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DADT Conflict Explained: Why Obama Administration Lawyers Fight For A DADT Policy Obama Opposes

MARK SHERMAN   10/21/10 07:57 AM ET   AP

Dadt
In this photo provided by the Department of Justice, Paul Clement is seen in this photo, date unknown. President Barack Obama opposes the Pentagon's 'don't ask, don't tell' policy on gays in the military, but there is a long tradition that the Justice Department defends laws adopted by Congress and signed by a president, regardless of whether the president in office likes them. The tradition flows directly from the president's constitutional duty to take care that the laws are faithfully execute

WASHINGTON — President Barack Obama opposes the Pentagon's "don't ask, don't tell" policy on gays in the military, so why are Obama administration lawyers in court fighting to save it?

The answer is one that perhaps only a lawyer could love: There is a long tradition that the Justice Department defends laws adopted by Congress and signed by a president, regardless of whether the president in office likes them.

This practice cuts across party lines. And it has caused serious heartburn for more than one attorney general.

The tradition flows directly from the president's constitutional duty to take care that the laws are faithfully executed, says Paul Clement, who served four years in President George W. Bush's administration as solicitor general, the executive branch's top lawyer at the Supreme Court.

Otherwise, Clement says, the nation would be subjected to "the spectacle of the executive branch defending only laws it likes, with Congress intervening to defend others."

That is why solicitors general not only serve the president who nominated them but also have a special duty to Congress, "most notably, the vigorous defense of the statutes of this country against constitutional attack," Justice Elena Kagan testified to Congress in 2009 after Obama nominated her to be solicitor general. She joined the Supreme Court a year later.

On occasion, the Justice Department will even defend a law it knows is likely to be judged unconstitutional, said Seth Waxman, who served as President Bill Clinton's solicitor general.

Six federal judges had ruled against the Communications Decency Act, a 1996 law that made it a crime to make available to minors on the Internet material that was "indecent" or "patently offensive." Nevertheless, Waxman backed the law in an appeal to the Supreme Court. He lost there, but felt good about serving "our adversarial system of constitutional adjudication."

William French Smith, President Ronald Reagan's first attorney general, once said that defending congressional action that extended the ratification period for the proposed Equal Rights Amendment for women caused far and away his most uncomfortable moments in four years in office because of the irate calls he got from administration supporters – who staunchly opposed the ERA.

Obama's supporters have similarly criticized the administration for its legal efforts on behalf of "don't ask, don't tell," the law that bars gays from serving openly in the military, even after U.S. District Judge Virginia Phillips in Riverside, Calif., ordered the military to immediately suspend and discontinue any investigation or other proceeding to dismiss gay service members under the law.

Indeed, Justice lawyers delayed their response to Phillips because the White House weighed in on the matter, according to a government official with knowledge of the situation. A couple of White House lawyers did not want to seek a court order that would temporarily suspend the judge's ruling, this person said, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss the administration's internal deliberations. Failing to challenge the ruling would have had the effect of ending the policy.

Obama says he supports repeal of "don't ask, don't tell" but only after careful review and an act of Congress.

Ultimately, the government did ask Phillips to suspend her ruling pending the government's appeal.

After Phillips refused, the administration asked the federal appeals court in San Francisco to freeze her ruling temporarily, which it did late Wednesday. Justice lawyers argued that while appeals were pending, abruptly ending "don't ask, don't tell" and immediately allowing openly gay service members could harm troop morale and unit cohesion when the military is fighting two wars.

On rare occasions, Justice officials conclude there is no reasonable argument that can be made in defense of a federal law.

Clement recalled two instances during his tenure. One posed free speech problems, because it sought to prevent recipients of federal transportation money from running ads favoring legalization of some drugs. The other was an obscure 1800s statute dealing with licensing of salvage operations.

When George H.W. Bush was president, he vetoed the Cable Television Act of 1992 in the belief that certain provisions were unconstitutional. The bill became law when Congress overrode Bush's veto.

Cable operators challenged the law in court, and Bush's Justice Department said it would not defend what the president had vetoed.

But then Clinton was elected. He reversed course and sent Justice lawyers into court on behalf of the law. The Supreme Court eventually upheld it.

