Atheists Sue to Stop Perry's Role in Prayer Rally

By Kimberly Winston
Religion News Service

(RNS) Five Texans are suing Gov. Rick Perry to prevent him from appearing at a prayer rally scheduled for Aug. 6 in a Houston stadium.

The federal suit alleges that Perry, a Republican, is violating the separation of church and state by appearing in a promotional video for a prayer gathering organized by several evangelical groups.

The suit also seeks the removal of a link from the governor's state-run website to the rally's website.

Billed as "The Response: A Call to Prayer for a Nation in Crisis," the rally's website lists Perry as "the initiator," citing his
proclamation of the day as one of "prayer and fasting for our nation's challenges."

The Freedom From Religion Foundation, a Wisconsin-based watchdog group, joined the suit filed by five Texans, who are identified by name as "nonbelievers."

"What he (Perry) is doing is beyond anything we've seen a governor do," said Annie Laurie Gaylor, co-president of FFRF. "It is his face you see when you go to the rally's website. It would not have happened without him. That is why we decided to sue."

Eugene Volokh, a professor of constitutional law at the University of California, Los Angeles, doubts the suit's potential. He said previous court rulings have recognized elected officials as individuals entitled to freedom of speech and religion.

"When a governor appears at an event, he is understood to be acting as both a person and a government official," Volokh said. "The courts have given these folks tremendous latitude in what they can say in their own statements."

Volokh said the suit could force Perry to remove the link to the rally from his official website, "but that would be a small victory."

Comments

[John Deakins]

12:21 PM on 08/07/2011

like it or not ,we are based on a christisn versin of religion. if you don't want to participate with it , you are free not to and will not be bothered. but you must also allow others to live and worship at there own will. it does not harm you at all. get over it and live your own way. when you attack the beliefs of others you become what you complain about.other beliefs dont stop your beliefs

[Kalone K Baker]

08:11 AM on 07/29/2011

I'm not exactly a Rick Perry fan but it is so ridiculous that a group of people would sue to try to stop him from attending a prayer event. He can still express his religious beliefs being governor doesn't stop him from being a person. What do they want? All politicians to suspend practicing their religions in public?

[Aquinnah1]

09:02 AM on 07/21/2011

An unholy alliance of politics and religion is bad enough in Texas, but now Maine Gov. Paul LePage has tossed his hat into the pulpit as well. http://www.eightfits.blogspot.com

[flsense]

09:45 PM on 07/20/2011

Perry wants a Christian version of Iran.

[Eclipse33]

05:12 PM on 07/18/2011

1st Amendment: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The Governor is not passing any laws.
The Governor is not forcing anyone to attend or punishing those the do not attended.

The FFRF (which is really only concerned with Christians) wants to use the "law" to prevent the governor from attending.
The FFRF want to pass law preventing the free practicing of Christianity.

Clearly the FFRF is the group that has a problem with our constitution.

[George Genung]

05:30 PM on 07/18/2011

Any use of taxpayer funds in support of any religious group is prohibited. Believe that Pappa Smurf will return to save the day, just don't ask me to pay for your belief.

[Dan Jighter]

09:26 PM on 07/18/2011

The issue is not the specific wording of the Establishment Clause in the Constitution. The Constitution has changed since the Founders via amendments and judicial review. When atheists speak of the 1st Amendment, we tend to not only mean the words you quoted but all the legal precedents interpreting the 1st Amendment.

I think what Rick Perry is doing violates the Lemon test. It is clearly the office of the Texas governor advancing and being excessively entangled with religion, in particular with evangelical Christianity. Perry is doing the event only because his is governor and is promoting the event based on his being governor. The event itself blames lack of worship of God for our problems and encourages the entire nation to pray as a solution.

The issue is NOT free exercise of religion. If Rick Perry wants to go to church on Sundays, no one cares. We only care about this particular prayer rally and how it is government endorsement of religion.

[Eclipse33]

11:32 PM on 07/18/2011

You do know that "but all the legal precedents interpreti­ng the 1st Amendment' have ruled in favor of the Governor.
Admit it you only care about forcing YOUR belief on someone else.

[George Genung]

05:31 PM on 07/16/2011

LOL, gotta love their theology. Either their deity selected this creation out of an infinite number of possible creations, knowing everything that would happen, before the creation. Or, their deity is just making it up as it goes along. In the first case praying and fasting is useless, in the second case you have capricious ego centered deity that needs to be constantly stroked and begged. For me, neither is very appealing. So, unless the great governor has some verified historical evidence of the existence of Jesus ( Josephus and the others wrote much later, and no one, repeat, no one knows who wrote the gospels. We will leave the contradictions within for another time), then, anyone who wants to have a prayer rally to Homer Simpson has as much right to taxpayer funds.

