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Shooting Survivors Decry Texas Guns-On-Campus Bill


First Posted: 03/23/11 01:46 PM ET Updated: 05/25/11 07:40 PM ET

Despite emotional testimony from survivors of the 1966 University of Texas shooting, Texas state senators appeared poised Tuesday afternoon to send toward a final vote a controversial bill that would permit students to carry concealed handguns on the state's college campuses.

The bill, SB 354, would make Texas the second state after Utah to allow the carrying of concealed weapons on public postsecondary campuses. Lawmakers in nine other states, including Arizona, have introduced bills to allow guns on campus this year, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures.

Like the survivors of the 1966 University of Texas shooting, John Woods, who was a student at Virginia Tech during the 2007 shooting that left 33 dead, expressed a different view Tuesday.

"My feeling is we have a Second Amendment in this country for a reason, but as the Supreme Court has said very clearly, that doesn't mean that you can take your gun with you anywhere you want," Woods, whose girlfriend was killed in the shooting, testified before the Texas state senate's committee on criminal justice.

As written, the legislation would grant private universities discretion as to whether they allow guns on campus, but Sen. Rodney Ellis, a Houston Democrat, has said he will try to amend the legislation to give public university officials the same choice.

Proponents of the legislation, however, say students should be the ones to decide. "We don't understand why people lose this option for personal protection when they step onto a college campus," Daniel Crocker of Students for Concealed Carry on Campus told The Texas Tribune.

The bill's supporters also note that applicants for a Texas concealed handgun license must be 21 years of age, meaning that only upperclassmen, graduate students, and faculty and staff would be able to bring guns on campus. There are exceptions to the state law, however: members or former members of the military need only be 18, and an ongoing Texas lawsuit, supported by the National Rifle Association, seeks to reduce the license age minimum to 18.

Both the Texas House and Senate are considering bills that would allow students with a concealed handgun license to bring guns to class. Last week, the House legislation, HB 750, passed out of the House Homeland Security and Public Safety Committee with a 5-3 vote split cleanly along party lines, and is headed for a vote in the full House.

A majority of lawmakers in the Texas House favor the measure, and the bill, in some form is expected to be signed into law by Gov. Rick Perry, an aide told HuffPost on Tuesday.

The legislation comes mere months after a shooting scare at the University of Texas, in which a student brought an assault rifle to campus and eventually killed himself.

The guns-on-campus issue gained national attention in the wake of the Virginia Tech shooting. Some gun-rights advocates have argued that the lesson of that tragedy is that more students should carry firearms for self-defense.

Not so, Woods said Tuesday, citing the findings of the Virginia Tech Review Panel, a nonpartisan commission that compiled a list of 70 policy recommendations to prevent campus shootings in the future. One recommendation, Woods noted, was that university policies banning guns be given the force of law.

Now a doctoral student in molecular biology at the University of Texas, Wood said in a Tuesday interview with HuffPost that he hadn't spent much time considering gun control before his girlfriend and dozens of their fellow students were killed.

"She was one of the brightest, most energetic, good-hearted people I've ever met," Woods said of girlfriend Maxine Turner, who he had been dating for six months before she was killed. "I loved her, and I never told her that, so I'm putting it on the record here today."

A final committee vote on the Senate bill was not taken after the testimonies on Tuesday afternoon, since the five committee Republicans expected to vote "yes" were not present, but a vote is expected as soon as next week.

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Despite emotional testimony from survivors of the 1966 University of Texas shooting, Texas state senators appeared poised Tuesday afternoon to send toward a final vote a controversial bill that would ...
Despite emotional testimony from survivors of the 1966 University of Texas shooting, Texas state senators appeared poised Tuesday afternoon to send toward a final vote a controversial bill that would ...
 
 
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09:10 AM on 04/03/2011
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Amanda Collins Self-Protection Act

Learn why Nevada is going to pass laws preventing schools (mini-dictatorships) from having policies preventing people like Amanda from protecting herself from the rapist in the college parking area, who raped and KILLED another student, while she went to her car where she was FORCED to store her gun instead of having it with her like she does everywhere else.
04:11 PM on 03/28/2011
Rick Perry goes and Celebrates Criminals Right to carry concealed hand guns and Glocks to Colleges...what a nimrod!
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Adam Davies
12:37 PM on 03/29/2011
No, Perry supports the right of law abiding citizens that are licensed to carry handguns everywhere else in Texas to be able to carry on campus, a location that doesn't suddenly change us into crazed murderers who are going to kill people. We are still responsible citizens on campus who just want to defend ourselves
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JimInHouston
Arma virumque cano...
02:43 PM on 03/29/2011
"Rick Perry goes and Celebrates Criminals Right to carry concealed hand guns and Glocks to Colleges..­.what a nimrod! '