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WASHINGTON — President Barack Obama opposes the Pentagon's "don't ask, don't tell" policy on gays in the military, so why are Obama administration lawyers in court fighting to save it? The answ...
WASHINGTON — President Barack Obama opposes the Pentagon's "don't ask, don't tell" policy on gays in the military, so why are Obama administration lawyers in court fighting to save it? The answ...
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08:16 AM on 12/19/2010
I sure hope all the haters, doubters, posers and so forth aren't choking too badly on all the crow they're having to swallow today after the repeal of DADT. Turns out that Obama's strategy was right all along. This is by far the best way DADT could have been eliminated -- that is, by Congress. I'm sure though that they won't want to recognize this reality. They will say he should have done this or that, or not done whatever. They will deny the reality that Obama's steady calm leadership (of course along with a lot of hard work and leadership from other people) got us the victory. Those people's hatred and distrust of Obama have twisted them so much to the point where they are willing to believe that Obama does not support the gay community and that he really didn't want DADT repealed. In this fantasy world they live in, it's better to attack the president, "take our vote and go home", without any consideration of what next then. This is the "I want mine and I want it now crowd and damn you if you don't give it to me no matter what the cost". Liberal whiners will be wishing they'd been more trusting and patient and respectful with President Obama when President Haley Barbour takes office in 2013.
Kyle Carlson
Progressive Professional Millennial
01:59 PM on 10/29/2010
We need to change tactics to make DADT even more of a painful PR issue for the White House.

There are different levels of judicial review of the constitutionality of a given statute. The easiest standard for a suspect statute to overcome is the “Mere Rationality Standard.” To pass the rationality standard for constitutionality a statute must 1) pursue a legitimate state objective (state as in gov’t, not as in 50 states) and 2) the means chosen to pursue this objective must be rationally related to the objective.

Here’s where the PR attack comes in. Ask Obama/Ax/Gibbs/Whoever what the legitimate state objective of DADT is, then ask them how DADT is rationally related to achieving that objective.

For example:
Press Secretary Gibbs, is DADT a rational method to achieve increased unit cohesion in the military?
President Obama, you’ve stated DADT harms unit moral/cohesion and damages military readiness, as a constitutional scholar, do you believe DADT rationally pursues a legitimate state interest?

The answer will either directly lead to the conclusion that DADT fails the mere rationality standard (i.e. is unconstitutional and should not be defended in court), OR
The answer will show a prominent WH official saying they think DADT is rational – a serious flip-flop and slam on the GLBT community.
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poeticjustice4all
Past = Prologue
07:33 PM on 10/22/2010
This article is a gag. This is not a real article. You are being punk'd.
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JShankel
I want my country forward
04:27 PM on 10/22/2010
Okay, someone break it down for me like I'm Christine O'Donnell:

First, do we want Obama to WIN or LOSE at the appellate and then Supreme Court level? Which is it?

Second, assuming Obama wins in court and DADT is ruled constitutional, exactly precisely how do we envision congress repealing DADT, considering that you can't pass gas in the Senate without 60 votes?

Third, assuming that congress repeals DADT, what prevents future presidents from just re-instating Reagan's ban? There was no DADT in 1982. And in the absence of any court ruling, the 1982 standard will still be constitutional.

Fourth, assuming this congress repeals DADT, what prevents a future congress from just passing it again?

These are the questions. Answers only to the questions, please. I'll take all "you just hate Obama" statements as granted comment, unnecessary to tediously repost.

This isn't about Obama. This is asking what the actual end game is here.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
David Speakman
Silicon Valley-based writer and law scholar.
03:36 AM on 10/23/2010
In case this is confusing, here is what happened Wednesday:

Barack Obama decided that there was an emergency reason to start firing gay people from the military again..starting today ... and

to be able to continue to fire gay people during the trial ... and

to make sure the gay people he fired do not get their jobs back ... and

to continue to fire gay people until Congress changes the law so that he is no longer allowed to fire gay people...

So he can sign that new law in a big ceremony to show how much of a friend he is to gay people.
06:39 AM on 10/29/2010
bull, he made it extremely hard to "fire" any gays; in fact it would take so long to do that the whole thing could be over before they could move on a single person. Once the Pentagon report comes out it will get repealed by congress.

It won't be reinstated by a later congress because by then it would have been in place successfully for a number of years.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
toldyeso
02:05 PM on 10/22/2010
BS

Obama is no friend to the gay community -

He says he wants dont ask repealled by the congress...

Isn't it funny though that since hes losing us the House and at least 7-8 dem senators - we should believe him that he will get this passed in the next session when it failed in this one?

Translation:
Obama says wait until after HE is "reelected.

As with all things - its ALL about whats best for obama.

Thats why he campaigned on a whole tour with anti gay gospel singers headed up by self hating gay - the rev donnie mcgurkin and his "you can change" singers throughout the south during the primaries - on a quest to rev up the anti gay vote in the black churches (since hillary was/is openly and fiercly pro gay human rights)

Remember that?