[Mort]

10:02 PM on 07/15/2011

It's interesting how many atheists think government officials are trying to force their beliefs on them, and choose to force their own beliefs on government as a solution.

[HotelDrama]

01:16 PM on 07/16/2011

No atheist is trying to force their belief on govt. They are trying to force to govt to uphold the Constitution.

But I know it sucks when the majority thinks they are under attack. God forbid God gets taken off our money, or out of our Pledge, or Congress stops saying a prayer, or more non-theists get elected to public office than theists, when non-theist groups actually sway public policy compared to theist groups, etc.

[Mort]

06:20 PM on 07/17/2011

Clever play on words, invoking God in the same sentence as removing him.

But then, how is banning leaders from free speech or religious activity upholding the Constitution?

[Dan Jighter]

04:06 PM on 07/16/2011

How are atheists forcing their beliefs on government? Are they compelling the government to assert there is no god? All atheists are doing is saying that the government can't promote Christianity.

Let me put it this way. How (specifically) are atheists forcing their beliefs onto Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, Wiccans, Deists, etc or onto those people's government? Surely if atheists are forcing their beliefs that there is no god, they are forcing their beliefs upon a variety of religions.

[Mort]

06:16 PM on 07/17/2011

I asked you a similar question, which you haven't answered. When you do, so will I.

[Watching rock grow]

07:55 PM on 07/15/2011

If I want religion in my government I can move to countries that have it already. I totally support this suit and hope it success.

[thorrsman]

08:54 PM on 07/15/2011

It will not. In America, you are free to worship as you please, and that includes the people in government. Just as you could not be forced to worship in a certain church--or worship at all, for that matter--others in government service can not be DENIED their Rights under the First Amendment AT ALL.

[Watching rock grow]

09:06 PM on 07/15/2011

Considering the federal judges in Texas, and the make up of the Supreme Court I have a sick feeling you are right. But not because of your argument, literally the support you are claiming is not within the Constitution.

[Dan Jighter]

04:14 PM on 07/16/2011

Surely we can distinguish between Rick Perry as a private citizen going to church on Sunday and inviting a friend to come pray with him and Rick Perry as the Governor of Texas asking Texans and Americans overall to join him in prayer at a stadium. Let me suggest a potential test for the distinction:

Could Rick Perry realistically ask Texans or other Americans to join him in prayer at some stadium on a specific date if he were not a Governor or some other government leader?

[Demetrios423]

11:33 PM on 07/21/2011

I am no fan of Rick Perry, but as a citizen of the United States he is allowed to participate in any religious service he wants. It makes no difference if he is the Governor or not. I don't think the Governor of Texas is holding a prayer service, rather a man who happens to be Governor is.

Besides that relax. You aren't going to be converted or forced to believe in God because he does.

[Watching rock grow]

07:39 AM on 07/22/2011

It is as the above you poster states, "Could RP realistically ask Texans or other Americans to join him....?" Could you? The answer is no. It is this reality that makes it wrong.

What makes you think that just because I want no religion in my government I don't believe in God? IMHO religion belongs in the heart, not the government.

[Greg Shatto]

06:30 PM on 07/15/2011

He is not getting paid to engage in religious activity. Let him do it on his own time.

[thorrsman]

08:55 PM on 07/15/2011

You mean when he is no longer governor?

So you would deny him his First Amendment Rights so long as he holds government office?

[HotelDrama]

07:27 PM on 07/16/2011

He should not appear in this "promotional video," should be the "initiator" and the link should be removed from the website.
If he wants to go to this event, he should just go to the event and not actually make an issue of it. Don't promote it. Don't make him a focal point of the event.

[Sabi Kanani]

06:26 PM on 07/15/2011

Do they suggest that elected officials should not be able to attend any religious function?

[Down in FL]

07:35 PM on 07/15/2011

Bit of a difference between "attending" and "organizing and promoting."

[HotelDrama]

04:43 PM on 07/17/2011

Big difference. You go to the website of this rally and the first thing you see is Perry's picture and a quote from him about how we need Jesus in our lives. He isn't just "attending." He is promoting it from his position as an elected official.

[Dave24]

05:55 PM on 07/15/2011

The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe with blood for centuries.

James Madison

[thorrsman]

06:48 PM on 07/15/2011

Which says nothing about requiring those in government service to hide their beliefs or refrain from worshipping how and where they so choose. So long as Christian, Jew, Muslim, Wiccan, Druid, Buddhist, Asatruar and even Atheist are free to practice their beliefs while holding a position in government, America will be safe from the dangers of a government controlled by religion or, even worse, a religion controlled by government.

[Dave24]

12:25 AM on 07/16/2011

No matter where Rick Perry is, he's the active governor.
That's 24 hours a day, 7 days a week until the end of his term.

