iPhone app iPad app Android phone app Android tablet app More

US Debt A 'Phantom Menace,' Krugman Argues

First Posted: 03/18/10 06:12 AM ET Updated: 05/25/11 03:45 PM ET

Krugman

The United States is borrowing trillions of dollars under terms that seem "too good to be true" just as a "spending explosion" on benefits programs like Medicare and Social Security is set to begin, according to the New York Times.

In a series titled "Payback Time: Debt Bomb," the Times details the magnitude of our nation's borrowing and warns of an impending and monumental reality check:

The government faces a payment shock similar to those that sent legions of overstretched homeowners into default on their mortgages.


With the national debt now topping $12 trillion, the White House estimates that the government's tab for servicing the debt will exceed $700 billion a year in 2019, up from $202 billion this year, even if annual budget deficits shrink drastically."

Replete with charts and stupefying figures (Americans must pay off more than $1.6 trillion in debt by March 31, 2010), the piece states that there is "little doubt that the United States' long-term budget crisis is becoming too big to postpone."

Au contraire, says Times columnist and Nobel Prize-winning economist Paul Krugman, who argues today that "Most economists I talk to believe that the big risk to recovery comes from the inadequacy of government efforts: the stimulus was too small, and it will fade out next year, while high unemployment is undermining both consumer and business confidence."

Krugman cites a recent interview during which President Obama warned that "if we keep on adding to the debt, even in the midst of this recovery, that at some point, people could lose confidence in the U.S. economy in a way that could actually lead to a double-dip recession."

Krugman's response: "What? Huh?"

[T]he concerns Mr. Obama expressed become comprehensible if you suppose that he's getting his views, directly or indirectly, from Wall Street.


Ever since the Great Recession began economic analysts at some (not all) major Wall Street firms have warned that efforts to fight the slump will produce even worse economic evils. In particular, they say, never mind the current ability of the U.S. government to borrow long term at remarkably low interest rates -- any day now, budget deficits will lead to a collapse in investor confidence, and rates will soar. [...]

A better model [for our current scenario], I'd argue, is Japan in the 1990s, which ran persistent large budget deficits, but also had a persistently depressed economy -- and saw long-term interest rates fall almost steadily. There's a good chance that officials are being terrorized by a phantom menace -- a threat that exists only in their minds.

Read Krugman's full piece here.

Likewise, economist and blogger Dean Baker scoffs at the Times's over-hyped debt reporting. Baker's post -- titled, "In Just a Decade the U.S. Interest Burden Could Be as High as It Was in 1992!!!!!!!" -- notes that there is "no evidence presented in this article that the rise in interest rates will place the U.S. government in a situation where it will be unable to pay its bills and no one cited in this article makes such a claim."

Incidentally, today's Wall Street Journal features more evidence that the Obama administration is rejecting Krugman's advice. "The White House is lukewarm about proposals by congressional Democrats to introduce broad legislation to create jobs, instead favoring targeted measures that would be less likely to inflate the deficit," the Journal reports, citing administration officials.

FOLLOW HUFFPOST BUSINESS

The United States is borrowing trillions of dollars under terms that seem "too good to be true" just as a "spending explosion" on benefits programs like Medicare and Social Security is set to begin, a...
The United States is borrowing trillions of dollars under terms that seem "too good to be true" just as a "spending explosion" on benefits programs like Medicare and Social Security is set to begin, a...
Filed by Nico Pitney  | 
 
 
  • Comments
  • 4,260
  • Pending Comments
  • 0
  • View FAQ
Comments are closed for this entry
View All
Favorites
Recency  | 
Popularity
Page: 1 2 3 4 5  Next ›  Last »  (58 total)
zanzy
your micro bio is empty, just like our democracy.
04:07 AM on 12/21/2009
WE need a health care system designed to provide quality health care for everyone that's affordable. Congress, most who are owned by corporations, do not have the knowledge or skills to design an effective health care system. I sure hope that the HOUSE care bill is adopted and not this senate bill. Why in the world can't we have a national level non-profit health care that means no profits), many countries have health care (they love it) and the USA is wealthier than these other countries.

KILL Profit in health care!!!!!
06:59 PM on 12/04/2009
Current Methods Of Fund Selection Deny 60 Million Mutual Fund Investors Access To Wealth Creation.

Why is there such a disparity between the net real returns of 8-9% produced by the Mutual Fund Winners Spreadsheet (MFWS) www.mutualfundwinnerpicks.com since 1994 compared to the average investor’s net real returns of 1-2% - confirmed by Dalbars recent independent study update - after fees, expenses, taxes and inflation?

