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14th Amendment: Democratic Senators See Debt Ceiling As Unconstitutional

14th Amendment

First Posted: 06/28/11 09:21 PM ET Updated: 08/28/11 06:12 AM ET

WASHINGTON -- Growing increasingly pessimistic about the prospects for a deal that would raise the debt ceiling, Democratic senators are revisiting a solution to the crisis that rests on a simple proposition: The debt ceiling itself is unconstitutional.

"The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law... shall not be questioned," reads the 14th Amendment.

"This is an issue that's been raised in some private debate between senators as to whether in fact we can default, or whether that provision of the Constitution can be held up as preventing default," Sen. Chris Coons (D-Del.), an attorney, told The Huffington Post Tuesday. "I don't think, as of a couple weeks ago, when this was first raised, it was seen as a pressing option. But I'll tell you that it's going to get a pretty strong second look as a way of saying, 'Is there some way to save us from ourselves?'"

By declaring the debt ceiling unconstitutional, the White House could continue to meet its financial obligations, leaving Tea Party-backed Republicans in the difficult position of arguing against the plain wording of the Constitution. Bipartisan negotiators are debating the size of the cuts, now in the trillions, that will come along with raising the debt ceiling.

Sen. Patty Murray (D-Wash.), head of the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee, said that the constitutional solution puts the question in its proper context -- that the debate is over paying past debts, not over future spending.

"The way everybody talks about this is that we need to raise the debt ceiling. What we're really saying is, 'We have to pay our bills,'" Murray said. The 14th Amendment approach is "fascinating," she added.

The White House referred questions on the constitutionality of the debt ceiling to the Treasury Department. Treasury declined to comment.

Adam Winkler, a law professor at the University of California, Los Angeles, said that the 14th Amendment option has recently been much discussed in the field.

"Without any clear case law about the debt ceiling in particular, no one knows exactly how the courts would rule on that issue, about whether President Obama could ignore the debt ceiling," he said. "If he wanted to continue to service the public debt, he'd probably get away with it."

Which leads to a related question: Who's to stop him?

"To have standing to challenge a governmental action, you must show that you have suffered some injury from that action, and it's hard for someone to show such an injury," Winkler said. "If Congress acted as a unified body, and claims that the president has usurped their authority, then it may have some standing."

"But," he cautioned, "it would have to be a joint resolution. And this Senate would almost certainly block it."

The 14th Amendment became law in the wake of the Civil War, pushed by a Republican Congress eager to extend citizenship rights to freed slaves. But it also included a section dealing with federal debt: The government wanted to make clear to the market that even though loans to the Confederacy would not be paid back, any loans made to the U.S. government were still good.

In 1935, the Supreme Court held that despite the Civil War context, the amendment clearly referred to all federal debt.

"While [the 14th Amendment] was undoubtedly inspired by the desire to put beyond question the obligations of the government issued during the Civil War, its language indicates a broader connotation," the majority wrote in Perry v. U.S. "We regard it as confirmatory of a fundamental principle which applies as well to the government bonds in question, and to others duly authorized by the Congress as to those issued before the amendment was adopted. Nor can we perceive any reason for not considering the expression 'the validity of the public debt' as embracing whatever concerns the integrity of the public obligations."

The law at issue, which tried to override the validity of a bond offering, "went beyond the congressional power," the Court ruled, setting a precedent that has not been overturned.

Because the government borrows based on its full faith, Congress doesn't have the authority to undermine that confidence by reneging on its obligation to its lenders, the ruling declared.

"To say that the Congress may withdraw or ignore that pledge is to assume that the Constitution contemplates a vain promise; a pledge having no other sanction than the pleasure and convenience of the pledgor," reads the opinion, delivered by Chief Justice Charles Evans Hughes. "This Court has given no sanction to such a conception of the obligations of our government."

President Barack Obama, who taught constitutional law, hasn't been afraid to assert executive authority. Most recently, he issued what amounted to a legal analysis defending the White House position that the military's operations in Libya were not in violation of the War Powers Act.

Ultimately, if Obama chose to ignore the debt ceiling, the debate would be more about power than an academic interpretation of the Constitution: Simply asserting that all debts and obligations will be paid may still spook the bond markets if a constitutional crisis is triggered.

Coons said that "from every professional -- either an economist or a currently practicing professional in the bond markets or financial services -- unanimously their input to me has been, 'You don't even want to have this debate, you don't want to terrify the markets by arguing over the interpretation of a previously irrelevant or not often applied provision of the Constitution. Don't spook the markets, don't scare the average American, just do your jobs.'"

But if that job can't get done, the government needs a fall back, Democrats say.