During this time, he's a public official. Public official. And during this time, he has to treat all people equally under the law, ensuring and promoting equality over some specific belief system.

Rick Perry can pray in private, and yes, he can pray in public. But making a statement and holding a many-thousand-person rally (while continuing to get paid a salary by taxpayers who are not Christian) is a little different.

We have religious plurality in this country precisely because religion and government is *constitutionally* separated. This permits pluralism and individual liberty.

Rick Perry, conversely, is trying to warp the Constitution to endorse not equality but a singular religious system. And it's a perversion of everything that was once right with America.

[methodman]

05:35 PM on 07/15/2011

The Atheists are being stupid here. They need to sue to be involved and be given a slot. of time to do their equivalent of a problem-solving dialogue. Aethism at least for me is not some idiot argument for or against some fiction. It is replacing faith with reason and mechanism. They need to usurp the topics and run the conversations in such a manner to bring reason ability and mechanical know how towards an interesting problem.

[Jeannette Lacey]

06:13 PM on 07/15/2011

Since the event is for evangelical Christians only - nobody else is being admitted. In fact, one of the ministers flat out said that Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus and other "idolaters" were not to be included. (I guess the thought they'd bring koodies or something). Now, if different faith and non-faith groups can breach this and appear at this farce, great.

[Down in FL]

07:40 PM on 07/15/2011

Go ahead and try that. Tell me how it goes.

We live in a nation where a politician can say that God won't allow global warming to happen, and that the Earth is 6,000 years old, and that we should "let the kids decide" what is science. Our nation is not nearly educated (or intelligent, which is different) enough to realize just how useless and ridiculous blind faith is.

[Aesthete]

04:32 PM on 07/15/2011

Is Governor Perry sincere in his "beliefs," or is he merely pandering to the right wing of his party to get their votes? It is against the teachings of Jesus to make a public spectacle of one's prayers. There are settings where one may pray openly and audibly and prayer is a deep, intimate, and spiritual communion with God, not an opportunity to "show off."

[cynical one]

05:35 PM on 07/15/2011

I actually think the alien that was controlling Trump from his hair landed on Perry's head some time last month...

[James Haun]

03:40 PM on 07/15/2011

Seems like the debate has slowed? Is it time for VBS pickup???

[bosmeetsmem]

02:53 PM on 07/15/2011

I don't understand the minds of these people, which is probably for the best. They are suing Rick Perry because he is the reason they are having National Day of Prayer?? So what? If Atheists don't want to believe in God that's just fine. I'm not here to judge anyone. But to sue someone because they DO believe in God and want others who share the same belief to pray with them is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard.Atheists (not all) accuse Christians of being intolerant and pushing Christianity down their throats, but they turn around and fly banners saying "God-less America" on 4th of July for all to see(and have the right to do so).They fight to end the National Day of Prayer...to take that away from Christians. If they just wanted it to be "live and let live" that would be one thing. But, instead they fight Christianity every chance they get.People, you can't preach about intolerance and then be intolerant towards any religion or group of people who don't practice or believe in the same things you do! You want to tell everyone that there is no God, fine. I'm strong enough in my faith to not let it get to me. But, to take away my right to religion, to take away the National Day of Prayer (because it's against YOUR belief), is not justified and just shows how hateful this organization is.

[UnderTheHedgeWeGo]

03:13 PM on 07/15/2011

You entirely miss the point. Its not SOMEONE, its a government official. I assure you you have never heard of an atheist suing a private citizen for organizing a prayer meeting.

The churches, and all religious people, can get together and declare a Nation Day of Prayer and nobody will make a peep. The government, our MUTUAL government, that is suppose to represent me and well as you may not take sides on religious issues. It is no more complicated than that. The Constitution tells us this.

You may do as you please, really. No one wants to take your rights to do anything away. But you do not have the right to enlist our COMMON government to support YOUR beliefs just as I may not use our government to support MY beliefs.

Do what you like. Pray, worship and organize as you like but you may not use the power and influence of the American government in service of your religion.

[UnderTheHedgeWeGo]

03:44 PM on 07/15/2011

And you make some sense as well. But I would be very unhappy if a government official made a show of supporting my beliefs over the beliefs of my fellow citizens. I don't think it is illegal or that he should be sued for it (despite the fact that I am a member of the Freedom From Religion Foundation). While it may unite his coreligionists, in a larger sense it is decisive. I think he should run the government and leave the task of leading his fellow Believers to priests, pastors and what have you during his term in office.

For those years while he is the Governor of all Texans, I think he could follow the admonitions of Christ;

"But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly."

Rather than showboating for the Lord, which is exactly what I think he is doing.

[MRDFS]

04:00 PM on 07/15/2011

reading comprehension is critical. So is the American notion of separation of church and state