGALS, no matter where they come from or who they are related to, need to be deported. Those who hire ILLEGALS should be heavily fined or jailed then the ILLEGAL ALIENS would self-deport.

[BlueMist602]

Peterbrady.... I feel your pain!

Signed a fellow AZ resident.

[MyrtleJune]

I too am in Arizona. I too know what you're talking about. However, I see the ONLY solution is to make sure our government stops messing with the economy of mexico making it so bad that people are driven across the border to work for slave labor to support their family. Let's make sure the republicans and business owners in the US stop importing slave labor. If it were not for the business need for slave labor this would never have gotten so bad. I undersand your anger though. Totally. I just see it as misdirected. Only when businesses stop exploiting slave labor in the country or offshore will this stop. Only then.

[Gasparilla]

Is it us messing with the economy of Mexico? How so? Or is it their longtime corruption?

[apoyo]

Is that you, Lou Dobbs?

How convenient to have someone to blame for everything.
And you checked their paperwork to ascertain they were illegal.

[MyrtleJune]

"Illegal immigrants account for an estimated 500,000 people in Arizona's 6.5 million population."

Is that all? 500K? The way people here carry on so about it you'd think that number would be much higher. gah.

And yes, it would have lead to an increase in the already high incidence of "racial profiling".

[Gasparilla]

Then there is an easy way to have no "racial profiling". There is a system called e-verify. When you apply for a job, then everyone's Social Security number is checked. If it's a no match to your name, you don't get fired but you have a certain number of weeks to straighten it out. Congress refuses to make this a nationwide program. If it were in effect, then it would be a simple matter of you having a legitimate SS number. Do you oppose this?

[MyrtleJune]

AZ alredy has E-Verify. Arizona already does "racial profiling" ........ just ask any police officer.

[propitiousmoment]

You don't have weeks, you have days.

[MyrtleJune]

"Arizona, which depended on the housing boom to power its economy, has lost 320,000 jobs in the last 18 months and seen its slowest growth in personal income since 1946."

From an LATimes piece "Arizona's budget war is a GOP Standoff" ..... big surprise. Someone has to pay for the greed of the banking industry and it is the taxpayers of Arizona who will HAVE to pay more because the banks got REALLY extra greedy in Arizona.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-arizona-budget27-2009jun27,0,1546521.story?page=1

Instead of bailing out the freakin' banks, someone should have bailed out the states. All the states facing shortfalls right now could have their deficit covered with a bailout that would be far more meaningful to US citizens than bailing out the banks did and for less money too. There could be a direct result, a direct benefit to the US taxpayor right now. But no. The banks come first.

BAIL OUT THE STATES!!! NOW.

[nee]

Fine and jail those who hire ILLEGALS and they would self-deport. That would save CA BILLIONS of dollars.

[MyrtleJune]

Well, now that's another reason this didn't pass. Because the REPUBLICAN business owners of Arizona would have to go to jail for hiring the slave labor they so desire by the stampeed of illegals they MAKE sure come here just for their family to survive.

That's the same for businesses all over the country. Look we're all up in arms over sending jobs out of country BUT you all make the reverse being done by driving mexicans INTO the country for slave labor a "racial" issue. It's not. Its business and that's why it was done to the mexican economy. They don't like nafta any more than we do. Do you honestly think people WANT to leave their country and their family just to provide for them? No they do not. Stop blaming them and get about blaming the people who created the conditions that necessitate people simply trying to provide for their family. Get about blaming the republicans and businesses who invented this scheme to gut the middle class with slave labor whether sending jobs offshore or importing slave labor. Same thing.

The only solution to immigration is to make sure we stop destroying the mexican economy so people can enjoy thier own country where their heart and family is. Simple as that.

[jsgaetano]

Looks like an entire state has reject Conservative Hate Speech.

The Goopers ran on being "fiscal conservatives", and failed at that. Now they are running on hate, and failing at that. Is there truly ANYTHING these failures can accomplish, aside from losing elections?

[nee]

I don't "hate" ILLEGALS - I hate spending BILLIONS on them instead of using it on our own citizens. I "hate" the decline in our educational systems because we cater to those who don't speak English and have no business being in the classrooms. I "hate" emergency rooms closing because ILLEGALS use them for non-emergency problems when they should be going to doctors in their own countries. I "hate" not having enough money to run a state because we spend BILLIONS on people who don't belong here. That is what I hate.

[frontman9000]

You certainly use the word "hate" alot. That is very powerful word that usually damages the "hater" more than the "hatee"

[jsgaetano]

You just got through spening TRILLIONS on illegal wars and "fiscal conservativism".

Didn't hear a peep out of you that whole time!

[LeftLeaner]

So, in other words, its' not "illegal" to be "illegal" in Arizona????????


Very interesting!

[jsgaetano]

No it's not. Being an undocumented person in the USA is a civil matter, at the Federal level.

It's not breaking any criminal laws, and certainly none at the state or local level.

[nee]

What about enforcing the laws already on the books. They need to fine and jail those who hire ILLEGALS and then they would start to self-deport. We need the BILLIONS we now spend on ILLEGALS. We need to use this money on our own CITIZENS!

[LeftLeaner]

Amen, that is also one of the primary reasons our health care costs are through the roof - they get free access to our Hospitals - and someone has to pay - US, the American taxpayer.

[Iraqnophobia]

careful, you are using common sense, that isnt acceptable from anyone left leaning. We need to sacrifice our own lives to make sure that illegals have a better one, that is the mantra around here, get it straight.

[jsgaetano]

How many TRILLIONS did conservatives just squander between either their illegal wars or their "fiscal conservative" bailouts for their buddies?

BTW... most of the money the US government uses comes from Blue States. Red States are the REAL welfare queens.

How about you guys at least start carrying your own weight in this country before you start trying to tell the adults how we can spend our money, mkay?

[nee]

Really? CA has 17% of the nation's population and 30% of the people who are on welfare live in CA. What color state is CA?