Obama went on that tour even AFTER every gay rights group in the nation BEGGED HIM NOT TO!

But that didn't stop Obama!

Once again he and his arny of deceitful enablers are trying to "hoodwink and bamboozle" us into buying that he will overturn DADT.

Look we wont have the votes in the next congress for a congressional remedy for DADT.

Let the courts do their duty. They'll end it.

and if the SCOTUS overturns someday down the road

Hopefully by then we will have our congressional majorities back and we could pass a new DADT bill then if needed..

Obama is offering us NOTHING but "just
06:43 AM on 10/29/2010
If he doesn't appeal it it won't go up in the courts — at all.

This district court opinion isn't binding on any other court outside of this judges so calif district. Another district court judge in say, KY could decide that is must be reinstated.
10:50 PM on 10/21/2010
I think the President is weak and really doesn't give a damn if DADT or DOMA is repealed.
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thepoliticalcat
Eradicate your microbioflora
12:40 AM on 10/22/2010
What you think isn't the issue. The law is.
HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
trishinpitt
No, your micro-bio is empty!
11:03 AM on 10/22/2010
I'm sure Speaker Boehner and President Palin will make it all better......
10:15 PM on 10/21/2010
The courts are supposed to be the final word. Either it is constitutional or not. This pandering to the homophobes is totally un-American.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
thepoliticalcat
Eradicate your microbioflora
12:42 AM on 10/22/2010
The courts have not yet had their final word. The DoJ is doing its duty. If they only defended the laws the President passed or liked, they would be derelict. We may not like it, but this is why Bush corrupted the DoJ with ideological appointments -- to ensure it could not carry out its duty. We cannot insist that the DoJ continue to perform in the manner it did under Bush.
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AnotherTry
Tell me again why we can't be equal?
03:41 AM on 10/22/2010
Bush was re-elected for a reason. His base was impressed with his leadership.
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toldyeso
02:06 PM on 10/22/2010
Look we wont have the votes in the next congress for a congressional remedy for DADT.

Let the courts do their duty. They'll end it.

and if the SCOTUS overturns someday down the road

Hopefully by then we will have our congressional majorities back and we could pass a new DADT bill then if needed..
06:18 AM on 10/22/2010
Huh? How are you for the courts and also against Obama and the DOJ for using the courts? DADT has been found unconstitutional by one federal judge, now it gets brought before the 9th circuit appellate court and then if found unconstitutional by them it will be brought up to the Supreme court. That's how the courts work, the court that the "pandering homophobes" are using.....
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JShankel
I want my country forward
04:19 PM on 10/22/2010
The administration has the option of allowing the lower court ruling to simply stand. No one besides the administration has standing to appeal or to bring a suit demanding that DADT be reinstated, so the lower court ruling is as good as any other's.

We are being sold a bill of goods. This is about delay, delay, delay, not about propriety or prudence.
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Subhunter
09:21 PM on 10/21/2010
Because that's the way we've always done it.. What total BS!
06:20 AM on 10/22/2010
You'd rather that the administration not defend the laws? So when the next Republican administration takes over, what laws would you like them not to defend?
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Subhunter
08:35 PM on 10/22/2010
I'm sure they'll do as they damn well please just like the last Republican administration did.
09:19 PM on 10/21/2010
"On occasion, the Justice Department will even defend a law it knows is likely to be judged unconstitutional"

this is seriously an example of how efficient our system has become? if so we are long overdue for a revolution. who still uses 18th century technology anyway?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
thepoliticalcat
Eradicate your microbioflora
12:43 AM on 10/22/2010
The law is not technology.
06:28 AM on 10/22/2010
Uh that's been the policy of the Attorney Generals office since the very first Attorney General appointed by George Washington in 1789. That's what the office of President does, it defends the laws
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JShankel
I want my country forward
09:06 PM on 10/21/2010
Okay, all this wrangling and complex analysis aside, why do I suspect that if the Obama Administration had just accepted this ruling and said "Okay, we performed our duty and defended this law, but the judge has ruled and we'll abide by the ruling...DADT is out" that everyone would be celebrating and no one would be saying "No! A mere federal court ruling is not enough! We need an appellate ruling and a repeal from congress!"

Something tells me we'd all just be happy if the administration let this ruling stand.

