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North Carolina House Votes For Ultrasound Law, Overriding Gov. Perdue Veto

Ultrasound

First Posted: 07/26/11 07:39 PM ET Updated: 09/25/11 06:12 AM ET

North Carolina lawmakers voted on Tuesday to override Gov. Bev Perdue's veto of a mandatory ultrasound bill that forces abortion doctors to say certain things to their patients before the procedure.

The Abortion-Woman's Right to Know Act, which Perdue vetoed in June, requires a doctor to give a woman an ultrasound prior to the abortion procedure and to describe her fetus in detail, including the size of its organs and limbs, whether she wants to hear it or not. If she refuses to view the ultrasound image or listen to the fetal heartbeat, the doctor must record that and keep her name on file for seven years.

Further, the bill stipulates that the woman has to wait 24 hours before having an abortion, which forces her to make multiple trips to the clinic. And an abortion physician has to hand her a document that says she is terminating "the life of a separate, unique human being."

"Physicians must be free to advise and treat their patients based on their medical knowledge and expertise and not have their advice overridden by elected officials seeking to impose their own ideological agenda on others," wrote Gov. Perdue in her June 27 veto note.

The bill's conservative backers say the measure could save thousands of unborn lives each year by educating a woman about the consequences of abortion, thus making her less likely to go through with the procedure. But Dr. Amy Bryant, a North Carolina gynecologist who provides abortions on a weekly basis, says the law's only function would be to place an undue emotional burden on patients.

"I've never heard of the ultrasound actually changing someone's mind," she told HuffPost. "Once they've made the decision that this is the right thing for them and their families, that's what they're gonna do. If you try to coerce women to hear these things or see the ultrasound or hear that there are fetal abnormalities, it's only going to be more distressing for them. I can't imagine how it would help."

After heated floor debates, the North Carolina House of Representatives overrode Perdue's veto by a vote of 72-47 on Tuesday. That being said, the Senate needs 30 votes to override Perdue's veto on Thursday and force the bill into law, and only 29 out of 31 Republicans voted in favor of the bill the first time around.

"I'm not supportive of it and I don’t envision myself changing that position," said Sen. Stan Bingham (R-Davidson), the one Republican who voted against the measure (the other, Sen. Richard Stevens (R-Wake), didn't vote). "I just really am troubled by the fact that the government is involved in something as directly related to someone's personal life as abortion, and I feel hypocritical in voting to support this because I've always raised my four daughters to make these kinds of decisions on their own."

Bingham told HuffPost he also questioned some of the information about abortions that Republican supporters of the bill were using during debates.

"There's a lot of non-facts in some of the things that have been said -- they make it sound like you go in to get a hamburger and you have an abortion, without any medical exams, no check-ups, no discussion," he said. "But the medical society strongly disagrees with this, and my daughter is a physician and she strongly disagrees with this too. So I'm trying to be open-minded."

Mandatory ultrasound legislation has been extremely popular on the state level during the 2011 legislative sessions. Fourteen states have filed a total of 28 ultrasound-related bills in 2011, compared to nine in 2010, and four states -- Ariz., Fla., Texas, and N.C. -- have actually passed them. Twenty-four states have waiting-period requirements.

According to a recent Gallup poll, about half of American voters support ultrasound requirements and 69 percent of voters support the enforcement of 24-hour waiting periods.

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North Carolina lawmakers voted on Tuesday to override Gov. Bev Perdue's veto of a mandatory ultrasound bill that forces abortion doctors to say certain things to their patients before the procedure. ...
North Carolina lawmakers voted on Tuesday to override Gov. Bev Perdue's veto of a mandatory ultrasound bill that forces abortion doctors to say certain things to their patients before the procedure. ...
 
 
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
WilliamWalton
Life's Path:Balt.>York>Chapel Hill>Atl.>Wilmington
11:38 PM on 07/28/2011
This list is going to be used to manipulate that the woman acknowledged a heartbeat and other info as a way to say that the fetus was a living separate being and will therefore equate to murder in the future.
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11:40 PM on 08/31/2011
YES!
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Just My Thoughts 2011
Life's but a walking shadow
11:24 PM on 07/28/2011
I do not understand the need to keep the patients name on file for 7 years.

