Sen. Vernon Asbill Introduces Bill To Give N.M. Schools Letter Grades Based On Students' Test Scores

Like many states, New Mexico's leaders are pressing forward with education reforms intended to improve the state school system.

This week, Sen. Vernon Asbill introduced a bill that would mandate that schools are given letter grades based on students' test scores, KRQE News reports.

Asbill says the legislation will help the state government allocate resources to the schools that need it most.

Critics oppose the bill's focus on standardized testing, which they say inhibits students from getting a "well-rounded education," according to KRQE.

The conversation mirrors the national debate over the effectiveness of education policies heavily based on testing, like many of those advocated by President Obama's administration.

WATCH:

Comments

[Christopher Bowen]

12:32 PM on 03/12/2011

This feels like more of a plea for political attention, but you could make a bit of a case for it with older kids. Having taught both, elementary school kids genuinely attempt to do their best. At least most of them do. As the kids get older, they start to realize that the test has no impact on their grades and are far more likely to give little effort on the test. If they knew the test was "graded" and counted as a portion of their grade, you might get more kids putting in a real effort and your scores might be a better reflection of what's really going on.

What would be ideal is for results to get back to schools almost instantly. It might be nice if teachers were able to use these tests as teaching tools. They give a version of the test in the beginning of the year (ideally on-line), they get the results back right away and plan according to student need. We take it again in the middle of the year and restructure based on those results. A final version is given at the end of the year. At least this way, the test would be an authentic teaching tool and of some real use to those in the classroom.

There are so many things that make standardized tests problematic, but this might, at least, make them more meaningful.

Chris Bowen
http://teacher2teacher.lacoe.edu/a-fresh-dreamer.aspx

[SeptimusDSX]

06:24 PM on 02/17/2011

Yet another worthless proposal. When will the people realize that this kind of political posturing does not address anything worthwhile?

[Ldcook]

09:39 AM on 02/17/2011

I have a radical idea here folks. Are you ready for this?

How about we don't promote students who cannot show they have mastered the material?

If it takes you 3 years to pass Algebra, so be it, but it is something we have decided as a society you need to know. It is time we collectively take the hard line and stop promoting students grade to grade who are not passing the grade. If you cannot read at a 5th grade level, you don't go onto 6th grade reading. By the same token we need to let students who excel at a subject to move on when they are ready.

TL;DR version:
Stop holding back students who are excelling and stop promoting students who are not up to snuff.

[SeptimusDSX]

06:21 PM on 02/17/2011

I agree. This is common practice everywhere else in the world.

[a little revolution]

11:52 AM on 02/20/2011

I teach in a university with students from, I'm told, 146 countries. Many overcome mind-blowing obstacles to come here and pay twice the local tuition to undertake difficult studies in a foreign language, English, which is not easy to learn. Students in Bangladesh, for example, take an entire year of each level of English, but if they don't score above an 80 on the final exam, they repeat the entire year, all just to be allowed to apply to come to the US to study. I'm in awe of these young men and women.

While I realize there are mitigating factors in a number of households in poor and disenfranchised communities here, I have little sympathy for American students who hold their own educational opportunities in contempt. Do the work or fail. Social advancement rewards ignorance, arrogance and superficiality. Take a look at society today. We're all paying the costs for such myopic behavior.

[trinity]

08:03 PM on 02/16/2011

Well so much for those schools with high numbers of students with special needs and English Language Learners...

[Andre L Jackson]

04:54 PM on 02/16/2011

People.... come on!! NEW MEXICO is not FLORIDA? They should focus more on great
education program like IDEAL-NM ideal-nm.org.

[jourdankr]

01:48 PM on 02/17/2011

I totally agree. Problem is that NM's new Secretary of Ed. is from Florida, as are all of her advisors. NM could be in trouble.

[ladyvader]

04:14 PM on 02/16/2011

Standardize test teaches students NOTHING! If schools start getting grades like students get and that school gets a "F", how many "D" or "F" students will get kicked out of school for bringing the schools overall score down.

I know someone that got told by his principal to quit because he was bringing the schools test scores down. And of course he quit school.