Rather than bemoan this sad state of affairs and since it is unrealistic to expect expenses, taxes and inflation to be drastically reduced any time soon, the approach was to find out what controllable factor(s) are responsible for this corrosive drag on performance.

After all, why should the average investor be subjected to a 95% chance of zero wealth creation over a lifetime of employment?

After 15 years of research using over 200 million data cells and some luck, the culprit was found. It was "adverse selection", which is the systematic selection of more losers than winners usually on a 75:25 ratio basis, caused by an overwhelming number of losers. By reversing these odds, mathematically, many times more winners than losers are now easily and consistently picked.

Isn’t it time the mutual fund industry stopped relying on gossip, tips, slogans, shibboleths, canards, anecdotes… and begin using basic, proven scientific principles to help at least 60 million fund investors create wealth?

Arthur Regen, Managing Director, Regen Associates

www.mutualfundwinnerpicks.com

RegenAssociates@comcast.net

888.666.8921
07:20 AM on 11/26/2009
c'mon y'all. we're america and everything we do is dope!
04:07 AM on 11/26/2009
Someone need to tell this man to go shave his face and run for president. Oh I forgot, he is one of the numerous Obama's back seat driver.
photo
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
acudoc
12:36 AM on 11/26/2009
Krugman :Fear no debt, Serfs. Your Overlords will protect you as you merrily work 80 hours a week for a paycheck with dwindling purchasing power.

Pass the beef, my Lords, and some more wine, too. I do your bidding. And throw the bones to the dogs (the productive citizens), everything is just fine with this fiat currency created by the debt of the masses who toil for us, the financial elite.

What a load of crock for a Nobel Prize winner to be spouting!

Go to gold fast, and repeal the Federal Reserve Act of 1913 that makes fraudulent fractional-reserve banking the fast road to hell, historically speaking. All the bloody excesses of the 20th, and now the 21st, Century, all the crooked wars, all the cultural degradation, can be laid at the altar of the central banks of the Western world.

Cui bono? The question that must be asked repeatedly in order to clarify the vision.
10:06 AM on 11/26/2009
While we are at it, let's ditch our cars and build some buggies and whips.

Do you even understand what you are proposing?

We need in this country a massive building and rebuilding of infrastructure for a future energy efficient economy. We need to spend the money that we are "printing" to improve our productivity for the next 10 - 50 years down the road. We must increase the capacity of our economy to create products (both goods and services) that the rest of the world wants and needs.

That is what we need to do - not cry chicken little. There is going to be gov't debt whether we like it or not for along time. Not only gov't debt, we have private debt that is huge as well. The issue is will we use this debt to purchase worthless consumables, create mirage wealth (fake Wall Street profits), unproductive asset bubbles. Or are we going to improve our national economic outlook by investing in infrastructure, R&D, education, green tech, homeland security, etc..

Also - hopefully we become peace mongers and not war mongers - could have saved a couple trillions of dollars if we did not invade Iraq on false premises.
11:24 PM on 11/25/2009
Just goes to show how a Nobel in todays world ain't worth $hit.
photo
Republitarian
Take your stinking paws off of my money!
04:53 PM on 11/25/2009
Not what the former Enron adviser was arguing when Bush was president:

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/03/11/opinion/11KRUG.html
11:01 PM on 11/25/2009
Nice. You only left out just a couple of tiny details, like the fact that between that 2003 article and today's we had a pretty bad recession, and because of that the former Enron advisor and 2009 economics nobel prize winner argues that this situation is indeed more similar to Japan's in the 90's. Which is also what he said at the end of his 2003 article.

The quote is "But unless we slide into Japanese-style deflation, there are much higher interest rates in our future." towards the end of the article.
photo
Republitarian
Take your stinking paws off of my money!
11:17 PM on 11/25/2009
"But unless we slide into Japanese-style deflation, there are much higher interest rates in our future."

And what exactly do you think the Fed printing all this money is going to do? The inflation has already occurred and continues to occur. Prices have just stayed down because of demand is down (people aren't spending). Have you not seen the dollar plummeting?