Did you fail to read the bill?
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TexasTreader
Fluffy, the yard dog
11:27 AM on 03/26/2011
Public policy should never be decided by emotional displays. I'm sure victims everywhere have stories that can provoke sympathy in even the most clinical of sensitivities but we have written agreements (federal and state constitutions) that are our guides for government. Better, victims should work out their issues in forums friendlier to that kind of rehabilitation.
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OdinsEye
Korean-Latino cop and retired military combat vet
01:12 PM on 03/26/2011
The tactic is known as "appeal to emotion" and you are correct, laws and policy should never be based on this tactic. It has given us some of our worst laws and policies.
01:36 PM on 03/26/2011
What makes these "appeals to emotion" different than those of gun rights activists who would have us insert ourselves into imaginary home invasion, or rape, or mugging scenarios in order to frighten us enough to want to carry guns?
This comment has been removed due to violations of our [Guidelines]
02:51 PM on 03/25/2011
The UT crime map shows in the past year, 153 assaults, and 186 burglaries (and currently CHLs must store guns in cars for vehicular burglars to get)

I think they should stay gun-free now and allow at least a few more rapes and car burglars to get free guns. Criminals need tools to get income too, and ways to celebrate.
10:09 AM on 03/25/2011
Those of you who rely on hyperbole and sarcasm to make your argument are hoping nobody will notice just how weak that argument is. If you can change the subject from the message to the messenger then you feel you can weaken that message. Not all of us fall for that. Surely you can do better... or maybe not.

To those of you who feel that codifying the "no guns on campus" policy as being the way to go, how is that working out for you? I look at the Virginia Tech massacre and I know how it's working out.

Instead of focusing on the wild and improbable scenarios, why not look at the experience of the 70+ campuses in this country which do allow CCW holders to carry on campus? Remember, every one of those holders is 21 or older, has passed significant background checks, been fingerprinted, taken a safety course, and paid significant funds for the privilege. They won't be freshmen. And I don't know a single CCW holder who doesn't take the privilege seriously.
12:40 PM on 03/25/2011
i could not agree more. a person that wants to shoot up campus doesnt pay attention to the "no guns allowed" rule but if i was going to shoot up a campus i sure as hell wouldnt pick a campus where potentially half the student population could shoot back at me.
jjtx
living between the trees
09:26 AM on 03/25/2011
I have had many comments on my last post regarding the intelligence of mixing handguns, college students and the college partying lifestyle.

I stand by those.

But, let's address another issue that seems to be on people's minds.

Does conceal carry make us safer?

My husband occassionally is called upon to lead police training. After Arizona, it was decided to train in a likewise scenario. My husband decided to add the addition of several citizens with conceal carry as well as several "bad guys" with guns drawn and firing when police arrive. Some of these experienced officers almost broke down when they realized they could not tell the "good guys" from the "bad guys". They froze and looked at my husband and said how do I tell who to stop. Hmmmmm, he responded. How do you tell?

This is something we all need to think about when it comes to conceal/carry laws but, specifically, when it comes to college students.

By the way, for those of you who say 18-21 year olds are in the military, may I point out that most warfare occurs with uniforms on and certainly the "good guys" all have on the same as me. In fact, it has become increasingly harder to work militarily when the "bad guys" and the local civiliams wear the same thing. Or, at least that is what the military experts say.

However, "bad guys" don't seem to want to identify themselves by clothing here and on colleges.
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Patricia Cash
Yellow Dog -Progressive-
11:43 AM on 03/25/2011
Well thought out post. Its geting harder to tell the difference. If police had their way CCW and OCW wouldn't be legal and I agree. My thinking only-its like the NRA has become the agent in support of homegrown terrorism on American soil and I will forever oppose the NRA as I depend up the police and military to keep my city,neighborhood and country safe ,that's why I gladly pay taxes.
12:36 PM on 03/25/2011
too bad that the 2nd amendment gets in the way of your desire
12:44 PM on 03/25/2011
http://www.todaystmj4.com/news/local/111922509.html
The majority of police officers, when polled fairly, support concealed carry.
but keep making stuff up.
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JimInHouston
Arma virumque cano...
01:55 PM on 03/25/2011
"Some of these experience­d officers almost broke down when they realized they could not tell the "good guys" from the "bad guys". They froze and looked at my husband and said how do I tell who to stop. Hmmmmm, he responded. How do you tell?"