[carester]

05:53 PM on 02/16/2011

Standarized test are a necessary evil that schools brought upon themselves. The grade inflation is rampant. Read the story of Brigedette Green, the valedictorian in New Orleans who could not pass the state standarized test (she was in the 1% tile). It took her SEVEN, 7 times to finally barely pass. She was actually trying to sue the school district for lying to her and robbing her of an education. Students who can barely put 2 + 2 together enrolled in AP calculus, isn't that taking students for fools? By suggesting/or allowing them to enroll in rigorous courses for which they are so utterly unprepared, school are beyond negligent. What is going to happen at the end of the school year when big, bad AP exit exam is waiting? The kid just wasted his/her time in a class he/she couldn't comprehend to begin with, foregoing a level appropiate class that he/she could have benefitted tremendously. My son is enrolled in advanced classes. The other day they were given the interm test. Guess how many kids got an A on the test? TWO, my son and another boy. How many kids in the class? 20+. Keep in mind that this is a BASIC, BENCHMARK TEST (and this is supposedly an ADVANCED CLASS). How does it come that the "brightest" couldn't do well on such test? There are so many Bridgette Greens out there ! !

[Phong Le]

03:06 AM on 02/19/2011

As someone who grew up in New Orleans, I can tell you that Ms Green's high school, Alcee Fortier Senior High School, is one of the worst school in New Orleans. I doubt Ms Green was taking AP classes, because I doubt Alcee Fortier Senior High School offers any AP classes. Being a valedictorian there means nothing, as the standardized test show. Standardized tests are not perfect at measuring a student's aptitude, but it is great at measuring basic proficiency.

[Gregory Gull]

08:12 AM on 02/16/2011

We can't improve the system with the same kind of thinking used to create it!
With all this attention to testable/measurable results and the rating and ranking for accountability, we are turning the focus of attention away from creating meaningful system for learning.
How foolish!

http://www.forprogressnotgrowth.com/2009/11/21/hey-einstein-solve-this/

http://www.forprogressnotgrowth.com/2011/02/10/better-thinking-leads-to-better-solutions/

[meowmix7]

12:06 AM on 02/16/2011

Sounds like an EXCELLENT way to encourage teachers to give A's that weren't earned. Try again, folks.

[carester]

07:40 AM on 02/16/2011

I don't know about N.M.'s proposal, but here in Florida we have a similar system of grading schools BASED ON STANDARIZED TEST NOT GRADED BY TEACHERS. Here in Florida, teachers have ZERO input on the students test results (the state takes the tests and grade them), so no way teachers can manipulate those grades. Actually, these tests have uncover the rampant grade inflation going on at our schools :-)

[eceresa]

09:55 AM on 02/16/2011

Well, there HAVE been cases of teachers and schools manipulating standardized test scores, either by changing student answers or by excluding special ed or ELL students who would be likely to score badly on the tests. You can sort of understand why schools might feel pressure to do this. The tests are MUCH more dependent on what goes on in the students' homes than they are on anything that happens in school, but the school takes the blame for low-scoring (usually poor) students. That doesn't make it right, though.

[Gregor53]

08:13 PM on 02/18/2011

The question is what happens when a school fails?  I would not be surprised that those with a low grade are associated with low income areas of the cities/county compared to those of the middle class and the "advanced" IP schools.  It would be like gradiing hospitals and including those that will take on the risky procedures in order to save a life as opposed to one that will NOT take the risk as it may impact their scores.  If it is the intent to provide more resources to the schools with poor grades, then bravo.  However, I would bet the teachers are blamed and then what decent teacher would even volunteer to teach in such a school.  Standard tests prove nothing other than how well a student can take a test.  As with everything else in this country, we like tests and performance indicators as opposed to managing the issues and focusing resources where they are needed.  Frankly, not being a parent of a student in either FL or NM, if that is how the state wants to manage such issues, fine.  However, it does not take any skills to manage something based on an indicator.  It is easy and anyone could do it.  Pay the administration less and just grade standard tests.

[BBackSoon]

11:50 PM on 02/15/2011

So we will get even more Teaching to the Test?

I believe in better schools but I don't know how you measure teachers or schools. Any method seems full of pitfalls.