You can't possibly run deficits like this, doubling the debt over the next 10 years, plus Medicare and Social Security's $100+ trillion insolvency, and not print your way out of it. A $14T economy can't grow its way out of $100+ trillion in liabilities, and you can't tax your way out of it.
photo
Donnat
Remember when teachers, public employees, Planned
04:30 PM on 11/25/2009
Has someone said it already - we're too big to fail
03:41 PM on 11/25/2009
its obvious the Krugman has no kids or has disowned them.
04:20 PM on 11/25/2009
What does your statement even mean? Why is it that every republican seem to be obsessed with this talking point: it's always about the children; how ever will they pay off the debt and such. It's interesting, but it's also deceiving, because if people like yourself truely cared about the children of the future then you would enact policies and pave the way for their success, such as fair, sustainable paying jobs and decent and affortable living environments. What good is clearing a debt that leaves half the country unemployed? Allow people to work first, and in time the debt will be taken care of.

Case in point, A person that is unemployed is doing nothing other than receiving unemployment benifit and therefore is not contributing to decreasing our debt. A person that is employed will slowly but surely be able to contribute through taxes in decreasing our debt. I think it's clearly obvious which one of our problems requires a greater level of our attention.

Seriously the reasoning and logic of some people leaves much to be desired.
04:47 PM on 11/25/2009
Your argument seems rather prone to circular logic. Let me see if I understand you correctly: In order to decrease the debt, we need to go into debt to provide jobs which will pay a portion of the generated income towards decreasing the debt. In other words, if the government provides someone a job at $60,000 a year, adding $60,000 to the debt, it's ok because that person will be paying about $20,000 in taxes and "contributing." Given that contributing usually entails consumer spending ("go to the mall"), I see this as only exacerbating our current predicament.

Wealth is generated from savings, not spending. We need Americans to start saving again, and yes, that means a painful period of recuperation. The artificially low interest rates and high leveraging of the past few decades sent the signal that there was a larger base of savings in the economy than there actually was. Therefore, consumption occurred at an artificially high rate. It only follows that we now need to go through a period of higher than average savings and lower than average consumption before the economy can truly recover.
05:45 PM on 11/25/2009
Where were the teabaggers and debt critics when the GOP took a balanced budget and ran up trillions in debt in 8 short years? Obama's administration's contribution to the mounting debt started on his 1st day with Bush's 2 wars, tax breaks for the rich, TARP, etc. So, the additional debt being laid on every day is thanks to whom? The REPUBLICANS!!! You wouldn't know it listening to the non-stop whining from the righties.

Some say they want the country they had under Bush & Cheney back. They are pining for the old days of conservatism spending. What a joke. Everyone is broke. The only effort to put money into the economy is coming from the FED. The welathy are putting there money where it's safe. Of course, the whiny righties what to reward them with more tax cuts. Our economy is in shambles under the REPUBLICANS!!!
photo
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
billw8017
History looks like this
01:36 AM on 11/26/2009
The deficit doubled over the past decade, too. Our current crisis is, however, deflationary. I never weary of telling how a nickel cup of coffee now costs $1.50 although nobody really cares. Clearly, a cup of coffee will cost $25 in half a century -- probably sooner because the federal government seems to have lost the power to match tax income and expenditures.

Inflation is merely a practical equivalent to a sales tax with the little kicker that it compounds. The critical matter is earnings to match prices. Give a person money, and it will be spent; just give us enough.
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
photo
02:24 PM on 11/25/2009
Oh if Milton Friedman were alive today to reap what he sewed.
04:53 PM on 11/25/2009
I agree, although I'm sure I have a different take than you on why Milton Friedman was responsible. Friedman was a monetarist. While he and Greenspan are often viewed as free-marketeers, nothing could be further from the truth. Both were in favor of a financial system with a strong central bank, which stands in stark contrast to a free market system that dictates interest rates on the open market. When you give the ability to dictate interest rates and the supply of money to a small group of powerful men in a secret room (Federal Reserve), problems are bound to follow.
01:15 PM on 11/25/2009
Krugman does point to an excellent example in Japan in 1990s as part of his argument. Today Japan has low inflation and an unemployment rate of 4.4% with the world 2nd largest economy. Unfortunately, it took over a decade to get it out of its slump and yet never fully recovered-while never suffering high unemployment. Could it be possible that the enormous debt that Japan created led to an extended transition out of its recession? Can we as a society grapple with 10% unemployment for over a decade. Will our debt stunt that transition? Japan has over 1/4 of its workforce participate in Unions, it has a declining population (more deaths than births) versus our growing population, and its work hours and wages have been steadily falling.