However, I can't see where a little education on such an important decision is a bad thing.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Just4theHalibut
03:18 PM on 07/28/2011
When the so-called "Patriot" Act forced librarians to keep lists of what library clients read, many of them refused. Let's see if the physicians of North Carolina have the same courage.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
WilliamWalton
Life's Path:Balt.>York>Chapel Hill>Atl.>Wilmington
04:02 AM on 07/28/2011
I live in NC and this is the first I've even heard about it, but I'm sure the news stations will be getting an ear full tomorrow.
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Gneirre
332 - 206!!! Obama/Biden
12:54 PM on 07/28/2011
Well, they just overrode Perdue's veto! This mess is now a law!!!!
04:08 PM on 07/27/2011
Though I agree with the Senator, he should really work on his grammar. "There's a lot of non-facts..." is improper. It should read: "There are a lot of non-facts..." People get lazy and say "there's" too often. I know "there're" is difficult & annoying to say, but geez.
03:38 PM on 07/27/2011
And the List? What's the List for? 7 Years? Like breaking a mirror is bad luck. It's a Black List. It will be an available database with women who are independent thinkers on the list. This is one way to eliminate the intellectuals. They did this in Communist China. In Communist and Fascist Regimes, lists are kept. They are kept as a means of intimidation for use later. There's only one reason for a list and one reason for a 7 year list. They must have an agenda that won't be complete until 7 years from now. So what are they planning in the next 7 years? By implication alone, the list has to have a purpose. What could they possibly do with a list of women who've had abortions? They aren't planning on sending them a Hallmark card on the anniversary of their abortion. So, they must be compiling names for some future purpose. Try to imagine what that may be.
10:02 AM on 07/28/2011
Arlene, I totally agree with you. I wrote in my post here yesterday that they may as well just go all the way back to the times of The Scarlett Letter and put a big red A on these women's foreheads! Maybe we'll bring back the guillotine too! Hey, how about chastity belts! Let's just go all the way back to living in caves! As you can tell, I'm really pissed off about this!
03:33 PM on 07/27/2011
I know of a case, in particular, in another state, where in fact two young people got pregnant early in their dating. Contraception failed. They barely know one another. The young woman had to endure just this kind of procedure. Her decisions were based on the coerced morality of a few people that she'll never meet. Her life is forever defined, as is the baby's father by unknown people's action. Their child will, by most predictions, have less than a stellar life. Their prospects are dismal in this economy without an unplanned baby. Their lives, compromised as they are by the last 2 decades of Right Wingers stripping education, creating a mass work force that is undereducated and easily manipulated because they have no critical thinking skills. Now a cheap abundant labor force is guaranteed for decades. Lots of impoverished Americans raising babies they can't afford to raise well, but they will be providing a valuable commodity to the American Corporations: Cheaper labor here than abroad. What a plan!!! The decades long plan by the right wingers to create The so-called "Christian" elite have managed to turn the clocks back to a time of social inequity, ignorance and fear. America The Reality Show!!!! Stayed tuned for more exciting entertainment!
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
LennyR
06:09 PM on 07/27/2011
"They barely know one another. The young woman had to endure just this kind of procedure. Her decisions were based on the coerced morality of a few people that she'll never meet."
To clarify: she underwent the procedure and changed her mind? What information was so moving that they changed their minds?

"Her life is forever defined, as is the baby's father by unknown people's action"
So creating a new life is the "fault" of people who have never met the couple?

"Their child will, by most prediction­s, have less than a stellar life."
Their child's rights do not depend on whether you think it's life will be stellar or not.
07:33 PM on 07/27/2011
"Their child's rights do not depend on whether you think it's life will be stellar or not."
..and a woman's rights do not depend on whether you think her life will be stellar or not.
10:05 AM on 07/28/2011
Here we go... a man's point of view.... which, SHOULD NOT EVEN BE CONSIDERED WHEN IT COMES TO A WOMAN'S RIGHT TO CHOOSE!
03:29 PM on 07/27/2011
Certainly there would be far less support if the facts were fully disclosed - the government will mandate women (including rape victims) to receive transvaginal ultrasounds - this is not a jelly/belly ultrasound when this early, instead it involves a vaginal probe. The government will require women to pay for and receive a medically unneccesary and invasive procedure.
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almedoz
Shh! Don't tell my Dad I'm here...
03:03 PM on 07/27/2011
"An abortion physician has to hand her a document that says she is terminating "the life of a separate, unique human being." "

So the NC legislature has finally been able to answer that centuries-old question of when life begins. I certainly hope every single one of them has an advanced degree in biology or human anatomy, and didn't make their decision based on their own personal religious beliefs, since we're supposed to have separation of church and state in this country.