[pauldununfola]

11:09 PM on 02/15/2011

I think they should not grade the school but the student. If for example the student takes the test in may and fails it, but got an A in math, then his grade should be reduced two letter grades to a C. Then perhaps the students will take the test more seriously.

I have parents tell the students in an IEP meeting "dont worry about the test, its to grade the teachers". Thats a fine job your doing there mom, meanwhile the only thing the district cares about is hitting the numbers. I really love my job because I get to ham it up with the students, but I completely understand why there is going to be a teacher shortage in about 7 years when this older generation of teachers retires.

Who wants to be vilified in the press, blamed for kids lack of motivation and then have to endure constant workshops plus pay for a teacher cred program where you have to work for free during your student teaching? Meanwhile China has doubled the number of college grads in the past 10 years. I get transient insomnia from thinking about our futures, its the stress I tell ya....

[mrskorn]

11:30 PM on 02/15/2011

I agree! If teachers are graded by this, then students should receive a grade based on it. If they do not pass, they do not move to the next grade, OR graduate. Let's see what Arne has to say about that....

[carester]

07:43 AM on 02/16/2011

Totally agree. Here in Florida, we are moving to End Of Course tests that will do both: grade the school and 30% of the students final grade in the class. Sounds much better to me :-)

[springsm]

10:58 PM on 02/15/2011

If this would be the case, there would never be any critical thinking skills.  I think once the education unions have been broken, the education argument will go away.  These things don't get started for no reason.   Teachers teach, some are better than others...but respect in the classroom would help the learning.  I think Teachers need the support of parents, the teachers need the support of the administrator in the school, and the administrator needs support from the Supt.   Without those, you don't have a reason to have expectations in the school room.  Kids need to drill on basics but they also need to learn to be a critical thinker.  Instant messaging, texting and the internet have ruined alot of educational methods.  Don't pass kids on if they can't pass the standardized tests.  (I dont' like those either if that is all the grade is scaled upon, but it is a beginning)  Kids come to school to be social, they don't care about learning...there needs to be some accountabililty and consequences for those who think they don't need to work at their own future.

[cstandri]

10:40 PM on 02/15/2011

Multiple-choice standardized test scores do not reflect reality. I spend so much time with my kids teaching them about the importance of "why's" of History...that is, "Why" diplomacy is important. "Why" the English Channel is important to the British. "Why" trade is important to nations through history. "Why" they need to know all this stuff.

There are no questions on multiple-choice standardized tests that show critical thinking and application to real-world events. But then, it seems a lot of our politicians have never studied the "Why" of things, either, so they don't care.

[ladyvader]

04:24 PM on 02/16/2011

I remember in 6th grade having to take a standardize test. I did not take the test seriously. Mostly because I was bored and I just filled in the paper with designs. I answered some of the questions, but most of them I just made little designs with the dots you fill in with your answer.

The next school year, I was put in remedial math. It took the teacher half the school year to figure out I really didn't need to be in that class.

I knew I was smart, I knew I didn't take the test like I should have, but I did it anyway. Multiple choice tests don't really test anything. You get x amount of time to finish and some students don't do well under that setting, but they are not dumb either.

[MyrtleJune]

10:38 PM on 02/15/2011

How about this..... ALL PUBLIC SCHOOLS GET EXACTLY THE SAME BOOKS, DESKS, COMPUTERS, CURRICULUM, ROOM DECORATIONS, PENCILS, PAPERS, LOCKERS, LUNCH MENU, SPORTS/PE PROGRAMS, ART PROGRAMS, MUSIC PROGRAMS, BUSES, SPACE ALLOCATION, STUDENT TEACHER RATIO, TEACHER ADMINISTRATOR RATIO, JANITORS, MAINTENANCE STANDARDS, and LIBRARY.

ALL money given to magnet/charter/churchie/home schooling programs gets funneled back to the PUBLIC SCHOOLS. If children are not there to learn, they get sent home period.

NO. The schools do not need grades, they need business to keep out of SCHOOLS and they need to stop all this incredible NONSENSE and TEACH THE CHILDREN THE SAME SECULAR curriculum across the board. They can give ONE test per year. ONE. THAT's it. I'm sick of this over testing making our students a bunch of robots trying to hit a moving target. sheeeesh.