And for those worried that "some other court" will "come along" and void this ruling, that can only happen if someone with standing sues to have DADT reinstated. That would be who? That would be the case of US v. Who, Exactly?
12:27 AM on 10/22/2010
Um HELLO? The Republicans?
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JShankel
I want my country forward
03:09 PM on 10/22/2010
A) little known fact, but the plaintiffs in this case are the Log Cabin Republicans...they would be the people arguing FOR the repeal of DADT

B) little known fact but you have to have some sort of standing to sue the government. You can't just sue because you're mad. Someone would have to show that the suspension of DADT has harmed them, personally. It can't just be "The Republicans."

This is all crap. All this "it's necessary to defend the policy in order to destroy it" stuff is BULLSH*T.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
thepoliticalcat
Eradicate your microbioflora
12:44 AM on 10/22/2010
The Obama Administration has no control of the DoJ. The DoJ is supposed to be an independent body. The fact that Bush corrupted the DoJ and turned it into an arm of the administration is NOT the norm.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
toldyeso
02:06 PM on 10/22/2010
SORRY NO

THATS RIDICULOUS
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
David Speakman
Silicon Valley-based writer and law scholar.
03:39 AM on 10/23/2010
That is just wrong.
GlennInVenice
Venice; Where Art Meets Crime
08:53 PM on 10/21/2010
Obama was sworn in to uphold the constitution, not the laws of congress.

At least I believe that is what he swore. I did not watch his inauguration as he choose a man who has shown offensive bigotry toward gay and lesbian Americans to say the inaugural prayer.

Anyhow, Obama could dignify the finding of the federal court judge and agree that DADT is unconstitutional. End of story.

If the continues to do things because "it is tradition", we are in more trouble than I thought. We have been building up some pretty heinous traditions lately. Also, I thought he was the president who continues to side-step justice by claiming to be "forward looking". Isn't tradition seen only when looking backward?

Me thinks that on the subject of civil rights, Obama speaks beautifully out of both sides of his mouth.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
thepoliticalcat
Eradicate your microbioflora
12:46 AM on 10/22/2010
You're incorrect. You assume the President can tell the DoJ to drop an appeal. He cannot. The DoJ is independent of the Executive. It stands in a unique relationship to the judiciary, the legislature, and the Executive. It has nothing to do with tradition. This is the way the government was set up, to prevent collusion by one or more branches at the expense of another.

It's sad that most Americans don't understand how their government works.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Doug Watt
Not ready for 2012
02:52 AM on 10/22/2010
The DOJ reports to the President and always has. It is sad indeed. Also, there are laws that the president refuses to defend or won't prosecute, so the claim that the DOJ must appeal every law is wrong. From Americablog: http://gay.americablog.com/2010/10/valerie-lifestyle-choice-jarrett.html

A) Last October the Obama administration outright ignored federal law regarding marijuana because it was at odd's with the administration's policy preferences with regards to medical marijuana.B) Then there is President Obama's use of signing statements to simply ignore laws passed by Congress.C) Then there's this from the NYT just two months ago:

The administration will consider itself free to disregard new laws it considers unconstitutional....Mr. Obama nevertheless challenged dozens of provisions early last year. The last time was in June, when his claim that he could disobey a new law requiring officials to push the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund to adopt certain policies angered Congress....Last year the Obama administration disregarded a statute that forbid State Department officials to attend United Nations meetings led by nations deemed state sponsors of terrorism.
GlennInVenice
Venice; Where Art Meets Crime
08:11 PM on 10/22/2010
The DOJ is under the Exectuve branch of government.

They are fighting a federal court decission that represents the Judicial branch.

The federal court decided that a law was unconstitutional that was written and passed by the Legislative (and signed by the Executive).

The DOJ reports to Obama.
06:39 AM on 10/22/2010
"Obama was sworn in to uphold the constitution, not the laws of congress."

And where do you think the laws that congress passes get their authority? By swearing to uphold the constitution he is alss swearing to uphold the laws of this country.
GlennInVenice
Venice; Where Art Meets Crime
08:15 PM on 10/22/2010
The point is that laws cannot be written that conflict with the Constitution; which the President has sworn to uphold. Recently the Judicial branch of government found DOMA and DADT to be unconstitutional. That is their job to do that. You now have Obama's DOJ fighting to maintain a law that has been correctly judged to be unconstitutional which puts him at odds with the Constitution he was sworn to uphold.

The unconstitutionality of these laws is evident a mile away. They stink of bigotry and conflict with many of the lofty principals enshrined in the Constitution. The fact that Obama is instructing the DOJ to defend these putrid laws speaks to his lack of character.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Dreamwalker420
08:40 PM on 10/21/2010
While I think that DADT is absurb, but a descent bandaid to a complex problem. Ahem ... the Constitution makes it very clear that Obama is the Commander in Chief.