"Our challenge is that we have a partisan divide over how to craft a package that allows us to move forward -- that seems to me so deep that I am gravely worried we are rapidly running out of time," Coons said, noting that the Congressional Budget Office needs days or weeks to analyze whatever package of cuts is agreed to -- if one is agreed to.

Would the administration go down this road? It's impossible to say, but if the choice is between a financial crisis and a constitutional one, the option becomes awfully appealing.

"The consequences of [ignoring the debt ceiling] will produce a legislative response, and almost certainly a constitutional crisis -- a crisis of interpretation, if not fact," Coons said. "Unfortunately there's no way that that does anything except spook the markets."

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WASHINGTON -- Growing increasingly pessimistic about the prospects for a deal that would raise the debt ceiling, Democratic senators are revisiting a solution to the crisis that rests on a simple prop...
WASHINGTON -- Growing increasingly pessimistic about the prospects for a deal that would raise the debt ceiling, Democratic senators are revisiting a solution to the crisis that rests on a simple prop...
 
 
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
verflixed
It will come to pass
03:12 PM on 08/14/2011
Solvency is maintained by means of a national debt, on the principle, "If you will not lend me the money, how can I pay you? Emerson
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
d4everman
06:23 PM on 07/27/2011
I hope Obama does invoke the 14th. I've served in the US military for 21 years and planned to retire this summer. Then my home was destroyed by the tornadoes in NC in April. Utterly destroyed. So I have to slog it out for another summer, because while my insurance covered me well, I don't want to be trying to outprocess, ACAP, and build a new home for my family. We are getting a new house built on our lot, but its not an easy process and of course, even with insurance it is a financial strain.
Teabaggers don't care about that or the other americans working through tough times. They are idiots at best, risking our countries credit rating, and traitors at worst. Considering that the ceiling is just to pay the debts that GWB racked up, how is this giving Obama a blank check? Its not, its just that they want to deep six him. (racism....pure and simple)
09:07 PM on 07/22/2011
Could the Attorney General of the United States file a law suit against the debt ceiling statute with the Supreme Court and have it declared unconstitutional, and thus allow the Justice Department to begin the process of removing from office every single person who has voted to cause the debt of the United States to be questioned (regardless of party) as every single one of them swore an oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States of America. This question was posed to me and I wonder if such a measure could seriously be entertained.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
SoquiliAsgaya
10:20 AM on 07/31/2011
Ask your neo con gopiggylett chief justice John if he would vote for that.
01:42 PM on 07/19/2011
Interesting interpretation, but it doesn't meet the "plain meaning" standard. To suggest otherwise is to confuse debt with liability. Our debts are our obligations to re-pay money that we've borrowed. Our liabilities are obligations or promises to pay as a legal responsibility or a contractual agreement. Simply put, our debt is money we've borrowed that we have to re-pay. Our other obligations can be variously described (e.g. obligation, liability, earmark, encumbrance), but they are not debt as they are not borrowed money.

This is not an insignificant distinction. These fundamental differences were well known by Supreme Court justices of the past. Whether they still are is subject to question.

This is just a trial balloon -- an attempt to gamble that there is enough collective ignorance about these differences for action to succeed.
05:44 PM on 07/15/2011
They will weather the storm they have wrought retaining their wealth and power elsewhere and will once again return to the shores of this country to reign once the citizenry has been weakened by the exportation of jobs and corporate investment, the expenditure
of the national wealth, (through unnecessary military ventures and subsequent borrowing) the weakening of the social safety net through austerity measures and the general acceptance of a lowered living standard as well as the continued erosion of civil liberties. It's like a long term battle plan...It's working rather nicely wouldn't you say?
05:43 PM on 07/15/2011
Why not disgard the fiat Dollar currency for a new currency that is based upon gold or silver or some other tangible commodity...corn, wheat or whatever? Use the dollar currency to pay the dollar debt while functioning our daily needs with the new currency. Then ELIMINATE CENTRAL BANKING AND THE FEDERAL RESERVE ALTOGETHER and recognise that the move toward a global economy is not in the interest of the United States citizenry but only the investment class.
The economic policies put in place during the Regan administration have had ample time to provide results, (30+ years or so), How long must we wait to declare a policy a failure?
02:05 PM on 07/19/2011
Interesting thought. A hard currency standard might have some merit. It shouldn't be a consumable commodity, however. Supply is far too unstable to use as a basis for currency.

Eliminating the Federal Reserve would be a good idea. I would expect a market crash if we were to do this. It would be an improvement to the status quo over the long term, not the short one.
03:13 PM on 07/08/2011
The 14th amendment with regards to "honoring deb authorized by law" only mandates that congress pay the debt already issued. IE the existing treasury bills and bonds. It DOES NOT restrict the right of congress to say we are not going to authorize any more borrowing.