Bear in mind that the constitutional protections in this country are NOT designed to "make the job of the police easier". Consider only Amendments 1, 4, and 5. The police MUST get it into their skulls that use of lethal force can only be used against the imminent threat of death or grievous bodily harm. A gun in a holster or even in a hand does NOT, per se, meet those criteria. The police (and non-police as well) must judge by the ACTIONS of the gun carrier.

In a shooting situation, this is surprisingly easy to discern, if for no other reason than a lawful citizen will drop his gun when challenged by the police.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Gun Banner Too
Violence Policy Advocate
09:24 AM on 03/25/2011
As a violence policy advocate, it’s important to note that none of what I write is personal conjecture but instead comes from the study of statistics, polls, and opinion found through research of web sites on the Internet. It’s come to my attention that gun owners belong to the NRA and are Tea Party Insurrectionists Extremist Gunophile Fetishists. It’s also notable that they will often give up their families, careers, and even their life to have “Wild West” type shootouts over minor disputes such as parking spots or to compensate for some other shortcoming. Again, this is not personal conjecture but consensus among the public as verified in the Comments sections of several web sites.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Rory Canfield
Rwy'n ysbaddu fy cath, nawr mae'n ryddfrydol
09:59 AM on 03/25/2011
In other words GUNBANNERTOO ...

study of statistics­=ones I make up
study of polls=ones I make up
opinion found through research of web sites on the Internet=ones I make up or sites like DailyKOS, AlexJones,CodePINK,MoveOn.Org ....
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Gun Banner Too
Violence Policy Advocate
11:00 AM on 03/25/2011
Everything I post is information that I’ve learned from the writings of gun control groups, their supporters, and supporting commenters. None of this is personal conjecture. A little searching will show this to be true. I’m doing my part to help spread the message.

http://tinyurl.com/4k346he
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enlightened45
03:26 PM on 03/26/2011
A poseur gun tr@//......get the humor....and no one else does either....
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Patricia Cash
Yellow Dog -Progressive-
11:45 AM on 03/25/2011
F & F

I so agree and I oppose the NRA support of home grown Terrorism on American soil in American Schools and neighborhood . The NRA is America's Bin Laden leader and I won't back off from that.
12:49 PM on 03/25/2011
PC--how about some proof for that histrionic rant, especially since the NRA has a long history of helping to train LEOs and keep that training current
12:56 AM on 03/25/2011
for some reason i feel that if one of you anti-gun people got saved by a concealed handgun holder, you would probably change your tune.
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TXconfidnz
Schpelling Bea Regect
08:21 AM on 03/25/2011
I thought guns didn't shoot themselves?
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Rory Canfield
Rwy'n ysbaddu fy cath, nawr mae'n ryddfrydol
08:33 AM on 03/25/2011
Aww, TXCONFIDNZ tried to make a funny.
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01:58 PM on 03/25/2011
They do not, but concealed handgun holders do. Your point?
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Patricia Cash
Yellow Dog -Progressive-
11:46 AM on 03/25/2011
I pay taxes for really good police protection so I don't need it-thanks but no thanks for the offer-
01:31 PM on 03/25/2011
yup, because the police always respond faster than a criminal can shoot you. they will totally keep you safe 100% of the time. you act as though the police are like superman with the ability to save you in the blink of an eye if something goes wrong. if you ask me who i would prefer aid from: a cop that is 10 minutes away or a 21 year old student with a ccw that has taken a course in how to use a weapon, i will pick the student every time.
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JimInHouston
Arma virumque cano...
01:58 PM on 03/25/2011
"I pay taxes for really good police protection so I don't need it-thanks but no thanks for the offer- "

I guess you don't know that the police have no legal duty to protect you. This interpretation has been solidified by several SCOTUS decisions.

Good luck to you.
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HUFFPOST PUNDIT
OSCPJ
Want it? Work 4 it. No 1 has ever drown in sweat.
11:51 PM on 03/24/2011
The criminals or those with bad intent wouldn't bring a gun on campus because of laws forbidding it?


The won't kill because they have laws against that too?  Or morality?


Criminals don't have access to weapons? But those that pass the background check shouldn't have access.