The scary thing about Japan's economy is that following initial loss in economic growth Japan cut discount rates in half and employed a stimulus plan (kind of where we were earlier in the year). Then asset prices in the real estate and stock markets rebounded and became inflated, the government responded by raising interest rates and then the Japanese stock market crashed. Is that our future?
01:02 PM on 11/25/2009
Hey, relax, our kids will have to pay it back.
03:44 PM on 11/25/2009
OK lets pay it back now and "our kids" can enjoy their unemployment checks -_-
11:09 AM on 11/25/2009
FWIW ... the go-go rah-rah central bankers of India and China are ridiculing Krugman for scaling
back banking ... read on ...

http://business.rediff.com/report/2009/nov/25/subbarao-pooh-poohs-krugman-boring-banking-idea.htm
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
photo
07:08 PM on 11/24/2009
Alexander Tyler about 240 years ago said the following about Athens but could just as easily apply to us today:

"A Democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that a Democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship."

It remains to be seen how much longer a majority can vote themselves money that doesn't exist out of the public treasury before someone starts calling in the tab.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
pkafin
08:59 PM on 11/24/2009
Seeing as how the Defense budget spends 54% of the money raised by taxes, I find your analysis lacking. It's not a case of voters choosing self benefiting largess. It, more often than not, is a case of big business special interest groups (largely shielded from democracy's reach) that push the system over the cliff.
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
photo
10:22 PM on 11/24/2009
"Seeing as how the Defense budget spends 54% of the money raised by taxes, I find your analysis lacking."

And we do not have the resources to sustain the out-of-control welfare state either. Both Defense and social programs need to be cut and the budget needs to be balanced. But many government representatives will do anything to maintain power (stay in office), so the funds keep flowing out of Washington. The so-called "stimulus" bill is a prime example.

"It's not a case of voters choosing self benefiting largess. It, more often than not, is a case of big business special interest groups (largely shielded from democracy's reach) that push the system over the cliff."

Which "big business special interest groups" are you talking about. Specificity would be nice.
01:36 AM on 11/25/2009
This comment is a very simplistic analysis. People repeat these little aphorisms like they were gospel, but the reality is a great deal more complex. I hate to see people posting them over and over.
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
photo
10:13 PM on 11/25/2009
"People repeat these little aphorisms like they were gospel, but the reality is a great deal more complex."

I agree...and I guess I'm in good company.

How many times did President Obama say, "If you like your health care plan, you can keep it." Well, unless your employer abandons health care coverage...such a small detail though. ;-)
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
deminmo
just looking for answers
06:04 PM on 11/24/2009
I have a prediction; the commercial real estate market collapses,
commodities collapse, oil goes to $180 a barrel, jobs continue to
disappear, China does not want any more of our T Bills, and this
starts to happen mid-2010. The stock market plunges to 400 and
the Great Depression follows. Then, maybe we start over in 2011
and finally get our collective heads out of our butts!
11:10 PM on 11/24/2009
Yep, honestly, our country is doomed financially and the current bull market after the great fall only one year ago is a complete and utter sham. It's propped up with the trillions in tax payer stimulus money invested by the bank, the government's co-conspirators--with OUR MONEY. The government is finally too big and Obama is powerless to defeat it. Our Congress is corrupt and truly made from dim-witted lawyers who only serve themselves. They don't understand economics and don't care to. Look at the latest report that two senators are proposing a "war tax" on the wealthy. The government has no where else to turn for money and can only tax or print money. That's why we are both headed for hyper inflation (not a question of if now, but when), and a mass exodus of wealthy/intelligent citizens expatriating. I list myself and family one of them. I would not have believed this a year or two ago, but we are not only going in the wrong direction, it looks like it's too late reverse course. The government is too big and should be cut to one quarter its size. The debt needs to be eliminated. We must create wealth, not tax it. Buy as much gold and silver as you can. Ok, a lot here, probably no one will read this, but just needed to get my thoughts out there. We need American Revolution 2.0.
photo
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
doneright
Mr. Sublime
12:17 PM on 11/25/2009
You think you want a revolution? You should have been there to greet the soldiers as they returned home after the civil war. Why is it that every time there is a crisis of confidence people want to start killing each other. The world is not deterministic. No matter want the outlook there is the possibility that we can see this thing through to success. If there is success recovering from the present economic crisis it will not come from the deterministic doomsdayers.
03:33 PM on 11/25/2009
Create wealth, don't tax it. Buy as much gold and silver as you can. We need American Revolution 2.0. Wow, that is some really deep stuff. You should sign up for the Tea Party Speakers Bureau.