I thought not.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
califson
Love my country, ashamed of my government
07:26 PM on 07/27/2011
American United for separation & States, finally admitted this past week that you will not find "separation of church and state" anywhere in the constitution. That is something we have known since it was drafted, and when Jefferson wrote the letter to those Baptist telling them that religion must be protected "from" government.
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almedoz
Shh! Don't tell my Dad I'm here...
09:00 AM on 07/28/2011
I know full well that those exact words do not appear in the Constitution. However, the establishment clause has been interpreted numerous times by the Supreme Court to mean just that.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
redsoxpagan
02:22 PM on 07/27/2011
It doesn't matter what the poll says one way or another. A woman's right to chose is not a popularity contest nor is it anyone else's business other than the woman's and the doctor's opinion based on MEDICAL knowledge.
I guarantee those who support these useless measures will sing a different tune when they have to face such a decision.
02:07 PM on 07/27/2011
The entire thing is disgraceful to me. We are running backwards in this state. I'm from NC and it just makes me mad as hell that the legislators will override the governor on this, yet, I'm sure have not made any provisions to help a woman with raising her child if she decides not to have the abortion. But it really sticks in my craw is that they intend to put these women's name on a LIST for 7 years!!! What the hell? Isn't that like the bankruptcy laws? And doesn't that smack a little of the way Hitler did things? Or maybe they will try to stamp the red letter A on women's foreheads next! These little legislators with their little simpleton minds think they're doing someone a favor. They are just drawing attention to what a simpleton state they are creating. I want them all voted out of office next go-round!
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
juicybrisket
true emancipation is a fantasy...
01:47 PM on 07/27/2011
this is ridiculous.

gotta love that small government....so small it fits in my uterus.
04:10 PM on 07/27/2011
It fits into the mini-cam they want to have sewn into your uterus to watch your every movement.
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11:47 PM on 08/31/2011
Dear juicy,

I agree. Big government fits better.
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MovieGuy2010
You can't fight in here..this is the war room!
01:43 PM on 07/27/2011
Really, why arent women in droves fleeing these red states, it's clear these old white Christianist facists HATE you, why do you stay?

Some of you EVEN VOTE for these nutjobs? That's like black folks voting for the Klan!
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
reviewingthesituation
Southern liberal feminist
03:07 PM on 07/27/2011
North Carolina's electoral vote went to Obama. They hoped voting for Repub state officials since then would improve the employment situation. Instead, the state legislature has been in full Taliban mode ever since.

It's reminiscent, in fact, of Afghanis who hope electing Taliban officials will improve the security situation, then end up living in terror of a Taliban encrouchment into every corner of their lives.
04:11 PM on 07/27/2011
No one has money to go anywhere. People are stuck in a home with families, and sometimes even a job. But I'm all for an old-fashioned exodus to the blue states that welcome women, minorities, the sick and disabled.
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MovieGuy2010
You can't fight in here..this is the war room!
04:31 PM on 07/27/2011
Like most states, we here in WA are cutting services, but we at least are fairly liberal, have two women senators and women governor, though Gregiore is retiring and not running again in 2012.

If they tried that Planned Parenthood closure stunt in Seattle, they would be run out of town on a rail......
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01:29 PM on 07/27/2011
Explain to me why the party of less government continues to enact regulations which bring government more into our private lives?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
catcrazee
Rescue...save their life and yours
03:45 PM on 07/27/2011
EXACTLY!
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
khg1
01:26 PM on 07/27/2011
Jezuz! This totally violates HIPPA laws regrading PRIVACY. Keeping a woman's name for 7 years on a list for what purpose? Is there some planned state retaliation planned for a woman exercising her right to make decisions about her life and medical health? This "forced conversation" is also a breach or patient/doctor confidentiality. The conversation between them is NO ONES business. If I go to my dermatologist are they going to make her give me a speech about how big more pore are or make me look at them under a microscope?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
catcrazee
Rescue...save their life and yours
03:46 PM on 07/27/2011
I bet they send you a "birthday card" every year for the fetus, just to be mean.
04:13 PM on 07/27/2011
I'm sure the ACLU will be suing once it becomes law. It has to become LAW first, before they can do anything. That means the legislature overriding the governor's veto. Some Federal judge will put a hold on it, and it'll eventually be deemed unconstitutional and illegal. This crap takes time, but soon some humanity will sink back into our nation.