I know the Liberals don't like weapons.  But pick some better arguments.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Rory Canfield
Rwy'n ysbaddu fy cath, nawr mae'n ryddfrydol
08:19 AM on 03/25/2011
F&F OSCPJ
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OdinsEye
Korean-Latino cop and retired military combat vet
11:02 PM on 03/24/2011
Actually concealed carry and firearms are already allowed on many parts of Texas campuses. This bill would extend that to inside of buildings. And IIRC, Texas law already does not forbid the carry on private campuses
This comment has been removed due to violations of our [Guidelines]
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
giant1
I have written what I have written
06:19 PM on 03/24/2011
I keep reading posts from glockophiles who claim that if you oppose guns on campuses you must be in favor of victims being deprived of an opportunity for self defense. Fact is, there will be far more kids harmed by someone screwing around with a gun while both it and they are loaded. There will be far more kids harming themselves after flunking a chemistry test than kids rescued from a crazed shooter. They are all victims, too.

That is what I see as the main problem in the gun regulation debate. The people I see as victims, to gun lovers, are just collateral damage.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
eljefefx
06:28 PM on 03/24/2011
Why don't you generalize some more? I don't think you did it enough in this post.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
giant1
I have written what I have written
07:25 PM on 03/24/2011
Not good enough. Please tell me a specific example of what I posted that is incorrect. General statements are fair game if they are correct. Just criticizing the person making them is not
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HUFFPOST PUNDIT
RevJimIII
Grin and Barret...
12:26 AM on 03/25/2011
Glockophile??  Fascinating sobriquet, think of that one yourself?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
giant1
I have written what I have written
04:53 PM on 03/25/2011
Yes
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11:19 AM on 03/26/2011
Glockenspiel- glock'-IN-speel, Noun.

A.) A percussion instrument composed of a set of tuned keys arranged in the fashion of the keyboard of a piano.

B.) Clever anecdotes composed usually by anti gun advocates (but sometimes by progunners) which employ variations of the name of the gun amnufacturer, Glock.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
theRealAmerica
bruised,battered and scarred...but hard
02:55 PM on 03/24/2011
I am a so called liberal...Democrat...Christian and I conceal & carry...I do so, not because I fear anyone in the "hood"...its because I am keeping my lamps trimmed and burning for "cons" in Texas IN hoods...most of them are cowards...and wouldn't bust a grape in a fruit fight...that's why they carry.
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Berettasskeeter
For what we are about to receive, may we be truly
03:14 PM on 03/24/2011
Were you aware that the KKK is strongest in the North, at this time? Can you point to anyone in Texas that might come after you in the night? Why would they do that?
You call them cowards. How do you know this? How have YOU proved your courage?
Semper fi
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
theRealAmerica
bruised,battered and scarred...but hard
03:30 PM on 03/24/2011
Oops...you got me...since YOU suggest I've not had any experiences...I must not have...
And since the KKK is strongest in the North...they must not be in Texas...where I've had personal experiences with...because YOU suggested I haven't.
And please don't confuse me not typing Semper Fi after every post that you know my story.
11:00 PM on 03/24/2011
and what proof do you have that the proRKBA folks here on Huffpo are members of the Klan especially since the activists I know here in Los Angeles consist of Caucasians, Asians, HIspanics and African AMericans
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Rory Canfield
Rwy'n ysbaddu fy cath, nawr mae'n ryddfrydol
02:48 PM on 03/24/2011
Oh Oh Oh .. I got one. Why is it that posters here think a 21 year old that went through a background check and training is incapable to handle a firearm and yet we have progressive groups fighting to allow 13 year girls to have abortions without parental notification? I don't know about you, but that sounds a little off.
03:04 PM on 03/24/2011
good points--I just adore the fact that "progressive" are supportive only of the rights they agree with, last time I checked--the BOR is there to protect the rights of others when we DON'T agree with them--which is why I think SCOTUS got it right with the First Amendment case concerning the Westboro church--I find their message disgusting, but I don't want to start building that slippery slope
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theRealAmerica
bruised,battered and scarred...but hard
03:16 PM on 03/24/2011
Wait...so you do agree with 13 year olds having the right to abortions without parental consent...and BTW...use the search bar...90% of "progressives" agreed with SCOTUS too...but this one...DARES one of them to show up at my house.
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OSCPJ
Want it? Work 4 it. No 1 has ever drown in sweat.
11:54 PM on 03/24/2011
Fanned, but in certain instances one can be alot younger.  17 if your parents signed your enlistment and went to boot camp.  At least here in Florida. 

Fanned and Faved.  Glock 17/19 CCW.
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Rory Canfield
Rwy'n ysbaddu fy cath, nawr mae'n ryddfrydol
08:40 AM on 03/25/2011
CCW, G17, Taurus 1911.