Now a lot of folks instantly assume that if we dont keep borrowing money, we will have to renege on paying the interest due on those existing treasury bills and bonds. That is not true. The currently monthly interest ont he debt is $30billion/mo. The federal government brings in about $200billion/mo in revenues.

If the debt ceiling is not raised, what will happen is that the $30billion in interest payments will be payed but other spending will have to be cut. That will mean cuts in social security payments to the military, medicare and other programs

These cuts WILL NOT violate the 14th amendment.

They wilk be painful and unpopular, yes. But, we have been living beyond our means for decades. The party has to stop sometime. That time is now
04:24 PM on 07/18/2011
If we were to stop all spending today, we still would require the debt ceiling to be raised in order to pay for already-committed obligations. The debt ceiling must be raised in order to pay for programs that Congress has already authorized. For example: funding the Pentagon.

I urge you to read this piece:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/five-myths-about-the-debt-ceiling/2011/07/06/gIQANwF01H_story.html

An excerpt of which is this:
"In 2003, Brian Roseboro, assistant secretary of the Treasury for financial markets, explained it best: 'The plain truth is that the debt limit does not affect the deficits or surpluses. The critical revenue and spending decisions are made during the congressional budget process.'

"The debt ceiling is a cap on the amount of securities the Treasury can issue, something it does to raise money to pay for government expenses. These expenses, and the deficit they’ve wrought, are a result of past actions by Congress to create entitlement programs, make appropriations and cut taxes. In that sense, raising the debt limit is about paying for past expenses, not controlling future ones. For Congress to refuse to let Treasury raise the cash to pay the bills that Congress itself has run up simply makes no sense."
02:21 PM on 07/19/2011
I used to have some respect for Bruce Bartlett. This is rather a shame. He is of course obscuring the matter of budget with respect to federal outlays, deficits and the debt in a way that suggests a prior act of Congress cannot give way to reality because Congress's budgets are sacrosanct. This is of course patent nonsense, and ignores the fact that expenditures cannot exceed receipts if new debt is not issued, and that expenditures will continue as long as there are receipts. His argument suggests by inference that spending cannot occur without borrowing, which is simply false. It means only that choices will have to be made. Obviously our interest payments must be made, and monthly revenue is sufficient to make those. Social Security and Medicare are separately funded through the payroll tax. As long as receipts equal or exceed payments, those should continue without any delay or cutbacks. The rest of this is chaff being thrown up in the interest of a political position, not a fiscal one.

The debt ceiling will be raised. Right now it is merely being used as leverage to get a reduction in spending. Hitting the limit would trigger an automatic reduction. What Mr. Bartlett has failed to contemplate here is the loss of confidence in treasury securities if the debt continues to rise. If we don't take corrective action soon, a limit will be imposed on us by holders and buyers of U.S. debt.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Goldshield
Retired NYPD Detective
10:52 AM on 07/07/2011
I agree that there is a constitutional question, but does a question about the interpretation of the 14th amendment wording give the congress and the president the right to bankrupt our country.

What ever happen to "We the People", were're the ones that will suffer if our currency will be devalued the cost of goods will increase, etc, etc.

What do we have to do , have a constitutional question go back to a Supreme Court which legislates from the bench just like our president wants to do?

Just do what ever sensible american does they don't spend more than they make or afford.

Vote all the bums out we need another revolution...
01:38 PM on 07/06/2011
"President Barack Obama, who taught constitutional law, hasn't been afraid to assert executive authority. Most recently, he issued what amounted to a legal analysis defending the White House position that the military's operations in Libya were not in violation of the War Powers Act."

******
He "taught" constitutional law? Without having a license to practice law? What happened to his law license?

Obama was a "lecturer" on the SAUL ALINSKY method of overthrowing the US Government.

His lectures were based on Alinsky's book - "RULES FOR RADICALS" - dedicated to LUCIFER.