Enough already!

[pauldununfola]

11:14 PM on 02/15/2011

Your mistakenly assuming that all learners start from the same place in life and can be enticed into reaching the same learning goals at the same time as all other students.

Sometimes the most eager sit right next two the most reluctant. Its hard for a teacher to be equally attentive to all. Most do their best, but education will never be "equal". I do like the idea about one test though, and lets design it to show how students apply information and think critically and see if they have the ability to ask provocative questions. That will impress the heck out of me.

[EyesWideShut7]

06:11 AM on 02/16/2011

Perhaps if you paid any attention in english you would have learned the difference between two, to, and too. Myrtle June's point was that you can not expect the same result from public and rich charter schools. Money is all the difference.

[MyrtleJune]

07:43 PM on 02/16/2011

ACTUALLY, you're mistaking the fact that with alllllll the funding to these idiotic "our children can't lern" BS returned to FULL FUND PUBLIC SCHOOLS ONLY, there will be funding for slow or fast learners. And you know what, WHAT is wrong with slow learners being in the same class as the faster learners? I am SICK of all this slicing and dicing of little children's academic ability. They are CHILDREN and nothing insprires any one better than being included in the same category as a faster learner and nothing teaches a faster learner the value of patience than being included with slower learners. I'm tired of all the "gifted" and "slow" designations placed on children! They are CHILDREN!

I thinkl a LOT of adults needs to realize this. I also think a lot of adults need to get their ego in check! It is about the CHILDREN, not the adults.

[mrskorn]

11:32 PM on 02/15/2011

Don't forget to add that charters and private schools will not be able to kick out the slow learners, behavior problems or ELL students.....if they are enrolled, they are responsible for them.

There is such a disparity or resources between inner city schools and suburban and charter....yet no one acknowledges it!!

[MyrtleJune]

07:33 PM on 02/16/2011

Um... in my scenario there are not charter schools. EVERYONE goes to PUBLIC SCHOOL or they go to private school FUNDED entirely with NO VOUCHER, NO TAX BREAK by their parents. If private school want to kick kids out, they can do that, though since they are a business I don't think they would dare lose a revenue stream. Slow learners in publics schools will be funded because they will have money from all the sources siphoning it off now. Siphoning STOPS NOW.

[Frank Bourne]

10:23 PM on 02/15/2011

Why the need for a grade? A simple look at the schools demographic makeup will tell you all you need to know.

[cstandri]

10:37 PM on 02/15/2011

Unfortunate, but true.

[jeanrenoir]

10:57 PM on 02/15/2011

Nonsense. Plenty of charter schools make terrific progress teaching poor blacks from poor, crime-ridden neighborhoods, for example. Admittedly, the kids that go to the charters have the crucial ingredient necessary, a parent who cares enough to enter the kids in the charter lottery in the first place. But his idea that it's impossible to get good academic results from poor black kids from poor, crime-ridden neighborhoods has been long since demonstrated to be WRONG. Everything depends on the quality of the teachers and the principle, AND on a parent who cares.

[Rugger]

10:20 PM on 02/15/2011

If you want to blame teachers for poor student scores, then you must add to the list, parents, local and state officials, business owners, corporate CEOs, the congress and the president of the United States. They are far more responsible for poor student acheivement than the teachers. The teachers at least have the courage to go into a class of poorly fed, poorly housed and nurtured children and try. All the rest can do is sit back and blame the one group trying to do something positive.

[cstandri]

10:41 PM on 02/15/2011

Should we start suing pharmacists and doctors when patients won't take medicine or stop eating junk food?

[jeanrenoir]

10:59 PM on 02/15/2011

But how do you explain WIDE differences in results with exactly the same kind of poorly fed, poorly housed kids in different schools? Magic? The tooth fairy? The experiments have been run. The results are in. The argument that its never the teachers' fault is nonsense.

[mrskorn]

11:39 PM on 02/15/2011

Only 17% of charter schools are better than public. The rest are equal to or worse.
Btw...you do know that charters cherry pick their students, kick out the worst and receive TONS of private money to buy extra staff, provide extras, and provide resources and support to their schools. I am sure they do not just get one package of paper per month for their class.....