It is his decision what lawyers for the Defense Department do. Period. No exceptions or scapegoats about the complexities of our modern Republic.

If he doesn't command the troops ... who does?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
David Moore
Teacher, German, Math, Pennsylvania
09:00 PM on 10/21/2010
All that would be wonderful, except that it is the Department of Justice which is fighting the case in Federal Court. The DoJ is obliged to take orders from the Attorney General and President.
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thepoliticalcat
Eradicate your microbioflora
12:50 AM on 10/22/2010
Sorry, but "Commander in Chief" is a military title. When it comes to the law, the President is not SUPPOSED to have any influence over the DoJ. The DoJ is independent of the Executive and required to report to the Legislature. That has to be so, otherwise the body that enforces the laws of the Republic is at the whim of the elected President. Which is what happened under Bush. Enforcement of civil rights aimed at uncovering discrimination against white people; violation of the First Amendment rights of anyone who might disagree with the Administration; summary kidnapping and jailing of people who might be suspected (often mistakenly) of involvement in !lleg@l @ctions, evidence for which was often slender at best, or illegally obtained. The President cannot order the DoJ to drop an appeal. Commanding the troops has nothing to do with presidential authority over civilians.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
David Speakman
Silicon Valley-based writer and law scholar.
03:47 AM on 10/23/2010
The DOJ most definitely *is not* independent of the Executive branch.

http://www.usa.gov/Agencies/Federal/Executive.shtml#Executive_Departments

Your fundamental mistake in understanding how our federal government works undermines the rest of your argument - which, by the way, also is fatally flawed for other reasons.
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JShankel
I want my country forward
08:31 PM on 10/21/2010
Everyone does realize of course that repealing DADT just makes it legal to outright ban gays from serving, right?

Repealing alone does nothing except make it the president's call. Any future president could just reinstate Ronald Reagan's ban.

In addition to repeal, we also need a new law that affirms the rights of gays to serve. Then no future president could ban gays from serving by executive fiat.

Or we need a court decision saying that discrimination is unconstitutional.
GlennInVenice
Venice; Where Art Meets Crime
08:54 PM on 10/21/2010
This is misinformation.

Just why do you think the air force and the recruiters were told to accept applications from gay people?
HUFFPOST PUNDIT
JShankel
I want my country forward
09:02 PM on 10/21/2010
Which statement that I made is incorrect?

Recruiters were told to accept applications because DADT was suspended and there is no executive order banning gays and in fact Obama, and I believe this, wants to allow gays to serve openly so in suspension of DADT that will be policy.

However it is also the fact that if we MERELY suspend DADT, it will remain within the president's power to reimplement Ronald Reagan's ban. This president won't do that. Perhaps no president will.

This ruling does not say that homosexuals must be allowed to serve. It says the manner in which homosexuals were allowed to serve, which requires their complicity and silence, violates due process.

It doesn't say that just banning gays violates due process.

We need a law in addition to the repeal that affirms the right of gays to serve. Otherwise it'll just be up to the whims of whoever happens to be president.
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JShankel
I want my country forward
08:25 PM on 10/21/2010
The most Democratic congress you're likely to see could just barely...just BARELY...pass a half-assed sort of improvement to the accessibility and affordability of private health insurance, the cost of which is spiraling out of control.

This is something that benefits virtually everyone if done right, handles a problem that everyone admits is a problem and yet what we ended up with is an incoherent mess that marginally better than doing nothing.

But somehow a more Republican congress, with a likely majority in the House and a bare Democratic majority in the Senate, is going to pass a repeal of DADT so gays can serve openly?

This is going to happen...how? If people don't care enough about the affordability of their own health care to push their Republican representatives to find a workable solution with the Democrats, they're not going to push them on gay rights, FFS.

This gets repealed by someone wearing a robe or it stands forever.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
toldyeso
02:08 PM on 10/22/2010
Look we wont have the votes in the next congress for a congressional remedy for DADT.

Let the courts do their duty. They'll end it.

and if the SCOTUS overturns someday down the road

Hopefully by then we will have our congressional majorities back and we could pass a new DADT bill then if needed..
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scott63
Genius IQ public High School education.
07:57 PM on 10/21/2010
Obama doesn't want to repeal DADT or give into any of the other gay community demands because he's a closet muslim and they hate homosexuality. Obama needs to come out of his own closet
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HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
ConfuciusSay-
Aglets: their purpose is sinister.
10:03 PM on 10/21/2010
So... he's a "closet homophobe" who needs to come out of the closet?

No - that's a Republican thing.
12:31 AM on 10/22/2010
stop.