In his lectures on the Saul Alinsky method of overthrowing the US Government - he was "teaching" how to rip the US Constitution to shreds.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Oedipa Mossmoon
09:36 AM on 07/08/2011
LOLZ
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HUFFPOST PUNDIT
StJames
In absentia luci tenebrae vincunt
10:37 AM on 07/06/2011
David Frum was on MSNBC last night and he made several good points. First he is appalled by the position Republicans are taking on the debt ceiling and said he can't believe they have allowed it to go this far. His criticisms of Obama could have been coming from a progressive because he said every time Obama acquiesces to the demands of the far right he emboldens them to grab for more. They played a clip of Bachmann saying the president would prioritize what gets paid and what doesn't if the debt ceiling isn't passed so the nation won't default on his debts...Frum said that brought out the speech writer in him...He would say "Okay, Texas medicaid payments, go to the bottom of the list. Georgia's military contractors will be paid when we have the money" That would change attitudes pretty quickly.
07:49 PM on 07/05/2011
Obama voted against raising the debt limit when he was a senator. great job guys.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Oedipa Mossmoon
09:40 AM on 07/08/2011
The debt limit was raised ten times in ten years under Bush. Think like a grown-up for a minute. Party politics naturally play a part. A protest vote against raising the debt ceiling is an expression of opposition to the President. Fine. But when that opposition puts the entire country's credit on the brink? I don't think that's something Senator Obama would have contemplated.
01:45 PM on 07/19/2011
There's something inherently political about Moody's warnings, as downgrading a debtor that has decided not to take on more debt is nonsensical. Someone is promoting policy, not giving an honest assessment in the interest of creditors.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
boomer59
05:57 PM on 07/21/2011
and he copped to it and said it was a political move at the time, you left that part out Dr. Steve
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
robrtl
10:41 PM on 07/04/2011
what is wrong is the imperial presidency unrestrained by law.... us navy flying bombing sorties after we have been told we are not engaged in hostilities,as Japan was not when bombed pearl harbor or confederates not when shelled fort sumpter; really...,,,,skirt debt ceiling with specious argument over 14th amendment/////exempt 1500 unions companies and states from obamacare c'mon guys we are supposed to be a nationof laws
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Nonyabizz
Facts are really just a liberal plot
03:17 PM on 07/05/2011
but, I bet you were right behind emperor GWB....
01:50 PM on 07/06/2011
selective politics - nonyabizz? selective war protesting?

does not change what obama is doing!

nor the fact that is an impeachable offense!
05:34 PM on 07/04/2011
Can anyone imagine the president utterly forsaking his oath of office to support, protect and defend the Constitution, choosing instead to uphold a Congressional mandate that contradicts the plain meaning of the Constitution, confirmed by the Supreme Court? If the Republicans hold out for agenda items that the public regards as grossly unfair or overreaching, surely the president should, instead of capitulating, invoke his Constitutional duty to pay the lawfully incurred debts of the United States, despite a Congressional debt limit that attempts to renege on debts exceeding a certain aggregate. The full faith and credit of the United States is vital to its sovereignty, its economic independence and leadership, and its security. Just as no president can suffer an attack on the United States that goes unchallenged, no president can allow the full faith and credit of the government to be impaired. So playing the debt ceiling game and making some concessions to get a deal make good sense: Upholding the Constitution makes better sense if the opposition pushes its agenda too far.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Goldshield
Retired NYPD Detective
01:57 PM on 07/07/2011
Did you ever research the who and whys we are in this mess and whose behind it?
02:28 PM on 07/19/2011
This presumes that the plain meaning favors this interpretation. It doesn't. Debt has a specific meaning, and our various mandated expenditures don't fall under that meaning. Only our currently incurred borrowing does.
08:33 PM on 07/20/2011
When legally authorized expenditures conflict with the debt limit, some have argued that the expenditures take precedence.
The President should negate the debt limit, and let the Supreme Court decide. I doubt they would even hear the case.
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02:26 PM on 07/04/2011
One more thing...if it were a republican or tea party president, they would have already taken action and justify it with or without congressional approval.
02:04 PM on 07/06/2011
@ Pinmason:
bullshyt - you people on the left would be throwing yourselves in the streets in Washington DC.

Instead you are blaming the opposition to raising the debt ceiling - ignoring OBAMA, Pelosi and Reid's FAILURE to pass a budget for TWO Years - the wild WASTEFUL Spending spree of Obama - his FAILED POLICIES - and The Democrat Party having control of the HOUSE and the SENATE for the past FOUR YEARS -
until the 2010 midterm elections - when the democratic party Lost the Majority in the House - bc of their constant corrupt machinations.
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12:23 PM on 07/07/2011
We need to get rid of Mortgage Backed Securities and take the the American home off the investor markets. I wonder how many Americans would have been able to keep their homes and Wall Street avoid a meltdown which will eventually cost the tax payer trillions thanks to the ever present efforts of the banking coalition in Congress that understands the shortfall the FHA fund will suffer in the very near future. Although Congress did pass the increase to MIPS to help offset all those FHA checks written to investors, it did not pass the 85 billions dollars needed to bring the FHA fund to the two percent ration mandated by Congress. Of course, no one will be the wiser until after the 2012 elections and a Conservative Congress voting to extend the debt ceiling at the request of the banking coalition to bail out the banks and investors with more checks from the FHA. Get rid of FHA funding and I would consider your ridiculous proposal to end medicare. Banking coalitions would never allow that to happen...they just might lose their entitlements.
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SoquiliAsgaya
10:32 AM on 07/31/2011
Oh the sounds of a toaster. It is like in elementary school when the teacher leaves the room and a bully runs up to the chalk board and scratches finger nails across it. No one wants to hear those sounds except the one making them.
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12:08 PM on 07/07/2011
As for contributing to the debt ceiling, Do you want to continue paying taxes that supports FHA Funding and prints checks to investors because one of the homes it insures just lost another fifty thousand dollars in value. Don't need to foreclose to collect an FHA check...just lose value. In 2003 the FHA funding required 342 million dollars to get it back to the two percent ratio mandated by congress to keep up with the demand on all those checks the Investors,mortgage companies, and banks just love to collect when a property values drops or they foreclose. With the subprime lending crisis and the negative effect it had on MBS held by Wall Street, American and Global investors lost billions in markets around the world and thanks to Angelo, trillions more will be lost around the globe due to his now toxic MERS and Countrywide mortages. The projected increase for 2009 and 2010 was 85 billion and with fifty thousand estimated foreclosures in Arizona alone by the end of 2011 the FHA fund is going to take another big hit and fall short or that projected increase. The Congresses solution is to bilk homeowners. By a resounding margin of approval in Congress, they increased the monthly MIPS insurance premium by an average of thirty dollars and increased that mips premium to $138.00 added to the end of a mortgage payment and made it even more difficult for many Americans already finding it difficult to make ends meet.
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02:20 PM on 07/04/2011
I think it's great that the 14th Amendment is getting such close attention; however, I agree with this article in part because it refers back to the Supreme Court for it's interpretation. The Supreme Court has ruled that under the 14th Amendment that voiding a United States government bond "went beyond the congressio­nal power". Defaulting on our debt is doing exactly that because trillions of dollars in that debt is covered by government bonds. Just ask China. The fourteenth Amendment Clearly states that the US Government will honor it's debts, but will not pay for loans by business and banks that went to the Confederacy By letting the Debt go into default, the federal government is stating that it will no longer honor it's debts and as stated above that goes beyond the congressional power.
02:14 PM on 07/06/2011
The 14 Amendment was mischaracterized previously by the Democratic Party=

Liberal loons of the democratic party twisted their way into FUNDING illegal aliens - through ANCHOR BABIES - children born on US soil to people illegally in our country.

Anchor babies and their extended families - acquiring FREE SERVICES - sucking on the tits of America their entire life - has caused the state budgets to be overwhelmed - and is the cause of a BIG PROBLEM - with our deficit.

But what a way to overwhelm the system - Saul Alinsky-style - the sicko method of Cloward and Piven - in order to overthrow the US Government.

That is why US taxpayers are tired of supporting ILLEGAL ALIENS and their ANCHOR BABIES - and find that providing automatic US citizenship to children of illegal aliens is DISCRIMINATORY against people who are respecting our legal immigration laws - maintaining their legal status and followng the proper procedures to become US citizens.
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11:07 AM on 07/07/2011
Liberal loons and anchor babies...remember Nixons trip to China. The one that improved Amercian and Chinese relations that put the Chinese on the path to Prosperity. Those same Chinese that have been coming to America for years to get that American Birth Cirtificate and then go home...just needed to pick up some paper work. The same Chinese that hold Trillions in Amercian Debt with Government Bonds and whose investors and others from around the globe who lost trillions due to failed Conservative Right Wing fiscal policy and a blatant disregard for fiscal law. Sounds like those anchor babies ship has sailed and taken it's anchor with them, but keeping their vested interest in this country with them at home in China. If liberal loon is the best you can come up with, I'm highly disappointed. I think the best term I have ever heard concerning my political dogma was after I returned from serving four years in the Navy with three of those off the coast of Vietnam on board the USS Enterprise where I spent a great deal of my time defending your right to free speech. The best term I've ever heard describing my military service and political dogma...Baby Killer. History has proven the inept quality of that statement and as your statement falls into this category with it's total lack of profound knowledge and it's limited understanding of the human condition history will also prove your statesments as inept as well.
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11:07 AM on 07/07/2011
People that believe in true freedom and liberty do not condemn people for where they want to live, but instead ask the question, what gives anyone the right to decide where any human being is allowed to live. Although it is not a mandated law Sir, it is an inalienable right and for all people not just Americans.